[HN Gopher] NSA Mobile Device Best Practices
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       NSA Mobile Device Best Practices
        
       Author : asix66
       Score  : 122 points
       Date   : 2021-07-28 14:01 UTC (5 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.documentcloud.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.documentcloud.org)
        
       | sandworm101 wrote:
       | Defense links for anyone on government systems that might not
       | have easy access to documentcloud.
       | 
       | https://media.defense.gov/2020/Jul/28/2002465830/-1/-1/0/MOB...
       | 
       | Corresponding NSA document for OCONUS (travel outside continental
       | US)
       | 
       | https://home.army.mil/stewart/index.php/download_file/view/1...
        
         | derefr wrote:
         | > Do not charge your devices by connecting them to charging
         | stations, computers, televisions, DVRs, etc. Use only issued
         | chargers or those acquired with sufficient OPSEC.
         | 
         | I'm surprised the government/military does not issue its
         | employees USB condoms to obviate this worry.
        
           | dsr_ wrote:
           | Same reason people treat internal email as insecure: you get
           | used to the convenience, then one day you reply-all to an
           | outside address. In this case, you get used to using public
           | chargers with a condom and one day you forget the condom.
        
       | johnchristopher wrote:
       | Well, considering all those restrictions and how it's still not
       | secure enough anyway how long before the recommendation will be
       | "Don't use your smartphone. Use the landline phone in your
       | office" ?
        
         | necheffa wrote:
         | Because land lines are super secure and no one has found out
         | how to tap the line from a switching station?
        
       | baybal2 wrote:
       | One problem with both Android, and Ios: impossible to disable
       | automatic previews
       | 
       | Send yourself a link by SMS, or some popular messenger like
       | Whatsapp.
       | 
       | Your phone will automatically make you a browser page preview,
       | and in the process run every browser exploit available.
       | 
       | Google added an extremely well hidden option to disable it it
       | Messages few versions ago. Since there is no way to be sure
       | Google does not remove it, and add some kind of another autoplay
       | like feature in the future, I just replaced the SMS app
       | altogether to one which does not peek into my conversations
       | https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.simplemobi...
       | (google straight tells they can get a copy of your SMSes as per
       | their disclaimer if you use Google Messages for "improving
       | service")
        
         | Hackbraten wrote:
         | No idea how Android does it but Apple has recently moved
         | message parsing and preview generation into a heavily sandboxed
         | process.
        
         | jvanderbot wrote:
         | Sounds like we need a more secure messenger app?
        
           | baybal2 wrote:
           | We need, but making a default SMS app straight sending your
           | texts to Google.com by default, and making it very hard to
           | disable for a technically illiterate user is beyond
           | unethical.
        
       | motohagiography wrote:
       | Annoyingly, putting your device in a shielded evidence bag
       | without turning it off can cause its various radios to franticly
       | seek connections and even amplify their signals until they
       | completely empty your battery.
       | 
       | Useful to have if you are curious about protests or concerts and
       | other gatherings of people with a significant criminal element
       | who could get your IMEI stingray-ed and then palantir-ed.
        
         | Arrath wrote:
         | I usually change my phone to airplane mode for long drives or
         | hikes through signal-less wilderness, otherwise they'll thrash
         | around searching frantically for signal until they drain the
         | battery outrageously fast. It's really quite annoying.
        
       | duxup wrote:
       | I worked for a company where we sent folks onsite to very secure
       | sites.
       | 
       | Nothing electronic EVER arrived at the facility or left with you
       | when you left the facility that wasn't accounted for. Nothing
       | that ever entered that wasn't needed, NO phones allowed ever. You
       | and your vehicle were searched on arrival and exit. We went
       | through a lot of laptops...
       | 
       | With the complexity of hardware / software involved, I suspect
       | that's the only way.
        
       | bottled_poe wrote:
       | Kinda surprised biometrics are recommended. I've always thought
       | passcodes were more secure - particularly as the data is not
       | easily accessible by interrogators for example.
        
         | nonameiguess wrote:
         | It says to protect your lock screen with a password, and
         | _additionally_ protect minimally sensitive data on an already-
         | unlocked device with biometrics for convenience.
        
