[HN Gopher] PureOS - a pure Linux phone experience
___________________________________________________________________
PureOS - a pure Linux phone experience
Author : TimTheTinker
Score : 113 points
Date : 2021-08-26 17:41 UTC (5 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (puri.sm)
(TXT) w3m dump (puri.sm)
| istingray wrote:
| Super curious about Librem 5 myself, though they're currently
| backordered and I'm a Linux newbie. If someone has one gathering
| dust, email is in my profile.
|
| My first step to switching off Apple is my laptop. I bought a
| System76 laptop. I also considered the Purism laptop. I'm a Linux
| newbie and went with System76, some explanation below. (Shipping
| times were also a factor in my decision)
|
| Purism's challenge is they may be trying to solve a "2-miracles
| problem".
|
| Miracle 1: open source hardware business
|
| Miracle 2: privacy focused business
|
| To the extent open source hw/sw SUPPORTS privacy, they're in
| alignment as a single miracle. But the alignment isn't perfect,
| it's all still so new. To put it another way, if Purism fails
| that doesn't affect System76 much. But if System76 fails that
| likely means a rough road ahead for Purism.
|
| Those who can at all muster the courage and budget to buy Purism
| right now totally should. Lead the way where others cannot.
| TylerLives wrote:
| How are Purism and System76 related?
| relax88 wrote:
| They both provide a means of running a user-first and
| privacy-first operating system on a laptop without supporting
| surveillance capitalists.
|
| You can't really buy a Dell or a MacBook, install Debian or
| some other *nix OS and make the same claim.
| TylerLives wrote:
| What I meant was: Why would System76 failing affect Purism
| (negatively)? I understand that there's some correlation as
| they're both targeting a similar audience, but it doesn't
| seem to me like they depend too much on one another.
| istingray wrote:
| Appreciate the clarification. I didn't know about the
| bootwork example, I meant reliant more generally.
|
| System76 is one of the few Linux-first hardware
| companies. Dell and Lenovo do this but as an aside.
| System76 is 100% Linux.
|
| If there were an entire ecosystem of Linux-first open
| hardware developers, Purism could simply provide a few
| hardware and software tweaks (ie hw switches for wifi)
| for enhanced privacy.
|
| The problem is Purism is forced to bear the weight of
| being one of the few open hw/sw vendors AND all the
| additional anti-surveillance pieces too.
|
| Curious if this explanation helped you.
| TylerLives wrote:
| It did. Thanks.
| pxc wrote:
| Purism is downstream to some of System76's coreboot work
| iirc
| vorpalhex wrote:
| You can buy a Dell with Ubuntu already installed...
| istingray wrote:
| There is one Dell laptop you can buy with Ubuntu: Dell
| XPS 13 Developer Edition [1]
|
| Linux is a side project for Dell at best.
|
| [1] https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/dell-laptops-
| and-notebo... edit to add dell link
| kashura wrote:
| I don't even see that XPS available on dell.com anymore.
| istingray wrote:
| Search engines also seem to have trouble finding it. It
| turns up only when I enter "dell xps 13 developer
| edition": https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/shop/dell-
| laptops-and-notebo...
| contingencies wrote:
| No longer available and was only ever limited
| distribution AFAIK. Also, their hardware has a habit of
| dying suddenly. For non-free vendors I recommend
| replacing Windows on current-era Lenovo laptop hardware,
| AFAIK so far everything just works out of the box.
| fsflover wrote:
| The difference is, most of System76's laptops are barebones
| models from Clevo, whereas Purism designs its own laptops.
| istingray wrote:
| As a new System76 customer, I like their stepwise
| approach. It tells me they're thinking long term and not
| rushing. That's what I want to support is a longterm open
| hardware+software industry.
|
| My understanding is they've started selling their own
| desktop models after selling white-labeled machines in
| the past. And that with laptops they are quite involved
| in the design process and are inching towards selling
| their own custom laptops.
