[HN Gopher] Ancient Greek 'pop culture' discovery rewrites histo...
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Ancient Greek 'pop culture' discovery rewrites history of poetry
and song
Author : diodorus
Score : 53 points
Date : 2021-09-14 00:16 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.joh.cam.ac.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.joh.cam.ac.uk)
| leoc wrote:
| Fun fact: Irish [Gaelic] poetry only switched from syllabic to
| stressed metre about the eighteenth century. One product of the
| transition was poems in the form of _tri rainn agus amhran_ ,
| having three stanzas of syllabic metre then a final stanza of
| stressed metre, for example "Tithe Chorr an Chait":
| http://www.clanntuirc.co.uk/TRAA/TRAA40.html .
| BoumTAC wrote:
| Do we know what ancient music sound like ?
| yyyk wrote:
| Sumerian music had a notation, a bit of which was recovered.
| Interpretation is however difficult and not yet agreed upon.
|
| https://openculture.com/2014/07/the-oldest-song-in-the-world...
| batrachos wrote:
| We have the notation for a small amount of Hellenistic and
| Roman era music, and I think a tiny little bit of Euripides.
| We'll never know what Sappho sounded like, though.
| irrational wrote:
| There is an audiobook called How to Listen to and Understand
| Great Music. The author starts way way back with the oldest
| music we have and then little by little moves forward to more
| modern times showing how music grew little by little over the
| millennia. The audiobooks includes audio excerpts of the music.
| I found it fascinating up until the classical music time when
| it started bogging down and going a lot slower.
| ARandomerDude wrote:
| Yes, actually. Here's one example:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
| sherr wrote:
| Will Astley ever get old?
| sherr wrote:
| I believe it is still quite a hard thing to be truly certain of
| but there are some indications around. Harmonia Mundi produced
| an album a few years ago that included some ancient Greek music
| [1].
|
| [1] La Musique De L'Antiquite https://www.discogs.com/Various-
| La-Musique-De-LAntiquit%C3%A...
| cblconfederate wrote:
| A little older than sibling comment
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seikilos_epitaph
| MatteoFrigo wrote:
| > Until now, 'stressed poetry' of this kind has been unknown
| before the 5th century, when it began to be used in Byzantine
| Christian hymns.
|
| FWIW, some scholars argue that the Roman Saturnian verse (3rd
| century BC or earlier) is stressed poetry. See
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturnian_(poetry) for examples.
| batrachos wrote:
| Different language though. Greek poetry was so conservative it
| can be hard to tell what is a living form and what is a clever
| pastiche, especially as the Hellenistic era goes on.
| mseepgood wrote:
| Extremely dumb lyrics. What's next? "Ooh baby ... I care for you
| ... I'll always be there for you ... I know that you want me to"
| grillvogel wrote:
| the original LIVE LAUGH LOVE sign
| laylomo2 wrote:
| Next headline: twerking found in 35,000 year old cave art
| thriftwy wrote:
| A lot of songs from the 2nd half of XX century till now have
| dumber lyrics.
|
| And their authors should have known better, whereas Greeks had
| to invent pop culture from scratch.
| kgeist wrote:
| "Rewriting history" based on a single poem? Could as well be a
| unique style of a particular poet/whoever made it?
| irrational wrote:
| My reading was that it wasn't a single poem (by which I think
| you mean, a single instance of the poem). Apparently this poem
| was found all over the place, both with and without the final 2
| lines, and that basically factories were churning out kitsch
| with the poem on it for sale.
| grillvogel wrote:
| its always seemed strange to me that we just assume something
| didn't exist before a certain time just because that was the
| earliest artifact we've found so far.
|
| so much of ancient history which is assumed to be truth is really
| just based on assumptions and suppositions
| mjw1007 wrote:
| In my experience historians don't assume that, but when
| journalists write up a discovery that pushes the earliest-known
| date back they like to write it up as if they had.
| colechristensen wrote:
| Especially Greek and Roman history. Some of what is "known" is
| based on as little as a word or two carved into some stone
| monument... other things are based on thousands upon thousands
| of written works that survived antiquity (in some cases we know
| more about Rome 2000 years ago than we do anywhere else until
| the renaissance)
|
| There is this transition between scant evidence and near modern
| levels of familiarity in a rather short time.
| pradn wrote:
| And if you compare histories, it gets even more absurd. We
| almost know what Cicero did hour-to-hour on some important
| days. We don't even know which century Kalidasa, the most
| important Sanskrit poet, was active in.
| sushisource wrote:
| Sounds like "haters gonna hate" is as old as it gets.
| roywiggins wrote:
| they say what they like / let them say it / I don't care / Burma
| Shave
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