         | WrtCdEvrydy wrote:
         | Biometrics are recommended if the data is not classified.
         | 
         | Remember this is for people working on sensitive information.
         | 
         | This is what the NSA's original mission was, to keep people
         | safe and strengthen the American defense posture from the
         | single person up to the entire infrastructure that we rely on
         | day-to-day. The mission has shifted to offense after 9/11 so
         | there's conflicting goals here (can't patch something we're
         | using against the bad guys)
        
           | nojito wrote:
           | NSA was always about offense and is strictly for
           | international offense.
           | 
           | The only shift after 9/11 was getting the three agencies to
           | actually talk to each other.
        
             | vajrabum wrote:
             | It says on their mission statement that they do SIGINT and
             | information assurance (i.e. IT security) and there is
             | plenty of public evidence that they do both. Plus they've
             | been deeply involved with designing cryptographic protocols
             | and equipment for the US govt for a very long time which is
             | part of SIGINT but it's not the offensive part.
             | 
             | https://www.nsa.gov/about/mission-values/
        
           | AlexCoventry wrote:
           | The NSA was created in a reorganization of US SIGINT/COMINT
           | services, because SIGINT/COMINT during the Korean War had
           | been unsatisfactory. Its primary mandate has always been
           | COMINT.
           | 
           | https://www.nsa.gov/about/cryptologic-heritage/historical-
           | fi...
           | 
           | > _The Brownell Committee suggested that the creation of AFSA
           | could be seen as a "step backward," and recommended that the
           | power of the director, AFSA, to centralize COMINT be
           | increased._
           | 
           | > _In October, Harry Truman authorized a reorganization and
           | renaming of AFSA, and in November, the secretary of defense
           | authorized the replacement of AFSA by the National Security
           | Agency._
        
         | sandworm101 wrote:
         | >> biometrics are recommended.
         | 
         | Maybe by the NSA. Any defense attorney will tell you otherwise.
         | If your fingerprint unlocks your phone then the cops will hold
         | your finger to the phone. If you face unlocks your phone then
         | they will do that too. A pin/password means you retain at least
         | some control.
         | 
         | If this was an Archer episode, I'd point out that while dead
         | people cannot divulge pins/passwords their fingerprints still
         | work.
        
           | derefr wrote:
           | I believe they're recommending setting your phone up in a
           | "lock immediately upon sleep; require password after five
           | minutes" configuration.
           | 
           | Passwords are better than biometrics for security; but
           | _between_ password validations, presuming some level of
           | convenience is needed, using biometrics to check that the
           | same person is still there is better than  "just stay
           | unlocked for a few minutes even after being put to sleep".
           | 
           | It's like HTTP Basic Auth (sending credentials with every
           | request), vs. logging in, receiving a short-lived session
           | cookie, and then sending that session cookie with your
           | requests for a few minutes.
        
         | hugh-avherald wrote:
         | It explicitly says 'minimal sensitivity'. That basically means
         | the threat vector is "I left it at the cafe."
        
         | CompuHacker wrote:
         | If every NSA employee has a perfect security posture, any
         | adversary is going to have to take more extreme measures to get
         | information. Better to let them have the occasional un-updated
         | iPhone.
        
         | twox2 wrote:
         | I went to a legal presentation at Defcon a couple of years back
         | where they said that the government needs a court order /
         | warrant in order to force you to tell them your password, but
         | if you're using biometrics, they can just force you to touch
         | your finger to your phone or scan your eyes without it. It's
         | some legal loophole.... so in that respect I think passwords
         | ARE more secure.
        
           | ne9xt wrote:
           | Smart, but there is a way to force your (faceid/touchid)
           | iphone to require your password by holding the power button
           | to get to the "slide to power off" screen.
        
           | panzagl wrote:
           | Presumably NSA employees are not using their phones for
           | illegal activities, so they should not be in a situation
           | where a court will order them to unlock their phone.
        