|
| If Purism fails it will likely be because they did too
| much from scratch. Taking on hardware and software all at
| once is a recipe for disaster. It's super expensive.
| 3r8Oltr0ziouVDM wrote:
| Keep in mind that both Purism and System76 still use
| proprietary CPUs (at least) so their machines are not
| completely open. There is a backdoor in every Intel and
| AMD chip that has full control over your computer. If you
| want 100% open hardware, there is
| https://www.raptorcs.com/.
| istingray wrote:
| Good to know about this, had not heard of Raptor
| Computing Systems.
|
| The complete open hardware model seems to require DIY
| chip fabrication at some level as a backstop. Will look
| for more opportunities to encourage this.
|
| I wonder if System76 has considered Raptor processors for
| their desktops. What is their roadmap towards more open
| hardware? Here goes my first recommendation to their
| customer support. I would consider a mini-desktop with
| Talos by System76 even though I'm primarily a laptop
| user.
| relax88 wrote:
| Intel ME is apparently disabled and not connected to the
| network interface in the Librem 13/15 if I remember
| correctly.
| fsflover wrote:
| Disabled and neutralized [0], but there are still some
| blobs in it [1].
|
| [0] https://puri.sm/projects/coreboot/
|
| [1] https://puri.sm/learn/software-freedom-in-
| perspective/
| Klonoar wrote:
| I believe both these companies go to lengths to disable
| Intel ME & co (where possible). Raptor is a cool option
| if you have the money and want a desktop approach, but if
| you're after a laptop you're ultimately playing the game
| of "how much can I deal with binary blobs and proprietary
| bits".
|
| Hell, for Purism's laptops it's not uncommon for people
| to shove in a different wifi card to get modern speeds -
| the card they use is used for being able to run with only
| open source drivers, which are old at this point.
| relax88 wrote:
| Yes... the wireless card on the Librem 15 has given me
| some grief due to sticky roaming. I'll have to look into
| this!
| fsflover wrote:
| More details: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Managem
| ent_Engine#Commer....
| nonplus wrote:
| Of the two people I know who ordered one, 0 have been
| delivered.
|
| I'm well into worried this is another eve laptop / failed to
| deliver a real product situation.
|
| So even if they are not sold out, Purism is not getting any
| money from me until I hear of delivered products to people I
| know.
| LukeShu wrote:
| I am still waiting on my Librem 5 phone (since April 2020).
| However, I've had my Librem 15 laptop (same order date) since
| June 2020. They are an actual existing company that has
| shipped a lot of real actual laptops to people. It sucks that
| they're taking so long to deliver the Librem 5 phone.
| nonplus wrote:
| That's good to hear, I don't know anyone who ordered the
| laptop so it's something to hear people online are
| receiving their products.
| kop316 wrote:
| Mines being shipped now, it should arrive early next week!
|
| ...though I guess I am not someone you know.
| nonplus wrote:
| Good to hear I hope it arrives soon! One of the people I
| know ordered later, and one backed it very early and is
| still waiting.
| pengaru wrote:
| My friend received his, so it's not exactly pure vaporware.
|
| But it's also not usable enough to be his daily driver either
| AIUI.
| 29083011397778 wrote:
| I have fairly minimal needs, mostly basic mapping, calls, a
| Matrix client, and a web browser. I know that's pretty
| basic, even for ~2011.
|
| That said, I'm using (and have _been_ using) my Community
| Edition Pinephone as a daily driver for a couple weeks now.
| It 's not impossible, it just varies based on what ones
| individual needs actually are :)
| jstanley wrote:
| "Backordered" is something of an understatement. I placed my
| order in February 2018 and still haven't received it.
| istingray wrote:
| Oh wow! I had no idea. That's wild. Check out System76 for
| other Linux-first options.
