[HN Gopher] I was a teacher for 17 years, but couldn't read or w...
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I was a teacher for 17 years, but couldn't read or write
Author : ptr2voidStar
Score : 199 points
Date : 2021-08-01 01:11 UTC (21 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.bbc.co.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.bbc.co.uk)
| 1MachineElf wrote:
| His says his writing level is roughly 6th grade, and the story
| reads like it too. I believe it. Illiteracy was the standard for
| humanity not long ago, and yet there were still teachers.
| dorkwood wrote:
| The story was written by the journalist, Sarah McDermott, and
| not by John Corcoran himself.
| mkl wrote:
| Despite the first person perspective, at the bottom it says
| "Written by Sarah McDermott". Maybe he dictated it, or parts of
| it.
| cfn wrote:
| I knew someone more or less like him. My friend went through high
| school and later even got into university. He was able to read
| but very slowly and he read everyday. He had this very large (and
| complicated) romance with him and he would read one page per day
| pointing at each word painfully slowly. I have no idea if he
| managed to understand the story or if it was just an exercise.
| Just like the person in the article, he was very popular with
| girls and managed to pull a number of similar stunts to go
| through tests and exams.
|
| Eventually he dropped out of university and got a job. This was
| the 90s and he started playing with computers and something just
| clicked inside. Sudenly he could read normally and became quite
| proficient with computers back then. I suppose it was some kind
| of learning disability that went away with time and persistence
| on his part.
|
| It also shows that schools are not equiped to deal with learning
| disabilities and push those pupils forward in the hope the
| problem goes away. BTW, this was in Europe, so it is not a US
| specific problem.
| camjohnson26 wrote:
| The author of the article was eventually diagnosed as dyslexic.
|
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Corcoran_(author)
| Ichthypresbyter wrote:
| A friend who worked as a doctor in the Fens of East Anglia said
| that many of the older farmers she treated (in the early 2010s)
| were essentially illiterate. If she gave them a form or a letter,
| they would hand it to their wife to read because they considered
| reading to be women's work.
| hogFeast wrote:
| > If he had called on me I was going to get out of my chair and
| take two steps, grab my chest, drop to the floor and hope they
| called 911.
|
| Used this tactic many times myself. You pull it once, they call
| 911. You pull it twice, they usually do it again. You pull it
| three times...an awkward silence fills the room...after the sixth
| time, my boss just carried on with the meeting, and I stopped
| getting invited. I think they call this life hacking.
|
| I now do it everywhere...in the line at the DMV _clutches heart_
| , wife nagging _clutches heart_ , kid wants new shoes _clutches
| heart_. People say you can 't outrun your problems...in reality,
| all you need to do is stay calm, pretend to have a heart attack,
| and your problems just melt away. I think I am going to write a
| self-help book.
| going_ham wrote:
| Can you elaborate how you fake the heart attack when you are in
| different situations? Your idea seems really interesting as a
| life hack. There must be specific ways to clutch your heart?
| amelius wrote:
| Put a self-inflating armband around your upper arm (like
| those in blood-pressure meters), let it inflate without
| anyone noticing, and the pulse in that arm will disappear.
| [deleted]
| hackeraccount wrote:
| There a funny short story I read in H.S. - The Verger by Somerset
| Maugham - about a guy who's in a position not unlike this. He's
| illiterate but competent. He doesn't bother to hide it though and
| is fired from is job as a verger because of that. It's a short
| read as I remember so I won't ruin the end but the punch line
| really stuck with me for some reason.
| xyzzy21 wrote:
| The extreme of "Those who can't do, teach"???
| high_byte wrote:
| waiting for the next article, "I was CTO for 17 years, but
| couldn't code"
| arp242 wrote:
| I know you're joking, but I have actually had coworkers who
| literally could not program at all. And I'm not talking about
| high-pressure situations like interviews, non-realistic
| examples like algorithms, or a one-off fluke: they consistently
| couldn't program even the most basic of stuff.
|
| How these people managed to stay employed as programmers is
| doing non-programming tasks and such, and copy/paste from Stack
| Overflow.
| high_byte wrote:
| haha that was expected. I'm waiting to hear about imposter
| managers. and no, not imposter-syndrome managers, and not
| managers who are not expected to know how to code. I mean
| actual imposters who are expected to code, can't, and still
| nailed high profile positions.
| siva7 wrote:
| the role of a CTO isn't either about coding ;)
| high_byte wrote:
| and a teacher's isn't about reading :D
| BrandoElFollito wrote:
| This also shows how poor the school system was it they did not
| uncover his illiteracy earlier. In France at least there was such
| an amount of loud reading at school that it would be hard to
| hide.
|
| I ready the article with a strong dislike for the guy since I
| knew he was a teacher. I was pissed off for the pupils.
|
| But it was not that bad, he was a teacher of PE where beside a
| limited technical knowledge (at the level he was in) the
| important part are social skills. So maybe it was for the better
| after all.
| larusso wrote:
| First time I read about this (Not from the US). I wonder what's
| with his Highschool/College degree? I mean by his own words he
| said that he cheated big time.
| hliyan wrote:
| Also not from the US, but I think read about him many many
| years ago in Reader's Digest. It was a long form that had a lot
| more information. I recognized the story because of this
| anecdote:
|
| "I passed my blue book out the window to him and he answered
| the questions for me."
|
| But the Reader's Digest version mentioned that he was dyslexic
| (which I don't think the BBC article mentions) and that he
| taught almost exclusively using audio/visual presentations,
| activity based learning and guest speakers.
| denton-scratch wrote:
| It does sound like he was dyslexic ("for me it was like
| opening a Chinese newspaper "). But the speed at which he
| eventually acquired reading and writing doesn't seem
| consistent with dyslexia; I figure there was some other
| problem interfering with hiis literacy.
| archibaldJ wrote:
| Computationally we don't understand what dyslexia is.
| Neuroplasticity is happening all the time. Perhaps at one
| point something changes and he has the ability to aquire
| the writing form of a language agian.
|
| Similiar to in mathematics where it's a very different
| process reasoning with symbols v.s. trying to visualize the
| mathematical construct through communication. Maybe it's
| difficult to aquire the writing form of graph theory when
| you are 19. But when you try to do that again at 25
| suddenly you can read all of Paul Erdos' papers less
| daunthingly.
| denton-scratch wrote:
| > Perhaps at one point something changes and he has the
| ability to aquire the writing form of a language agian.
|
| That sounds like what I was wondering. Perhaps something
| "snaps" into or out of place "catastrophically" (in the
| sense of almost discontinuously, in the context of the
| usual timescale of psychological changes). For example,
| it sounds like his loss of fear occurred pretty suddenly.