           | greggturkington wrote:
           | A defendant was compelled to use their face to unlock their
           | computer in a recent case (2021) [1]. The reasoning given by
           | an analyst:
           | 
           | > requiring a defendant to expose his face to unlock a
           | computer can be lawful, and is not far removed from other
           | procedures that are now routinely approved by courts, with
           | proper justification: standing in a lineup, submitting a
           | handwriting or voice exemplar, or submitting a blood or DNA
           | sample
           | 
           | Contrasting the logic used by a judge in a similar case in
           | (2019) [2]:
           | 
           | > If a person cannot be compelled to provide a passcode
           | because it is a testimonial communication, a person cannot be
           | compelled to provide one's finger, thumb, iris, face, or
           | other biometric feature to unlock that same device
           | 
           | Ars has a summary of more cases [3]. It looks like in several
           | instances state courts allowed the devices to be unlocked
           | using biometrics, but the rulings were reversed at the
           | federal level. In many cases a warrant was required.
           | 
           | 1. https://archive.is/i2Bx9
           | 
           | 2. https://archive.is/px2Qz
           | 
           | 3. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2020/06/indiana-
           | supreme-...
        
       | mikewarot wrote:
       | Why do people need smart phones, really? The only time they come
       | in handy is for driving directions.
       | 
       | It turns out my Samsung candy bar phone with no camera, GPS and
       | internet leads the way in security.
        
         | CabSauce wrote:
         | Why stop there? You can't get hacked if you don't have
         | electricity.
        
         | lovelettr wrote:
         | You must work at my company's cyber security team. They're
         | convinced that the safest stuff is when that stuff is never
         | allowed to exist in the first place. Which is probably true but
         | in my opinion misses the point.
        
         | vajrabum wrote:
         | Why do people need computers, really? A smart phone is a small
         | portable computer with a phone built in. Maps is one of the
         | types of apps that most people use but it's not the only one.
         | Email, social media, text messaging, note taking, audio and
         | video recording, a camera, a compass, pedometer, access to
         | cloud file storage, reading apps like nook or kindle are a few
         | of the apps that I use regularly on my phone in places where a
         | laptop or even a tablet wouldn't be inconvenient or impossible.
        
       | aasasd wrote:
       | Sorta have to wonder if it's safe to open that pdf locally--the
       | site doesn't quite work on the phone.
        
       | maerF0x0 wrote:
       | I'm curious if anyone has any leads/stories on compromised 3rd
       | party devices? Would love to learn more about detecting these
       | things. Like say a USB charging brick that also attempts malware
       | or a keyboard etc?
        
         | Arrath wrote:
         | Is there much that can be done to detect them? I know they're
         | for sale for pen testing and what not, but I've never seen much
         | in the realm of preventing or protecting against them.
        
           | maerF0x0 wrote:
           | I've thought about somehow creating a raspberry pi that sits
           | between usb devices and snitches on data transfer that is not
           | expected? It could be really hard to do, and probably easy
           | for a device to mask (only attempt attacks when other file
           | operations are happening)
        
       | ARandomerDude wrote:
       | > Power the device off and on weekly.
       | 
       | Thoughts, HN? I can see how this might be good for performance,
       | but how is it good for security?
        
         | a5withtrrs wrote:
         | Running your malicious actions without writing to disk is a
         | very effective way of bypassing a lot of security and forensics
         | technologies.
         | 
         | As soon as you make changes have persistence you have proof and
         | some operators are not oaky with that.
        
         | whoisjohnkid wrote:
         | a lot of exploits deliberately avoid persistence as an extra
         | layer of protection from detection. Since most folks rarely
         | restart their phones these bugs can live on your phone until a
         | restart. So by restarting your phone on a weekly basis you are
         | potentially wiping out memory only infections.
        
           | quenix wrote:
           | Another explanation is the hardware root of trust. On iOS,
           | for example, hardware root of trust in a separate physical
           | security processor validates all code in a chain. An exploit
           | cannot gain persistence across a reboot unless it has access
           | to the private signing keys of Apple
        
         | necheffa wrote:
         | I highly doubt this is as complicated as persistence.
         | 
         | 1) even on mobiles you still get the occasional webview or
         | other core library update and need to reboot to complete the
         | patch.
         | 
         | 2) modern versions of Android use per-file encryption.
         | Periodically rebooting flushes unencrypted buffers.
        
