[HN Gopher] Putting an Ultra-Tiny Linux Board in a Phone Charger...
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Putting an Ultra-Tiny Linux Board in a Phone Charger Eventually
Author : rbanffy
Score : 105 points
Date : 2021-05-06 11:06 UTC (2 days ago)
(HTM) web link (hackaday.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (hackaday.com)
| withinboredom wrote:
| Neat! If it's a phone charger, instead of WiFi, why not work as a
| USB host and use the phone's internet via tethering?
| valyagolev wrote:
| I assume because it would be more obvious to detect?
| vvll wrote:
| Why not just buy something like this off aliexpress? I don't have
| one but I'd assume it'd be pretty easily hacked to run linux (or
| maybe it does already?) given it already has a camera and wifi:
|
| https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002413810261.html?spm=a2...
| Qub3d wrote:
| In this case, the lede was buried a bit. The actual source
| article [0] talks about making this project completely open
| source and using components optimized for linux and networking
| from the get-go.
|
| [0]: https://itnext.io/im-putting-a-wifi-router-into-a-wall-
| charg...
| hans-moleman wrote:
| " I will ignore the "powered from mains" requirement for this
| round of the board and feed in 5V elsewhere."
|
| I feel this will be a challenge. The wall wart is the size it is
| because that's the size of a transformer/rectifier for 120/240 to
| 5v. Trying to add a Linux machine to that but keep the same size
| is the tricky part.
| dijit wrote:
| I'm sure there's something that can be done with Gallium
| Nitride. The chargers coming from that method are many times
| smaller than the contemporary. Often you can get a 90w charger
| where a 40w charger used to fit.
|
| https://www.howtogeek.com/509209/what-is-a-gan-charger-and-w...
| sokoloff wrote:
| Several smart plugs run OpenWRT already.
| Epskampie wrote:
| The example he shows is pretty big (but not suspisiously big)
| https://miro.medium.com/max/720/0*jUoQD3Udknc9b5Lx.jpg
|
| Since there are a lot smaller chargers out there this should
| still be possible. https://store.storeimages.cdn-
| apple.com/4668/as-images.apple...
| fy20 wrote:
| IKEA Koppla chargers would be perfect for this.
|
| https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/IKEA+KOPPLA+Connector+(fix)/126...
|
| I expect you could even fit a Raspberry Pi Zero inside if you
| replaced the charger electronics with something smaller.
| zibzab wrote:
| Transformers are fairly uncommon these days due low efficiency
| and large size.
|
| You can build a much smaller (1-3 cm3) and more efficient
| system using more modern technology.
| userbinator wrote:
| Relatedly, here's a _GSM cellphone_ in a package only slightly
| larger than a normal USB plug:
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15676737
| [deleted]
| exikyut wrote:
| (2017)
|
| So, we could fit phones inside USB connectors, 4 years ago.
| Nice >:(
| squarefoot wrote:
| Just slightly bigger, but one could actually build a similar
| thing at home literally for change coins:
| https://www.ebay.com/itm/284022359237 (or search for "SIM 800
| module")
|
| This one is a module that does GSM voice+SMS communication;
| just add a cheap GPS module if necessary, a small 8 pin uC
| that speaks serial, some code, a battery and voila. The
| problem with these devices is that they need a SIM card which
| I believe needs some form of registration pretty much
| everywhere, so unless there is some governmental screen to
| protect you, if you use any SIM based device to spy on others
| you'll be leaving behind sensitive traces useable to identify
| you.
| i_have_to_speak wrote:
| Whatever happened to SheevaPlug [1] ?
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SheevaPlug
| spditner wrote:
| They're still available in newer forms[1]. Its manufacturer,
| GlobalScale, is more an ODM for plug computers and provides
| reference devices.
|
| There are also other smaller full package variants around. I
| used the Ionics PlugComputers for a PBX project ~8 years ago
| (no longer manufactured), and still have one of them running a
| PBX on debian under my desk[2].
|
| [1] https://www.globalscaletechnologies.com/t-products.aspx [2]
| https://imgur.com/a/YuaLFtc
| techrat wrote:
| The RasPi eclipsed it in cost, usability, function, specs and
| performance.
| testmasterflex wrote:
| Do you guys think Linux on small SoCs are the future?
|
| I've chosen the RPi 0W direction for a bathroom music player
| (Loodio.com) I'm working on because there are so many
| possibilities in the software and the goal currently is to make
| it so small a wall socket can support its weight. That way you
| never have to think about charging it, can do OTA updates and
| already supports so much software with Linux.
|
| Perhaps the overhead is too high and you can already do a lot
| with Arduino etc?
| Apanatshka wrote:
| Make sure to test your RPi 0W with the Bluetooth speaker you
| had in mind asap. Mine won't connect to my soundbar, which is
| complicating my setup for connecting my projector and soundbar
| wirelessly :(
| testmasterflex wrote:
| Had some issues with it not showing up on iOS at first but is
| resolved. (First result on google) So the unit itself is now
| a Bluetooth speaker as well. Like so: https://www.instagram.c
| om/p/CNsMwbhlSTj/?igshid=1wre6yuxymaz...
|
| Just added a DAC/Amp + speaker inside.
| the__alchemist wrote:
| No. Compared to an embedded device running targeted code, Linux
| will be slow, and consume more power. We're not in a post-
| computational scarcity period yet - responsiveness and battery
| life matter.
| Sanzig wrote:
| It's also much easier to handle applications that require
| very tight timing (examples: motor control, real-time signal
| processing) when you're using a microcontroller with bare-
| metal code or almost bare-metal with a very lightweight RTOS.
