[HN Gopher] Identifying banknote fingerprints can stop counterfe...
___________________________________________________________________
Identifying banknote fingerprints can stop counterfeits on streets
Author : sizzle
Score : 16 points
Date : 2021-03-24 19:45 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (warwick.ac.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (warwick.ac.uk)
| w0mbat wrote:
| So in the actual article they prove they can tell one real PS10
| note from another real PS10 note, because every plastic note
| accidentally has a unique random texture.
|
| But as these are real notes, they can be uniquely identified by
| the serial number anyway.
|
| They never get to a part where they explain how this technique is
| useful in telling real notes from fake, since fake plastic notes
| would also have unique textures.
| readflaggedcomm wrote:
| Yes, they left out that part. The paper's abstract ends with:
|
| >[Our method] ensures that even in the extreme case when
| counterfeiters have procured the same printing equipment and
| ink as used by a legitimate government, counterfeiting
| banknotes remains infeasible because of the difficulty to
| replicate a stochastic manufacturing process.
|
| Which means each note manufacturer has its own signature,
| though whether the researchers confirmed that with more than
| random samples from circulation, I haven't been able to tell.
| The full paper is here: https://arxiv.org/abs/2103.06184
| wizzwizz4 wrote:
| Associate the fingerprint with the ID in the "what money have
| we issued?" database, probably. This sounds like a more
| practical version of my "use leaves as money" idea, and that's
| what I did. The impressive part of this research is realising
| that there might be a pre-existing "fingerprint", and finding a
| way of looking at it. They probably assumed "how this is
| useful" was obvious.
| dcroley wrote:
| They would keep a DB of the note fingerprints and look them up
| in that. Thus, this would only work if online or something.
| Aachen wrote:
| You can counterfeit that serial number. It's much harder,
| perhaps neigh impossible, to counterfeit this fingerprint. Thus
| a database of existing fingerprints tells you whether it's real
| or counterfeit. If you kept a database of serial numbers, you'd
| additionally need to store who has which bill or you'd still
| not know whether you're the sole owner of this serial number.
| someguyorother wrote:
| Couldn't the central bank just sign the fingerprint and print
| the signature on the note? If the fingerprint can't be
| counterfeited and the private key can't be stolen, then the
| note would be unforgeable. As long as the fingerprint is
| robust enough.
| mattnewton wrote:
| This was my thought, but with a central database of serial
| -> fingerprint. I like yours because of the distributed
| nature.
| thatguy0900 wrote:
| I assume they would fingerprint every note at manufacture, then
| compare every note at purchase time to see if it matches a
| known good fingerprint. You would need to completely remake all
| bills in circulation with a new style and make invalid the old
| style, and equip everyone that takes cash with a fingerprint
| machine. If they tried to just slowly scan in existing bills
| people would just keep making the fakes, I would imagine.
| UncleEntity wrote:
| > You would need to completely remake all bills in
| circulation with a new style and make invalid the old
| style...
|
| It takes a while for all the old bills to get out of
| circulation though -- a few years ago I got my hands on a $20
| bill from 1970 and the kid at the corner store almost didn't
| take it since they had apparently never seen one that old,
| probably didn't help it was nice and crisp as well. Only
| thing I can imagine is someone was saving it from their birth
| year and had to spend it for whatever reason since $20 in
| 1970 was over $100 in today's dollars so they lost a bunch of
| value holding that bill.
| mannykannot wrote:
| You do not have to equip everyone who takes cash with a
| scanner, as banknotes regularly circulate through banks.
|
| I do not know how, and how frequently, current anti-
| counterfeiting measures are checked, but the more subtle of
| them are almost never checked in ordinary cash transactions.
| Presumably they are checked somewhere?
| thatguy0900 wrote:
| I would imagine the only time it is important to stop a
| counterfeit bill is the first time its used, right? If the
| goal is to stop people from counterfeiting, at least.
| w0mbat wrote:
| I am not convinced that the texture fingerprint is robust
| enough to remain unchanged once the note goes out into the
| world and is circulated for a while. Notes would start to be
| rejected as not matching the factory fingerprint just from
| normal wear.
| rlpb wrote:
| The article covers this concern, and the claim there is that
| they have verified that regular wear and tear does not
| tarnish the fingerprint.
| psychlops wrote:
| I was curious so checked and thought other might be interested.
|
| https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/banknotes/counterfeit-bankno...
|
| "How many counterfeit banknotes are in circulation?
|
| The vast majority of counterfeits are discovered before they go
| back into circulation, when retailers and the banking system are
| sorting them. A smaller number are detected by the public or
| retailers who hand them directly to the police, or when the
| police carry out search warrants. Counterfeits are typically
| removed from circulation quickly, often after a single use.
|
| Only a small fraction, typically less than 0.02% of banknotes are
| counterfeit, that is less than 1 in 5,000 banknotes. In the first
| half of 2020, around 94,000 counterfeit Bank of England banknotes
| with a face value of PS2.1 million were taken out of circulation.
| At any one time, there is an average of 4 billion genuine
| banknotes in circulation, with a notional face value of around
| PS75 billion."
|
| The scope of the problem seems to be about 2 million pounds per
| year. I wonder what this solution will save and cost.
___________________________________________________________________
(page generated 2021-03-24 23:02 UTC)