[HN Gopher] The Rise of Mobile Wikipedia
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The Rise of Mobile Wikipedia
Author : luu
Score : 51 points
Date : 2021-08-24 04:17 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (yuri.is)
(TXT) w3m dump (yuri.is)
| vernie wrote:
| Is there a workaround for the unsearchable collapsed default view
| for mobile Wikipedia pages?
| nightpool wrote:
| If I need to search, I get around this by just scrolling to the
| bottom of the article and uncollapsing each section from the
| bottom to the top. This ends up being very fast for most
| articles, because uncollapsing the lowest section won't move
| any of the previous sections, so you can tap through them
| quickly.
| forgotmypw17 wrote:
| I don't think so, because the sections are lazy-loaded, and
| also discarded when the page is instantiated.
|
| This also means that when you press the Back button, the
| sections are collapsed, and you lose the place where you just
| were.
|
| All-around a terrible design and implementation from usability
| perspective, in my opinion.
| iggldiggl wrote:
| The text itself isn't lazy-loaded - I can load any Wikipedia
| article, go offline, and still successfully expand all
| sections. Images _are_ lazy-loaded, though, and while this
| has some merits, for the offline use-case this is equally
| somewhat annoying.
|
| Also yes about the scroll position - while at least
| occasionally (possibly within the same session, but not if
| you're closing and later re-opening the whole browser) it
| seems like Wikipedia tries remembering which sections were
| opens and which were collapsed, it happens too late in
| comparison to the browser attempting the restore your scroll
| position. So if you had scrolled farther than you can scroll
| in the completely unepxanded state of the stage, your scroll
| position will be lost.
| carlinmack wrote:
| The app allows you to search within the article. Normally apps
| are a hard sell, but it's genuinely good
| yjftsjthsd-h wrote:
| I like that it lets me save pages for offline reading
| bawolff wrote:
| The desktop view!
|
| Some people on mobile phones like the desktop view with
| timeless skin (add ?useskin=timeless to end of url).
|
| E.g.
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Border_between_Quebec_and_Newf...
| (assuming you arent autoredirected to mobile)
| ranger207 wrote:
| My biggest gripes with the mobile versions, app and website, are
| the lack of categories at the bottom of the page. It seems that
| there's been a de-emphasis of categories in general on Wikipedia.
| I hope they don't get rid of it though, because it's a fantastic
| way to organize related content. The contents of a category box
| often show relations between subjects better than the article
| itself
| [deleted]
| clipradiowallet wrote:
| Does anyone use the actual mobile app? If so, why do you prefer
| it over the mobile web version? (I have not tried it and am
| curious)
| gpas wrote:
| I use it, it's very well made. It's easy to search in different
| languages from the same field, it has tabs, favourites,
| themes...everything works.
| meibo wrote:
| The official app is genuinely well made and has nice features
| like selecting your favorite languages, saving entries in
| lists, tabs, and offline reading.
|
| I think it's one of the few things on my phone that I actually
| prefer the app version of.
| chizhik-pyzhik wrote:
| I use it so I can read wikipedia in dark mode
| franga2000 wrote:
| I don't have it anymore but I used to (like 2 years ago). It
| was genuinely one of the most well-made apps I've used.
| Everything was just so smooth and well-optimised for touch
| control.
|
| One of my favourite features were the summaries (like ther
| hover cards that sometimes appear on desktop now) and reading
| lists, which are basically bookmarks but hyper-optimised for
| Wikipedia articles. All of it was something you could already
| do with a browser, but it was just way more streamlined.
| sdumi wrote:
| I use it because I like to have all my wiki tabs in one place.
| I can also save tabs for offline reading. The app is very nice
| to use and it feels faster than the browser: one of the few
| cases where I like the app more than the web equivalent.
| Tomte wrote:
| Not anymore, the website suffices for me, but what stood out in
| my opinion is that a) the app is beautiful and b) it shows
| articles of places/features nearby.
| lacksconfidence wrote:
| > it shows articles of places/features nearby
|
| That functionality is likely the same data as
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Nearby but with a
| better interface
| Tomte wrote:
| Yes, probably. I never noticed that. In the app it's in
| your face (first start asks for location services with
| explanation what for).
| kitsunesoba wrote:
| I do. As others have said, it's built well and feels smoother
| to use than the site does.