| relax88 wrote:
| Yeah I had no issues with shipping my Librem 15 laptop, it
| was only a few weeks. The phone however I opted for the
| Evergreen release of the Librem 5 hoping to get something a
| little more polished. I've been waiting since summer 2019. It
| seems they've been having issues with manufacturing, possibly
| due to small order sizes plus semiconductor shortages plus
| COVID.
|
| I think the reason system76 has less issues is that it isn't
| custom silicon. I'm not sure about Pine but perhaps it's the
| same case?
|
| The Librem 15 is a decent laptop and is very serviceable /
| easy to repair but for the price it's definitely not as good
| as the build quality of a Dell XPS for example.
|
| I really like the idea of a quality open source phone
| (hardware and software) that isn't sold by surveillance
| capitalists, which is why I support them but I still don't
| know if I'll use it as a daily driver.
| freedomben wrote:
| Congrats on the System76 laptop! I'm excited for you. My advice
| would be to keep Pop OS in place at least until you're feeling
| confident. It's a good distro that you can use forever, but
| part of the fun of being a Linux user is freedom to explore and
| try things.
|
| Do you have a community/destination to go for help if/when you
| need it? I would imagine you shouldn't need much unless you
| like to leave the beaten path, but it's always good to have
| some idea.
| istingray wrote:
| Appreciate the encouragement! I'm planning to pipe all
| feedback and expectations to System76 directly. I know what I
| bought likely isn't as good as my Mac from a look and feel
| standpoint. The Linux community seems incredible, and I'm
| looking for opportunities to pay money to do my part to push
| it.
| mdp2021 wrote:
| > _but part of the fun of being a Linux user is freedom to
| explore and try things_ [from poster freedomben]
|
| Make yourself a few virtual machines for that, initially...
|
| Then try loading systems on the laptop from a USB Mass
| Storage Device (meaning, the non destructive way, without
| writing to the disk).
| Klonoar wrote:
| > I know what I bought likely isn't as good as my Mac.
|
| It's probably moreso the hardware that will bug you, not
| the software - Linux on System76 machines is probably the
| closest to "it actually just works" that I've seen and it's
| super cool, but at the end of the day it's still rebranded
| Clevo shells.
|
| I like their desktop towers and I remain hopeful they can
| do their own laptop one day.
| istingray wrote:
| Appreciate the advice on this. Wonder if there's any
| hardware extras I can purchase that will ease the pain.
| Skins, adapters, dongles etc.
| gtf21 wrote:
| I switched to System76 last year from being on a mac for
| about 15 years. I knew that there would be some things
| which would be lower quality (speakers, webcam, mic,
| trackpad, screen) but found a couple of things:
|
| 1/ my machine is way faster and lasts way longer; 2/ I have
| had really great support from System76 (esp. compared to
| Apple -- they helped me debug a hardware problem and then I
| just ordered a new card and popped it in myself); 3/ I
| actually don't mind the quality degradation compared to the
| massive improvement in my day-to-day experience.
|
| I'm an Arch user (/fanatic -- aren't we all?), YMMV.
| zwayhowder wrote:
| I highly recommend you adjust your perspective. Look for
| the positives not the negatives.
|
| Isn't as easy to use as your Mac for some things, sure, but
| to start out thinking it isn't as good means you'll look
| for the things that are flawed instead of noticing the
| things that are amazing.
|
| I've used Linux as a daily driver since 2016, yes there are
| things that would be easier if I just owned a Mac -
| somewhat ironically that includes Microsoft Office - but
| there are many things that are just amazing on Linux.
|
| The ability to pipe audio from one program into another, or
| quickly create a virtual audio device that combines two get
| a lot of use from me on the unending stream of video calls.
|
| The fact my home directory contains all my configs in plain
| test making it easy for me to have the same custom setup
| across 3 different computers (and all nicely versioned in
| git).
|
| How about the fact that while I love a keyboard centric
| tiling window manager (i3wm) when my wife or son log in
| they get a KDE or Gnome desktop that is as familiar to them
| as their existing Window's computers.
