https://snackstack.net/2024/02/17/the-long-running-joke-of-a-moon-made-of-cheese/ Snack Stack + About The long-running joke of a moon made of cheese Hello, Snackers. That giant rock in the night sky? It's not edible. But did people centuries ago really think it was made of cheese? Quick update: The domain transfer worked but there are still some lingering issues with switching paid subscriptions from Substack. If that's you, it'll all be fixed soon, fingers crossed. Thanks for your continued patience. --------------------------------------------------------------------- [89425_doug-mack_post-banner-2] [image-9] Snack Stack illustration. Moon illustration from Science & Society Picture Library, men with cheese from Wisconsin Historical Society, both images via Getty. I've been thinking about super-duper-mega-sized snacks lately. Blame Las Vegas. Football doesn't interest me much, but I'm endlessly fascinated by the spectacle around it. (Twenty-plus years ago, in the days of VHS, I used to tape the Super Bowl just so I could fast forward through the game and watch the ads.) This year's big game was especially rich in sidebar stories, including the presence of a certain pop star and the fact that the host city was one of the most over-the-top places on Earth. Everyday Las Vegas is Let's build one of the world's largest pyramids to house a hotel and casino, with an accompanying Sphynx. That's already more than enough. Super Bowl Las Vegas takes this baseline of bizarreness and goes, Okay, now let's make the side of the pyramids into giant billboards. [gettyimages-1974169374]Ethan Miller/Getty Images When I first saw those photos, I genuinely thought they were AI, but it turns out they're just Las Vegas. I can't decided which is more upsetting. Anyway, the giant chip made me think about giant nachos, which made me think about giant cheese, which made me think about the moon, which made me wonder just how big a full slice of moon-cheese would be, and the size of the Ritz cracker you'd need to hold it. (Obviously, I had to do the math. If you took a cross-section slice from the middle of the moon, you'd need a Ritz 76,086,958 times larger than normal to hold it. Now you know.) And then, finally, I got to the question that stuck around for a while: When and where and how did people start joking that the moon is made out of cheese? Did people in Olden Times really think there was any truth to that? Here, finally is our task for the day. --------------------------------------------------------------------- It turns out that more than a few people have looked into this question over the years. Mark Mancini in Mental Floss in 2023. Miles Klee in Eater in 2015. In 2022, New Scientist, asked readers to consider the consequences of a moon made of cheese, with responses pointing out all kinds of problems, including the effect on tides, the possibility of gaseous emissions, and the inevitable creation of "the largest fondue in the universe as the heat generated by the gravitational collapse of the cheese melted and boiled it." The peak period of these discussions was probably the 1960s, during the space race, when American aspirations to lunar conquest led various writers, scientists, and dreamers to consider what, exactly, things were like up there. Newspaper columnists of the era loved to quote Yeats and Shakespeare and Twain and others to show the enduring romance of that glowing orb; they also repeatedly returned to the fanciful speculation that perhaps the moon was made of cheese. "Poets pave way for Apollo 11," read one characteristic headline. My favorite article, published in the Fort Worth Star-Telegram in 1964, included a quote from a scientist who thought the moon's surface might be like powdery cotton candy, because no one actually knew what consistency to expect. [image-12] The whole article is fascinating and worth a read (well done to the reporter, Blair Justice, and additional kudos to him for possessing a superhero name). Beyond the science of it all, Justice makes the excellent point that, other than perhaps a few gullible children, no one has ever actually thought the moon was made of cheese. It's just a saying, not a belief, and the expression has been around for hundreds of years. Justice quotes a line that he claims is from the 16th century: idiots and peasants woulde made men beleue that ye Moone is made of grene ches I was unable to verify the origins of that line, and I couldn't find that specific wording anywhere beyond Justice's column. But the sentiment of the quote has ample precedent from the 1500s and 1600s, so he's right about the timing. The meaning of that quote, and nearly every reference to a cheese-moon during this time, is to belittle specific people or groups (like "peasants") as not very bright: Haha, they're so ignorant and gullible, they think the moon is made out of cheese. This usage was common. When I do research on things from Olden Times, I'm obviously relying on documents available on the internet, which is inherently limiting and means that there's typically a drop-off in examples before, say 1850--but that's not the case here. Even within the relatively small pool of searchable scanned documents from back then, there are many, many examples of this insult. A short list includes this instance from 1603 and this one from 1611, or here's a round-up from 1896 that includes examples from 1562, 1640 (one of several instances where the diss was aimed specifically at the Welsh), 1670, and 1846. Discovery of a World in the Moone, published in 1638, includes the observation that many more evident truths seem incredible to such who know not the causes of things: you may as soon persuade some Country peasants that the Moon is made of green cheese (as we say) The parenthetical "as we say" is telling: this was already a common turn of phrase in 1638. Everyone knew what it was and what it meant: it was nothing but an idle taunt directed at an absent enemy, a person or group you don't really know but loathe nonetheless. Type your email... [ ] Subscribe --------------------------------------------------------------------- Most sources I've seen, including nearly everything written in the internet era, trace the concept of a cheese-moon back to a book of proverbs published by John Heywood in 1546. Here's a version of the book printed in 1874, with annotations. The top lines are Heywood's original