[HN Gopher] Session Protocol: Technical implementation details
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       Session Protocol: Technical implementation details
        
       Author : johnchristopher
       Score  : 21 points
       Date   : 2021-01-08 20:30 UTC (2 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (getsession.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (getsession.org)
        
       | loup-vaillant wrote:
       | > _In practice, cryptographic deniability is often disregarded
       | when it comes to court cases or media reporting._
       | 
       | That's because implementers fail to follow through.
       | 
       | The signal _protocol_ enables deniability, but the signal
       | _application_ does not. For a communication app to deliver actual
       | deniability it needs _at least_ to provide the ability to add,
       | remove, and edit messages locally, with timestamps and
       | everything. That edit feature must be easy to use, and easy to
       | find. Ideally, it would be advertised when you first use the app.
       | It must be crystal clear to any judge that screenshots from this
       | app is no better than  "he said, she said".
       | 
       | For offline protocols where messages stay online for a long
       | period of time (file encryption, and Signal to a lesser extent),
       | we should also have an easy way to forge messages to oneself.
       | With protocols from the Noise framework, this is easy to
       | implement. From a user's perspective, we just need a "forge false
       | message to self" button, where you specify the "fake sender".
       | Only then can encrypted files be reduced to a "he said, she said"
       | situation.
       | 
       | Cryptographic deniability is not enough. We need _plausible_
       | deniability, and that can only be achieved when (i) forgeries are
       | easy, and (ii) everybody knows it.
        
       | upofadown wrote:
       | The news here is that Session is dumping Signal Protocol in
       | favour of something simpler. So not so much forward secrecy and
       | denyability. They do not think such features are worth the cost
       | in complexity.
        
       | ggm wrote:
       | If you studied networking in computer science, "the session
       | protocol" means something between the presentation and transport
       | layers in the iso 7 layer model.
        
         | wmf wrote:
         | Unfortunately, common nouns being reused as product names is a
         | lost cause at this point.
        
           | loup-vaillant wrote:
           | _(Shameless Plug(tm))_ Do not despair just yet:
           | https://github.com/LoupVaillant/Monokex/
        
         | arghwhat wrote:
         | Anything above level 3 in the osi model is pretty useless
         | distinction, and even the useful levels the distinction is just
         | a bogus description of the status quo, rather than something
         | truly useful.
        
       | dunefox wrote:
       | Sometime last year I tried Session and while the idea sounds
       | great it needs a lot more attention before I can use it in anger
       | - but I'm a fan of the idea.
        
       | driminicus wrote:
       | Yet another closed source, centralized ostensibly private chat
       | client? If it actually gets a decent user base it should probably
       | be bridged, but otherwise I don't really care.
        
         | 5evOX5hTZ9mYa9E wrote:
         | Exact opposite, based on Monero and Signal code, decentralised
         | by relying on service nodes that anyone can run, implementing
         | it's own onion routing. Honestly, on paper, it looks pretty
         | good.
         | 
         | The core problem is that devs are Australians and can be
         | secretly compelled to backdoor their app via Assistance and
         | Access Act.
        
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       (page generated 2021-01-08 23:00 UTC)