[HN Gopher] Chris Hedges: "Dying for an iPhone"
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Chris Hedges: "Dying for an iPhone"
Author : pauljonas
Score : 45 points
Date : 2021-06-02 19:59 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (scheerpost.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (scheerpost.com)
| [deleted]
| Leary wrote:
| I-phone manufacturing is already gradually shifting from China to
| South and Southeast Asian countries as wages rise in China.
| Gradually, it will shift to even poorer countries. Improving
| conditions in these factories should be a key priority. However,
| it's not as if these jobs haven't had their positive effects as
| well.
| coldtea wrote:
| > _Improving conditions in these factories should be a key
| priority._
|
| Huh? Why would that be? Getting those factories operational and
| churning out units faster will be the key priority.
|
| Conditions thus will be the same, or worse, than China,
| especially in even poorer countries.
| Dah00n wrote:
| This is a good example of the slaves we all hold - in the US and
| outside. No-one owns a smartphone, a PC, or pretty much any
| modern item without having slaves.
| enlightened1 wrote:
| More alarmism, I see. Anyone who has read Steven Pinker knows
| that this all is patently false. Things are better now than they
| have ever been before. There are certainly some jobs that are
| less paying, but every individual has the possibility to bring
| themselves up as it were, and learn basic HTML/JS/CSS and help
| the world economy go ever forward. I always like to joke with my
| colleagues and say it less a matter of pulling oneself up by the
| bootstraps, and more by the Bootstrap (css)!
|
| And even if it were a problem, the solution is so... lame. I
| particularly like pg's essays on the proposed solution. A wealth
| tax is simply just not workable. In fact, it violates my rights
| as an individual. I've worked hard, stepping over the drugged out
| homeless people in the tenderloin on the way to my startup's
| office. I've put in the work, getting the connections so that the
| VC's would fund my expensive expresso machine requirement at any
| office _I_ work at.
|
| I also find it troublesome that the article does not talk about
| the environment or diversity, which are clearly more serious
| issues. We need more BIPOC at the top, sharing some of the
| spoils, and don't need to necessarily spread the gains across
| _classes_. And all of this doesn't matter until we tackle more
| important problems like global warming! If anything, the working
| class contribute to the problem, I hardly see any of them driving
| Teslas...
| manicdee wrote:
| How does a child living in poverty in a backwater country under
| a repressive dictatorship get access to a computer and an
| internet connection and a bank account so that they can
| bootstrap themselves into a remote working web development gig?
| enlightened1 wrote:
| Exactly! That is why I always buy things that are organic and
| fair trade. It costs a bit more, but it is worth the price.
| I'm not exactly sure how that translates into what you are
| asking though, but rest assured, I believe it does.
| andrekandre wrote:
| Anyone who has read Steven Pinker knows that this all is
| patently false.
|
| ive heard it said that if you take china out, steven pinkers
| numbers dont hold up well... anyone have more info/pointers
| about that?
| yellowapple wrote:
| I can't tell if your downvotes are due to people being
| oblivious to dripping sarcasm or due to the HN crowd
| recognizing this as sarcastic and feeling personally attacked.
| bryanlarsen wrote:
| Your 6 figure salary is about 1% due to your hard work and
| about 99% due to standing on the shoulders of giants: those who
| fought and died for your freedoms, those who educated your
| workers, those who ensured your customers had money to buy your
| stuff, those who ensure your belongs aren't stolen, those who
| built the open source software your work is based on, those who
| designed the free standards your software is based on, those
| who built the network you distribute on, those who ensure you
| didn't die in childhood, scientists from Aristotle to Newton to
| Babbage to Einstein and on up who were the giants you're
| standing on.
|
| You're lucky your income tax rate is only ~50%. It morally
| could be much higher.
| coldtea wrote:
| > _More alarmism, I see. Anyone who has read Steven Pinker
| knows that this all is patently false._
|
| Anyone who has reas Steven Pinker knows he is a well-fed, of
| the top 1% richer, cheerleading for the modern era and global
| capitalism by cherry-picking facts and figures made up to make
| governments look good, from the comfort of his posh office.
| Joeri wrote:
| There are two narratives. One is the 99% narrative, how the rich
| have captured not just the wealth but also the government and
| have turned most of society into what amounts to feudal serfs.
|
| The other narrative is the chicago school triumph narrative, how
| there has never been a time with more opportunity and more wealth
| thanks to the economic policies of the past half century, and all
| you need to take part in that is to put in a little effort.
|
| What I would like is for people to stop telling stories and start
| digging into facts. Strongman the narrative of the other team,
| find the best set of facts to support them, contrast with your
| own facts. Someone who does that, i'm interest to read their
| take. But this article is all narrative and zero insight. Not
| impressed.
| adamcstephens wrote:
| Both these groups have "facts" that they can point to support
| their claims. Facts aren't some divine truth. They can and are
| used to support the narratives people tell in their stories.
| Sometimes the same facts are used to support different sides.
|
| And yes, we tell stories because that's a very basic way we
| communicate with each other. Just spouting facts at people in a
| narrative (how is this different than a story?) isn't really
| received by most people.
|
| edit: I see you're saying that facts should just tromp
| "narratives", but I stand by the rest of what I said.
| lordnacho wrote:
| Chicago strongman would be that by a load of measures, we're
| all better off in an absolute sense. Fewer kids dying, easier
| to treat disease, everyone is consuming more stuff. All due to
| various liberalizations ranging from tax cuts to less
| regulation (City / Big Bang) and generally less of the state.
| There's lots of opportunity to do stuff, generated by this
| fantastic economy. I think I lean more to the right than most
| people, and that's more or less the summary on that side.
|
| My take is that absolute wealth hardly matters to most people.
| It's always been a question why Bob gets more than Alice,
| regardless of whether they lived in the stone age or the
| information age. People care about relative status a heck of a
| lot, and they will keep doing so. If absolute wealth were all
| that mattered, nobody would complain anymore because we all
| have much more than people of not long ago, and insanely much
| more than stone age people.
|
| Look at various struggles between people of different status
| throughout history. The Barons and the Magna Carta (John), the
| French Revolution, the general strikes of the 20th century. All
| of them are somehow about what relative status people have, yet
| it makes no sense from an absolute point of view. The 20th
| century miners for instance had free healthcare and running
| water toilets, which the Barons and French aristocrats didn't
| have. Only the lens of relative disparity, aka common sense,
| explains it.
|
| So if I now look at some factory worker in China, who is doing
| better than all her ancestors, do I take the view that she's
| simply spoiled and complaining too much? Not really.
|
| The 99% strongman is, well, look at it: you can't even run for
| office in America without being really, really rich. Lobbying
| is a legit career. The wealthy are approaching gilded ages
| levels of relative wealth, and that buys power. There's no
| formal slavery, but loads of people are on a precarious
| treadmill, forcing them into negotiations that are only
| slightly better than slavery. You don't get whipped, and you're
| allowed to vote, but only for whichever rich guys are on the
| ballot. You'll never really be allowed to work your way up,
| because you need capital to grow capital, and you're not gonna
| get any.
|
| What's wrong with this argument? Well there is a bit of choice
| at various levels in the tree. If you're on minimum wage,
| there's more than one thing you can do for that wage. A bit
| higher up the chain, a software dev has a bit of choice over
| who employs him, and can often take a break from the career.
| With a little luck you might also be able to get funded for
| your own shot at being wealthy.
| EvilEy3 wrote:
| Commie central strikes again.
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