|
| Note that this is not an issue of speed, wikipedia in the
| browser is plenty fast. It's smoothness -- the app's navigation
| model is better adapted to the use case, it's themed to match
| the OS perfectly, and there's no extraneous browser chrome or
| other little browserisms dragging down the experience.
|
| If the iPad version got a Mac Catalyst port I'd probably use
| that on the desktop too.
| occz wrote:
| I do. Given that it's a native app, it behaves a bit better on
| mobile than its web-counterpart. Links to Wikipedia open in the
| app, so the experience is not that disrupted when switching
| from web (or other apps) to the app.
| hdjjhhvvhga wrote:
| Anyone has an idea why the Germans use the mobile app so much?
| minikites wrote:
| The German edition of Wikipedia is notable in many ways, it's
| arguably the second largest after English:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Wikipedia#Characteristi...
| antasvara wrote:
| Those characteristics don't explain why it has the largest
| relative view share in the Wikipedia mobile app.
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| Mobile wikipedia is one of the biggest scourges of the HN
| comments. People just won't stop linking to it, because they know
| better than me which version of wikipedia I'd prefer to view.
|
| Stop posting en.m.wikipedia.org links!
| mypastself wrote:
| At this point the majority of web browsing is done from mobile
| devices, around 60% (at least in the U.S.):
|
| https://www.perficient.com/insights/research-hub/mobile-vs-d...
|
| I suspect the number is lower on HN, but it's still a losing
| battle. It's also fairly easy to miss the "m." when you're
| copying a URL.
| paxys wrote:
| It isn't done out of malice. People simply copy paste whatever
| is in their browser.
|
| "m." subdomains are just a totally outdated concept and I wish
| they would disappear entirely. It is trivial for the web server
| to detect what device type, OS, screen size etc. the user is on
| and serve content accordingly.
| [deleted]
| handrous wrote:
| I use the "m." subdomain on some sites on purpose, when on
| the desktop--though not on Wikipedia, as they cut _so much_
| content out of the "m" site, it's awful, I don't even like
| it on mobile, though if it actually had all the content I'd
| probably prefer it everywhere.
|
| That's more convenient than having to change my user agent or
| simply having mobile versions unavailable unless I shrink my
| browser window down to phone-sized.
| grlass wrote:
| I prefer m.xkcd.com because the alt-text is easier to
| access
| dspillett wrote:
| _> "m." subdomains are just a totally outdated concept_
|
| Yes. Some might argue otherwise, but I'm with you there
| _except_ ...
|
| ... sometimes the mobile version of a page is preferable as
| it cuts out a load of crap including adverts and other
| distractions, just giving you the information actually being
| linked to. So "m." type links or other "force mobile view"
| options can be accidentally useful for a purpose beyond what
| their designer intended.
|
| _> It is trivial for the web server to detect what device
| [properties]_
|
| No, it is not trivial to do this _reliably_ server-side with
| no client-side assistance. It is much better where possible
| to do it client-side with well-designed CSS (maybe, but not
| necessarily, making use of media queries and such).
|
| There is an exception here too: if you want to send less data
| to the mobile client, instead of sending everything you would
| send to others and adjusting styles to alter the display for
| small screens and finger-based input, then you need to either
| try detect the UA's properties or given the user an explicit
| "full or minimal" option (which may put you back to offering
| an "m." URL or equivalent so a user can jump direct to the
| minimal version).
| marcosdumay wrote:
| If your site is not responsible and you have a mobile
| version, please, place a mobile selector on the header of
| your pages, and a cookie on the client with the option.
| onkoe wrote:
| It is out of malice. And I have the same malice https://en.m.
| wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia%3AEnable_mobile_ve...
| agumonkey wrote:
| I think wikipedia would be smart to add a quick switch button
| at the top. both versions have value IMO
| LeifCarrotson wrote:
| They're linking to the mobile version because they're entering
| the comment with a mobile phone that makes it far easier to
| copy the full URL and makes it, well, not difficult, but harder
| than with a full keyboard to edit out the subdomain.
|
| If I'm on a desktop, have a moment, and see one that's
| particularly egregious, I often respond with a comment to the
| full version linking to the appropriate table of contents
| anchor.