         | shiado wrote:
         | There is a whole category of potentially exploitable bugs that
         | result from programs simply running. Slow memory leaks,
         | floating point precision loss, and integer overflows to name a
         | few. But this is more likely about clearing caches.
        
           | Hackbraten wrote:
           | It's to get rid of exploits that have no persistence.
           | 
           | For example, your running kernel space may be compromised but
           | your on-disk kernel image may be still pristine due to a
           | secure boot chain. That's why rebooting can help remove such
           | exploits.
        
         | timpattinson wrote:
         | It's possible to have a security exploit which can compromise a
         | running device, but is not able to make itself permanent across
         | restarts (e.g. changes programs in RAM but not in flash)
         | 
         | That's my best guess.
        
           | gruez wrote:
           | Concrete example: all the recent ios jailbreaks (aka sandbox
           | escape and/or EoP exploits) are tethered, which means they're
           | undone/reset after a reboot.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | alex_anglin wrote:
         | Makes it harder to maintain persistence on the device, I
         | believe. Whether it solves the problem in question is another
         | matter.
        
         | beermonster wrote:
         | This is a good tip to avoid persistence. Lots of exploits won't
         | survive a reboot and so the target would have to be exploited
         | again.
        
           | runjake wrote:
           | beermonster has it right.
           | 
           | For a very recent example of this, see the NSO Pegasus
           | scandal from the past couple of weeks.
           | 
           | A reboot "unloads" the malware (until the adversary sends
           | another payload, anyway.)
        
       | barcoder wrote:
       | Having recently switched to iPhone I have been very surprised at
       | finding my wifi and Bluetooth automatically turning on. There
       | could be a better way, but I had to create a shortcut to disable
       | connectivity until I manually turn it back on
        
         | billbrown wrote:
         | If you long-press the icon in Control Center, it brings up a
         | panel that allows you to turn Wifi and Bluetooth entirely.
         | 
         | In general, try long-pressing everything: there's generally
         | shortcuts or "power moves" afterwards.
        
           | nofunsir wrote:
           | Are you sure? This is not the case in the latest iOS. Long-
           | pressing the icons in Control Center offers a wider view and
           | access to hotspot and airdrop settings. Pressing either WiFi
           | or Bluetooth from this second menu has the same effect as the
           | icons on the first page, (you can inspect settings afterwards
           | and see it's still "off until tomorrow") and further long
           | presses on the second page icons only let you choose which
           | WiFi network or Bluetooth device to connect to.
        
         | markn951 wrote:
         | They're not automatically turning on if you're "turning them
         | off" from Control Center. Those buttons just temporarily
         | disable them (and state that clearly when you do so). The only
         | way to actually turn off Wifi and Bluetooth is to go into
         | Settings and turn them off there.
        
           | MAGZine wrote:
           | "Clearly" it's not as clear as you think it is.
           | 
           | On android, if I turn bluetooth off from the quick access
           | menu, it stays off--which is what I expect.
        
             | marcellus23 wrote:
             | Can't get much clearer than text that says "Disconnecting
             | nearby wi-fi networks until tomorrow."
        
               | bkallus wrote:
               | But that same button used to be a permananent toggle, and
               | now there is no way to restore the (better) old behavior.
               | Another instance of Apple thinking they know better than
               | their users.
        
               | marcellus23 wrote:
               | You are not everyone. Just because _you_ think it 's
               | better doesn't mean it actually is. Most of the time when
               | I want to disconnect from Wifi, it's a temporary measure
               | because the network I'm connected to is slow or dead. I
               | imagine it's the same for many others.
               | 
               | Apple is notoriously allergic to putting toggles for
               | every little thing, and that shouldn't be a surprise to
               | software developers. We all know every user-configurable
               | setting increases complexity.
        
               | howaboutnope wrote:
               | > We all know every user-configurable setting increases
               | complexity.
               | 
               | They can also mean the difference between a tool and a
               | toy or even worse, a slave collar.
               | 
               | One of the good practices in programming is to not
               | hardcode things. Where that is followed, often the
               | hardest part about configurability is the UI for it,
               | since under the hood it's already determined by a bunch
               | of variables anyway, and it's mostly a matter of exposing
               | them nicely to the user.
               | 
               | Besides, it's way more complex to have a timed toggle
               | than just a toggle.
        
