[HN Gopher] Brainwashing, Italian-Style: The Birth of "Plagio"
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Brainwashing, Italian-Style: The Birth of "Plagio"
Author : aww_dang
Score : 60 points
Date : 2021-09-06 06:31 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (bitterwinter.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (bitterwinter.org)
| ykevinator3 wrote:
| But not christianity, that's not remotely culty
| duxup wrote:
| The evolution of words are interesting, but without any real
| examples of the "brainwashing" style "plagio" being prosecuted
| ... it is really hard to know what it means / how it could play
| out.
| occamrazor wrote:
| It's hard to provide examples, because they don't exist!
|
| Only one person has ever been convicted:
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aldo_Braibanti
| AnimalMuppet wrote:
| That looks like a complete and total miscarriage of
| justice...
| Remote-Mouse wrote:
| If something is deemed illegal, then you are bound by law to
| adhere.
|
| Unless there are loopholes in such law, in which case you exploit
| them.
|
| In the absence of any law that depicts something as "illegal",
| are you not free to do the thing that is not considered illegal?
|
| The other alternative it to bring about a law that expressly
| permits such an act as legal.
|
| Lets say, to allow the government to spy on the people of the
| country or wider, or perhaps to brainwash them with propaganda?
|
| It's either remove a law that says it's illegal, or create a law
| that permits it as legal. Either way, the people are screwed. /o\
| qwerty456127 wrote:
| > It said that "plagio" does not exist.
|
| It obviously exists. In all meanings of it. How did they conclude
| it doesn't?
| Remote-Mouse wrote:
| Obviously by the use of "plagio" itself of course...
|
| Mind-control is a tricky subject you know. ;-)
| matco11 wrote:
| The content of the article is inconsistent with what is explained
| by other sources, and, from a quick search, the author seems to
| be politically involved on the subject.
|
| The law was introduced in 1930, during the Fascist era. The
| Italian Constitutional Court declared the law on "plagio"
| unconstitutional in 1981, as it found the law to be imprecise,
| resulting in a hard to measure definition of the crime of
| "plagio", lacking coherence, and hence liable of arbitrary
| application by courts. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagio
|
| More detailed explanation here [in Italian]:
| https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagio_(ordinamento_penale_ita...
| Apparently, there are similar laws about "mind manipulation"
| (brainwashing) in France, Spain, and Belgium.
| berikv wrote:
| Amazing to see that this exactly matches with another item in the
| front page - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/06/three-
| near-ide...
| a_chris wrote:
| Italian here, first time I see the word "plagio" used like this.
| We usually say plagio when someone does not respect a copyright,
| e.g. I wrote a book and someone copy the majority of book to
| write its own book
| zoover2020 wrote:
| Plagiarism?
| riffraff wrote:
| Yes. As an Italian, I agree with OP, I have never heard
| "plagio" to mean "brainwashing" or "mind control".
|
| EDIT: on second thought, there is the idiomatic expression
| "una persona e stata plagiata" which might be what the
| article is about. It is used in the sense of someone who's
| led astray by "evil" influences.
| blue1 wrote:
| It is a technical term. See former article 603 cp (italian
| penal code).
| mmarq wrote:
| It's not that rare, "e stato plagiato da x" (he's been
| brainwashed by x), it's relatively common (given that people
| don't talk that much about brainwashing).
| gpderetta wrote:
| As an Italian, I did in fact hear 'plagio' being used in the
| sense described in the article. I did not know it was an actual
| article of law and that it was repealed before I was born.
| qubex wrote:
| Actually "gli/ti hanno plagiato la mente" is a sentence that,
| as an Italian, I have heard often.
| znpy wrote:
| It actually used to be more common, back when that kind of
| stuff was discussed from time to time (eg: back in the day when
| there was this huuuge general mania/phobia about "bestie di
| satana").
| aww_dang wrote:
| The article goes into the etymology, explaining how the
| plagiaristic sense came about by a satirical use of the term in
| Roman times.
|
| >The word "plagio" is not of recent coinage. It derives from
| Roman law, which also created its present ambiguity, because
| "plagio" in Italian means both "mind control" and "plagiarism,"
| as in "My book has been victim of plagiarism." It was the same
| in Latin, except that the meaning of "control of a human being"
| came first, and the meaning of "plagiarism" came later.
|
| >Responsible for this confusion was a satirical roman poet of
| the first century CE called Martial. In his epigram no. 52,
| Martial used the word "plagium" humorously and metaphorically.
| Just as those who try to pass off another person's slave as
| their own are guilty of "plagium," Martial said, so should be
| considered those who pass off a literary work they copied from
| somebody else as their own. They also commit "plagium,"
| protested Martial...
| q-rews wrote:
| Incredibly, neither Treccani [1] nor Wiktionary mention that
| meaning even for the Latin word. [2]
|
| However there's a page on Wikipedia in English [3] and Italian
| [4] and also Treccani mentions this meaning in Plagiare's
| thesaurus [5] only.
|
| If feels like it's meant as "to enslave", either physically or
| mentally. 1:
| https://www.treccani.it/vocabolario/plagiare/ 2:
| https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/plagium 3:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagio 4: https://it.wikipe
| dia.org/wiki/Plagio_(ordinamento_penale_italiano) 5:
| https://www.treccani.it/vocabolario/plagiare_%28Sinonimi-e-
| Contrari%29/
| [deleted]
| AdrianB1 wrote:
| Just curious, were you an adult in 1981 when it was removed
| from legislation? If now, it may be just old history for you.
| ABS wrote:
| plagio has multiple meanings, one it's the one you are
| referring to (e.g. plagiarasing someone else's work) and
| another is what this article is about.
|
| vittima di plagio, plagiare una persona, etc are all in common
| usage (and subject of study in psychology)
| slim wrote:
| It is fascinating that the roman empire bloated the legal corpus
| so much, the concept of ownership became so broad that you could
| own a human or an idea. And then plagio stems from both stupid
| ideas because for real property the concept of theft was well
| understood and defined and could not be applied. Thanks op for
| submitting this. Now reading the second part.
|
| https://bitterwinter.org/brainwashing-italian-style-the-fasc...
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(page generated 2021-09-07 23:01 UTC)