[HN Gopher] People Keeping BlackBerry Alive
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       People Keeping BlackBerry Alive
        
       Author : sharkweek
       Score  : 56 points
       Date   : 2021-02-02 18:21 UTC (4 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (debugger.medium.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (debugger.medium.com)
        
       | simlan wrote:
       | I don't have a classic blackberry but the licensed model key Le.
       | I love it :) qwerty for the win. I hope they find another
       | licensee to do qwerty hardware keyboards for Android again.
       | 
       | I actually got hooked on qwerty phones by the Nokia e61. To date
       | the most solid phone I owned. Not very user-friendly by today's
       | standards but it did the job most of the time.
        
       | zucked wrote:
       | As a true lover of the physical keyboard, I tried to love the
       | KeyOne. It was okay; the way the OS handled the screen ratio was
       | a bit wonky, and the camera was pretty lackluster. The device
       | itself was a midranger - it chugged from time to time. Ultimately
       | I sold it because I really wanted a better camera.
       | 
       | As productive as I once was on a BB, I think the physical
       | keyboard days are done.
        
       | andmikey wrote:
       | I've been using a Blackberry Passport since early 2019 - as a
       | replacement for the "dumb" phone I used for many years. I love
       | it! The build quality is fantastic. The keyboard is a beauty to
       | type on. The camera is great quality. In terms of build it's my
       | ideal phone. What I wouldn't give for an up-to-date version of
       | this [edit: at an affordable price]!
       | 
       | Unfortunately the software limitations mean that I'm likely going
       | to need to switch to a "modern" phone soon. Per the article you
       | can't run Android apps beyond Android 4.3 and even those often
       | don't work - means I can't use banking apps, or government apps
       | (eg. Track&Trace or recently the EU Settled Status app), or
       | Spotify, or most chat apps. Many websites don't work on it
       | either.
        
         | bluecatswim wrote:
         | >means I can't use banking apps, or government apps (eg.
         | Track&Trace or recently the EU Settled Status app)
         | 
         | Can't you use a web browser for those things?
        
           | mato wrote:
           | Here /Europe/ some banks are starting to _require_ the use of
           | mobile apps for authenticating transactions, instead of
           | providing hardware tokens.
           | 
           | When I ran into this problem they told me: "either pay us X
           | EUR/month extra for Business Banking or, no hardware token
           | for you". Calculated that (X * 12) < (cost of cheap Nokia
           | Android phone), and got the latter which I keep in flight
           | mode in a desk drawer and use for the banking app only.
        
       | gertrunde wrote:
       | In the 10-12 years since I last had a Blackberry, no phone that
       | I've had has come close to it in terms of an email device.
       | 
       | Current phones do a lot of things much better (apps, games app
       | stores etc), but not email, and voice calls have only recently
       | started to show some advantages (Voice over LTE/Voice over
       | WiFi/HD Calls etc).
        
         | mato wrote:
         | AFAICT from the Internets, BB10 OS actually supports VoLTE, but
         | there's no way to manually enable it. Given the support status
         | of the devices no carrier will provision VoLTE on it for you
         | these days either, so we're out of luck.
        
         | hinkley wrote:
         | I think the iPhone got a lot of customers who were on the fence
         | about blackberries. I wanted better email, but the stereotype
         | of the PHB blackberry owner was just fading into obsolescence
         | when the iPhone 3G showed up and killed half of everything.
        
         | jeffbee wrote:
         | BlackBerry had wifi calling since 2007.
        
           | adrianmonk wrote:
           | Not the only one, either. I actually had the Nokia 6086
           | (https://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_6086-1798.php) which had UMA.
           | I got it through T-Mobile and got my first wifi router ever,
           | the WRT-54GTM ("TM" for T-Mobile), through their HotSpot@Home
           | service. There was a small monthly fee in exchange for
           | unlimited wifi calling.
           | 
           | Article: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2007/06/t-mobile-
           | intros-long...
        