               | marcellus23 wrote:
               | > a slave collar
               | 
               | for real? because you have to go into the Settings app to
               | turn off wifi permanently? Sometimes you people are
               | delusional.
        
               | howaboutnope wrote:
               | "you people" -- you don't know the first thing about me.
               | And this argument to excuse to treat adult consumers like
               | infants, and use the people that don't mind as the
               | measure all other adults have to reduce themselves to, is
               | used for a lot more than just a wifi toggle.
        
               | mixmastamyk wrote:
               | If you want to have a disconnect button, add as another
               | button choice to the panel. Even make it default. But the
               | original button shouldn't have been broken with no
               | recourse.
               | 
               | Not to mention, some brief wordy nearby text display in
               | tiny print after the fact, is the opposite of clear.
        
               | oauea wrote:
               | Does it say that text on the button before you press it?
               | Do you have a screenshot?
        
               | deelowe wrote:
               | https://imgur.com/a/zk382Wl
        
               | asix66 wrote:
               | It does indeed say, clearly, "Disconnecting Nearby Wi-Fi
               | Until Tomorrow" [0]
               | 
               | [0] https://ibb.co/kJ59LCN
        
               | mixmastamyk wrote:
               | That's afterward.
        
           | unethical_ban wrote:
           | It's different than Android, and different from itself pre-
           | iOS13. It is a new behavior that cannot be toggled.
        
           | mixmastamyk wrote:
           | Also the BT is often turned on after an update. I know this
           | because I've never ever used it, therefore never had it on
           | purposely.
        
             | cygned wrote:
             | They do that in order to allow accessibility devices to
             | connect for disabled users, I've been told.
        
           | J253 wrote:
           | This is one of the nice things about shortcuts. I created a
           | shortcut that will turn off wifi and Bluetooth. You can then
           | add an icon to your home screen to run the shortcut and boom.
           | Both are actually turned off...not just disabled for 24
           | hours. I also have a shortcut to turn them back on when I
           | need them.
        
         | snarf21 wrote:
         | As much as I prefer iOS to Android, this is my biggest pet
         | peave. They way they are so aggressive with bluetooth and wifi
         | is annoying. I hate that they don't even go through DHCP most
         | of the time and just assume that last known IP is still
         | available, all to "help it connect quicker". Just get your own
         | IP because having to toggle wifi on multiple devices is way
         | slower and annoying. I get that AirDrop and FindMy** and other
         | features require these things to work but how about just giving
         | a (one-time) warning when people turn them off. Most people
         | will never turn them off ever so let the subset of us who want
         | them off have it work in a sane way.
        
           | da_chicken wrote:
           | > I hate that they don't even go through DHCP most of the
           | time and just assume that last known IP is still available,
           | all to "help it connect quicker".
           | 
           | Oh, I forgot all about that.
           | 
           | I worked at a K-12 that deployed Apple devices awhile back,
           | and this behavior was a nightmare for network management.
           | Especially for travelling teachers who would take their
           | device to several different buildings throughout the day
           | (and, therefore, different IP subnets with the same WiFi
           | name).
           | 
           | The worst part was that some of the devices would just...
           | never emit a DHCPREQUEST. They'd either ignore the fact that
           | there was an address collision confusing everyone else's ARP
           | tables, or connect to the network but stick with an IP that
           | had no route to a gateway. As I recall -- it's been awhile --
           | even setting the lease duration to something very low didn't
           | seem to help. Indeed, I think that made it worse.
           | 
           | It was bad enough at one point that we had those devices with
           | the worst behavior set up with reserved IPs and a hidden WiFi
           | network that was a district-wide VLAN with a single subnet.
        
         | fossuser wrote:
         | If you turn it off via settings it stays off. The control
         | center just disconnects for 24hrs.
        
           | ThisIsTheWay wrote:
           | I know its a minor inconvenience, but this is one of my
           | biggest pet peeves with the whole OS. I wish there was a way
           | to change the setting to actually control things with control
           | center...
        
