[HN Gopher] At Shul, We Drink Single Malt: On "A Fortress in Bro...
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At Shul, We Drink Single Malt: On "A Fortress in Brooklyn"
Author : drdee
Score : 59 points
Date : 2021-08-18 00:33 UTC (22 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (lareviewofbooks.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (lareviewofbooks.org)
| smitty1e wrote:
| Reading this, I was struck by a similarity in the strength of the
| distinctiveness (obviously not the content) between the Hasidim
| and the Amish.
| not_throw_away wrote:
| And that was the basis of an in-joke in the movie The Frisco
| Kid when Gene Wilder called out to the landsmann !
| cainxinth wrote:
| The urban Amish
| steviedotboston wrote:
| While their way of dress seems similar, the comparisons
| really stop there. Hasidim don't have an opposition to
| technology. They drive, use electricity, have cell phones,
| etc. B&H Photo in NY is run by Satmar Hasidim, for example.
| MaysonL wrote:
| Well, both groups also have many more children than
| average, thus requiring ever-expanding amounts of real
| estate.
| TchoBeer wrote:
| >have cell phones
|
| My impression was that this isn't true? It's at least true
| of some Hasidim, maybe Satmar was different.
| schoen wrote:
| I think there are lots of other parallels you could draw.
|
| * Religion is supposed to define almost every aspect of
| life and culture.
|
| * Unlike many other Jewish and Christian movements and
| communities, both groups emphasize visible, conscious,
| active separatism from surrounding cultures. (Whereas other
| orthodox Jews not uncommonly wear clothes typical of their
| neighbors and work in secular cultural vocations, like
| secular university teaching or even being the host of
| Jeopardy.)
|
| * As a sibling comment pointed out, having lots of kids is
| encouraged.
|
| * There is a process by which local authorities can
| interpret the rules, and their interpretations are binding
| on their communities. (If you don't like them, you need to
| leave the community to be subject to a different
| community's interpretation.)
|
| * There are different communities with different
| interpretations and traditions, but, within certain
| parameters, they may respect and accept each other,
| intermarry, cooperate in various ways, and so on.
|
| The hasidim do also regulate the use of technology by their
| members (this article alludes to Internet restrictions, for
| example), but maybe on a "default allow" rather than
| "default deny" basis.
|
| It seems like the Amish prioritize keeping their
| communities based around certain kinds of work (farming and
| small-scale crafts and manufacturing), and also keeping
| them rural. Hasidim have made a switch to urban (and, as
| the article notes, suburban) living.
| dragonwriter wrote:
| > Hasidim don't have an opposition to technology.
|
| Technically, as I understand it, neither do the Amish. They
| have opposition to _uses_ of technology that they feel
| undermine the social, and particularly family, structure.
| This may result on bans on technology which is seen as
| prone to such use and for which there isn 't a combination
| of positive use and prescribed manner of use that
| adequately mitigates the problem (the exact boundaries of
| which differing between different Amish groups.)
| cainxinth wrote:
| I've been shopping at B&H for decades. The similarity goes
| beyond clothes.
|
| The Hassids and the Amish basically decided that their
| society should, as much as possible, try to replicate their
| existence in 18th century Europe.
|
| The Amish have gone further in that attempt, but both want
| to block out modern influences to a large extent.
|
| Not saying it's good or bad, but that's what they are
| doing.
| alisonkisk wrote:
| Nothing except clothing and religious spiritual belief is
| "18th Century".
|
| An on-line camera store is not 18th Century.
| flerchin wrote:
| There's not a strict religious group in the world that seems to
| be happy.
| weimerica wrote:
| You only hear the malcontents.
| alisonkisk wrote:
| There's not a secular group that seems to be happy either.
| yaacov wrote:
| I know a good number of Hasidim (no Satmars though) and they
| seem about as happy on average as everyone else, maybe a little
| happier.
| JasonFruit wrote:
| You'd have to talk to them directly to hear about the people
| who are completely satisfied with their lives in strict
| religious groups. Naturally, such a group isn't for everyone,
| and drama and conflict make more interesting stories, so that's
| what you see in news and fiction.
| avipars wrote:
| Capturing all the jews here
| prvc wrote:
| >Restrictive covenants that allow private owners to discriminate
| on the basis of race, ethnicity, or religion were deemed illegal
| by the Supreme Court in 1948, and the 1968 Fair Housing Act
| prohibits refusing to sell or rent on the basis of membership in
| a protected class. But in this case, it was the protected class
| doing the discriminating.
|
| The article was not clear about this, but one gathers that these
| laws were never enforced for that reason?
| alisonkisk wrote:
| >> But in this case, it was the protected class doing the
| discriminating.
|
| That's a Category Error. "Religion" is a protected class.
| "Jewish" is not a protected class.
| Gunax wrote:
| My guess is it was not enforced because it's a politicaloy
| savvy community and there wasn't sufficient outrage to justify
| enforcement.
| oh_sigh wrote:
| This article confuses the idea that certain race/ethnicity are
| "protected classes", versus the idea of race/ethnicity itself
| being a protected class. It's always a "protected class" doing
| the discriminating, because everyone has a race/ethnicity.
| There's no special law that protects Jews and blacks but
| doesn't protect Indians or whites.
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(page generated 2021-08-18 23:02 UTC)