| tshaddox wrote:
| Well, the "mobile" Wikipedia design is vastly better on desktop
| than the default desktop design, but I suppose that's a matter
| of personal preference.
|
| The only sense in which a mobile link "forces" you to see a
| specific design is that en.wikipedia will redirect to
| en.m.wikipedia on mobile devices, but the inverse is not the
| case: en.m.wikipedia will _not_ redirect to en.wikipedia on a
| desktop computer.
|
| But here's the thing: the only way for me to ensure that all
| Wikipedia pages will use the mobile design on my desktop is to
| either 1. create an account to change my theme preference and
| always be logged in on all devices, or 2. use some browser
| extension. Both of those options are roughly as difficult, and
| option 2 is also available for you to ensure that you always
| see the desktop design!
| rjsw wrote:
| It would be good if HN could automatically change
| en.m.wikipedia.org links to en.wikipedia.org ones when a post
| is submitted.
|
| And change any Reddit ones to point to old.reddit.com.
| Arnavion wrote:
| Why does your preference for en.wikipedia.org and
| old.reddit.com take precedence over my preference for
| en.m.wikipedia.org and old.reddit.com ?
| riffic wrote:
| I'm in full agreement with you. Perhaps sites could
| automatically convert en.m.wikipedia.org into en.wikipedia.org.
|
| or you can do this client-side with an extension or
| tampermonkey sort of fix.
|
| To anyone pasting in wp links: be kind, take the m out of the
| url when sharing links.
| thamer wrote:
| Interesting to see that people dislike the mobile version so
| much! I only use the mobile version, it's so much more
| readable.
|
| I literally wrote a script that does the exact opposite of
| what you suggest!
|
| I have one script that runs on all pages and converts all
| Wikipedia links to the mobile version, while another that
| runs on Wikipedia only and automatically redirects to the
| mobile version if I somehow land on a non-mobile Wikipedia
| page. It also has a shortcut to switch between mobile and
| desktop, and takes the referrer into account so that once
| I've switched to the desktop version links aren't pointing to
| the mobile version again. It has a couple more features like
| a shortcut to edit the page, since I often contribute.
| Arnavion wrote:
| >I only use the mobile version, it's so much more readable.
|
| Same. Once I discovered that, and that the mobile site
| didn't have the random stalls from loading
| login.wikimedia.org, I started using it exclusively. The
| hardest part was retraining my muscle memory to type !wm
| instead of !wiki when searching for something.
| bee_rider wrote:
| It seems like we're rapidly converging on the idea
| "websites could be dumb content, and the browsers should
| decide how it should be laid out." Perhaps we can have
| something like this, maybe in the far distant future of 25
| years ago...
| thamer wrote:
| I can't edit the original post, but here's the script if
| anyone's interested:
| https://greasyfork.org/en/scripts/431384-switch-to-mobile-
| wi...
|
| The one to rewrite all WP links on all pages is part of a
| larger script which I haven't cleaned up yet, but this
| already provides an automatic switch to mobile if you
| happen to load a desktop version of the page.
| crazygringo wrote:
| There already is a Chrome extension:
|
| https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/mobile2desktop-
| wik...
|
| I stopped using it a while ago because it wound up breaking
| something else, I don't remember what it was exactly though.
|
| But honestly this is just something _Wikipedia itself_ should
| handle -- if I 'm logged in to Wikipedia, give me a setting
| to "always redirect mobile to desktop".
|
| Wikipedia _created_ the problem with the "m" subdomain, they
| ought to be the ones fixing it too.
| sharikone wrote:
| Perhaps it's me but I like to be able to edit articles and see
| discussions, and I haven't figured out how to do that from the
| mobile version.
|
| So I find myself constantly fighting the website to access the
| Desktop version
| nmstoker wrote:
| I also like the section menus for pages that the mobile version
| dispenses with (which is annoying when you want to share a
| specific section with someone, all the more important as
| finding text on a page for the minimised sections that mobile
| uses is v. awkward). Plus it hides other content at the end of
| articles (eg primarily the categories section but also other
| boxes/details too)
|
| The version you get served when using an m. URL but forcing the
| mobile browser to view Desktop pages is something of a
| compromise - it has a sharper design than the proper desktop
| mode but it still lacks the categories.
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(page generated 2021-08-25 23:01 UTC)