             | billbrown wrote:
             | Long press the Bluetooth or Wifi icons in Control Center
             | and you can entirely disable either in the panel, saving
             | you a trip to Settings.
        
             | concernedctzn wrote:
             | You can use the Shortcuts app to make a custom shortcut
             | that permanently turns off both wifi and bluetooth, and
             | then add that shortcut to your news/leftswipe menu to
             | reduce the number of swipes/taps to get to it
        
             | mixmastamyk wrote:
             | Indeed, who even thought up such a misfeature? Much less
             | made it default.
        
               | fossuser wrote:
               | It's one of those features that is more annoying for you
               | or me, but useful for 95% of (less technical) users.
               | 
               | My guess is accidentally disabling those services via
               | control center was a common issue.
               | 
               | I'd rather it be the other way, but that's probably why
               | it's not.
        
               | mixmastamyk wrote:
               | I don't understand why it would ever be useful. Either
               | you want it on, or not. Imagine if your mute button
               | decided to reset every now and then. Pause button, or
               | flashlight?
               | 
               | Basically nothing else works like that.
               | 
               | In fact figuring out how to turn off wifi with the
               | combination of Airplane mode and wifi button just about
               | blows my mind every time I try. So complicated.
        
               | fossuser wrote:
               | You're in a user bubble.
               | 
               | Imagine you're not good at using computers. I've seen
               | people accidentally turn on do not disturb and be unable
               | to figure out why their phone isn't ringing so they think
               | it's broken.
               | 
               | We are in a small minority of 'power users' - iPhones
               | have hundreds of millions (billions?) of users across the
               | entire world.
        
               | mixmastamyk wrote:
               | That's happened to me. I had to google it, turns out
               | there's a physical switch I never used on the side of the
               | phone that enables it and pushed accidentally.
               | 
               | IMHO, these are not good excuses to avoid a clear
               | interface. If the rules are simple and clear, and
               | presented clearly, even the dumbest of the dumb can learn
               | them. Trying to guess and out-think the user only ends up
               | in more confusion.
        
               | fossuser wrote:
               | I think we're mostly in agreement?
               | 
               | When you disable wifi/bluetooth via the control center,
               | pop-up text appears saying exactly what that means. I'm
               | not sure how they could make that more clear. It still
               | may not be your (or my) desired default, but I at least
               | understand the reasoning.
        
               | mixmastamyk wrote:
               | Tiny, wordy, brief text after the button press is not
               | what I'd describe as clear. If you need to add "comments"
               | to a (now three-state) button, it's a sign that the
               | interface needs work.
               | 
               | It's extra complexity in the form of rules added to what
               | was previously a simple to understand toggle button. That
               | it goes against historical norms, reduces privacy, and
               | wastes a bit of power is the icing.
        
         | nojito wrote:
         | You can disable it from the settings app.
         | 
         | The icon in the swipe up control center is for temporarily
         | disconnecting it...which it literally tells you when you click
         | it.
        
         | [deleted]
        
       | jeffbee wrote:
       | Surprised they go with "DO NOT" connect to wi-fi, but just
       | "avoid" attaching untrusted hardware devices. That seems
       | backwards.
        
         | jvanderbot wrote:
         | "Avoid jumping off cliffs" does not mean that occasionally it's
         | ok to jump off cliffs.
         | 
         | Is the surgeon general's advice "Pregnant women should avoid
         | alcohol" unclear?
        
           | jeffbee wrote:
           | The U.S. Surgeon General's mandatory warning for alcohol
           | states "women should not drink alcoholic beverages during
           | pregnancy because of the risk of birth defects." It does not
           | use the word "avoid".
        
             | jvanderbot wrote:
             | Well I asked for that.
             | 
             | Here's a long list of scholarly articles that use "Avoid
             | Alcahol" when stating or re-stating health recommendations
             | from various countries.
             | 
             | https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=wom
             | e...
        
       | bamboo2 wrote:
       | Problem with this: keep your phone with you always conflicts with
       | don't have secure conversations within mic range of your phone.
       | You can't do both of these.
       | 
       | But otherwise this is great and I would probably add "reset and
       | replace devices often."
        
