[HN Gopher] Stack on a Budget - A collection of services with fr...
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       Stack on a Budget - A collection of services with free tiers
        
       Author : bryanrasmussen
       Score  : 332 points
       Date   : 2021-05-03 06:01 UTC (17 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (github.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (github.com)
        
       | PinkPigeon wrote:
       | Our project started on a free Heroku tier (which funnily enough,
       | to this day, is the reason our DB is postgres), but quickly
       | outgrew that and I heard horror stories about how quickly it got
       | expensive.
       | 
       | We then switched to the cheapest Hetzner tier, which was just
       | astoundingly cheap and performed very well for two years or so.
       | 
       | Eventually we had to upgrade and are now paying EUR 5 for an
       | instance that's probably beefier than we need.
       | 
       | All of this is backed by Dokku (haven't found a use case for k8s
       | yet, single-machine is good enough for now).
       | 
       | Be interesting to see what happens if we ever wanted to scale
       | horizontally, but there's quite a few Hetzner instances we can
       | scale to vertically, before needing to go horizontal I think.
       | 
       | We also used some other 'free' services, like Netlify for hosting
       | the static sites our product spits out, but we found that they
       | have a lot of hidden (and surprisingly expensive) costs, like
       | form handling. Those costs add up quickly.
       | 
       | Ended up going with Cloudflare for that, which delivers a lot on
       | their free tier (and less worrying about getting DDosed by
       | something like HN).
        
       | boobo94 wrote:
       | This is nice. Thanks for sharing!
        
       | coder1001 wrote:
       | Rules for contributing to the list:
       | https://github.com/255kb/stack-on-a-budget/blob/master/CONTR...
        
       | voiper1 wrote:
       | Similar list: https://free-for.dev/ with previous HN discussion:
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26239711
        
       | sakisv wrote:
       | Very nice, thanks for sharing!
       | 
       | Speaking of free services, one thing I've been looking for with
       | not much luck is a Google groups equivalent. It can be paid as
       | well, just not hosted by Google because I don't trust them to not
       | discontinue it in the (not so distant) future.
        
       | wlk wrote:
       | For anyone looking for really straightforward way to get cloud
       | hosting credits, checkout out IBM cloud:
       | https://developer.ibm.com/startups/ you can get a $1000/month
       | credit for one year no commitment to continue using them after.
        
         | bufferoverflow wrote:
         | One year goes fast. I'd hate knowing I have to move a year from
         | now.
        
           | alephu5 wrote:
           | Have an open mind, maybe you wouldn't want to move.
        
             | giglamesh wrote:
             | For some of us, it is simply a question of budget. I'm
             | using these tiers to run static sites for non-profits with
             | no money and no plans to raise any.
        
         | spamalot159 wrote:
         | $1000/month is actually really impressive. I have seen a couple
         | of others that offer some free credit but not nearly as much.
         | For example Azure only gives $200 for your first 30 days
         | https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/free/search
         | 
         | The real question is: is using IBM cloud worth it? I haven't
         | had any experience but I might be willing to try if they are
         | just handing out money like that.
        
           | wlk wrote:
           | You have to apply for the free credits, by filling out simple
           | form, so there might be cases where you don't qualify.
           | 
           | Among the people who applied I don't know of anyone who was
           | rejected.
        
           | kryptk wrote:
           | Was spending $20k/mo with IBM at the peak in 2019, have since
           | migrated to AWS and left IBM completely.
           | 
           | Thoughts:
           | 
           | - Support, including paid enterprise support, was hilariously
           | bad. It would take 3 days of escalations to the account
           | manager to get even get someone to look at a ticket, weeks to
           | resolve anything.
           | 
           | - Billing is a broken mess. There is no common uuid between
           | the billing and storage systems. It's literally not possible
           | to link a billing line to a storage resource. Nobody at IBM I
           | discussed this with felt it was a problem, but my stack
           | dynamically provisions disks so this was actually a huge
           | issue for me.
           | 
           | - Managed IoT services would change under us with no notice,
           | new quotas kicking in that took us completely offline. Nobody
           | bothered to reach out before flipping the quotas on.
           | 
           | I could continue but I think you get the picture.. dont take
           | their $1k/mo poison pill, you dont want to go prod with these
           | incapable morons.
        
