[HN Gopher] ProtonMail removed "we do not keep any IP logs" from...
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       ProtonMail removed "we do not keep any IP logs" from its privacy
       policy
        
       Author : leephillips
       Score  : 96 points
       Date   : 2021-09-07 21:35 UTC (1 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (arstechnica.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (arstechnica.com)
        
       | ColinWright wrote:
       | Discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28443449
        
       | Ms-J wrote:
       | What deceptive marketing. I never did trust this company
       | especially with reading the material on the forums.
        
       | mandliya wrote:
       | Very responsibly done! The issue was not that they had to share
       | the logs with law enforcement, the issue was that marketing
       | message was incorrect from them. This is a responsible step.
        
         | futureproofd wrote:
         | The fact that the messaging was there to begin with is the
         | issue. People assume tech companies are immune from the law
         | based on make believe claims that their ideals allow them to
         | circumvent it.
        
         | DoubleDerper wrote:
         | Consumers relied upon ProtonMail's prominent and concise
         | marketing claim. Consumers who signed up for the service are
         | now in jeopardy, perhaps facing real [legal] injury based on
         | reasonable expectation of not having their IP logged.
         | 
         | The privacy-centric nature of this abuse is unlikely to result
         | in a class-action-type of response, but Caveat Emptor abuses
         | can be dealt with by the marketplace, too.
        
           | stingraycharles wrote:
           | What do you suggest they do to rectify the situation?
        
             | beaner wrote:
             | Pay damages.
        
               | Johnny555 wrote:
               | I don't think you can get damages for what might happen
               | in the future, only for real damages and probably only
               | this activist that had his IP disclosed can prove
               | damages.
               | 
               | Probably the best you could hope for would be to get out
               | of a long term contract "I paid for a 2 year term based
               | on promises that weren't true"
               | 
               | Otherwise, your best recourse to prevent your IP from
               | being disclosed in the future is to find a provider that
               | won't disclose it under any circumstances (probably not
               | possible), or hide your IP yourself.
        
             | ironmagma wrote:
             | Here are some ideas: Proactive compensation, an apology
             | letter, hosting an AMA live stream, and a postmortem on how
             | this misleading messaging made it out in the first place.
        
         | reginold wrote:
         | Love how you put this. Yes, marketing message was incorrect.
         | 
         | Did they also fix the part about "no personal info to open an
         | account?". They require a phone number to register through Tor
         | >.<
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | goldforever wrote:
         | Dummy
        
       | great-potential wrote:
       | I deleted my proton account about a year ago when I saw that I
       | could not login from tor anymore, kudos to tutanota for allowing
       | to register/login without a cell phone it must be really
       | challenging !
        
         | gralx wrote:
         | Just FYI for anyone having this issue, Tor 2.0 is deprecated
         | and has been hit or miss for roughly the past year. As long as
         | you're using their Tor 3.0 onion address you should have few
         | issues.
        
       | 10GBps wrote:
       | Now if VPN providers would do the same because they can be
       | compelled to log just like Proton was.
        
         | loudtieblahblah wrote:
         | yup - you can claim all day long you don't log IPs and you may
         | very well be telling the truth.
         | 
         | but if you live somewhere that a court can compell you to log
         | IPs, then it's all rendered useless.
        
           | great-potential wrote:
           | So a VPN provieder has to check with the laws of all the
           | countries in the world to be able to function ? does'nt make
           | sense you cant create logs if you don't log anything ..
        
             | loudtieblahblah wrote:
             | computers and network devices, by their very nature, log
             | all kinds of shit.
             | 
             | you actually have to go in and disable default logging in
             | applications and OS level functions in order to make a
             | system NOT log something.
             | 
             | a court is just compelling them to turn it back on or more
             | specifically, turn it on as it may apply to a singular
             | user.
             | 
             | and yes, if you operate some place - you have to comply
             | with its laws. there's no technical way around this unless
             | you're going full darknet.
        
       | ggoo wrote:
       | I'm glad they did that, but still wish they had removed it before
       | keeping IP logs.
        
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       (page generated 2021-09-07 23:00 UTC)