|
| I feel a bit awkward speculating about the mind of
| someone who I know of from just a single essay. That
| said, he's published a scathingly-honest record of his
| fascinating history with writing, and presumably he wants
| it read and discussed. And it's about him, so we discuss
| him, I guess.
| nindalf wrote:
| He says it took him 7 years to feel literate. Does that
| seem quick to you?
| philliphaydon wrote:
| This was after he finished his job. I assume he was
| spending a lot of time learning during those 7 years.
| Good on him tho.
| ghoshbishakh wrote:
| I still don't get it. How is it possible that he managed to go
| through the system.
| booleandilemma wrote:
| He mentions he got girls to do his homework for him. When half
| the population wants to see you succeed you're going to have an
| easy time.
| IntrepidWorm wrote:
| Case and point: I wear glasses. In fact, I'm almost blind
| without them: my effective vision ends at about 3 feet. Though
| I am able to perceive distinction between large objects and
| people, everything dissolves into a fuzzy mess. In American
| public schools (in the northeast US, at least) in the early
| 90s, schools would test student vision every year during
| elementary/primary school years. They would use the traditional
| eye test sheet, with strings of letters in smaller and smaller
| font vertically stacked, to be read at a distance.
|
| It took them 5 years to figure out that I couldn''t see
| anything other than what was immediately in front of me. I was
| a smart kid, and never had problems in the classroom as I sat
| in the front row and listened very carefully to what was going
| in.
|
| I would memorize the eye test sheet while standing in line at
| the nurses office, waiting to be tested. They never suspected
| anything was amiss, and routinely reported to my parents that I
| had perfect vision.
|
| I was finally discovered when my father, trying to be clever
| while we were out shopping, asked me about an ice cream parlor
| in the distance. Despite the name of the shop being written
| clearly above the shopfront, I bombed the question and my
| father realized that I couldn''t see what he was talking about.
| inglor_cz wrote:
| "I would memorize the eye test sheet"
|
| There were so many of us...
| Aerroon wrote:
| I have poor vision as well. We didn't have eye sight tests. I
| couldn't see anything written on the blackboard for at least
| a few years. I realized I had poor vision and even timidly
| asked about it a few times. It went nowhere and just like any
| kid, I felt like it was my own personal moral failing that I
| couldn't see well enough. (Every failing as a kid feels like
| that.)
|
| The result was that I spent a few years not being able to see
| what was written on the blackboard. I had to mostly figure it
| out by myself. The worst were the tests that teachers only
| wrote on the blackboard. I'd inevitably have to quietly ask
| someone around me to tell me what the questions were. I don't
| think I failed a single test because of it even though
| talking was forbidden.
|
| The funny part was that when my parents eventually took me to
| an optometrist they tried to convince me that wearing glasses
| won't be that bad. I distinctly remember that situation
| because I kept thinking "I _asked_ for them _years_ ago! "
|
| Eventually my eyesight became bad enough again that the
| glasses I had didn't cut it anymore. I fell a little bit back
| into my old habits, but it wasn't as bad as before. Sitting
| closer and all of that helped immensely.
| arp242 wrote:
| Why would you memorize the eye tests? You were afraid that
| your low vision was "discovered"? Wouldn't that be a good
| thing?
|
| I'm actually really confused by your story to be honest, I
| think there's some part that I'm missing somehow.
| ThePowerOfDirge wrote:
| These "anecdotes" make my blood boil.
| arp242 wrote:
| That seems excessively strong. There's probably just an
| assumption about something somewhere I'm not getting
| because of different cultural context or the like.
| fastaguy88 wrote:
| I did very well in elementary school, though by 4th or 5th
| grade I often asked to be seated near the front because of
| the "glare" on the black board. I did not realize I could not
| see until a science class about clouds, and I could not tell
| that the sky was overcast, not blue. I was also surprised to
| see that street lights were points, not large haloes.
|
| I've heard many similar stories from nearsighted friends.
| code_duck wrote:
| His success at gaming the system has plenty of applicability to
| modern issues with coordinated cheating, purchasing papers,
| plagarism and so forth. Sports stars who somehow go through
| school without learning anything academic is a serious issue in
| the modern day as well. That higher view of the issue like a
| more interesting topic than the sensational extent to which he
| fit the bill by falling short of even literacy.
|
| As for him, he was apparently resourceful and charismatic, good
| at sports, had adequate innate math skills and was dedicated to
| gaming the system.
|
| "So I was going to be a teacher's pet and do everything
| necessary to pass that system. I wanted to be an athlete - I
| had athletic skills, and I had maths skills"
|
| "I ran around with college kids, I dated the valedictorian -
| the student with the highest grades who gives a speech at the
| graduation ceremony, I was the homecoming king"
| Broken_Hippo wrote:
| A combination of cheating, life hacks, folks enabling him, and
| being labeled as a bad - and then good - student, which
| diverted people's attention away from his lack of reading.
|
| And to be fair: Some of this was the time period. We catch a
| few more learning disabilities now (not enough, though) and
| have more tools to help. We just didn't screen so much in the
| 50s.
| IntrepidWorm wrote:
| Because despite his illiteracy, he is a clever and resourceful
| person- with enough cleverness and a bit of luck, its possible
| to do lots of stuff like this. He was able to circumvent the
| barriers imposed by illiteracy through deception, careful
| manipulation, or outright swindling. While iliteracy is
| definitely a huge concern in the world, I hope I'm not the only
| one out there to admire him for grifting his way through
| multiple schools and jobs...!
| [deleted]
| wyclif wrote:
| I used to be an ESL teacher for foreign students transitioning to
| English in the USA before I was in tech. I've also taught high
| school English, Latin, and History. These days the only English
| teaching I do is helping adults learn to read. John Corcoran's
| story is incredibly inspiring and courageous. It's hard to
| imagine the amount of courage it took for him to go public with
| his illiteracy. It's never too late to right a wrong in your
| life. If you know an adult who cannot read, please encourage them
| to seek help. There are many people who are generous in donating
| their time to teaching reading skills in a non-judgemental and
| caring way.
| jmercouris wrote:
| Incredible, but I still can't help but feel like he is an idiot.
|
| Noticing an obvious deficiency in your life and doing nothing
| about it is in fact idiotic.
| inglor_cz wrote:
| "Noticing an obvious deficiency in your life and doing nothing
| about it is in fact idiotic."
|
| So, how many people are overweight and fat these days?
|
| Maybe some things aren't easy to solve. If someone told me to
| learn writing in Chinese, I would be very creative in finding
| ways how to do without. It is just too hard for me at 43 years
| of age.
