[HN Gopher] Wendy Carlos on Bob Moog (2005)
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Wendy Carlos on Bob Moog (2005)
Author : fipar
Score : 113 points
Date : 2021-03-23 10:56 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.wendycarlos.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.wendycarlos.com)
| jacquesm wrote:
| I've been re-discovering organs (and specifically, pipe organs)
| and I think they are an early pre-cursor so electronic
| synthesizers. Wendy Carlos got me hooked on electronic music back
| when that was still brand new (ok, Theremin), and her Switched On
| Bach record is one of very few vinyl records that I still own.
| Karawebnetwork wrote:
| This website is a trip back in time! I love coming across old
| style sites out in the wild. It reminds me of a bygone era.
|
| Her site makes me want to change the style of mine and go back to
| old school design paradigms.
|
| http://www.wendycarlos.com/
|
| (Another great site when you need a little nostalgia boost is
| Space Jam: https://www.spacejam.com/)
| bjelkeman-again wrote:
| > From the beginning it was a balanced yin/yang relationship
| between a maker of musical tools and the artists who used those
| tools. It doesn't seem to work that way much anymore, and more's
| the pity.
|
| A place where I think this still happens is Darkglass and Neural
| DSP where Doug Castro leads teams that create great musical
| products in collaboration with artists. They just released the
| Quad Cortex digital guitar effects pedal/platform which is
| getting high praise. (Anxiously awaited I just got mine as part
| of a the first batch of a preorder).
|
| https://neuraldsp.com/
| Mizza wrote:
| Steve Duda worked with Deadmau5 to come up with Serum, which is
| probably the most popular synth VST (and I think previously he
| was a sound designer for Trent Reznor).
| terramex wrote:
| It still happens even in 'classic' synthesiser industry. Aphex
| Twin did a collaboration with Korg few years ago, he was
| providing feedback to them and created some excellent product
| demos like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUT01p-C2xo
|
| He also had input into Novation Bass Station II:
| https://novationmusic.com/en/news/bass-station-firmware-v414
|
| _AFX Mode
|
| Electronic music legend Richard James, aka Aphex Twin, has
| already played an instrumental part in the Bass Station II
| story, having provided guidance for the implementation of the
| micro-tuning added with Firmware v2.5. His conceptual
| contribution to v4.14 is even more profound, however.
|
| Letting his imagination run riot, Richard envisioned the
| decidedly radical notion of having a discrete set of synthesis
| parameters assigned to each note of Bass Station II, either
| variations on a 'seed' patch, or disparate sounds designed to
| constitute a chimeric whole. Although this sort of thing could
| already be kludged using very fast program change messages,
| having multiple sounds active at the same time would clearly be
| a far more creative and efficient system.
|
| AFX Mode is the realisation of James' out-there concept. Put
| simply, it lets you modify your Bass Station II patch on a key-
| by-key basis. Use it to introduce subtle changes to a sound as
| you play up and down the keyboard; divide the keyboard into
| multiple zones (one per key if you like!), each playing its own
| sound; or create entire drum kits in a single preset for
| triggering manually or via the Arpeggiator. It's a truly
| inspiring feature that really does open up a whole new world of
| sound design and performance possibilities._
| weatherlight wrote:
| They even rereleased the bass station 2:
|
| https://novationmusic.com/en/synths/afx-station
|
| the thing to remember is that this was written before 2005,
| that might have been the state of teh world then.
| oilbagz wrote:
| Look no further than Zynthian for another example of a balanced
| relationship:
|
| http://zynthian.com
|
| Seems like FOSS is more resilient to the effect that Wendy
| noted has, almost, made a farce of the synth market.
| mxmilkb wrote:
| Also https://moddevices.com
| wdfx wrote:
| Or build your own around an RPi 4
|
| https://bitbucket.org/doughammond/guitarix-foot-
| remote/src/m...
| Mediterraneo10 wrote:
| It has happened at IRCAM, too, where composers and technicians
| work together. The technician helps explain to the composer
| what electronics are available off the shelf, the composer
| drives the technician to invent new technologies to create what
| the composer can hear in his or her head.