         | annoyingnoob wrote:
         | We have lockers to secure phones when you can't take them with
         | you.
        
         | sandworm101 wrote:
         | The rooms where you can have secure conversations will have a
         | bank of tiny lockers outside the door for phones/keys.
        
           | wycy wrote:
           | Usually, but not always. I've been to rooms that don't have
           | this and there's just a pile of phones sitting outside.
        
           | godelski wrote:
           | Are lockers really that secure? Similar documents advise
           | against leaving laptops in hotel rooms or cars, even if
           | locked, because they are easy to get into. I imagine a locker
           | is not hard to break into. Small locks can be picked in a
           | second or two by people with practice, which does not look
           | different than retrieving your own phone.
        
             | sandworm101 wrote:
             | The lockers are just so you have a place to put your phone.
             | They are not secure in any way. Using a keyed locker just
             | ensures you don't pick up someone else's phone by accident
             | after the meeting. Remember that secure rooms live inside
             | secure buildings, usually inside a secure facility with a
             | fence and guy standing at the gate. And the guy has a gun.
        
               | dragonwriter wrote:
               | > Using a keyed locker just ensures you don't pick up
               | someone else's phone by accident after the meeting
               | 
               | It also prevents casual but intentional unauthorized
               | access, just not a determined attacker.
               | 
               | As you note, there are other layers of security for that.
        
         | hereforphone wrote:
         | It's prohibited to bring phones into places where you will have
         | these kind of conversations
        
       | nimbius wrote:
       | >Use strong lock-screen pins/passwords: a 6-digit PIN is
       | sufficient if the device wipes itself after 10 incorrect password
       | attempts.
       | 
       | im calling BS. NSO and others have demonstrated repeatedly they
       | can (and do) bruteforce these pin based logins quickly and
       | efficiently without triggering the wipe using sidechannel attacks
       | on running services and software over the air and through USB.
       | use a PASSPHRASE.
       | 
       | >Consider using Biometrics (e.g., fingerprint, face)
       | authentication for convenience to protect data of minimal
       | sensitivity
       | 
       | remember: the fifth amendment does not cover biometrics . if a
       | DUI case can forcibly extract your blood, then you can and will
       | be required to present your face to unlock a laptop. use
       | passphrases.
       | 
       | >DO NOT jailbreak or root the device.
       | 
       | this often allows people to remove pre-installed spyware just as
       | easily as it can be installed.
        
         | spurgu wrote:
         | > remember: the fifth amendment does not cover biometrics . if
         | a DUI case can forcibly extract your blood, then you can and
         | will be required to present your face to unlock a laptop.
         | 
         | On the iPhone theres a neat trick: If you seem to be in a
         | situation where you might be forced to hand over your phone
         | (and unlock it with bio), hold down the power button for a
         | second or two (secretly/inconspicuously in your pocket or
         | wherever your phone is). This will disable fingerprint
         | unlocking and you will be forced to enter PIN.
         | 
         | Doesn't seem to work on Android (11 at least) though.
        
           | dragonwriter wrote:
           | Android doesn't have a stealthy way to do it without powering
           | down, but you can either activate lockdown mode, reboot, or
           | power down and the next access will require PIN, not
           | biometrics.
        
           | 29083011397778 wrote:
           | I'd imagine it varies by OEM, as my BlackBerry KeyOne gives
           | me the option to "Lock Now" when I hold the power button for
           | 2 seconds. It does actually lock out biometrics, as I've
           | tested it previously.
        
           | hiq wrote:
           | > Doesn't seem to work on Android (11 at least) though.
           | 
           | I'd hold the power button a bit longer and turn off the
           | device altogether. Granted, not as convenient.
        
       | ajdecon wrote:
       | I've seen most of these recommendations before, but the "mic-
       | drowning case" to muffle room audio is new to me. Certainly makes
       | sense, but are there any common commercial phone cases that
       | advertise this feature?
        
         | spacephysics wrote:
         | I would also like to know. I've only found phone cases that
         | hide the camera via a slide or flap.
         | 
         | Ideally I'd like both the mic and camera cover
        
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