|
| People with certain disabilities may find English spelling (a
| notoriously tricky terrain full of illogical exceptions)
| similarly overwhelming.
| SamPatt wrote:
| He did fix the deficiency. It just took longer than most.
| xupybd wrote:
| Sometimes we hide something as a child and it gets so ingrained
| in us that we don't question the child's logic. We just live
| life hiding something that a child decided had to be hidden.
| CTDOCodebases wrote:
| I once worked with a Chef that couldn't read. He made it through
| culinary school, had his own catering company at one point and
| owned two residential properties. He was a charismatic guy but
| very cunning and deceptive. I figured it out after a couple of
| weeks working with him. I tried to offer him help but he just
| brushed it off and said that he was dyslexic. Smart phones have
| many features that make it easy for illiterate people to survive.
| timonoko wrote:
| On Google translate you can test new phonetic spelling. "Wii shal
| miit tu dei in Nyy Jork" works best in Polish, Icelandic and
| Finnish. I suggest we just ignore weird sounds like th and d and
| just use "th" as "tho" sounds reasonably good in those languages.
| timonoko wrote:
| Correction: those languages seem to have already "th" == "th".
| tuukkah wrote:
| That's weird as "th" is pronounced "th" in Finnish and there
| is no "th" sound:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_phonology#Consonants
| juki wrote:
| "th" isn't really used in Finnish (at least in modern
| kirjakieli). Even loan words just drop the "h" (e.g.
| "termostaatti"). There probably are some exceptions, but
| none that I can think of right now.
| sampo wrote:
| Finnish has only 3 words, all loanwords that didn't drop
| the h: thai (+ thai food, thai boxing etc), theeta (name
| of the Greek letter) and thorax (medical term, common
| word is rintakeha).
|
| https://www.kielitoimistonsanakirja.fi/#/th?searchMode=al
| l
| tuukkah wrote:
| That's surprising to me, perhaps because "th" appears in
| inflected words such as "ovathan", dialectal words such
| as "vasthaan", compound words such as "oluthana" and
| names such as "Elisabeth" or "Porthania".
|
| Also, I wonder what's the share of the pronounciations
| "t", "th" and "th" in the word "theremin".
|
| (You can download a list of word forms encountered in
| some selected written texts here:
| https://kaino.kotus.fi/sanat/taajuuslista/parole.php)
| sampo wrote:
| I only searched for 'th' in the beginning of the word. We
| can add these to the previous result:
|
| triathlon, smoothie, maybe also apartheid
|
| Also the dictionary finds huithapeli, hathataa,
| rustholli, but I don't think these have 'th' as a
| phoneme.
|
| https://www.kielitoimistonsanakirja.fi/#/*th*?searchMode=
| onl...
| tuukkah wrote:
| Nice new findings in the dictionary!
|
| What do you mean by having 'th' as a phoneme? If you mean
| the sound "th", I don't think any of the words are
| pronounced with one in Finnish, typically. Rather, they
| have a "t" sound followed by a "h", or just a "t".
| nindalf wrote:
| Is this comment chain supposed to be related to the story about
| the teacher who couldn't read? Seems like a software bug.
| timonoko wrote:
| Yes. I forgot to explain.
|
| I learned to read in one month like any other Finnish child
| ever. But it took a month longer to understand what I was
| reading. Like my small brain was using all its capacity in
| pronunciation and I forgot what I just said.
|
| English is like Chinese, you have to learn all pictorials and
| their meanings. Learning the pronunciation is different
| process. That is why English takes years and years to learn.
| nayuki wrote:
| It would be nice if they used IPA instead of yet another
| informal nonstandard system.
| timonoko wrote:
| If you try "Wii shal miit tu dei in Nyy Jork" in Google, it
| works quite well in Inglish too, except tho "Nyy Jork".
|
| It would be easy to organize meeting of all Anglos and accept
| this as an alternate spelling. Polish have some weird
| sibilants, so that it could be the starting point.
| krisoft wrote:
| > It would be easy to organize meeting of all Anglos
|
| You must be surelly joking there. :)
| arp242 wrote:
| I can understand what's intended with "Wii shal miit tu dei
| in Nyy Jork" without even knowing what system is being used.
| In IPA this is "Sael mi:t t@'deI In nju: jo:k", and I have no
| idea what that says at all.
|
| I find IPA fairly inaccessible for the casual user. There's a
| reason other systems exist.
| marviio wrote:
| My grandfather was a teacher and in the 50s he started noting
| that trouble learning to read/write wasn't linked to lack of
| intelligence. He started groups for kids (mostly guys) with what
| we now call dyslexia and tried to help them. He had to invent
| material and methods.
|
| On his eightieth birthday some of his students, now in their 50s,
| told how they had always felt stupid until he showed them they
| were not. Now they had businesses and successful careers.
| pfrrp wrote:
| Great story. He's an excellent speaker and very charismatic.
|
| For those interested he has a non profit focused on teaching
| reading and writing: https://www.johncorcoranfoundation.org/
| sparrish wrote:
| The first failure of his illiteracy sits solely with his parents.
|
| So many of us parents put the burden of our children's learning
| on teachers when the responsibility is squarely ours.
|
| If my son is in 5th grade and can't read, it's my responsibility
| to teach him or get him the help he needs to be able to learn.
| john579 wrote:
| No one noticed for 17 years because none of his students could
| read or write either. They probably got a better education as a
| result.
| gnicholas wrote:
| (2018)
| mmmuhd wrote:
| I told my friends about this article,they replied no this could
| never happen in the US, this could only happen in countries like
| Nigeria. What a world we live in.
| jasonhansel wrote:
| Here's a question: what can be done to make tech more accessible
| for illiterate people? That seems to be a side of accessibility
| that usually gets overlooked.
| ajsnigrutin wrote:
| Put symbols and images on stuff... like we already do on most
| devices. Play, stop, pause, fastforward and reverse are
| pracitcally never written out in text.
|
| In reality, teaching them to read first, would be best.
| cwdegidio wrote:
| My grandfather, born in the back hills of West Virginia, was
| forced to leave school when he was around 6 years old to chop
| lumber so his family had enough to survive. After he left WV, he
| worked a press at a forge and was a landscaper at night an on the
| weekends. He never has learned how to read, and sadly he is in
| the early stages of dementia so I think that ship has sailed.
| But... he was always a whiz with finances.
|
| He was the kind of guy that can take a dollar on Monday and give
| you back $100 on Friday. He owns, I believe at this point, 8
| properties including his own home.
|
| I always regret not staying back home for a bit to try and help
| him, but I think by the time I would have been in a place to do
| it he would have told me he had just accepted the fact he would
| never learn to read. I can't imagine going through life like he
| did, how much I would hav missed.