| istingray wrote:
| Good framing! I'll look for what's better not what's
| missing: - I love that the laptop is user upgradable for
| RAM and drives. - I love that I'm supporting a positive
| open hardware/software future
|
| edit: just realized I can play Steam games natively! And
| also have a built in SD card slot.
| zwayhowder wrote:
| Also have a look at the unixporn subreddit. You'll find a
| lot of inspiration for beautiful and functional desktops
| that will consume all your time if you're not careful.
| But in a fun way.
| mark_l_watson wrote:
| I have a few questions, stuff I couldn't find out about on the
| web site. Does the USB-C port drive an external monitor
| supporting a Linux desktop? Will people buy the "all USA parts"
| version, given that it is more than twice as expensive?
|
| Anyway, a great project.
| fsflover wrote:
| > Does the USB-C port drive an external monitor supporting a
| Linux desktop
|
| Yes, they call it "convergence": https://puri.sm/posts/mobile-
| desktop-convergence/.
|
| > Will people buy the "all USA parts" version, given that it is
| more than twice as expensive?
|
| Some people reported receiving their Librem 5 USA, so probably
| yes. See also: https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/community-
| wiki/-/wikis/Freque....
| mark_l_watson wrote:
| Thanks!, the mobile/desktop/convergence is what I was
| thinking of. The linked article says that it is still under
| development, but in the future that is what I am looking
| forward to: a powerful pocket device that can plug into a
| monitor/keyboard/mouse in my study, into a whole wall display
| in our living room, and public I/O devices in libraries,
| offices, malls, friends' homes, etc. One can dream, right?
|
| There is another great alternative for the longer term
| future: compute would be everywhere as well as public I/O
| devices for user interaction. Wherever you are, you could be
| recognized and your personal environment would be right
| there.
|
| Pardon me for going far-afield here, but I am a fan of
| Gibson's cyberpunk sci-fi future, and I enjoy imagining what
| the combination of tech/society/governance/etc. will be.
| fsflover wrote:
| > The linked article says that it is still under
| development, but in the future that is what I am looking
| forward to: a powerful pocket device that can plug into a
| monitor/keyboard/mouse in my study, into a whole wall
| display in our living room, and public I/O devices in
| libraries, offices, malls, friends' homes, etc. One can
| dream, right?
|
| Well, according to many articles [0] and videos, this is
| practically a reality already. Also confirmed by people not
| affiliated with Purism [1].
|
| [0] https://puri.sm/posts/my-first-week-of-
| librem-5-convergence/
|
| [1] https://social.librem.one/tags/convergence.
| LeoPanthera wrote:
| From the page:
|
| > It is the only smartphone on the market today to ship with a
| fully-free and auditable operating system, from the ground up,
| that is created in your best interest instead of corporations'
| bottom lines. It is the only project with a bona fide community
| instead of a "Big Corp" governance model.
|
| Was this written before the PinePhone or does the PinePhone not
| count somehow?
| fsflover wrote:
| Pinephone requires two binary blobs for the WiFi/Bluetooth in
| Linux kernel, and cannot run FSF-endorsed distros without
| adding those blobs. Concerning the community, you might be
| right, although Librem 5 was probably first here (announced in
| 2017).
| Arnavion wrote:
| >Pinephone requires two binary blobs for the WiFi/Bluetooth
| [...]
|
| _One_ binary blob for the WiFi /Bluetooth. The other binary
| blob is for the modem, for which an alternative OSS firmware
| has been in development for some time. There's also a third
| blob for the camera autofocus firmware.
|
| >[...] in Linux kernel, [...]
|
| All three blobs are firmware, not drivers. There are no blobs
| in the kernel. It's identical to the Librem 5 in this regard;
| the Librem 5 also has firmware blobs for WiFi/Bluetooth,
| modem, and some others, but no blob drivers.
|
| >[...] and cannot run FSF-endorsed distros without adding
| those blobs.
