[HN Gopher] Visual Studio 2022
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Visual Studio 2022
Author : kyleShropshire
Score : 65 points
Date : 2021-04-19 20:51 UTC (2 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (devblogs.microsoft.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (devblogs.microsoft.com)
| yellow_lead wrote:
| Hoping they can fix the "Intellisense operation in progress" pane
| from ever appearing again.
| tdrp wrote:
| I don't know what they did in VS2019 but there was clearly a
| ridiculous perf hit in many modules, especially Intellisense
| related.
|
| While I sort of liked the AI-predictions they introduced a
| serious lag in typing and every couple of seconds typing would
| nearly freeze. After I turned those off, typing became smoother
| but still slightly laggy (sort of like typing on a remote
| terminal on the other side of the world), and the predictions
| would pop up much slower than VS2017.
|
| Lots of other perf issues like "Find in files" being 3x slower
| than in VS2017. Or adding a new class to a file wastes several
| seconds looking up templates _somewhere_. I saw dozens of bugs
| filed for these issues over the past few months and most were
| resolved as "Fixed" (allegedly) or "No repro" but in practice
| the IDE perf is still IMO unacceptable.
|
| I really hope they fixed that stuff with VS2022.
| 2bitencryption wrote:
| Before clicking the link I was going to joke, "But is it 64-bit
| yet?" So I was pleasantly surprised :D
| malkia wrote:
| This ^^^ - Longest waiting for this to happen. Solves quite a
| lot of issues - from not having to support 32-bit for your own
| extensions, designer forms, etc. to have tests run in the IDE,
| to not have plugins/extensions all go IPC which is probably not
| without problems.
| conradev wrote:
| I hope this is one step closer to ARM64 support!
| jgon wrote:
| At a previous job we were repeatedly running into memory
| pressure issues and had talked about converting to a 64-bit
| application on and off for years. It was something I had pushed
| for as we were doing increasingly baroque work-arounds and I
| was asked to do some work to estimate what it would take to
| convert over. Ultimately it was decided not to do so and one of
| the repeated reasons that was cited for why we shouldn't was
| "Visual Studio isn't 64-bit, why are we so worried!?" Suffice
| it to say, I found that reasoning pretty frustrating and I am
| curious to know what will happen now that VS can no longer be
| cited.
| jalalx wrote:
| Ok, with this new x64 version, should we rewrite the extensions?
| Does extensibility API changes?
| thrower123 wrote:
| Only a decade too late on the move to 64-bit
| antaviana wrote:
| Rico Mariani, the "perf guy" at Microsoft, had this opinion on
| VS 64-bit in 2009:
|
| https://web.archive.org/web/20160309232651/http://blogs.msdn...
| thrower123 wrote:
| This was a stupid take even then.
|
| Performance in Visual Studio has become such a problem that
| I've renounced it entirely in favor of Rider.
| Hydraulix989 wrote:
| Huh, why does this still exist if there's VS Code?
| Thristle wrote:
| I only used VS in recent years for unity development
|
| You can't compare - VS is way ahead of VSC in terms of code
| completion and IDE<->engine integration
| partiallypro wrote:
| A compiler vs a basic IDE, yeah, totally the same.
| malkia wrote:
| Because it's more stable, has better debugger, testing, etc. In
| Visual Studio Code I feel like things might break if just
| update it, or the plugin/extension got updated. Also you can
| keep the whole team in the same "boat" with single IDE, and
| your IT would know how to respond.
| gerash wrote:
| I tried out VSCode after all the rage and was pretty
| underwhelmed. It looked like a lightweight syntax highlighter
| plus a JS extension marketplace.
|
| I remember VS was a real well integrated IDE back when I used
| it. Something in the same league as IntelliJ, etc. VSCode
| wasn't in the same league at least for me.
| 2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote:
| VS Code is a glorified text editor (which isn't bad, I use it).
| Visual Studio is a full-fledged IDE.
| acdha wrote:
| VS Code has things like refactoring support and integrated
| debugging which are traditionally seen as the dividing line
| between an IDE and a text editor. How are you defining that
| distinction?
| rp1229 wrote:
| Same reason other IDEs exist. VS Code is just the tip of the
| iceberg.
| paddim8 wrote:
| More powerful debugging, more mature UI development tools, does
| a bit more for you.
| wvenable wrote:
| I love VS Code but it's no replacement for Visual Studio when
| developing .NET apps.