|
| But it also was always an inspiration to me. Every time I would
| feel my motivation for something academic or professional start
| to wane, I remind myself that this man who gave me and my
| siblings anything to help us succeed didn't get to do 90% of the
| things I take for granted.
|
| It's really sad to see some folks on this thread call this man an
| idiot. From first hand experience, that's not necessarily the
| case and often people like him become far more clever than I'll
| ever be as a means of survival.
| inglor_cz wrote:
| One of my grandfathers was illiterate as well. Not a finance
| whiz, but not stupid either. He was a rural blacksmith and he
| was rather good with engines and small appliances, repairing
| them for paying customers.
|
| This is also a good moment to meditate on "right of repair". As
| recently as approx. 1970, most of the machinery in daily use
| could be repaired by a skillful, even though illiterate,
| person. The advent of semiconductors did away with that and
| nowadays even highly qualified people struggle to update a
| firmware against the vendor's wishes.
| everyone wrote:
| You are implying finance people are intelligent???
| inglor_cz wrote:
| Please read the original comment I am replying to. It had
| nothing to do with finance industry and everything to do
| with small-scale household economy.
| cwdegidio wrote:
| It's interesting you mention this. I got a chance to visit
| the family holler (rural mountain farmstead) when I was a
| teenager. Everyone back there was still driving old pickups,
| most of their tools were pretty old as well. You could tell a
| lot of things were kept just because of that very idea that
| they could repair them.
|
| I know my grandfather, growing up as poor as he did, NEVER
| threw anything broken away until he was absolutely convinced
| that it could not be repaired. I wouldn't be suprised if most
| of his gardening equipment was from the 60's and 70's.
| beckman466 wrote:
| > I can't imagine going through life like he did, how much I
| would hav missed.
|
| Yeah your granddads story is impressive. I cannot imagine not
| being able to read and write.
|
| > He was the kind of guy that can take a dollar on Monday and
| give you back $100 on Friday. He owns, I believe at this point,
| 8 properties including his own home.
|
| So he owned other peoples homes? Ugh I hate this system. Why is
| absentee ownership a thing, why is it seen as 'success'?
| Lording over others isn't 'success' in my book. I think it's
| inhumane for some to be able to extract a toll from others for
| such a basic need. Yes the system makes it legal, but
| 'landlords' shouldn't kid themselves that they are providing
| value to others.
| hutzlibu wrote:
| "Yes the system makes it legal, but 'landlords' shouldn't kid
| themselves that they are providing value to others."
|
| A landlord who takes care of building and maintainig the
| house etc. is not providing value?
|
| You think that happens automatically?
|
| I mean sure, it would be nice to live in a world where
| everyone is wealthy and capable enough to own and maintain
| their home. But there are actually people who like to rent to
| not have that responsibility. They just pay money regulary
| and have a home. And there are surely lots of sharks in the
| housing and renting market, but that does not mean renting
| per se is evil.
| Kye wrote:
| >> _" A landlord who takes care of building and maintainig
| the house etc"_
|
| How many actually do this? I don't know anyone who
| complains about landlords who do something useful. For
| example: there are people who build/buy and maintain
| properties to house queer people who've been kicked out of
| their homes after coming out or being outed. Often _by_
| landlords.
|
| No one would hate landlords as a class if useful ones were
| at all representative.
| AuryGlenz wrote:
| If you saw a typical apartment unit after people moved
| out you wouldn't be asking that.
|
| My parents own a 12 unit apartment building in a small
| town, and my dad is up there multiple times a week.
| There's regular stuff like cleaning hallways, and then
| there's stuff like "the tenant on the top floor installed
| a dishwasher themselves and it leaked while they were
| gone flooding their unit and the one beneath it."
|
| After most people move out the carpet needs to be
| replaced and the walls repainted at the minimum.
| Kye wrote:
| Respect is a two-way street. How many of those problems
| came from the ways people coped with absent landlords not
| fixing things? How many calls to fix the dishwasher
| preceded the self-install? How many of those people are
| on their nth slumlord and long past giving the new one
| the benefit of the doubt? You only have one side of the
| story from one apartment building.
|
| Maybe your parents are good ones. Nothing I've heard from
| the other side gives me reason to trust this account.
| chiph wrote:
| "Absent" landlord here. I pay a management firm to handle
| repairs. If I find out they aren't responding to tenant
| maintenance requests, I'm going to start looking to
| replace them with another firm.
|
| But I love my management firm. They get me discounts on
| appliances, repairs, carpet & paint because they have
| agreements with local suppliers. If I had been the one to
| call for a quote to replace the air conditioner, not only
| would it have been much pricier, I would have gone to the
| back of the line (because of COVID equipment
| shortages...) to get the work scheduled. Instead, it was
| replaced in only 2 days, they did a great job, and it's
| more efficient - saving my tenant money on their utility
| bills.
|
| Are there slumlords out there? Of course. But you're
| painting with a pretty broad brush here and it's unfair.
| Kye wrote:
| Why is my broad brush unfair and not that of the person I
| replied to? That's quite a thing to skip over. Mine is at
| least based on much more than one 12 unit building. Your
| bias is showing.
| yesenadam wrote:
| > But there are actually people who like to rent
|
| I've never met any. Have you?
|
| I guess maybe rich people who could afford to buy but
| choose not to, like to rent. I live in Sydney, don't know
| anyone who owns their house or even dreams of it one day.
| Saying there are people who like renting, sounds to me like
| saying there are people who like pain, or a terminal
| illness, or a death sentence. But hey, at least our money
| is going every week to people who already own more than one
| house?
| stadium wrote:
| I have a residential realtor friend who rents their
| family house. Yes, he earns his living selling houses,
| and rents his own house to live in, and they have lived
| there a few years. good schools, friends, like the
| neighborhood, etc.
| telesilla wrote:
| I've lived in many countries and while I own a home in my
| original country to retire to (should that happen), I
| need places to rent when I don't want to be there. And my
| home is rented at those times, sometimes for years.
| beckman466 wrote:
| > while I own a home in my original country to retire to
|
| You're proving their point...?
|
| From OP:
|
| > I guess maybe rich people who could afford to buy but
| choose not to, like to rent.
|
| > at least our money is going every week to people who
| already own more than one house
| telesilla wrote:
| Where would I, or some other temporary migrant, live if
| not in someone's house who rented it to me? My owning a
| home is irrelevant.
| beckman466 wrote:
| > Where would I, or some other temporary migrant, live if
| not in someone's house who rented it to me? My owning a
| home is irrelevant.