             | qorrect wrote:
             | > Support, including paid enterprise support, was
             | hilariously bad. It would take 3 days of escalations to the
             | account manager to get even get someone to look at a
             | ticket, weeks to resolve anything.
             | 
             | Having just finished a job that used an IBM tool ( IBM
             | Sterling File Gateway ) , I want to throw in that I'll
             | _never_ pay for an IBM product again, their support was
             | awful , I think they actually helped the situation once out
             | of the 30 times we called them.
        
       | stygiansonic wrote:
       | Grafana Cloud, which provides Loki logging and all the Grafana
       | goodness. It has a free tier:
       | https://grafana.com/products/cloud/pricing/
       | 
       | (Not associated with Grafana, but have used this free tier for
       | personal projects and to learn Grafana/ Loki)
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | the_duke wrote:
       | Free is great, and you can get a decent mileage out of cobbling
       | together a few services.
       | 
       | But I'd personally be way too stressed and annoyed by worrying
       | about the often very restrictive free tier limits. You can very
       | easily blow through the network egress, for example.
       | 
       | For things I want to be cheap I've started hosting a lot of
       | things on Hetzner Cloud [1].
       | 
       | Even their cheapest instance (1vCPU/2GB RAM/20TB traffic) at 2.5
       | Euro/month can run a k3s Kubernetes cluster with Traefik ingress,
       | loki logging, their own CSI driver, cert-manager, Grafana and a 2
       | or 3 light weight Go/Rust services. With their Terraform provider
       | I can easily scale up the cluster in less than a minute.
       | 
       | And since it's Kubernetes I can also always move things to GC or
       | AWS if required.
       | 
       | That's incredibly cheap, and you don't have to worry about limits
       | or free tier periods ending, etc. It's a long-term solution.
       | 
       | I'm sure there are some other similar providers out there.
       | 
       | edit: to be clear, I also have clients with sizable production
       | workloads on the same infrastructure, it's not just for tiny toy
       | deployments. Above is just an example how far you can go for
       | _almost_ no money.
       | 
       | [1] https://www.hetzner.com/cloud
        
         | darumderum wrote:
         | +1 for hetzner
        
         | trinovantes wrote:
         | How's the latency from NA to their German datacenters? Their
         | offerings seem much better than my current Digital Ocean setup
         | at the $10 bracket
         | 
         | (as a side note, is there an NA-equivalent of Hetzner?)
        
           | krageon wrote:
           | Generally latency the other way is 100-120ms if both sides
           | are close to an exchange. If you live way out in the boonies
           | those numbers to straight out the window.
        
         | bogle wrote:
         | That's a lot of moving parts. To give me an idea of what's left
         | over, how lightweight are we talking when you say, "2 or 3
         | light weight Go services"?
        
           | the_duke wrote:
           | Sure, and that's only recommended if you know your way around
           | Kubernetes. I just wanted to illustrate that it's possible to
           | host a k8s cluster with some workloads for 2.5EUR per month.
           | 
           | You can always skip the Kubernetes overhead and use plain
           | VMs.
           | 
           | Obviously you can't expect too much from a single vCPU at
           | that price, but as an example, I had the above setup plus
           | miniflux (feed reader), Postgres, Maddy (mail server) and
           | Nginx for a few static sites, all on the cheapest instance.
           | It was mostly fine, apart from occasioal stutters.
        
             | papito wrote:
             | The amount of time and the opportunity cost involved in
             | "knowing your way around Kubernetes", might as well just
             | pay for Slack.
        
         | CodesInChaos wrote:
         | Hetzner's dedicated server offerings are great. But their cloud
         | offering seems rather limited.
         | 
         | For that I'd rather look into scaleway (starting at 15
         | EUR/month for DEV1-M), who offer services like managed
         | kubernetes or S3 compatible object storage. What I like about
         | their pricing is that it's very predictable. For example
         | traffic is free (but bandwidth is limited) and object storage
         | is only billed by size, not by API calls.
         | 
         | (disclaimer: I didn't use scaleway yet, so I don't know if it
         | works reliably in practice)
        
         | jean-malo wrote:
         | Hetzner is great! I have a k3s cluster running there and can't
         | complain, my experience has been very smooth.
        