| IAmPym wrote:
| And it absolutely still happens at Sequential (where I work),
| speaking as an engineer who is also a musician and works very
| closely with artists to hear what they want and build tools
| that they get super inspired by. I couldn't imagine building
| what we build without the close artist engagements that we
| focus on. Every single person at our company is a musician,
| which I've found out is not commonplace in our industry.
| 52-6F-62 wrote:
| It definitely still happens in the acoustic world, but much
| like the audio software world there's more noise to signal than
| there was in the past. Advanced instrument makers tend to work
| closely with artists, while there's a much larger market for
| cheaper, utility builds than ever.
|
| I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. To me it says the
| impact of music has only grown and I don't think we've began to
| scratch the surface of understanding of what it really
| communicates and does for people, and how it does it (stop me
| before I get metaphysical). The increasingly wide reach and
| accessibility of the craft with a select of standout talents to
| me says renaissance.
| jolux wrote:
| >Advanced instrument makers tend to work closely with
| artists, while there's a much larger market for cheaper,
| utility builds than ever.
|
| It's just a function of many instruments becoming
| commoditized, which is overall a good thing. I bought a new
| electric guitar for under $200 last year and it played great
| out of the box. That didn't used to be possible.
| 52-6F-62 wrote:
| For sure! I learned on something my parents ordered from
| Sears for $100. I think they still have it. Some of the
| parts look like they were composed of boxwood or balsa, and
| even cardboard.
|
| It was horrible and I would play until my fingers would
| bleed, then quit for the day. I learned to play on that for
| _years_. It made learning a battle, not just a challenge.
|
| It's another league entirely these days.
|
| I would argue to the bitter end about instrument
| construction and argue that "good" instruments are indeed
| better than the commoditized versions of the same, but for
| people starting out and coming up and even recording
| they're fine tools! Memorable is Mike Campbell absolutely
| tearing it up on an Epiphone Florida Gators LP special AKA
| a cheap novelty guitar
| (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e25p0Y3Vd38).
|
| But I to explain my original point further: It's not as
| simple as just being a function of the commoditization.
| That is undeniably what's happening, but the _why_ is, at
| the root, a demand that didn 't previously exist, and not
| just for novelty or aesthetic but playability. The need for
| playability and a pleasing sound follows adoption, and
| widespread adoption is what I think signifies renaissance.
| There are more capable musicians than ever, and even
| through the noise there are more capable productions than
| ever, in all manner of genres and tuned to all manner of
| tastes. Similar to how printing brought music to the wider
| public and a generally supportive environment for the arts
| during the period of the (capital R) Renaissance.
| numlocked wrote:
| Perhaps with Teenage Engineering as well?
|
| https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/25/magazine/electronic-music...
| motohagiography wrote:
| The impact of synthesizers is only just starting, imo. I'd argue
| that a generation of kids are using their musical ear to develop
| physical intuition for what sine, triangle, saw, pulse and other
| waves are and how they interact. The principles apply to light as
| much as they do to sound. When you take the combinatorics and
| symmetries of music and the physics of waves, you've got the
| makings of a pretty good intuitive curiosity for analog and
| quantum computing.
|
| If you've got a modular synth rig and kids in your house, I'd
| posit that you are very much our future.
| jcpst wrote:
| Glad to hear this sentiment. I have a 5U modular system I built
| long before I had kids. I'll start a patch, then have my 8-year
| old start messing with it, enjoy the sound, then talk through
| what is being changed.
| TheOtherHobbes wrote:
| The impact of synthesizers is already over. They were used far
| more imaginatively in the 70s than they are today.
|
| The real future is software, especially composition integrated
| with DSP. Not aimless generative nonsense based on randomly
| reshuffling arrays and maybe snapping them to a harmonic grid,
| but complex, composed architectures of sound.
|
| Some of them may not even have a bass drum on every quarter
| beat - a bit radical, but who knows what the future holds?
| naringas wrote:
| microtonal harmonic grids free from the rigors of 12-tet
| (i.e. midi, i.e. the keyboard)
|
| but don't get me wrong, 12-tet is an incredible
| accomplishment on its own. but it's what it is because of
| (now obsolete) physical constraints of instrument building.
|
| I've been trying to think about how to go beyond 12 tet for
| years. I recently read this quote on a (unrelated nothing to
| do with music) book[1] "So it's a bit like a piano that has a
| meta-key that lets you add new keys." which summarizes my
| goal better than I've ever been able to.