|
| Why does the housing need to be supplied by private
| landlords? There are places that have a lot of social
| housing, like Sweden. Let the government build and own
| property, it works well. It also means people from
| different backgrounds and occupations can all live
| together, instead of e.g. redlining, which devastates
| minority communities.
|
| As it stands now only the rich are able to move into
| cities, with low-wage workers having to commute from far
| outside the city, which is a pretty disgusting shift if
| you think about it. Imagine having a crappy cleaning job,
| cleaning offices at night, and you have to travel hours
| for your job because you live so far out [1]. It's a
| reality for more and more people, as the assault on labor
| intensifies.
|
| [1] https://taliajane.medium.com/a-week-in-new-york-city-
| on-13-5...
| wsatb wrote:
| I prefer to rent, and am not rich. I live in a large
| metro area in the US where rent is not insanely high,
| though. As someone who is single, it comes with a lot
| more freedom and less to worry about. Probably not the
| best long-term, but it's less stress in my life in my
| opinion, so the trade off is currently worth it.
| yesenadam wrote:
| Ok, well, if not rich, it sounds like you have the choice
| of buying or renting. Lucky you! I don't know anyone who
| has that choice. The person I responded to initially only
| meant, I guess, that some people who have the choice,
| prefer renting. Hm..but they were also talking as if
| people without the choice, like renting:
|
| > it would be nice to live in a world where everyone is
| wealthy and capable enough to own and maintain their
| home. But there are actually people who like to rent
|
| It just sounds like landlord's rationalizations. Also,
| the landlords here don't "take care of building..the
| house"--that happened 100-150 years ago or so.
| wsatb wrote:
| I don't think we really disagree, I think we just live in
| very different places. My point was that renting has
| benefits in some places, whereas you implied it does not.
| spicybright wrote:
| I strongly doubt GP has a choice. Not rich + insane rent
| means he's probably building up saving too slowly for a
| house near where his social group is.
|
| It sounds like you've been burned by a landlord in the
| past and are taking it out on all of them unfairly.
|
| I hate the concept of a landlord, paying a lot without
| building any equity, unlike a mortgage on property. But
| I've never had one that does absolutely nothing.
|
| Between tenants, my landlords vacuumed, repainted,
| sometimes re-carpeted if needed, removed old tenants
| belongs left behind, etc.
|
| I've had landlords be good about replacements of major
| appliances too. One thing I learned is you need to be
| assertive and advocate for yourself. Persistence and
| following up until they do something is key.
|
| But I've had multiple washing machines, laundry machines,
| and garbage disposals be replaced for no charge to me,
| without me doing anything but letting them into the
| house.
|
| I'm still getting a bit ripped off with inflated rent,
| but that type of convenience takes a lot off my plate.
| ksaj wrote:
| I rent, and am plenty fine with it. One thing I like is
| that we get a yearly home inspection. Some people surely
| dislike the thought of people trouncing through their
| inner sanctum, but what it means is that every year they
| find things that need fixing, and fix them. Last year we
| got a new (and better) stove out of it. The year before
| we got our washer/drier dismantled, fully cleaned, and
| rebuilt with a few new parts, and a new water heater.
|
| They want to keep their units in good condition, and I
| don't have to do much of the hard work to keep it that
| way. Air filters are pretty much the only utility
| maintenance we have to do.
|
| Also, if you have rowdy neighbours, there isn't a whole
| lot you can do about that if you own and they aren't
| actually breaking any laws. Our landlord has been rapid
| at addressing neighbour complaints. However, I have
| rented a number of different places, and this particular
| landlord is the first and only one I've had that actively
| tries to maintain peace and order as well.
| _-david-_ wrote:
| >Also, the landlords here don't "take care of
| building..the house"--that happened 100-150 years ago or
| so.
|
| So landlords haven't painted, repaired the roof, added
| appliances, etc in 100 years?
| CryptoPunk wrote:
| >>So he owned other peoples homes? Ugh I hate this system.
| Why is absentee ownership a thing, why is it seen as
| 'success'?
|
| The more investment capital goes into real estate, the more
| impetus there is to expand housing supply, and thus the more
| affordable rental rates, which is the cost of having housing,
| is.
|
| There are of course numerous other factors involved in
| determining housing costs, like the municipal government's
| permit processing efficiency, zoning restrictions on building
| density, accessibility of residential neighborhoods to job
| centers via road networks and public transportation, etc, but
| ceteris paribus, more investment increases housing supply and
| reduces rental rates.
|
| Beware of the anti-profit bias:
|
| https://digest.bps.org.uk/2017/08/04/we-have-an-ingrained-
| an...
| SuoDuanDao wrote:
| This attitude expanded just a little also applies to farmers
| who produce a surplus. They're also extracting a toll from
| others for a basic need. When it's actually used to guide
| policy farmers get kicked off their land and everyone fucking
| starves.
| winrid wrote:
| Owning a property has risk. By renting you are paying to
| defer risk.
| HowTheStoryEnds wrote:
| Only true in those instances where rent is significantly
| cheaper than mortgage + maintenance costs.
| Akronymus wrote:
| Shouldnt it be the other way around?
| beckman466 wrote:
| Landlording is a weapon the property-owning classes use to
| get away with not doing anything. [1] It's the same with
| the other type of property: intellectual property. Big
| companies buy patents and trade secrets to monopolize
| knowledge to starve the commons, imposing their non-modular
| single-use black-box products on the working class. Society
| would be so much more effective and beautiful if knowledge
| was free and land registries were 1000% more transparent
| (they should be completely open).
|
| Is it really a democracy when only a small group of people
| have a bird's eye view of the systems and programs that run
| society? Does Bezos work 2,687,125 harder than warehouse
| workers? Fuck no, yet: _"Bezos' net worth is 2,687,125
| times the median US household income and equivalent to
| 0.85% of US GDP"_. Those numbers aren 't even recent by the
| way, they're from 2018.
|
| [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWSVG9nsRa4
| CryptoPunk wrote:
| Real estate is a man-made resource that is created
| through investment of capital. It doesn't emerge
| otherwise. Without the freedom to invest in property,
| there would be less housing, and higher housing costs.
| ricardobeat wrote:
| How exactly would housing costs rise without property
| investment? I'd expect the opposite, as you see in
| countries that have rent and ownership controls.
| CryptoPunk wrote:
| With less investment, you would have less money going
| into building housing.. Profit-motivated investment is
| the primary way in which market needs are met. When it's
| impeded by regulatory restrictions, market needs are met
| less.
|
| >>I'd expect the opposite, as you see in countries that
| have rent and ownership controls.
|
| The highest rental rates in the world are in the US city
| with the most ownership controls to prevents developers
| and landlords from profiting: San Francisco.