         | hardwaresofton wrote:
         | You think cloud is good wait till you use the dedicated servers
         | :). I was sold on Hetzner after running into their robot
         | marketplace (on HN I think) years ago. Fantastic provider if
         | you can live with a little bit of latency depending on where
         | you are.
         | 
         | With what Hetzner prices at I'm always on the look out for a US
         | competitor but there doesn't seem to be one yet -- best prices
         | consistently come from OVH most of the time or LeaseWeb.
        
         | yunohn wrote:
         | Do you have an estimate of how much traffic/load this can
         | serve? Your description doesn't make it sound like these are
         | for public services.
        
           | zuzun wrote:
           | Yesterday there was a blog post by someone receiving HN
           | traffic on a cheap Hetzner instance:
           | 
           | https://blog.royalsloth.eu/posts/how-much-traffic-comes-
           | from...
        
             | yunohn wrote:
             | Thanks for this, it answers my question partially - the
             | author talks about Hugo-based static sites. As for OP, I'd
             | be curious to know how services with more dynamic workloads
             | fare. However, reading another comment of theirs, it
             | confirms my suspicion that it was for their personal
             | services, not public.
        
               | the_duke wrote:
               | I edited my I initial comment to mention this, but I also
               | know companies with sizeable production deployments.
               | 
               | It's definitely viable for businesses if you need to save
               | money.
               | 
               | Although I primarily recommend it for secondary
               | workloads.
               | 
               | As a business you will probably be better off having
               | S3/GCS and managed Kubernetes, managed databases etc.
               | Better guarantees and less risk. And everyone is familiar
               | with the big clouds, so less training for new hires.
        
         | sdevonoes wrote:
         | In terms of usability (their UI/UX, integration with Terraform,
         | etc.), features and support, would you recommend Hetzner Cloud
         | over Digital Ocean? I'm really interested, but, for instance, I
         | don't see Hetzner offers VPCs, right?
        
           | the_duke wrote:
           | The UI is very responsive and well done. The TF provider has
           | been excellent and bug free, in my experience.
           | 
           | DO has a few features that Hetzner lacks: S3 equivalent,
           | managed Kubernetes and managed databases. So you need to have
           | enough tolerance for managing all of that yourself. (they do
           | have storage volumes, so you can get there with self hosted
           | Minio etc, but it's obviously more work)
           | 
           | Support is pretty good, but quite a bit more responsive if
           | you have larger deployments.
        
             | e_proxus wrote:
             | I tried to use DO Spaces (their S3 equivalent) to store 13
             | Kb of Pulumi state data, it took 5 minutes to save.
             | Switched to AWS S3, it took less than a second.
             | 
             | It seems to be seriously rate limited to the point of being
             | unusable.
        
             | [deleted]
        
           | j45 wrote:
           | I would be weary of DigitalOcean.
           | 
           | DigitalOcean unlike other providers does not allow you to
           | easily download your disk images or backups of your own
           | servers.
           | 
           | It has been a feature requested many times and support simply
           | lets you (eventually) know that it's not going to happen.
           | 
           | That means you cannot have backups stored in more than one
           | location, and more regularly, it's a veiled form of lock in
           | to make it unable for you to move.
           | 
           | Other vendors simply let you download your disk image,
           | snapshot or backup at anytime.
           | 
           | DO has a good interface, but so do others. Proxmox or ESXi
           | can be run pretty easily on a piece of equipment too.
           | 
           | OVH and Hetzner are strong options, and I have heard good
           | experiences with Linode, who's pricing is on part with DO.
        
             | onlyrealcuzzo wrote:
             | Can't you just:
             | 
             | 1. mount /mnt/archive <block_storage>
             | 
             | 2. dd if=/dev/<your_sda_partition>
             | of=/mnt/archive/<my_image> bs=64K conv=noerror,sync
             | 
             | 3. Download your image from your block.
             | 
             | ?
        