|
| You can disable the WiFi/Bluetooth, modem, and camera with
| hardware switches. Given that, and that the RYF criteria
| allows firmware blobs for auxiliary chips, I'm not sure why
| it would apply differently to the Librem 5 vs the PinePhone.
| fsflover wrote:
| > All three blobs are firmware, not drivers. There are no
| blobs in the kernel.
|
| Blobs means proprietary pieces of software. Firmware is
| software, too, it just runs not on the main CPU. If it
| resides in the OS, then the OS has "binary blobs",
| according to the definition by FSF. Librem 5 also has
| blobs, but they are not in the OS. They reside in the WiFi
| card and in the modem, both of which are replaceable pieces
| of hardware, not really parts of the the phone itself.
| tjader wrote:
| Also, does it count as being on the market when you haven't
| delivered devices "pre-ordered" over 2 years ago?
| zulu314 wrote:
| Back in March I was super excited to order the "shipping in June"
| librem 14 laptop. Contacted support, was told august 1st, no
| news.
|
| I would stay clear of this company. They might have good
| intentions but clearly they suck at supply chain.
| squarefoot wrote:
| I was looking for a certain GX-412TC based firewall mainboard a
| few days ago, so different hardware and different vendor: the
| delivery time was over 200 days.
|
| It's not their fault, it's like that pretty much everywhere.
| Just try to buy a graphics card at 2019 prices; no way.
| fsflover wrote:
| Everyone "sucks at supply chain" today, even Apple [0] and
| Toyota [1].
|
| [0] https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/04/28/apple-warns-of-
| ip...
|
| [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58266794
|
| By the way, many customers reported that they received their
| laptops on forums.
| kgwxd wrote:
| We can't get anything electronic in a reasonable amount of time
| at a reasonable price right now, surely we could cut a major
| underdog a little slack.
| InitialLastName wrote:
| The world sucks at supply chain right now.
|
| Even with the best intentions and planning, lead times have
| been expanding faster than orders come in. Orders are being
| pushed back and cancelled by vendors, and parts are
| disappearing from distributors _very_ quickly.
|
| Even the huge players shipping millions of units (Apple [0],
| Toyota [1], Sony [2], Samsung [3]), who are usually able to
| order the manufacturers around (in what's really a "bank owns
| you" vs "you own the bank" situation), are having trouble
| building products. Why would you expect a low-volume
| manufacturer to be in any way capable of doing better?
|
| [0] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/27/apples-iphone-hot-streak-
| wil...
|
| [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58266794
|
| [2] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-09-15/sony-
| is-s...
|
| [3]
| https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-03-17/samsung-w...
| zulu314 wrote:
| Understood but you could expect a customer support to be
| candid about it.
|
| They brushed me off with unpleasant tone + fake promises.
| gunapologist99 wrote:
| Pine Phone (also a pure Linux phone experience) is delivering
| phones within three to four weeks. Purism has no excuse.
| fsflover wrote:
| See here why they do have an excuse:
| https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/community-
| wiki/-/wikis/Freque....
| gunapologist99 wrote:
| "Purism could have avoided these delays by following the
| same model used by the PINE64 in designing the Pinephone
| by only using older components that already have good
| Linux support and launching with an existing mobile
| interface. If Purism had used the i.MX 6, the hardware
| would have been antiquated, but it could have avoided
| most of the problems it has encountered implementing the
| LCD screen, video out, cameras and power management. If
| Purism had used the i.MX 6 and Ubuntu Touch, it probably
| could have shipped in 2019, and avoided most of the
| delays, which have generated so much public criticism,
| but those would not have been good choices for the long-
| term future of the phone."
| Arnavion wrote:
| Note that "these delays" is referring to the time taken
| to develop the software for their choice of components,
| not sourcing the hardware of those components. The
| PinePhone doesn't have this problem not because of its
| choice of older components, but because Pine64 doesn't do
| any software and lets the community work it out, which it
| has.
