[HN Gopher] Setting goals for 2021 - A brief guide about persona...
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Setting goals for 2021 - A brief guide about personal goal setting
Author : jonmal
Score : 138 points
Date : 2021-01-11 12:05 UTC (9 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (blog.doit.io)
(TXT) w3m dump (blog.doit.io)
| stakkur wrote:
| Stop setting goals.
| Jtsummers wrote:
| There's nothing wrong with setting goals. But you usually have
| to create a system to go along with the goals in order to
| achieve them. Having goals, though, can direct the systems you
| want to create for yourself.
|
| Goals (for me) over the past few years:
|
| 1. Be able to play 140 minutes of soccer in one go without
| wanting to die (or feeling like I would).
|
| 2. Be able to stop taking a statin.
|
| 3. Get my blood pressure down from 130 over 90 to a healthy
| level (not critically high, but worrisome high)
|
| 4. Become a better GM for my bi-weekly RPG games
|
| 5. Become a better whole-system software developer/designer
|
| Those are all goals I achieved, but in order to achieve them I
| established systems that enabled them. 1, 2, and 3 were created
| by a focus on _always_ exercising MTWR, occasionally F (but
| that was left open for social events) and of specifically going
| to the grocery and shopping in specific sections (stay on the
| perimeter, ignore most aisles) and cooking at home. 4 was
| achieved by creating a habit of increasing fiction /RPG book
| reading and setting aside time to draw up/write down material
| for sessions so it was less improvised, but the fiction reading
| also gave inspiration for better improvisation. I also
| explicitly asked for feedback about sessions rather than
| letting players stew and be pissed at me because I made
| something too hard or seemed to be targeting a specific player.
| 5 was achieved by a similar approach, though around creating
| personal projects and reading technical content and carving out
| the time to do it. Creating various short term objectives (like
| being back in school) that would exercise specific areas I felt
| I was weak in, along with soliciting feedback from others
| (peers and managers).
| stakkur wrote:
| Most of what you're describing is habits and systems, not
| goals--and that's what I'm saying, too. James Clear's article
| here espouses what I'm talking about:
| https://jamesclear.com/goals-systems
| Jtsummers wrote:
| Well, I _am_ setting goals, but I 'm specifically creating
| systems to enable achieving and sustaining those goals.
| That's my point. Systems aren't better than goals, and
| goals aren't contradictory to systems. They feed on each
| other. Goals are motivation to create systems, systems are
| mechanisms to achieve goals.
|
| Goals can also be "repeated" goals. Like my fitness
| example, I didn't want to make it through 140 minutes of
| soccer on just _one_ Saturday (this is a problem with "I
| want to run a marathon" goals, it's a singular
| achievement). I wanted to do that every Saturday throughout
| the season so the system enabled perpetuating that ability
| throughout the years.
| stakkur wrote:
| I'm guessing you didn't read the article, which covers
| exactly what you're saying.
| segmondy wrote:
| Most people can set goals, follow through and completion is often
| where they get stuck. I don't blog, but if I did, "Completing
| goals for 2021" would be a nice one.
| CommieDetector wrote:
| Goals are for losers, systems are for winners.
| weinzierl wrote:
| From what I get, this is focussed on SMART, which is good. For
| goals like the ones that are mentioned in the article ("Workout
| 3-5 times a week") what I found though, and what did wonders for
| me, was additionally considering the results of research in habit
| forming. Especially binding the activity to a trigger instead of
| a certain date and time was really effective.
| A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote:
| Can you elaborate on the trigger part? As many, I have
| established some goals for this year and it already feels like
| the existing habits are reclaiming their spots.
| weinzierl wrote:
| The following video might help. I references the papers it
| used as sources. I linked right to the part where it gets to
| the "events not times" topic.
|
| https://youtu.be/yv6L_xmjw5I?t=527
| sweetheart wrote:
| Im not the type of person to worry about, or try to optimize for,
| productivity, because I think it can turn insidious or unhealthy
| quickly, but from the little that I _have_ read about goal
| setting and whatnot, this seems like a great explanation of how
| to quickly get started implementing a system for personal growth.
|
| Im glad that it wasn't biased towards specific systems, but
| rather general concepts which anyone can implement however they
| like. This feels like non-bullshit content marketing. Well done,
| doit.
| jonmal wrote:
| Thanks, glad that you liked it!
| afarrell wrote:
| All of these present problems in different contexts
|
| Specific: This assumes that the picture you currently have of
| what you want is the thing you actually want. Do you want faster
| horse, a Model T, or swift reliable transportation of a form
| you've not yet imagined.