|
| Rent control makes housing less affordable:
|
| https://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/RentControl.html
| beckman466 wrote:
| > The highest rental rates in the world are in the city
| with the most ownership controls to prevents developers
| and landlords from profiting: San Francisco.
|
| Correlation is not causation. The reason rents are high
| in San Francisco is because it's where the 'owners' of a
| bunch of high-tech Intellectual Property live. Labor
| aristocrats have to move there to be able to work on that
| tech. That is what has driven up the rents.
| CryptoPunk wrote:
| >>Correlation is not causation. The reason rents are high
| in San Francisco is because it's where the 'owners' of a
| bunch of high-tech Intellectual Property live.
|
| San Francisco does not have the highest average incomes
| in the world. What puts SF at the top of the rent
| rankings is the combination of high average incomes, and
| the most restrictive housing market in the US.
|
| I recommend you read the article I provided on rent
| control.
| beckman466 wrote:
| > San Francisco does not have the highest average incomes
| in the world.
|
| Are you joking? I seriously can't tell.
|
| Focusing just on worker's wages, when there are
| billionaire property owners (specifically owners of IP)
| living around the corner from you, is just ignorant and
| disingenuous if this really is your argument.
|
| Steve Jobs famously paid himself $1 a year, remember? I
| mean, that's probably why he wore those hippy sandals
| right? He just couldn't afford more because of his measly
| wage? A few tech CEO's will pull down the average if they
| all pull off this wonderful tax trick.
|
| Honestly I don't understand why you use these arguments
| and sources, they seem to me to be completely
| incompatible with reality.
|
| > I recommend you read the article I provided on rent
| control.
|
| You keep mentioning rent-control, but I have never said
| that it's the measure I am for. You do realize rent-
| control is not the only policy that a city or government
| can use and enforce right?
|
| I think this 2019 documentary called Push (by Fredrik
| Gertten) does a great job of showing what is happening to
| the working classes and their lack of options for
| affordable housing:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWSVG9nsRa4
| CryptoPunk wrote:
| >>Focusing just on worker's wages, when there are
| billionaire property owners (specifically owners of IP)
| living around the corner from you, is just ignorant and
| disingenuous if this really is your argument.
|
| Average incomes within the city are the overwhelming
| determinant of the demand side of housing supply and
| demand.
|
| A dozen billionaires are not going to materially affect
| the availability of housing, even if they all buy huge
| estates. Average income determines what the vast majority
| of the city's renters are able to afford to pay for rent.
|
| In any case, San Francisco is not even in the top 10 for
| number of billionaires among cities:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_number_of
| _bi...
|
| >>Honestly I don't understand why you use these arguments
| and sources, they seem to me to be completely
| incompatible with reality.
|
| I suggest you actually read the article I linked to. It
| describes what economists at large think of rent control,
| and what studies on the effects of rent control have
| found.
|
| >>You keep mentioning rent-control, but I have never said
| that it's the measure I am for. You do realize rent-
| control is not the only policy that a city or government
| can use and enforce right?
|
| I brought up rent control because you wrote the
| following, which implies cities with rent control have
| had a positive experience with it:
|
| >>I'd expect the opposite, as you see in countries that
| have rent and ownership controls.
| ricardobeat wrote:
| "Economists at large" being a hand picked few and US-
| centered. Rent control can take many forms: rental caps,
| incentives/benefits, zoning and housing policies, etc.
| The view that it's solely a supply-demand equation is way
| too simplistic. Rent prices are currently falling as much
| as 10% in Amsterdam despite an extremely strained housing
| market with a 50k+ deficit on units available vs demand.
| frogpelt wrote:
| You make it sound like you don't think people (or
| corporations) should be able to own property.
|
| I hate to burst your bubble, but someone is going to own
| the property. And if you insist on it being the
| government, you are going to severely disappointed by
| what happens next.
| wizzwizz4 wrote:
| > _You make it sound like you don 't think people (or
| corporations) should be able to own property._
|
| Ideas aren't property. Copyright law, patent law,
| trademark law, service mark law... they _used to be_ very
| different to property law, and for good reason.
| "Intellectual property" is the power to silence your
| critics, sue your competitors and profit from other
| people 's work - if you have enough money to throw your
| weight around. (Contrast with copyright, which lets you
| get a cut from those publishing your work; or trademark,
| which protects your professional reputation...)
| hellbannedguy wrote:
| The cleverest, wealthy guys, I know, barely finished high
| school.
|
| I'm talking self made guys, and not guys from wealthy
| sympathetic families whom fund their kids until something turns
| a profit. Jonny at Dentek--you don't count, but daddy was a
| wiz.
|
| If I had a child, buying real-estate, and learning the stock
| market, would be right up there with the three R's.
| NonContro wrote:
| What you are describing is rent-seeking. Its easy to make
| money when house values and the stock market are expanding
| greater than the cost of money, particularly when you buy in
| at the start of the bubble.
|
| Typically the limitation for real estate ownership is lack of
| access to credit, or a stable job enabling you to stay in one
| place.
| SaintGhurka wrote:
| By that definition, wouldn't saving for retirement be rent-
| seeking?
| abakker wrote:
| Not all investing is rent seeking.
|
| Rent seeking REQUIRES manipulation of public policy to
| benefit you.
|
| Being a landlord at the 5 building scale gives you no
| leverage in public policy. It makes you a capitalist.
| wizzwizz4 wrote:
| Rent-seeking behaviour isn't always about manipulating
| public policy. If public policy _allows_ you to commit
| rent-seeking behaviour, you can still choose not to carry
| it out. (Of course, you could make a lot more money by
| rent-seeking from those who have no other options...)
|
| But yes, your main point is valid: it is entirely
| possible to (e.g.) be a landlord without being abusive.
| Heck, you can even give your tenants a better deal than
| they could've got otherwise, if the circumstances are
| right. The issue is that this behaviour (in many places)
| is _actively disincentivised_ , so unethical people can
| push out the ethical ones.
| rubyn00bie wrote:
| I dream of having the confidence of a white man for only one day.
| Like, I've been writing code for twenty years, and I feel like an
| imposter still. I can't even fucking imagine being able to wake
| up in the morning, living a lie like this, fucking up kids
| educations because your too much of a pathetic child to admit
| your own failings?! I find this article to be pretty disgusting
| to be honest.
| avianlyric wrote:
| > fucking up kids educations
|
| Please provide evidence. Last I checked most schools have
| exams, and teachers performance is monitored. You don't become
| a teacher, and suddenly face no further professional
| evaluation.
| rubyn00bie wrote:
| What? It's the article. Damn, racism making your memory shit?