|
| That said, the problem of components shortage is real,
| which is why the PP's Beta Edition ships with identical
| hardware to the previous Community Edition but for
| needing to use a different, worse, magnetometer. ("Worse"
| because it has no driver in the mainline kernel yet so it
| can't be used.)
| TimTheTinker wrote:
| Is PureOS compatible with any other phone besides Librem?
| ryukafalz wrote:
| Not itself, no - but Mobian is compatible with other similarly
| open phones (so basically the PinePhone and a few others) and
| runs essentially the same software: https://mobian-project.org/
|
| For other Android phones there's Droidian which is downstream
| of Mobian; I've not used it myself though so can't speak to its
| current state: https://droidian.org/
| fsflover wrote:
| Only smartphones which provide good, open documentation and
| specs can run alternative OSes. Pinephone is the only such
| smarptphone apart from Librem 5, and it can run PureOS:
| https://forum.pine64.org/showthread.php?tid=9361.
| thereddaikon wrote:
| And while I've yet to see anyone with a librem 5 other than
| journalists and youtubers my pinephone arrived last year when
| they said it would. It ain't perfect but its a real product.
| fsflover wrote:
| Yes, they definitely have problems with the phone's supply
| chain: https://puri.sm/posts/the-ball-and-supply-chain/.
| seba_dos1 wrote:
| The only phone officially supported by PureOS is Librem 5.
| There were also people adapting it to PinePhone unofficially.
| kop316 wrote:
| Something that I would offer that, though Purism does advertise,
| I do wish they would hit it home more, they give a lot to the
| FOSS community. No really, they give back A LOT.
|
| - Phosh, their phone shell, it being worked into upstream GNOME,
| and libhandy, which they started, is in upstream gtk4. GNOME
| Calls used to be a Purism app, now it is a GNOME app being
| maintained primarily by Purism.
|
| - Several of their full time staff are Debian Maintainers and
| Debian Developers. One of the full time staff is a Mobian
| Developer and is very active in maintaining/developing Mobian.
|
| - Purism has made a lot of effort to ensure that their
| applications and framework is available to the Pinephone, and to
| the greater community. Purism's work has helped advanced the
| Pinephone many times over.
|
| - Several Purism employees are active in the Pinephone community,
| and help out not only the devs, but users who need help!
|
| - For those that know my work (I have been working on MMS and VVM
| for the Pinephone/Librem 5), the Purism developers took a lot of
| time to help and mentor me so that I could get these features out
| there. They simply did not have to do that, but they did. I
| simply do not think those features would be available at all if
| it weren't for their help. (To those devs, I won't name you as I
| don't know if you want to be named, but you know who you are, You
| have my sincere gratitude.)
|
| - Their Coreboot efforts has enabled others to port coreboot to
| other laptops. Here is one example:
| https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/50924.html?thread=1900524
|
| These are just examples I am exposed to and can readily give off
| the top of my head.
|
| To me, a company that does that sort of work, I do think they are
| sincere in the fact that they have supply chain troubles, which
| is why the Librem 5 has taken so long to get into users hands.
|
| Also, I see that $799 price tag as not only buying the phone, but
| also paying the developers who do all of the wonderful things
| that I outlined above. As much as I like the Pinephone, the $150
| you pay is for just that, the phone. Most of the software
| ecosystem you see from the Pinephone comes from unpaid volunteers
| (such as myself). I'm not saying that is a bad thing, I actually
| think having such a cheap phone is great! But I don't think a lot
| of folks have these things in mind when they see the difference
| in price.
|
| And before it's asked, yes, my Librem 5 has shipped, I should get
| the package early next week.
| fataliss wrote:
| Is the expected Linus mobile os experience more of a mini laptop
| with a touchscreen or are they really going after the Android/iOS
| feel?
| Arnavion wrote:
| The latter. You can look up videos of "phosh" to see what it
| looks like.