|
| Measurable: If you only value that which has a number, you'll
| lose sight of what truly matters in life because of the
| Streetlight Effect[1]. Consider the ridiculousness of the
| question "What NPS score would your children give you?"
|
| Attainable: There is a limit to the degree to which you can "be
| sure" of anything, especially without 2020 vision.
|
| Relevant: This requires really knowing what your values are so
| that you can practice the subtle art of not giving a fuck[2]
| about other things. Determining those can be hard emotionally-
| painful work, but in any context it is a good problem you want to
| have solved.
|
| Time Bound: Sometimes deadlines spur action, sometimes they
| paralyse or cause you to lose sleep. Sometimes, they are so far
| off in the future that you don't think about them until it is too
| late because you thought you could do them. If you're looking at
| a timescale longer than 6 weeks, consider instead that you might
| want a CGP-Grey style Theme:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVGuFdX5guE
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streetlight_effect
|
| [2] https://www.audible.co.uk/pd/The-Subtle-Art-of-Not-
| Giving-a-... Highly recommend this to anyone who spends lots of
| time thinking about personal goal-setting.
| johncessna wrote:
| >"If you only value that which has a number, you'll lose sight
| of what truly matters in life because of the Streetlight
| Effect[1]"
|
| I don't think that's the intent. The intent is to look back and
| see if you accomplished your goal or not. If you don't have a
| measurement, then you don't know if you've meet your goal.
| Something such as 'I want to be a good parent to my kid' Isn't
| specific, nor is it attainable. Setting a goal of 'I want to
| spend an hour of time a day with my child' is both specific and
| measurable.
|
| >" Sometimes, they are so far off in the future that you don't
| think about them until it is too late because you thought you
| could do them."
|
| Seems like the contradicts the 'Relevant' part of SMART.
|
| I see this as a framework to help you focus in on your goal
| instead of making wishes at the start of ever new year. 'I'm
| going to lose weight this year' Okay, how are you going to do
| that? Are you going to exercise and eat less? Okay, how much or
| both and how will you know if you met those micro goals? Given
| what we know about weight loss at the moment, what's a
| reasonable goal weight for March, June, August?
| afarrell wrote:
| > I don't think that's the intend
|
| Indeed, it is a possible unintended consequence if you're not
| reasonably aware of that risk.
| Jtsummers wrote:
| > 'I'm going to loose weight this year' Okay, how are you
| going to do that?
|
| About this goal specifically, I found it beneficial to stop
| thinking about a target weight. Instead think about: What
| level of fitness do I want? What kind of health do I want?
| (the two are related, but not the same)
|
| Main reason: If you take up exercise and are _not_ obese or
| at the higher end of "overweight", you may not lose weight
| for the first couple of months (or ever!) depending on the
| style of exercise you've selected and your body's tendency to
| build muscle. If you take up weightlifting, and are
| overweight but not obese, you could see your body composition
| basically trade, nearly pound for pound, fat for muscle. You
| will _look_ better and _feel_ better but not achieve the
| weight goal, which can be disheartening to people who have an
| _explicit_ weight goal even though what they 've done has
| measurably improved their fitness and health. And if you take
| up running or something similarly cardio intensive, you may
| gain weight (building up leg and core muscles with running,
| for instance) in the first few weeks before any weight loss
| begins. This is similarly disheartening and demotivating.
|
| Instead, think about what fitness or health level you want
| and why, then work towards them.
|
| My fitness goal was predicated on being able to play back-to-
| back soccer games (rec league, 70 minute games). So I needed
| to be able to sustain nearly 2 hours of continuous movement
| including sprints and extended periods of running/jogging. So
| I took up running and got my 5k time below 25 minutes, then
| upped it to 10k runs. A single game left me feeling like I'd
| just finished a warmup, the second game would leave me
| feeling like I'd actually exercised but not fatigued.
|
| My health goal was predicated on getting off a statin and
| reducing my blood pressure (largely work stress induced, but
| my weight and fitness at the time pushed it into the pre-
| hypertensive range). So I ate better in order to achieve
| that, and reduced (not eliminated, still drink coffee black)
| caffeine in order to improve sleep (both improved sleep and
| reduced caffeine also helped reduce my anxiety levels and my
| periodic panic attacks at the time left me, happy side
| effect).
|
| Both of those left me at a lower weight than I started at,
| but I had no explicit weight target. If I had, I could've
| been demotivated by early weight gains (when I started
| running I went from 215 to 220lbs) or later weight gains
| (when I added BJJ to my exercise regimen I went from 175 to
| 190). Both of those were the result of increased muscle mass,
| but they both took me in the "wrong" direction if weight loss
| and a weight target were specific goals.
| PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
| Coming at this from opposite direction as you, I
| nevertheless wholeheartedly agree.
|
| I've spent large chunks of my life as an extremely fit
| ultra-endurance athlete. I've done events that other ultra-
| endurance athletes called "insane". I wasn't at the front
| of the pack, but I was at the front of the middle of the
| pack.
|
| These days, I'm not interested in racing. I'm not even
| interested in training. But if I do think about "fitness"
| or "health" goals, it's definitely structured around what
| I'd like to be able to do, rather than specifics of my
| body.
|
| For example, one standing goal I've had for a long time is
| to be able to go out and run a half-marathon in 1:45 or
| less without hurting too much.
|
| More recently, having moved to 6000' as a home elevation,
| as well as being very sedentary from work/life stuff, I'd
| like to be able to keep up runs uphill without stopping,
| regardless of the pace I'm moving at (currently
| impossible).
|
| I think structuring things around "what I want to be able
| to do, and how I want to feel after I do them" is an
| excellent framework, and far better than "lose N pounds" or
| "cut X minutes off my time for Y".
| serverholic wrote:
| > Something such as 'I want to be a good parent to my kid'
| Isn't specific, nor is it attainable. Setting a goal of 'I
| want to spend an hour of time a day with my child' is both
| specific and measurable.
|
| There are so many factors that play into being a good father
| that "I want to spend an hour of time a day with my child" is
| essentially useless.
| johncessna wrote:
| I'm sorry. I didn't mean that to be an exhaustive list of
| how to be a good parent. It was meant to be an example of
| specific and measurable sub goal on the path to what
| someone feels leads to being a good father.
|
| It's off topic, but you seem to have some insight into
| this. What steps would you take to achieve a goal like
| that?
| kritiko wrote:
| All great points. Is there any research that SMART goals work
| or are they just a management fad / anecdotally useful?
| lbotos wrote:
| The point of SMART is that it's a framework to help you
| communicate your goals. They are often used in management
| because if someone says "i wanna build x" you and that person
| may have a different definition of what that means. If you
| agree on specifics and how you will measure done you've
| clearly communicated.
|
| If you can't communicate what you will deliver and by when
| how can someone know if you've done what you've set out to
| do?
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goal#Goal_setting covers some
| empirical research.
|
| For example, 'purpose' can be nebulous, but a goal should be
| reasonably specific.
| afarrell wrote:
| yea. SMART is a tool with flaws that are more or less
| relevant in different contexts. Being aware of the flaws
| helps you use the tool better and helps you decide when to
| choose a different tool.
| munificent wrote:
| I think you're assuming that long-term goals can't change. Just
| because I have a goal to do X in ten years, that doesn't mean I
| am forcibly committed to reaching X even if I no longer want
| to.
|
| Let's say I have a vague dream of becoming a sailor. Consider
| these four scenarios:
|
| - Scenario A: I make it an explicit goal. In year 1, I read
| some books, take a sailing class, and forgo some luxuries to
| start saving up for a boat. In year 2, I buy a boat and sail.
| Dream attained!
|
| - Scenario B: I make no goal. In the absence of a concrete
| goal, I don't read or save in year 1. In year 2, I still long
| to sail but am no closer to getting there. Eventually I run out
| the clock on my life.
|
| - Scenario C: I make it an explicit goal. In year 1, I read
| some books, take a sailing class, and forgo some luxuries to
| start saving up for a boat. In year 2, I decide I am no longer
| interested in sailing. I remove that long-term goal, and spend
| the money I saved on something else.
|
| - Scenario D: I make no goal. In the absence of a concrete
| goal, I don't read or save in year 1. In year 2, I lose
| interest in sailing. Nothing gained, nothing lost.
|
| The two failure modes are B and C. If you fail to pursue a
| long-term goal that _doesn 't_ change (B), you are eternally
| unfulfilled. If you pursue a dream that changes before you
| reach it (C), you have some lost opportunity cost for the work
| you put into that dream that is now not relevant.
|
| For most people, the latter is a much smaller harm than the
| former. It's more rewarding to strive towards something
| meaningful even if it ends up not panning out than to abandon
| your dreams pre-emptively.
|
| Of course, the ideal is A or D, but none of us have a time
| machine to determine who our future selves will become. So the
| only choice you can make today is A/C or B/D.
| mr-wendel wrote:
| My contrarian take:
|
| 1) Write out your goals in the form of a personal letter to
| yourself. Focus on the things you think are making you unhappy,
| not what you think will make you happy. Read it out loud in
| private. After that, hide it away for a while where only you will
| find it.