|
| [1] https://www.wiley.com/en-
| us/Don%27t+Teach+Coding%3A+Until+Yo...
| motohagiography wrote:
| If I ever made a eurorack module, it would be a controller
| for this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acoustic_levitation
| analog31 wrote:
| The funny thing is that outside of keyboards and electronic
| music, nobody cares about temperament. Most wind and string
| instruments are for all intents and purposes, untempered.
| The 12 tone scale is still important -- it produces a
| roughly consonant scale without excessive complexity. A 19
| tone saxophone would be unplayable.
| motohagiography wrote:
| Synthesizers in the 70s cost the equivalent of a new car
| today. In the 80s and 90s, they were out of reach of the
| majority of creative people, and definitely out of reach of
| kids. The problem with software instruments today is that
| their connection to the internet and social media rewards
| imitation over experimentation. I can assemble a bunch of
| samples and post it on soundcloud and call it dubstep, and it
| just creates a landfill of crap to sort through to find
| anything good. It's cultural noise, it's not signal.
|
| I seriously think the current era of modular synths and
| analog devices is to quantum computing what radio electronics
| kits of the 50s and 60s were to the personal computer. We're
| only a decade or two from a quantum Hewlett-Packard or Woz-
| Jobs garage-style project. That time goes by very fast.
| EVdotIO wrote:
| Back in the late 80s-early 90s with the advent of FM,
| digital recording, samplers and other stuff, people were
| ditching analog equipment en masse and _nobody_ wanted to
| buy it except for broke kids, and this gave rise to whole
| new genres and creative idioms we take for granted today.
| The modern iteration of this is a kid with a cracked
| version of FL Studio making weird phonk-hyper-trap. Maybe
| playing in a band will come back. Who knows, but most of
| the innovation right now is in the box.
| Minor49er wrote:
| Are you an Autechre fan by chance?
| weatherlight wrote:
| <3 Autechre and basically all of the 90s warp catalogue.
| Slow_Hand wrote:
| Word. Even their 00's releases are among some of my
| favorites.
|
| The GGP post stating that we're somehow in an ebb-tide of
| synth programming quality and musicality probably doesn't
| have much of an ear to what's being created.
| the_local_host wrote:
| > The impact of synthesizers is already over. They were used
| far more imaginatively in the 70s than they are today
|
| 1970s-style modular synthesis has been making a comeback over
| the last... 20 years. (It was a slow comeback at first).
|
| I agree that the impact of synthesizers was diminished during
| the "preset era" of the 1980s until almost the present, but
| interest in re-taking control of synths is growing (just look
| up "modular synthesis" on Youtube to see many examples) and I
| expect that we're on the cusp of having synthesis become
| interesting again as artists sort out what to do with all the
| new stuff.
| jcpst wrote:
| Yep. And it's important to note that advances in
| software/DSP are not isolated from the hardware synthesis
| world. There is a lot of innovation in digital modules
| happening right now.
|
| The hardware is simply an interface. The preferred
| interface for most musicians.
| _0ffh wrote:
| I've been following Colin Benders (aka Kiteman) on Twitch
| for years, he's probably my favourite modular user.
| munificent wrote:
| The negativity, cynicism, and sarcasm in this comment
| regarding a subject I hold dear just makes me sad.
|
| That "aimless generative nonsense" brings plenty of joy to
| its creators and listeners and for many there are more
| important goals than "complexity" (which is generally
| considered a _bug_ not a feature in other areas).
| weatherlight wrote:
| you might be a little out of the loop,
|
| Eurorack is completely booming at the moment. We are quite
| literally living in a synth golden age. everything from very
| boring Behringer clones of old synths to all the cutting edge
| DSP in Eurorack and wacky combinations of audio synthesis
| techniques, its all there.
| CliffStoll wrote:
| It was my honor to work with Bob Moog in the early 1970's; as
| technician for the SUNY/Buffalo electronic music studio, I kept
| the synthesizers running.
|
| He was one of those wonderful people who was happy to show you
| how to do something, without showing off or making a big deal of
| it. Figuring out what was wrong in a voltage controlled
| oscillator - cool stuff for this undergrad.