         | mhd wrote:
         | That's quite early to go Kubernetes cluster. (I'm reminded of
         | the old "does it run Beowulf" meme)
        
           | dfox wrote:
           | That depends. Nowadyas installing k8s is easy enough that it
           | is probably the most strightforward way of getting automated
           | deployments that is reasonably reliable. The only issue is
           | that the control plane is somewhat heavy weight, which can be
           | issue for these small cheap VM instances (and I suspect that
           | the reason why they are cheap is that they are intentionally
           | sized such as not to make sense for production k8s
           | deployment).
        
             | watermelon0 wrote:
             | Installation is easy, but maintenance/upkeep is non-
             | trivial. Kubernetes ecosystem is complex by itself, without
             | having to run non-managed control plane.
             | 
             | They have K8s cloud controller manager to manage load
             | balancers and private networking, and driver for attaching
             | persistent volumes. Also, instances go up to 32 vCPU/128 GB
             | of memory, so they are more than enough to run most loads,
             | including the control plane.
        
             | mhd wrote:
             | I think it boils down to what people deem "reasonably
             | reliable" for such starting situations or whether that's a
             | requirement in the first place. Related to whether it's
             | better/required to structure your software as set of
             | services or a monolith.
             | 
             | Of course, if you're already doing a devops or particularly
             | mean full stack regular job where this is your daily bread,
             | you might as well use the knowledge.
        
         | BiteCode_dev wrote:
         | I didn't know Hetzner Cloud, an first thought, "wow, it's even
         | cheaper than OVH, which is already a bargain"
         | (https://www.ovhcloud.com/fr/vps/).
         | 
         | But then I realized you are limited in bandwithd to 20 TB,
         | while OVH provides, for barely more EUR, unmetered traffic.
         | It's huge because you never have to worry about a random spike
         | day, a bot doing something stupid, an attack, or a use case
         | switch (ex: video streaming).
        
           | q3k wrote:
           | OVH might give you 'unmetered' traffic, but their
           | connectivity _sucks_. Hetzner's 20TB/mo is equivalent to a
           | constant measly ~60Mbps, but at least you'll reliably get
           | this rate to most of the Internet, and very often will be
           | able to saturate your link speed for peak usage.
           | 
           | There have been times where I wasn't able to get more than a
           | handful Mbps from an OVH box in RBX to any network I've tried
           | (multiple eyeball networks, Google Cloud, AS204880...). I
           | also know multiple people who had to quickly migrate out of
           | OVH because they suddenly got DSL-tier performance to their
           | critical customers, and there was nothing they could do about
           | it.
           | 
           | So it might be theoretically unmetered, but technically...
           | I'd be surprised if you'd be reliably able to push more than
           | 20TB in a month to outside OVH's AS, or even datacenter. You
           | get what you pay for, and while network connectivity is not
           | nearly as expensive as what large cloud providers would like
           | you to believe, it's not free.
           | 
           | A true unmetered, non-oversubscribed, globally reaching Gbps
           | link would run you something close to $200/mo in T1 transit
           | commitment costs alone, and that's if you buy in bulk and
           | already have good settlement-free peering with large networks
           | to supplement that T1 transit.
        
           | gruez wrote:
           | >But then I realized you are limited in bandwithd to 20 TB
           | 
           | How are you using 20TB/month? Are you running a tor relay or
           | something?
        
             | rollcat wrote:
             | Video.
        
             | BiteCode_dev wrote:
             | Streaming, webrtc, chat, file storage and upload,
             | torrenting, file conversion, proxying, web crawling,
             | backups, sync...
             | 
             | There is more to the web than crud.
        