| posterboy wrote:
| a better idea would be to get it to replace the socket, give it
| a neat face plate.
|
| Actually, you only need to have the input/output in place and
| plan for the wiring at building construction, because the--
| literally--biggest problem should be the power converter. Guess
| that's why you complain about weight, too.
| testmasterflex wrote:
| Sure but that would raise the threshold for setup a lot for
| consumers. Maybe viable one day if I get a large order from a
| hotel chain or similar
| rbanffy wrote:
| Linux has a ton of pull in this space, but you can still do a
| lot with thinner RTOSs on smaller, less powerful (and power-
| hungry) SoCs.
| testmasterflex wrote:
| Yeah the fact I can SSH into the unit and install just about
| any services like a web server just makes me happy and I can
| focus on building cool software instead as if it was a fully
| featured server.
| rbanffy wrote:
| It's excellent for development. Being able to have a
| complete development and debugging toolset inside the
| target environment is awesome for all sorts of reason.
| vidarh wrote:
| The RPi 0W is orders of magnitude faster and bigger than the
| first Linux machines I used as a desktop and even the first
| Linux machines we used as login and mail servers for an ISP I
| used to run. We handled dozens of simultaneously logged in
| users on that machine.
|
| So the overhead of Linux is not the issue, even with modern
| Linux kernels taking up substantially more space. But the
| overhead of any given distro may be.
|
| You can certainly get lots of things done with a more basic
| device, but at this point if the unit cost of an RPi 0W works
| for you, it's certainly convenient to use something like that.
|
| That said, you can do a lot smaller device and still run Linux.
| E.g. the smallest device I've run Linux on (and it was no
| record breaker by any means) had 4MB RAM and 4MB flash, and a
| mid 1990's low end x86 clone.
|
| The Transcend WiFi SD-cards that I linked to elsewhere also is
| a good demonstration of how small you can get a Linux machine
| (or could, almost a decade ago)
| andromaton wrote:
| faster and *smaller
| vidarh wrote:
| I should have been more precise - I meant it has magnitudes
| more storage and memory. My first workstation had 16MB RAM
| (and we ran X on them) and 400MB hard-drives.
| blihp wrote:
| It's not an either/or thing or even a particularly new decision
| point. I generally just ask myself for smaller projects if an
| OS is justified/worth it? If so, go with a SoC or larger
| running an OS. If not, go with a microcontroller. All that has
| really changed is the area of overlap between microcontrollers
| and SoCs continues to grow so it increasingly becomes a
| requirements/preference decision vs. only one or the other
| being possible.
| amelius wrote:
| One tiny problem: I don't have a wall socket in my bathroom,
| and I suppose many people don't. And even if they do it's
| likely occupied by the electric toothbrush.
|
| The future is probably to have the CPU integrated in the
| speaker.
| testmasterflex wrote:
| Sure, but afaik new homes do. And the latest prototype we
| built was battery run but I made a lot of mistakes so I'm
| starting over with the raspberry and eventually making a
| battery version again with another mcu.
| amelius wrote:
| By the way, some portable speakers have a USB charging
| outlet which you could use as well.
| testmasterflex wrote:
| When it's time to DFM the plan is to contact a CM that
| makes portable speakers
| ascorbic wrote:
| I don't know where you're planning to get it
| manufactured, but I can recommend a CM in the UK that I
| used for my own Kickstarter project (vela.io) and have
| continued to do so for multiple rounds of reorders. I
| originally found them via an intro from another indie
| hardware maker who sells high end portable speakers. If
| you want a chat, send me a DM on Twitter where my
| username is the same.
| vidarh wrote:
| Yeah, many places there are specific restrictions on
| electrical equipment for bathrooms that includes e.g.
| specific sockets types. In the UK for example, most wall
| sockets in the bathroom use two prongs and are typically
| marked "shavers only". You _can_ install three prong sockets
| that can take normal UK plugs in a bathroom, but they must
| have RCDs, and must be IP (Ingress Protection) rated, and the
| equipment to be used must also be IP rated to a certain
| level, depending on proximity to a bath etc.
|
| As a result, most bathrooms in the UK only have the two-prong
| shaver outlets, if that.
| ngcc_hk wrote:
| Unfortunately the ulisp can run only on arduino. Otherwise it
| would be interesting.
|
| But in the other hand if you just want a hacking device that can
| be there abd phone home, can arduino-ulisp fit the bill. Wonder.
| Spunkie wrote:
| Neat.
|
| Should combine it with power line internet for an almost
| completely unmonitored channel for data exfiltration.
| ekianjo wrote:
| You can't combine it with power line internet out of nothing -
| you need an appliance already installed in the first place, and
| usually the data is encrypted over the power line anyway.
| XorNot wrote:
| Powerline internet to the fusebox where you turn it into 4G
| with another device.
| schoen wrote:
| You could use UPB to signal over the home wiring to another
| device.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_powerline_bus
|
| (Well, I guess there are several different protocols in
| this area, with their respective transceivers available. I
| used to use X-10, which has a much lower data rate.)
| scoopertrooper wrote:
| You'd only be able to get access to the fuse box at a very
| small company or at a residence. Either of which probably
| isn't monitoring their wifi or cellular (especially)
| channels.
| monocasa wrote:
| You can pick up homeplug signals from other houses if you're
| on the same phase. And the encryption isn't really the best.
| vidarh wrote:
| There's the good old sdcards with wifi running Linux that seems
| like they'd be a good candidate for that.
|
| EDIT: This is the one I was thinking of:
|
| http://haxit.blogspot.com.au/2013/08/hacking-transcend-wifi-...
| zeckalpha wrote:
| Power line internet is very noisy in the RF spectrum.
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