|
| If you _want_ a mini-laptop OS because you always run it docked
| or something, you 're of course free to use a desktop-first
| shell that provides that. Though the phone-first shells also
| support that already ("convergence").
| zozbot234 wrote:
| The videos of 'phosh' one can see online are not that
| encouraging - the experience seems very sluggish and quite
| far from "daily driver" quality.
| fsflover wrote:
| It depends on how old those videos are:
| https://puri.sm/posts/librem-5-getting-faster-with-age/.
| AzzieElbab wrote:
| Big Ouch on that 2k phone
| masterof0 wrote:
| Yeah, I wonder why they didn't prioritize lowering the cost to
| make it more accessible to people? This project can only take
| of if lots of people start using the phone. I doubt a few
| hundreds of folks, mostly in first world countries, with a
| decently high income, would be a large enough crowd for this
| project's long time success, I hope they become successful. The
| laptop in the other hand, is decently priced, for what it
| offers.
| comprev wrote:
| Absolutely bonkers pricing. Looks like the niche market is die-
| hard people on FAANG engineer salaries.
| TimTheTinker wrote:
| Or journalists, or politicians, or dissidents... anyone whose
| livelihood depends on privacy.
| fsflover wrote:
| Only the made-in-USA version costs $2k.
| masterof0 wrote:
| Yeah, the other one cost 900. Not necessarily cheap.
|
| https://shop.puri.sm/shop/librem-5/
| agumonkey wrote:
| if the bill can be flatten let's make it so
| jwithington wrote:
| i had that same confusion! they should clarify that on their
| site.
| runako wrote:
| This looks very interesting. However, it does put into context
| how much value operational scale brings:
|
| - The Librem 5 specs out in the ballpark of the 2016 iPhone 7
| Plus.
|
| - My goodness it's expensive. Similarly-specced iPhones still on
| the market are in the $300 range.
|
| Obviously kill switches etc. are worth some money, but it's still
| surprising to see the magnitude of the value differential.
|
| I'm always going to root for more competition in the market, so I
| hope this does well. But I am baffled at who the target market
| is. "Is okay with outdated phone but willing to pay 3x for it"
| would seem to be a very small market.
| fsflover wrote:
| > Obviously kill switches etc. are worth some money
|
| It's much more than just kill switches:
|
| https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/community-wiki/-/wikis/Freque...
| runako wrote:
| Hence the "etc." in my comment.
|
| But the product page on the website (not the community wiki,
| which is not linked from the product page) leads with the low
| specs and the next feature is kill switches. I didn't make
| the choice of how to position the product.
| masterof0 wrote:
| You are buying into the ideology/promise/cause. Is like buying
| a $200 poster, just because it has your favorite
| singer/politician/influencer/... on it.
| neilsimp1 wrote:
| Maybe. But you're also financing the development of free
| software that is used not only by Purism but other companies
| and FOSS groups.
| spicybright wrote:
| I'm always very nervous about replacing my phone with something
| not main stream.
|
| My laptop is fine to tinker with, but I don't want some issue
| coming up making me unable to use my phone in a situation where
| I'd need it.
| fsflover wrote:
| PureOS is officially endorsed by the FSF [0], and it's the most
| popular one among the endorsed [1].
|
| [0] https://www.fsf.org/news/fsf-adds-pureos-to-list-of-
| endorsed...
|
| [1] https://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=popularity
| gunapologist99 wrote:
| If you want an actual (non-Android) Linux phone experience,
| there's only one that's actually shipping:
|
| https://pine64.com/product/pinephone-beta-edition-with-conve...
| fsflover wrote:
| But note that it's significantly less performant than Librem 5:
| https://forums.puri.sm/t/comparing-specs-of-upcoming-
| linux-p....
| gunapologist99 wrote:
| True, but from $899 to > $2,000, it's also at least 4.5 times
| as expensive (!!!) as $199 for the PinePhone.
|
| And, it exists today and runs an Arch Linux derivative like
| the SteamDeck.