       | tdeck wrote:
       | See also: https://free-for.dev
        
       | 256DEV wrote:
       | This is a great resource, my currency API [1] has actually been
       | on this list for a while!
       | 
       | One thing that amazes me though is some of the places people rely
       | on free services. As someone who has run a free and open access
       | API for over 10 years now it never ceases to amaze me how people
       | integrate free services into critical production code and high
       | volume, high availability contexts.
       | 
       | Sometimes I can see from my logs and sometimes because users end
       | up contacting me - developers happily include the version of my
       | API that doesn't require any API key [2] in large corporate ERPs,
       | apps in the Atlassian app store, shopping carts of super high
       | volume e-commerce stores etc. etc.
       | 
       | Obviously I take great care in how my free APIs are provisioned
       | and monitored, but it is still shocking to me that people just
       | pick an API off a list and then rely on it in a system that
       | probably cost millions in developer salaries to build...
       | 
       | [1] https://www.exchangerate-api.com [2]
       | https://www.exchangerate-api.com/docs/free
        
       | bongobingo wrote:
       | Good for hobby or personal projects, but not if you're building
       | something for work. Many of these "free" tiers are designed to
       | vendor lock you before they walk you off a pricing cliff.
       | 
       | Take Auth0. Free for up to 7,000 user but then it jumps to about
       | $250/month. Migrating from Auth0 is a pain. You should really
       | only consider these "free" services if you think you'll always be
       | in the free tier, and if you'd use the service even if it wasn't
       | free.
        
         | j45 wrote:
         | The time it takes to integrate ( and switch) many of these
         | services may not be much less than spinning up something
         | comparable yourself between docker, k8, lxc containers, etc.
         | 
         | Prematurely building scaling into every single layer of a test
         | project might be a bit much, especially when it might not be
         | known where the bottlenecks may occur.
         | 
         | In many cases, early prototypes/mvps should be semi throwaway
         | anyways.
         | 
         | The idea of having a turnkey stack like this, maybe even with a
         | script remains intriguing tho :)
        
       | IceWreck wrote:
       | There is also PythonAnywhere which isnt mentioned here
        
       | roncohen wrote:
       | I was delighted to see Opbeat on there (under Application
       | Performance Monitoring).
       | 
       | Opbeat was acquired by Elastic, Inc and turned into their APM
       | product. You can try the Elastic APM product for free as well:
       | https://www.elastic.co/apm
       | 
       | (I was an Opbeat co-founder and part of the team that built
       | Elastic APM)
        
       | PaulHoule wrote:
       | I hate people who spend $10,000 of time to save 10 cents. Is
       | anybody collecting a list of people interested in these things so
       | I can send their resume to my competitor?
        
         | KronisLV wrote:
         | Some people don't even earn $10,000 per year, so that's
         | probably an exaggeration. I agree that it'd be unreasonable to
         | spend a year or even months looking for ways to save money, but
         | if it's a few simple choices that you can make while
         | researching what to use, it would probably be worth it!
         | Besides, if you intend to keep a project alive, it makes sense
         | to minimize the expenses that it'll passively incur.
         | 
         | The choice between using SaaS platforms (any of the managed DB
         | services, Auth0 etc.), PaaS platforms (like Heroku), the big
         | IaaS vendors (AWS, GCP, Azure, Alibaba) and just hosting most
         | of those yourself in something like Docker containers on cheap
         | VPSes (think Hetzner, OVH, Contabo or Time4VPS) can result in
         | an order of magnitude less or more expenditures.
        
       | gigatexal wrote:
       | What's really nice about this repo is that it has pros/cons and
       | specs for each service. It's actually a really nice way to learn
       | how one might use a service. I thought this was a nice side-
       | effect.
        
         | 255kb wrote:
         | That was my goal when I created it. I wanted it to be an
         | explanation on how and why a service is good or ready for free
         | prod usage :)
        
       | novaleaf wrote:
       | I'm a bit tired of submitting to these lists-as-git...
       | 
       | If you are interested in web scraping, you can use my SaaS free:
       | https://PhantomJsCloud.com I've had the same free tier since
       | 2017.
        