| The guy couldn't read. Are you serious? There's obviously
| enormous failings in whatever evaluation process exists. Like
| you're telling me to provide evidence when you just read
| evidence. There's no chance he didn't negatively affect
| students educations. They had a teacher who couldn't read!
| Did he ever fail one? It's comical the level of willful
| ignorance on HN.
|
| At least you bigots are exposing yourselves instead of
| staying hidden. I appreciate it.
| xupybd wrote:
| He probably dreams of having the confidence of an abel person.
| Dyslexia is no easy ride. Yes on one dimension he is privileged
| on another he is not.
|
| I'm not sure he messed up these kids. He may have taught them
| well without the ability to read or write.
|
| He is no doubt a fraud however. Especially with his collage
| degree.
| TheRealNGenius wrote:
| That's a pretty racist thing to say. Their race has nothing to
| do with their story. Would your comment have applied if this
| person was the same race as you?
|
| You can't imagine their struggle because you didn't read what
| they wrote. You just glanced at the picture plastered at the
| top. Just cause you don't know how to read/write != you have
| jeopardized a kid's education.
| rubyn00bie wrote:
| Lmao. You really think race had nothing to do with their
| story? You are naive, dear child.
| EvilEy3 wrote:
| Racist crap.
| TheRealNGenius wrote:
| It's pretty clear who's "too much of a pathetic child to
| admit [their] own failings"
| rubyn00bie wrote:
| I'm glad you've found the errors of your ways so quickly.
| May you be less ignorant and a better person for all.
| inglor wrote:
| IMO this comment takes a very cynical and US centric view of
| things.
|
| I've found this story was well written and pretty inspiring.
| Just because people are privileged doesn't mean they don't
| struggle or that their struggles can't teach us things.
|
| It's surprising to see this sort of toxicity in hacker news.
| rubyn00bie wrote:
| You're surprised someone didn't find it inspiring? Really?
| C'mon it's a story about a guy who committed fraud, screwed
| up kids education, and then got an applause for it? This is a
| picture perfect case of white privilege. I'm not at all
| surprised at the comments like yours on HN. This is a place
| dominated by white people and they don't like to be
| uncomfortable.
| kzrdude wrote:
| Maybe it could be called fraud when he was adult.
|
| But this story starts with a child who can't read and is
| ashamed to admit it, and it's nothing strange, it is human.
| rubyn00bie wrote:
| You're excusing 17 years of fraud bu saying we're all
| human. It's pretty gross that you're willing to excuse
| this because he was ashamed. Loads of people live with
| shame, loads of people don't commit 17 years of fraud and
| get applause for it.
|
| This whole thread wreaks of white privilege. I for once
| am actually enjoying the downvotes because each one is a
| little tear from a racist I'm enjoying. Mmmm. Nothing
| like making all white bros on HN feel a modicum of
| anything besides comfort.
| TheRealNGenius wrote:
| Totally believable. I've had math teachers say they can't write,
| and language teachers say they can't math
| alexashka wrote:
| Rather than learning how to read, it'd do everyone a whole lot
| more good to admit that some people are not cut out for school
| and to send them off to work when they're teenagers.
|
| This poor guy has felt bad his entire life when he could've been
| an excellent coal miner instead.
|
| Every place I've worked is filled with people like this guy to
| one extent or another - fearful parents pushing their kids to go
| to school and pretend to be something they're not. Then people
| who have an affinity for thinking have to navigate these insecure
| idiots (sorry, medical term) their entire careers.
|
| It makes workplaces hell for everyone involved, both the idiots
| and the capable.
|
| People ought to do what they are capable of doing. People ought
| to be treated with dignity and respect. If we get that far this
| century, boy, that'd really be something.
| ramblerman wrote:
| > It makes workplaces hell for everyone involved, both the
| idiots and the capable.
|
| I think your attitude is what makes the hell tbh.
|
| We should definitely teach everyone to be literate, and not
| just decide they should be "excellent coal miner"s instead.
| Ntrails wrote:
| Slight devils advocate. Is everyone happier with mandatory
| schooling for longer? It isn't that we shouldn't give
| everyone the chance to learn, but maybe some people really
| would be happier dropping out at 14 and just getting a job.
| Being at school where all you do is fail does not make for a
| good life experience!
|
| I think the answer is probably that we don't want parents
| pulling kids out of school early just to earn money for the
| family? So legally requiring they stay at school longer
| protects.
|
| Just a thought
| arp242 wrote:
| My grandfather went to school until he was 14, but he was
| also highly literate, had a keen technical insight, and was
| generally fairly smart.
|
| He wasn't unhappy in life, or the way his career as a
| factory worker turned out. At least, as near as I can
| determine those kind of things: he was an old-fashioned
| kind of man who didn't have a heart to heart with his
| grandchildren. He never ate pizza in his life, and refused
| to eat it when I offered to take him out to try it.
|
| But at the same time I've always felt he could have
| achieved much more if he continued school. The reason he
| didn't was because his family was poor and another child
| working was needed to put bread on the table. A big reason
| this mandatory schooling exists is for these kind of
| reasons.
|
| That being said, I do think there's too much emphasis on
| degrees; not having a college degree is almost something
| you're embarrassed of. My brother did basically a useless
| "animal care" study because he felt like he had to do _A_
| study (note: it 's not a useless education, but there are
| tons of people doing it and very few jobs, almost no-one
| who graduates gets a job in that field and the impression I
| had from his friends is that it's mostly the kind of thing
| people do when they don't know what else to do).
| moonchild wrote:
| 14-year-olds are likely not equipped to make such a
| decision. If all you're doing at school is failing, then
| the school itself should provide better support mechanisms.
| Ntrails wrote:
| Better support to what end? Walking out of school age 16
| with 4 GCSE passes is not much of an improvement on 2,
| and maybe we should accept that there exist people who
| cannot via standard schooling do better than that? Maybe
| those two additional years of special measures is not
| better than a couple of years learning on a job?
|
| Unless your claim is that with sufficient support
| _everyone_ can leave school at 16 with good grades, which
| is simply not a school of thought I ascribe to.
| opheliate wrote:
| My (much) older brother has severe dyslexia. He's bright, and
| now owns his own business, but in his school, they'd already
| reached the capacity for SEN provision, and he was refused a
| diagnosis. He could have massively improved his literacy if
| help was just available, but at that time, it simply wasn't.
| Branding anyone who doesn't immediately take to school an
| "idiot" is incredibly myopic.
| alexashka wrote:
| Replace the word idiot with 'fool' and see if your point
| still applies.
|
| In other words, the problem is not stupid people (or people
| with learning disabilities, which I happen to have btw), who
| undoubtedly exist. The problem is foolish people who think
| they can cheat their way through life.