       | blhack wrote:
       | I would pay a _lot_ of money for a blackberry 7500 based phone.
       | With some minor upgrades to make it work with modern paradigms )I
       | do want to be able to use signal).
       | 
       | The world I want is where my media device (for tik tok, Spotify,
       | Facebook, etc) and my _work_ device are physically different, and
       | tailored specifically to their purpose.
       | 
       | Nothing released since then had even come remotely close. It had
       | hardware buttons, the scroll wheel based interface on the right
       | hand side, the recessed screen, email as a first class feature.
       | 
       | That device was _perfect_ and if it had Nextel PTT, it was
       | transcendently so.
       | 
       | Here's a lesson for people running companies now: BB failed when
       | they stopped marketing to boring suits, and started trying to
       | compete with the Motorola RAZR, then the iPhone. The phones got
       | glossier, lost their recessed screen, got smaller, and eventually
       | when the trends shifted, they got left behind.
        
         | Fnoord wrote:
         | Did you consider the Unihertz Titan? I actually loved my Nokia
         | E71, but I cannot say I was very productive with such a small
         | keyboard. Hence I'm aiming for a keyboard with larger keys and
         | more travel, ie. like Planet Cosmo / Planet Astro.
        
         | jariel wrote:
         | The people in the suits are actually a really small part of the
         | market. Nobody really sells that kind of specific devices.
         | 
         | Irrespective of any choices BB made - they went up against the
         | iPhone, the #1 product of the last few decades - and on the
         | other end a mass deluge of Android manufacturers.
         | 
         | And the scale of operations is hard to fathom: BlackBerry had 1
         | guy for mapping. Google has an entire mini division.
         | 
         | The actual handheld team at BlackBerry was tiny. Shockingly
         | tiny.
         | 
         | There were other major mistakes made, such as not really
         | embracing being 'platform' where apps were always a second-
         | order thing. It's actually a very hard thing to do to make a
         | straight up modern mobile smartphone platform, that takes a lot
         | of the 'right things'. I'm not sure Symbian for all of their
         | upsides, ever quite pulled it off either.
        
         | 908B64B197 wrote:
         | > Here's a lesson for people running companies now: BB failed
         | when they stopped marketing to boring suits, and started trying
         | to compete with the Motorola RAZR, then the iPhone.
         | 
         | But here's the thing: Suits all pretty much wanted iPhones. I
         | recall one of the most requested feature on the iPhone was
         | Exchange support.
         | 
         | And their custom messaging thing just wasn't valuable enough to
         | keep users around (hint, the real high value messaging platform
         | for business is and always has been Bloomberg).
         | 
         | Looking at devices like the Storm and playbook, I wonder why
         | blackberry couldn't execute. Talent gap with Apple?
        
       | decafninja wrote:
       | Never understood the raves about the keyboard. I've had several
       | PDA or phones with built in keyboard, including multiple
       | Blackberries issued by work. I've detested the typing experience
       | on every one of them. My hands and fingers are pretty small too.
        
         | alpaca128 wrote:
         | Meanwhile I have relatively large hands and really fat thumbs,
         | and the Blackberry keyboard is the only phone keyboard I don't
         | hate. The absolutely terrible UX of almost all virtual
         | keyboards is the main reason I rarely use my current Android
         | phone. It feels as bad and imprecise to use as those old laptop
         | touchpads.
        
       | boomskats wrote:
       | The Key2 is the best phone I've ever owned.
       | 
       | My K2 died (I broke one of the smd antenna connectors). Went back
       | to using an iphone (mini) and quite liked it, but getting
       | anything done was soooo slow. I bought another Key2 last week and
       | I'm in task switching heaven again. The k2 is the i3wm of the
       | phone world.
        
       | jariel wrote:
       | It was always unrivalled as a comms device.
       | 
       | It was really odd to see the industry shift so hard from that
       | utility.
        
       | koiz wrote:
       | "What can I say--I just love the keyboard," Ron says. "I feel
       | like an idiot when I tap a glass screen."
       | 
       | You look like an idiot when you take out a bb though.
        
       | simo_dax wrote:
       | I'm one of those guys, I still use a Q10 (OS10 family) as my
       | daily driver. I felt in love with its ux e.g. the hub which acts
       | both as notification center and timeline, full gesture-based
       | navigation (back in 2013!) and an app permission system which
       | allowed you choose which one should be granted to the app (again,
       | back in 2013! Android had to wait years before this was
       | implemented)
       | 
       | Apps are scarce, many don't work anymore due to obsolescence, but
       | the main ones are there: I mantain a Twitter and a Twitch app,
       | and keep updating them to follow Api changes. Spotify and
       | Whatsapp can be used through the android layer, the native BB
       | maps are still functional. Another nice guy on Crackberry
       | mantains a youtube app.. I feel I can say that if you don't have
       | many requirements it's still a solid phone, it can't do much but
       | what it does it does well.
       | 
       | Also, the privacy is unmatched
        
         | Nition wrote:
         | > full gesture-based navigation (back in 2013!)
         | 
         | Only two years behind the N9.
        