|
| 2) Keep your goals private. Especially keep progress private.
| Trying to stop smoking/drinking? Folks will notice, but politely
| decline to answer that infamous "how long since...?" question.
| Don't externalize the rewards.
|
| 3) Focus on very small results. Find a way to make them stick.
| Build on that and in time you'll find that amounts to a LOT more
| progress and personal satisfaction.
|
| IMO build from the ground up and the fancy big goals will come
| more easily and naturally. You won't have to game it.
| serverholic wrote:
| Definitely agree with #2, especially with big goals (or what
| they call BHAG in the article).
|
| Seriously, go around and tell people that you want to write a
| new york times best seller and see what kind of reactions you
| get lol. Talk about destroying your motivation quickly.
| mr-wendel wrote:
| I think it's a trap either way. The flip side can also be
| just as problematic.
|
| Having people sincerely wishing you the best, congratulating
| you on your initiative and dream-chasing tends makes it feel
| like you're doing something positive. All you've done,
| however, is talk about it and are already getting rewarded.
| That undermines real motivation to start/continue far too
| easily.
|
| Let those rewards come naturally and from within with
| _actual_ progress.
| Jtsummers wrote:
| There was a discussion here on HN perhaps 8 or 10 years ago
| that led me to realize I was doing essentially that. I
| _talked_ about getting in shape and other goals, and got an
| emotional high (of a sort) from the response I got and from
| thinking about what I would do to get in shape and be able
| to do once I was in shape. But I never followed through.
|
| Then I shut up about it, and actually got in shape. And
| when I ran into some people who I rarely saw, and they were
| shocked by my 40+ lb weight loss and how good I looked, I
| got that same emotional reward but also the actual reward
| of being in shape and being able to do the things I'd only
| imagined being able to do.
|
| Now I discuss what I'm doing with some like minded friends
| and we keep each other accountable (Hey, how's the running
| going? Made it a full 10k yet?). But I don't discuss it
| with other people in general unless it's brought up by
| them. A kind of happy-medium between the talk-too-much and
| just-shut-up-and-work modes of operation.
| oumua_don17 wrote:
| >> 'I want to spend an hour of time a day with my child' is both
| specific and measurable.
|
| This is probably not a goal but a system and systems are much
| preferable to goals. This has been discussed elsewhere and I
| personally prefer to have systems than goals.
|
| I have still not reached a stage where I can define systems
| without a goal as a starting point. Even then I let the system
| make the goal fade into the background and eventually make it
| invisible/irrelevant.
|
| The key difference is systems eliminate the end stage of a goal
| and the resulting emptiness after completing a goal.
| amysox wrote:
| Here's the question I struggle with: _How do you set "goals" when
| you don't know what you want?_ I have been stymied by this time
| and time again. If you don't know what you want to accomplish,
| how do you set _any_ "goals"?
| wsinks wrote:
| Goal 1: Figure out what I want.
|
| SMART Goal: Spend 30 mins on Sunday researching what new thing
| I will try that week. During that 30 minutes, identify the
| smallest reason why I find that thing interesting. Repeat for 8
| weeks.
|
| I'm currently in this stage. :D
| Jtsummers wrote:
| I have few long term goals, primarily health/fitness (now at
| the sustainment phase of this) and financial (to be able to
| properly retire without _needing_ supplemental income). Most of
| my goals are near-to-medium term. I base them off of things I
| want /need to do but cannot for some reason.
|
| I cannot, presently, understand the systems at work to the
| extent I want to (astrodynamics, satellites and such; calc,
| linear, and physics are 15 years in my past). So I'm
| deliberately setting aside time to study and practice those
| topics to enable my understanding of astrodynamics and what we
| do at work. I don't intend to master it (that is, to the extent
| of the literal rocket scientists in the office), and I don't
| know that I'll need or use it after this current position. But
| I do want/need to know it now so I've established goals around
| it.
|
| I want to make furniture, and have the ability to do decent
| work. I took some courses and enjoyed it, and demonstrated to
| myself I wasn't incompetent at it. But I have no equipment in
| my home to do it. So I'm setting aside money to buy some basic
| equipment, and planning to set aside time to spend on it once I
| do.
|
| What, in your life, is currently blocked from you or are you
| not at your desired level? Create near-term goals to remove the
| blockers or achieve your desired capability/level. If you start
| to make a habit out of thinking this way and developing
| routines and systems to enable these goals, it may become
| easier to make long term ones. Or you may never really make
| long term goals, we don't all need them.