text; I've included the footnote just to give one more example of early usage. [image-16] (Extra nerdy research sidebar: If you go back to the 1950s and earlier, many sources point to Sir Thomas More as the earliest scribe to discuss this, with the line "He should, as he list, be able to prove the moon made of grene cheese." Supposedly that's in English Works, but I can't find it on the internet. More died in 1535, so if he did write that, he beat Heywood by at least 11 years. Still, it looks like Heywood can take credit for popularizing the idea, because it exploded after his book.) An important fact to understand here is that when all those early references use the adjective "green," what they mean is new, unripe cheese, the kind that hasn't had the whey pressed out of it. For example, queso fresco: [gettyimages-481423404] That description is essential to the whole gag. Green cheese is mottled and moist and shiny. It looks like the moon! This is a key detail that so many investigators seem to miss: the joke/insult isn't that the moon looks like any ol' piece of cheese (Swiss, fontina, gouda, whatever) but a specific kind, for which the comparisons are actually kinda accurate, even if (once again!), no one has ever believed the big circle in the sky is a dairy product. It's like if there were a common insult that went, "this dipshit thinks the sun is made out of lemons," but over the years it just became "this fool thinks the sun is made out of fruit." Both would be absurd, yes, but on different levels. One put-down makes far more sense than the other; you can see why it works as comparison or metaphor or even poetry. Humans of the 1500s were still figuring out lots of things, but they weren't dolts. If anything, they were probably more clever than we realize--and their references to the moon may be evidence of this. --------------------------------------------------------------------- As Klee notes in Eater, the moon and cheese share common ground in culture as enigmatic things, the sort of oddity or exception that we tend to get hung up on, as a surreal clip of QVC host Shawn Killinger and fashion designer Isaac Mizrahi sincerely bickering over whether the moon is a planet or star readily attests. It's an astute observation, one with which I agree. Both satellite and food are sources of enduring delight and confusion, in ways that defy easy explanation. In my own final analysis, though, "the moon is made of cheese" is most intriguing not for the parallels between the two but things but because this absurdist concept has endured for half a millennia as vehicle for mockery. To me, what it shows is not the romantic allure of both objects but the endless human capacity for cruelly joking at the expense of other people--or just to stir up shit, even if those on the receiving end are aware of the humor. In the 1948 book A Hog on Ice and Other Curious Expressions, author Charles Earle Funk identifies another intriguing angle to the "green" cheese origin story. According to Funk, right as that particular insult/comparison was getting started, other moon-watchers were joking that it was "belewe"--blue. Funk writes: [image-19] I don't have the time and energy to go down an hours-long rabbit hole investigating the origins of "blue moon"--my love of research does have some limits and I need to publish this post!--but in my five-minute check, it sure looks like the precise origins of this expression are still unknown. That is to say: it's very possible that every reference to a blue moon is actually, quietly, just another way of saying that it's made of cheese. If Funk is correct in this speculation, it also means that "the moon is green" and "the moon is blue" were winking memes of the day. People like to argue about random things, it's part of our nature (citation needed but it's probably true). The good people of the 2020s sometimes argue about whether or not a hot dog is a sandwich (it is not) or the precise boundaries of the Midwest (Ohio doesn't count, come on) or any number of other things. Part of the joy of such arguments is that it doesn't really matter and we all know it doesn't really matter. It's fun to argue because everyone understands that it's a low-stakes conversation (come at me in the comments!). We all understand the joke, just like people in the 1500s were fully aware that the moon was not green cheese. Happy snacking and thanks for reading! -- Doug If you like this, please share it and help others find it. The new site on WordPress still feels slightly hidden, compared to the one old one on Substack, and I'd love to have more people come over here and enjoy some snacks. Thanks so much! Type your email... [ ] Subscribe Share this: * Twitter * Facebook * Like Loading... --------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted February 17, 2024 in Uncategorized by Doug Mack / Snack Stack Tags: Comments 4 responses to "The long-running joke of a moon made of cheese" 1. forestlitter Avatar forestlitter February 17, 2024 Unsubscribe LikeLike Reply 1. Doug Mack / Snack Stack Avatar Doug Mack / Snack Stack February 17, 2024 There's a link at the bottom of the email if you want to unsubscribe. LikeLike Reply 1. iggylmc Avatar iggylmc February 17, 2024 Ouch! You are expecting a helpful comment or even a criticism to this lovely post, and instead you get, "You're such a moron, you probably think the moon is made out of cheese. I'm outta here. Unsubscribe." LikeLiked by 1 person 2. BFSEsq Avatar BFSEsq February 17, 2024 This was so interesting! I love it. I never considered that this was a taunt. Even in the 16th Century. Glad you're up and running on WordPress! LikeLike Reply Leave a comment Cancel reply [ ] [ ] [ ] [ ] [ ] [ ] [ ] D[ ] Snack Stack Blog at WordPress.com. Subscribe to get more snacks in your inbox Get every post delivered while it's hot and fresh! This is one email you'll open every time. Type your email... [ ] Subscribe Continue Reading Loading Comments... Write a Comment... [ ] Email (Required) [ ] Name (Required) [ ] Website [ ] [Post Comment] * Comment * Reblog * Subscribe Subscribed + [89425_] Snack Stack Join 3,809 other subscribers [ ] Sign me up + Already have a WordPress.com account? Log in now. * + [89425_] Snack Stack + Edit Site + Subscribe Subscribed + Sign up + Log in + Copy shortlink + Report this content + View post in Reader + Manage subscriptions + Collapse this bar %d [b]