|
| Reminds me of how, in those days of analog electronics, an
| oscilloscope was the debugging tool of choice...
| brylie wrote:
| If you are interested in experimenting with modular synthesis,
| check out VCV Rack. It's an Eurorack simulator with a huge number
| of modules, many of which are open source.
|
| https://vcvrack.com/
|
| Omri Cohen recently hosted the Mycelium Symposium where many
| creators showed some interesting possibilities using VCV Rack.
|
| https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nnipBoTOQ2g
| lacavao wrote:
| +1 for VCV Rack. It's an amazing piece of software, and
| entirely mitigates the up-front cost issues that come along
| with diving into modular synthesis.
| gwbas1c wrote:
| It's great to see Wendy Carlos on the front page of Hacker News.
| I have an original pressing of her "Switched on Bach" framed in
| my living room.
| jacquesm wrote:
| Props!
| dahart wrote:
| I'm pretty sure I wore my dad's original vinyl copy of Switched
| on Bach into near unplayability, as a child more than thirty
| years ago. Absolutely my favorite record of all time. The
| followups later with "better" synths never came close in my
| mind to the sounds and performance of the first one.
| jcpst wrote:
| I picked it up at a thrift store, and that's why I started a
| deep dive into modular synths.
|
| I almost forgot I was reading the article from a hacker news
| link, and not just from my own searching!
| amysox wrote:
| She's one of my role models, so I'm pleased to see this as
| well.
|
| I have two of her albums: the hard-to-find CD of _Peter and the
| Wolf_ she did with "Weird Al" Yankovic (the whole thing is a
| delightful spoof), and _Switched-On Bach 2000,_ where she
| revisited her original electronic music album with modern
| synthesizers and authentic Bach tunings. (The liner notes are
| an education in themselves!)
| racl101 wrote:
| I still listen to original TRON soundtrack a lot while working.
|
| That and Blade Runner OST really hold up.
| dang wrote:
| Related:
|
| _How Wendy Carlos Changed Music_ -
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16077589 - Jan 2018 (43
| comments)
| konjin wrote:
| For something similar from the same time:
| https://archive.org/details/MusicOnThePDP1X/02+Little+Fugue+...
|
| Adding a few sine oscillators to the MIT PDP-1 (yes 1) and then
| togging them really fast to build up notes and scores.
|
| A video about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Led4jL-DnPk
| S_A_P wrote:
| Gotta shout out Isla Instruments here. Their S2400(SP-1200
| inspired drum sampler) had pretty much a whos who of producers as
| beta testers.
| throwawaycuriou wrote:
| the excellent writing style feels anachronistic. like a form that
| wouldn't be done quite so if it were done today.
| aklemm wrote:
| Until recently there was a music+engineering+social issues
| festival called Moogfest. I got to go twice, and it had been one
| of my greatest pleasures as an adult. Lots of synth music,
| technical classes during the day about synthesizers and other
| electronic and music topics, and then a bunch of social issue
| events hosted as well such as discussions of Afro-futurism.
|
| Anyway, it died due to mismanagement, but talk about geek heaven.
| Would love to see such a broad event again sometime.
| barney54 wrote:
| Thank you for posting this! I had not listened to Switched on
| Bach before and after just a few minutes of listening I
| definitely need to listen to more!
| lentil_soup wrote:
| I wanted to listen to it but couldn't find it on Spotify or
| Youtube. Where did you listen to it?
| xrd wrote:
| Is this available online somewhere? I can only find snippets.
| I'm happy to pay for it, I am not finding a link on her site at
| all.
| dewert wrote:
| Also somewhere on archive.org. Not sure about linking to it
| from here, but should be easy to find using their search.
| Quite surprised that it's not on streaming services!
| Freak_NL wrote:
| Only (thankfully) through torrents, but needless to say that
| is not legal in most jurisdictions. Most of her works are now
| not available for sale except for second hand vinyl or CD.
|
| This includes the four Switched-on albums, as well as such
| rarities as her collaboration with "Weird Al" Yankovic:
| _Peter & the Wolf/Carnival of the Animals - Part II_.
|
| I think the excellent and dystopic sounding Clockwork Orange
| soundtrack is available digitally though.
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