           | app4soft wrote:
           | > _Only two years behind the N9._
           | 
           |  _Symbian_ still alive![0,1,2] (Not sure about Maemoo /MeeGo)
           | 
           | [0] https://github.com/mrRosset/Symbian-Archive/issues/10
           | 
           | [1] https://old.reddit.com/r/symbian/new
           | 
           | [2] https://github.com/search/?o=desc&q=symbian&s=updated&typ
           | e=R...
        
         | mato wrote:
         | Which is your Twitter app? Now that m.twitter.com no longer
         | works in the BB10 browser, I need one.
        
           | simo_dax wrote:
           | Bird10! It's open source (https://github.com/SimoDax/Bird10)
           | and you can find it here https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb
           | erry-10-apps-f274/bird10...
        
         | Jermaine_Jabi wrote:
         | The unified message centre has not yet been topped.
        
         | arch-ninja wrote:
         | Hello fellow q10 fan! Small question: if someone were to start
         | a company to maintain q10 and q20 devices, how valuable would
         | that be to you at a monthly subscription rate?
         | 
         | I do not want to see these devices fall into obsolescence, and
         | they are simple/old enough you could reverse-engineer the parts
         | or get in touch with the asian companies who did some of the
         | production runs for RIM.
        
           | simo_dax wrote:
           | I can safely say that you can't make money out of this
           | platform anymore, the user base is just too small. If I had
           | to live with the donations coming from my apps for BB10 well,
           | let's say I would have already starved to death ;)
        
           | caiob wrote:
           | I loved my q10 and my Passport as well. I wish they'd release
           | a new Android version.
        
           | mato wrote:
           | Not the original poster, but I have a hard time imagining
           | you'd be able to meaningfully maintain the OS and integrated
           | software (e.g. Hub, supported TLS versions for mail, etc.)
           | via "mods" of any kind.
           | 
           | What _might_ be useful and actually possible would be an up-
           | to-date maintained "rebuild" / "rewrite" of the native
           | browser app, since there you can vendor pretty much all the
           | important components you need.
        
         | NearAP wrote:
         | I held on to my Q10 for a long time. That feeling of being able
         | to type text with one hand because of the physical keyboard was
         | so awesome. Alas, I finally had to drop it when an application
         | I basically couldn't live without stopped supporting BB
         | platform and I needed the latest version of that App.
        
       | Scramblejams wrote:
       | My kingdom for a slick, open Linux phone with a fantastic camera
       | and a keyboard on par with the Curve's.
        
         | HideousKojima wrote:
         | Pinephone is getting a keyboard attachment. Not sure on the
         | camera quality though
        
         | HarryHirsch wrote:
         | Yes, the infrared touchpad beats the hell out of swiping around
         | the screen!
        
           | hinkley wrote:
           | I can't recall who, but someone showed me a phone with a
           | physical keyboard that had a touchpad built into the
           | keyboard.
           | 
           | Which is to say, if you ran your thumb over the keys without
           | pushing any, a cursor would move on the screen.
           | 
           | Was that a Blackberry?
        
             | nfoz wrote:
             | My Blackberry Passport has that and it was super cool and
             | useful. It felt great. I miss that keyboard so much.
             | 
             | Blackberry was innovating but nobody cared; tech media
             | loved to mock them and push them down. They lost a
             | marketing war in addition to a product war.
        
             | volkl48 wrote:
             | Yes. My Priv and Key2 both support it, at least if you mean
             | in terms of scrolling functionality.
        
             | numpad0 wrote:
             | Keyboard surfaces that doubles as touchpads aren't exactly
             | a bleeding edge feature, PS3 chatpad has it and it works on
             | PC(IIRC feels broken until calibrated through secret combo
             | shortcut)
        
       | KarlTheCool wrote:
       | The Priv is still my all time favourite form factor for a smart
       | phone. Typing benefits are self explanatory but having your thumb
       | off the screen by swiping on the keyboard was super nice. It was
       | a total step backwards switching to a fixed keyboards.
        