|
| My contention is that we're sinking under the weight of
| foolish people cheating their way into positions they have no
| business being in.
|
| Foolish as in lacking wisdom. Not foolish as in lacking
| ability to do calculus. We have plenty of calculus, we
| severely lack wisdom :)
| [deleted]
| kzrdude wrote:
| He's not an idiot, he would have gotten much further, and had a
| better life, if school had helped him to learn to read and
| write. Some children need extra help/support lessons (and
| nowadays usually get it).
| novalis78 wrote:
| In 2008 when my kids went to VPK in Florida I was surprised to
| find out why they memorized words instead of learning how to
| read. The lady I spoke about this was a veteran teacher of 25
| years. She said it was all BS and that a decade or two earlier
| they had used a book called 'Learn how to read in 100 lessons'.
| With that systems, she said, they never had anyone fail. Every
| child that passed through learnt reading. She said it was like a
| miracle. But, at some point, the higher ups fell into the trap of
| having to introduce new regiments and systems because of ever
| changing fashions. They were forced to introduce silly
| approaches, changing them every few years, leading to kids
| suddenly unable to read. Whenever she met parents she would tell
| them about this book and everyone had success with it and was as
| shocked as I was how it worked and how it was missing from the
| school curriculum. I ended up teaching all of my children how to
| read with it. It's one of the most precious experiences. They all
| learnt to read at a very early age. There are many stories like
| this about writing and early math. Many years later, I read the
| episode In Feynman's book 'Surely you must be joking' on his
| encounter with school text books and his disappointment - to say
| it lightly. One great experiment I can highly recommend is
| collecting textbooks from the 20th century and compare the
| decades and (basic) skills taught.
| [deleted]
| frogpelt wrote:
| Is this it?
|
| https://www.amazon.com/Teach-Your-Child-Read-Lessons/dp/0671...
| hmwhy wrote:
| Maybe I'm joining the large amount of comments at the bottom for
| once, but this article is not just about someone who ended up
| being a teacher due to serendipity -- he committed crimes to get
| there.
|
| I'm all for supporting people with disability, and there is no
| doubt that it requires courage to admit to being a fraud after so
| many years -- but being dyslexic shouldn't be an excuse for
| anyone to commit crimes and get away with it (please read what he
| actually did if you haven't -- it wasn't a simple case of
| cheating).
|
| I have personally seen a lot of academic misconducts that went
| unpunished that makes cheating in exams seem seem mundane. Fake
| results that academics don't own up to/just blame their students
| when proven wrong; made-up results so that a thesis would look
| better; lying about publications to get scholarships, etc. Nobody
| ever gets punished and some would eventually go on to hold
| important positions.
|
| Reading the "supportive" comments in this thread is pretty
| demoralising for me.
| BeFlatXIII wrote:
| It's a natural consequence of a culture that praises
| competition. "If you're not cheating, you're not trying" is the
| motto of those who only have a tenuous chance at success. No
| point accepting your "just" lot in life: may as well cheat if
| the consequences from cheating aren't that much worse than the
| expected quality of a life lived legitimately.
| hliyan wrote:
| I agree in principle. But I think there has to be a difference
| in punishment between unrepentant perpetrators who get caught,
| and perpetrators who come forward on their own volition. If I
| remember the original Reader's Digest article, this person was
| already held to account many years ago -- he lost all his
| credentials, qualifications and not to mention respect and
| credibility. Even the original story was published much later.
| If we continue to pounce on people like this many years after
| the fact, we're only discouraging others with a guilty
| conscience to come forward.
| hmwhy wrote:
| Thank you very much for taking the time to address my
| comment, it has given me some food for thought.
| baron816 wrote:
| Yeah, this is kind of a Frank Abagnale type story. He did
| some incredible yet dishonest and criminal things, but
| redeemed himself later in life. I'm sure this guy bullied a
| lot of people to get them to help him cheat. He spent 40
| years pretty much as an asshole--he had stolen a life that he
| hadn't earned, and had deprived his students of a qualified
| educator.
|
| Maybe the moral of the story is that people can change and
| become positive contributors to society. Think of all the
| people who have been locked up for decades for crimes they
| committed as teenagers. They were just thrown away by society
| without a chance for redemption. This is part of what Black
| Lives Matter means to me--there's a primitive impulse in
| people's brains to say they're criminals and they won't
| amount to anything and just cause harm. This guy got a chance
| that was denied to millions of black youths.
| dwohnitmok wrote:
| Speaking of... there seems to be a good chance that Frank
| Abagnale lied about lying and his biggest con has been
| making a career out of convincing people of his non-
| existent previous cons (which in retrospect isn't all that
| surprising I suppose, there's no a priori reason to believe
| that an ex-conman has been honest about his ex-cons).
|
| It seems that he had only one big true con: where he conned
| a woman's family into taking care of him and stealing money
| from them while he essentially stalked her, was found out
| and then sent to prison.
|
| https://whyy.org/segments/the-greatest-hoax-on-earth/
| arp242 wrote:
| This guy was born in 1939. These events happened in the 50s.
| It's been a long time, and at no point is the article saying of
| even implying it's a good thing: it's just some young person
| struggling to get by doing what he could because he thought it
| was the only way to get anywhere in life.
|
| I don't understand why some people feel the need to be so damn
| judgemental and moralistic about things.
| jccalhoun wrote:
| Honestly, it sounds unbelievable. I absolutely can believe that
| people go through life without learning to read. I'm a college
| teacher and I've met them.
|
| The lengths he went to in college, however, seem so incredible
| that I am skeptical. Stories like Richard Montainez's claims of
| inventing flaming hot cheetos and Frank Abagnale's claims of
| impersonating have been found out to be false so I need actual
| proof before I believe these kinds of stories are true.
| tashi wrote:
| I haven't seen any comments that praise him for cheating or
| stealing or faking his way through being a teacher. The only
| praise I see is for his learning to read and then coming out to
| tell his story.
| iammisc wrote:
| I agree, what this man did was criminal. It doesn't matter how
| he felt about it, or the great redemptive arc the story talks
| about (him learning to read eventually), the truth is he short-
| changed a lot of children on a proper education.
| daniel-s wrote:
| Can someone who has read the whole thing spoil it and tell me how
| someone illiterate wrote a big, long article for the BBC?
| namenotrequired wrote:
| He did learn to read and write eventually.
|
| But going by the last line, this article was written by a
| certain Sarah McDermott and not by John Corcoran
| aymendjellal wrote:
| He eventually learned how to read later in his life (after his
| teaching career!) by seeking help at his local library adult
| literacy initiative.
| edge17 wrote:
| last line,
|
| Written by Sarah McDermott.
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