| visviva wrote:
| I don't quite get the advice to come up with a "big hairy
| audacious goal (BHAG)" for one's self. It's one thing if one
| already _has_ a personal BHAG, but going through a process to
| develop one as a personal goal seems almost... backwards to me. I
| would find it difficult, if not impossible, to come up with
| something so specific that "sums up" the way I'd like my life to
| turn out, but maybe that's just my personality.
| cosmojg wrote:
| CGP Grey has an excellent video on this exact kind of goal
| setting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO1mTELoj6o
|
| And another on New Year's resolutions more generally:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVGuFdX5guE
| lazyant wrote:
| Process beats goals.
|
| Don't set a goal of running a marathon or losing x pounds/Kgs but
| rather run every day x distance and eat / don't eat every day x
| healthy food / y unhealthy food.
|
| Once a process or habit is in place, you can look at goals and
| more ambitious processes. Small goals are good to start with and
| having huge life goals is fine (having a "purpose").
| hawktheslayer wrote:
| I attended training at my work where they changed M to
| Motivating, and I use that with all of my employees' objectives.
| One might say that if it's Relevant then it should be motivating,
| but when I ask them if it's motivating I often get an honest no.
| I find if the person doesn't like the goal despite it being
| SMART, then they tend to avoid it.
|
| The other question I learned to ask for Attainable is "do you
| think there is an 80% chance or better you'll hit your date--if
| not it's good to dial the goal back.
| slsii wrote:
| That's a great suggestion. Thanks for sharing.
|
| Did you encounter problems with removing M for Measurable in
| that case?
| [deleted]
| helmholtz wrote:
| Christ I hate the word 'overwhelm'. It's SO jarring. It's like
| when people say "I'm feeling melancholy". NO! You're feeling
| melanchol _ic_! You did something "on purpose" and not
| "purposely"! And the world is _not_ full of overwhelm. It 's full
| of emotional overload[1] perhaps.
|
| [1] https://www.dailywritingtips.com/overwhelm-is-a-verb-isnt-
| it...).
| irrational wrote:
| Wouldn't it be "I feel overwhelmed?"
| helmholtz wrote:
| Indeed, that would work too. But since the author was talking
| about the world as one...
|
| Also, to preempt other comments, I know that purposely is a
| word. I just hate the sound of it :)
| quesera wrote:
| "Overwhelm" is a fine word. It just isn't a noun.
|
| From the post:
|
| > _The world is full of overwhelm._
|
| This is a total grammar fail[1]. Ironic, perhaps, hopefully,
| but definitely unappealing.
|
| [1] Phrasing chosen purposely, purposefully, and also on
| purpose. Sorry!
| afarrell wrote:
| Note that a person who is likely to feel that way is also
| likely to be less well-equipped to predict your specific
| preferences for how to express that.
| helmholtz wrote:
| Fair enough, although in writing such a post, the author does
| take up the mantle of having some kind of expertise in the
| first place that enables them to preach to others. As in, the
| advice presumably works for her to not feel overwhelmed.
|
| My comment is widely off-topic either way though.
| visviva wrote:
| This article is the first time I've seen it used as a noun. It
| stopped me in my tracks (so I could duckduckgo it), then it
| made me consider that maybe the article wasn't written by a
| native English speaker, then (finally) I read the rest of the
| article.
| zoba wrote:
| The post mentions Accountability Tools. I offer my services as an
| accountability coach. I'm geared towards helping coding project
| type goals, but, I'd help with most anything. If folks want help
| getting their projects across the finish line, I can (personally)
| help!
|
| https://coding-pal.com/
| afarrell wrote:
| I think your URL is a fantastic choice and hints at what a lot
| of "accountability coaching" really is:
|
| Camaraderie
|
| An easily-imaginable person who acts as a reward model[1] you
| can imagine saying "yea! Make progress on the thing! You're on
| the right path[2]! Keep going." When you anticipate [social]
| rewards for an action, that action is motivating.
|
| If you watch Dr. Andrew Huberman's talks about the roles of
| Dopamine in the brain, he'll say it is not a signal of reward,
| but of _anticipated_ reward. It does spike when you recognise a
| surprisingly strong reward, (like when you hit a jackpot or an
| unexpectedly interesting HN link) to help you learn to repeat
| the path to that reward[2], but mostly it signals "Yep, you're
| on the right path. Now go make that test green".
|
| [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYylPRX6z4Q
|
| [2] https://deepmind.com/blog/article/Dopamine-and-temporal-
| diff...
| dhimes wrote:
| Cool! I have a course online for time management and work-life
| balance. I'm an old guy and I know a few things (don't let the
| wordpress fool ya!). bizworklife.com
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(page generated 2021-01-11 22:01 UTC)