| symlinkk wrote:
| Other than legacy technology like WYSIWYG form builders,
| Visual Studio Code has the same functionality but with a
| simpler, superior interface. Visual Studio is a legacy
| product, it's that simple, although a lot of people don't
| seem to want to accept it.
| e-master wrote:
| No it's not. VS Code doesn't allow you to view/manage
| threads, modules for example which are crucial for a bit
| more advanced debugging. I love VS Code and use it daily,
| but it's no replacement for VS yet.
| alkonaut wrote:
| Designers is just one of a handful of things. The perf
| analysis tools for example don't exist in vscode. You can
| compensate by using a separate profiler but that just
| drives home the point that VScode replaces only some parts
| of VS.
| tester756 wrote:
| For me VS has more reliable IntelliSense.
| wvenable wrote:
| Visual Code has a simpler interface because it has a
| fraction of the functionality.
|
| https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2001/03/23/strategy-letter-
| iv...
|
| "80% of the people use 20% of the features...
| Unfortunately, it's never the same 20%."
|
| > legacy technology like WYSIWYG form builders
|
| Kind of a weird statement to make -- who doesn't use
| WYSIWYG when working in XAML? Nothing legacy about that.
| fassssst wrote:
| It does a ton more than VS Code, especially for large Windows
| applications and C++ stuff.
| [deleted]
| johnnycerberus wrote:
| Why does the hammer still exist if there's pliers?
| Someone1234 wrote:
| Visual Studio supports some legacy technologies that VSCode
| likely won't ever support _well_.
|
| Even ASP.NET Core which was specifically designed to allow
| development exclusively from the terminal, still offers a
| better experience in the full VS Than VSCode (even if
| JavaScript/CSS/TS/etc part is arguably better in VSCode, the
| C#/.Net side is better in VS).
|
| But long term: I anticipate VS being a life-support product for
| that legacy tech and VSCode being the only IDE they move
| forward with. We just aren't quite there yet.
| smusamashah wrote:
| There is no comparison between the two. VS is the _real IDE_
| while VSCode is a text editor _like Sublime Text_
| alkonaut wrote:
| When it uses even 3GB (open a 100 project sln) it's
| excruciatingly slow as it is. It's also already not limited to
| 4GB because it consists of multiple processes. I can't see how
| being able to use 10GB or 20GB in the main process will help.
| brokencode wrote:
| 64 bit is an improvement IMO. If the main process has more
| memory to work with, then it's easier to keep things in memory
| and in a single process where you don't have to incur IPC
| overheads.
|
| As mentioned elsewhere, the switch does increase pointer sizes,
| but I'd be very surprised if that is significant compared to
| the amount of memory used by strings and other data.
| donatj wrote:
| > Updated icons for better clarity, legibility, and contrast.
|
| I feel like a lot of these are at best _different_. The entire
| bottom row of icons in their comparison seem FAR FAR less
| legible, especially the _X_ , _Check_ and _i_ icons
| henhouse wrote:
| Mac is only getting an updated UI? That's a huge shame. It's been
| out for years and there's still no C++ support. VS Code is decent
| if you use Cmake, but the code completion and highlighting is
| really off compared to native VS.
|
| Is there any decent alternative to a good C++ IDE for Mac besides
| Clion (which costs money).
| Thristle wrote:
| That's probably because VS for mac is not really "VS" but a re-
| skinned Xamarin IDE
| ianlevesque wrote:
| Honestly just pony up for CLion. It is actively developed
| (support for makefiles and arbitrary build systems was just
| added in addition to the existing CMake) and JetBrains has a
| super reasonable subscription that lets you keep the last
| version you had indefinitely if you ever cancel.
| tbrock wrote:
| I've tried to like the JetBrains stuff (especially Clion) but
| I just have never gotten to the point where I love it.
| lstamour wrote:
| If you can get used to some oddities, Xcode works well enough
| for any C++ code you write yourself, or have enough control
| over to make sure you follow the conventions it expects.
|
| But if you need CMake support within your IDE, CLion's worth
| it, just get the JetBrains subscription (student or
| professional) and don't look back. Oddly enough when I last
| used it, CLion didn't work with Clang-based projects quite as
| nicely as Xcode (it preferred GCC) but that might have changed
| since then.
|
| Finally, if you want to support open source, you can try VS
| Code. It mostly works, but it's not an IDE.
|
| Eclipse CDT also exists, but ... I think the last time I tried
| eclipse was back in the mid-2000s before RubyMine when there
| was a Ruby-on-Rails plugin for Eclipse. I haven't looked back
| since...
| ianlevesque wrote:
| Clang and LLDB work fine now
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