       | ausbah wrote:
       | I remember growing up in the late 2000s, my father was in the
       | military and blackberrys were the defacto issued phones for
       | employees
        
       | afandian wrote:
       | To anyone who has a fond recollection of BlackBerry, I recommend
       | the book "Losing the Signal: The Untold Story Behind the
       | Extraordinary Rise and Spectacular Fall of Blackberry".
       | 
       | It's well paced and captures a lot of atmosphere (from what I
       | recall).
       | 
       | And "Piloting Palm: The Inside Story of Palm, Handspring, and the
       | Birth of the Billion-Dollar Handheld Industry" if you're into
       | that kind of thing.
        
       | speeder wrote:
       | If I could get a new blackberry that supports WhatsApp (basically
       | mandatory in my country), I would.
       | 
       | Right now I am tolerating a extremely low ram KaiOS phone that
       | often crashes... but I still prefer it to Android.
        
         | shock wrote:
         | I wish I could run WhatsApp in a VM in the cloud via Anbox and
         | stream the WhatsApp UI to the phone via something like VNC.
        
         | Rumperuu wrote:
         | I still use WhatsApp on my BB Classic daily. The native app
         | died years ago so it's an emulated Android version, and for a
         | long time I was capped at whichever the last version that
         | supported Android 4.3 was. Mid-2020 I started getting
         | notifications saying I would have to update the app at the end
         | of the month or it would stop working, so I thought my luck had
         | finally run out, but when the day came it gave me the option of
         | updating the app, which somehow worked.
        
       | nunodonato wrote:
       | All my best phones were blackberry. From the good old ones up to
       | the Z10. The developer scene at he time of OS10 was so cool!
       | Fantastic devices, such a shame that people enjoyed seeing
       | blackberry die out. I'm still using my playbook, 11 years and
       | going strong
        
       | bluedino wrote:
       | We are using Blackberry UEM for MDM of Android and iOS devices.
       | It works surprisingly well.
        
       | 908B64B197 wrote:
       | I remember seeing the first touchscreen blackberry (it was named
       | the Storm).
       | 
       | It came out two months after the iPhone 3G and the app store. I
       | remember it being extremely laggy, even scrolling basic webpages
       | while the iPhone was buttery smooth. And for some reasons they
       | wouldn't include Wifi on it, so even indoor it was forced to use
       | edge making it even more sluggish.
       | 
       | You couldn't really install apps on it, there was no app store. I
       | mean I think there was an SDK but it was for that device only and
       | no easy distribution method. I don't think anyone ever bothered
       | anyways.
       | 
       | Blackberry was at least 3 years behind at that point, having
       | almost managed to ship an original iPhone's prototype in terms of
       | specs.
        
         | bengale wrote:
         | I seem to recall the whole screen sort of clicking. I don't
         | remember why it did that though.
        
           | dfxm12 wrote:
           | It was just another input button. It had capacitive touch and
           | you could also press on the screen as a button. So there was
           | a touch and a click. This more or less replaces the other
           | BB's trackball functionality (which I think you could click
           | as a button). So moving your finger around the touchscreen
           | was like moving the trackball and pressing the screen as a
           | button was like pressing the trackball button.
           | 
           | At a time where most apps were being designed for the
           | touchscreen iPhone, most devs didn't take advantage of the
           | Storm's device specific hardware, which is one of the reasons
           | why it wasn't very memorable...
        
             | 908B64B197 wrote:
             | I thought the screen was just loose. Had no clue it was a
             | button.
             | 
             | Granted I only tried one unit.
        
             | bengale wrote:
             | Ah that makes sense. I never had one myself, I'd moved over
             | to a G1 at that point. But I do miss my old blackberry.
        
       | arch-ninja wrote:
       | I use a BB Classic (q20) every day. It's the most responsive,
       | ergonomic phone on the market aside from the q10. I also have the
       | native development kit and the skills to keep that device
       | operating forever, one thing I noticed is the root SSL
       | certificates are no longer updated. I have copied the ones off my
       | Arch system to the SD card and manually install new roots of
       | trust as they are published.
       | 
       | When I push a button an action happens, always. It's that simple.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | ashneo76 wrote:
         | Can you share this script please? Thank you so much
        
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