|
| As they say in the old country, a device in the hand is worth
| two in the bush.
| Klonoar wrote:
| The thing is, neither of these devices is a usable daily
| driver yet for people outside of fanatics (and I don't say
| this with negativity - fanaticism is probably what builds
| these products, or sub your term here, e.g devoted).
|
| If you're looking to dabble and write apps to contribute to
| the ecosystem, the PinePhone is arguably a steal. I grabbed
| one over the Librem 5 mostly due to price and availability.
| b1n wrote:
| My PinePhone runs _significantly_ faster than my Librem 5, on
| account of my Librem 5 not existing - even after being part of
| the original kickstarter-esq funding.
| dogman144 wrote:
| I'd love to buy Purism phone but their shipping delays seem
| insane.
| SubiculumCode wrote:
| Curious, is there a way to run android apps (either natively or
| in a vm)?
| fsflover wrote:
| Yes, in Anbox: https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/community-
| wiki/-/wikis/Freque....
| GRBurst wrote:
| I am very curious about Linux phones and getting away from
| Android (Using Graphene OS RN). But my experience weren't very
| satisfying.
|
| Could someone give me a quick overview or link to different Linux
| based OS for smartphones?
|
| How is this one different from Sailfish?
|
| Happy to hear from you! :-)
| fsflover wrote:
| https://forums.puri.sm/t/comparing-specs-of-upcoming-linux-p...
|
| Sailfish is proprietary, not FLOSS.
| GRBurst wrote:
| Ah nice, short and concise and the link looks like what
| wanted, perfect
| smallerfish wrote:
| Is there any move towards a Linux-mobile equivalent of FlatPak,
| so that the same apps can be made to run on PureOS, Sailfish,
| Plasma Mobile, etc? It'd be in vendors' interest to collaborate
| on a common standard, as developers are going to find it a pain
| to have to target different distros, as has happened on desktop
| Linux. Given that it's a more or less brand new space, might as
| fix the problem before it becomes one.
| fsflover wrote:
| https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Development_Environment/Wo...
|
| > Linux-mobile equivalent
|
| Librem 5 runs desktop GNU/Linux, so you don't need any
| equivalents really.
| seba_dos1 wrote:
| There is, and it's called... well, Flatpak :)
| smallerfish wrote:
| Good - and there's legitimately consensus on using it in the
| various mobile os app stores?
| nickstinemates wrote:
| Cool let me know when its available so I can buy one.
| fsflover wrote:
| Consider supporting them with a preorder if you can. They have
| a hard time currently AFAIK.
| nickstinemates wrote:
| 180 day lead time with a warning about procurement delays
| doesn't instill a lot of confidence. Along with a $900 price
| tag seems a little too risky.
| olyjohn wrote:
| I'm desperate to get off of the iPhone / Android ecosystem. The
| problem for me is that I live in a weird spot and no cell
| reception comes to my house. I bought a Pinephone, but it doesn't
| support WiFi calling... Is there an open source phone like this
| that supports WiFi calling? I used to own a femtocell back in the
| 3g days... but I'm on an MVNO who doesn't offer one, and WiFi
| calling is the only way I can get any service at my house. I have
| a landline, but it gets so many junk phone calls, I'm about to
| disconnect it completely... Maybe I need an LTE repeater with a
| big ass antenna mounted high above my house. Seems like the only
| option I have, if those even exist.
| fsflover wrote:
| https://social.librem.one/@joao/106815850485862296
| xbmcuser wrote:
| You can get Chinese built repeaters for $100-200 I know of them
| as a friend was also thinking of installing one but he moved to
| another city so can't recommend a brand or anything
| kop316 wrote:
| > open source phone like this that supports WiFi calling
|
| Even on Android, WiFi Calling is done via a proprietary
| library, AOSP doesn't support it. As of now, no one has
| attempted to RE the protocol, so no open source solution
| exists.
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(page generated 2021-08-26 23:03 UTC)