       | wexq wrote:
       | It's missing Oracle Cloud's free tier.
       | 
       | Now, I don't like Oracle, their goings about with Java or their
       | database (fortunately currently I don't have to maintain any of
       | those), but their always free tier is solid, and I'd rank it as
       | the best among free offerings.
       | 
       | I made an issue for it's inclusion, but for those who want a
       | decent free cloud service, do check it out
       | https://www.oracle.com/cloud/free/
       | 
       | You get 2 VMs with 1GB RAM, 2 Block Volumes for 100GB total, 10GB
       | Object Storage, 10GB Archive Storage, 2 Virtual Oracle Databases
       | (20GB) , Load balancer, 10TB outbound traffic/month and 10TB
       | outbound bandwidth
        
         | easton wrote:
         | Give them a fake phone number though (if possible, I can't
         | remember if they require SMS auth), they called me for like two
         | weeks asking for me to spend money until I explained I was in
         | college and I wasn't going to spend money.
        
           | jeroenhd wrote:
           | Should've read this earlier. Hopefully they keep their sales
           | pitch to a minimum in my country...
        
             | wexq wrote:
             | FWIW, I've not had any spam whatsoever from them.
        
         | saurik wrote:
         | FWIW, I feel like hating Oracle is a _perfect_ reason to use as
         | much of their free service offerings as you possibly can...
         | bleed them dry! ;P
        
           | tyingq wrote:
           | I guess you could create and share a "continuous cartesian
           | join" image in whatever their equivalent of an AMI is.
        
         | popotamonga wrote:
         | Seconded, i run some basic etl jobs there on a cron. VM 100%
         | uptime for 1 yr so far. Also the S3-compatible 10GB block
         | storage is just awesome.
        
       | aitchnyu wrote:
       | I wanted to use Geojango and Postgis, the framework for GIS apps.
       | I chose Cloud Run, since it allows me to install system packages
       | in container, can scale down to zero, can scale up to meet
       | demand. But I had to mess with Docker etc. I wonder if a much
       | simpler PHP stack can absorb 5-10 RPS without an autoscaling
       | containerized setup, be cheaper than a VPS and can still interact
       | with Postgis in a concise way as Geodjango. I wonder if I'm
       | pragmatic or wasting massive effort.
        
       | brudgers wrote:
       | In terms of business use (not personal use), if free is
       | appealing, your business is under-capitalized. Building a
       | business is about building relationships. Not just customer
       | relationships, but business to business relationships. Customer
       | retention is important and so is vendor retention. Customer churn
       | is a drag on operations, so is vendor churn.
       | 
       | The cost of a vendor is mostly the time and energy that is put
       | into building your operations on top of their platform. It is
       | also cash of course. But free means that your vendor will have
       | trouble staying in business. That is not what you want.
        
         | seg_lol wrote:
         | Free is a huge liability, there is no contract, implicit or
         | explicit. Free can go away, either by having the service
         | disappear or being priced out of reach.
         | 
         | Having TF scripts that can provision dev environments quickly
         | and reliably is a more mature engineering approach than
         | stitching together a bunch of free tier services.
         | 
         | If one literally has no money and the free tier means the
         | difference between doing a thing and not doing a thing, by all
         | means, embrace the free tier. Otherwise it is a liability, esp
         | if it is easy to exceed the limits of the free tier and having
         | to handle uncontrolled charges.
        
       | uncomputation wrote:
       | I really wish we had a more robust solution to the "free vs paid"
       | problem where you can trust the free solutions don't do anything
       | nefarious or shady. Maybe this is already the ideal model and
       | there's always going to be some downsides, but I long for the
       | days when some filecoin-esque or subsidy option is available.
        
       | ArtWomb wrote:
       | One more: AWS Graviton t4g.micro vm instances using the 64-bit
       | ARM Neoverse N1 cores are free until Jun 30 ;)
       | 
       | https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/graviton/
        
       | daniel_iversen wrote:
       | So cool! What else good is missing? Maybe customer service like
       | chat (Drift etc) or CRM (free tiers)?
        
         | simfree wrote:
         | Erxes.io does both :P
        
       | 255kb wrote:
       | Hi, I'm the creator of this repo :) Thank you for sharing it on
       | HN! I am glad you people find it useful. Feel free to contribute
       | if there is anything that needs to be updated, I will do my best
       | to review and merge today.
       | 
       | And also, thanks to all the contributors who helped creating this
       | awesome list.
        
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