https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/144f6xm/apollo_will_close_down_on_june_30th_reddits/ jump to content my subreddits edit subscriptions * popular * -all * -random * -users | * AskReddit * -funny * -worldnews * -pics * -todayilearned * -mildlyinteresting * -news * -gaming * -movies * -explainlikeimfive * -aww * -tifu * -videos * -TwoXChromosomes * -Jokes * -Art * -LifeProTips * -OldSchoolCool * -Music * -nottheonion * -Futurology * -Showerthoughts * -dataisbeautiful * -books * -IAmA * -askscience * -science * -space * -nosleep * -food * -photoshopbattles * -DIY * -gifs * -gadgets * -WritingPrompts * -sports * -creepy * -history * -GetMotivated * -announcements * -InternetIsBeautiful * -Documentaries * -EarthPorn * -philosophy * -UpliftingNews * -listentothis * -blog more >> reddit.com apolloapp * comments * other discussions (34) Want to join? Log in or sign up in seconds.| * English [ ][] [ ]limit my search to r/apolloapp use the following search parameters to narrow your results: subreddit:subreddit find submissions in "subreddit" author:username find submissions by "username" site:example.com find submissions from "example.com" url:text search for "text" in url selftext:text search for "text" in self post contents self:yes (or self:no) include (or exclude) self posts nsfw:yes (or nsfw:no) include (or exclude) results marked as NSFW e.g. subreddit:aww site:imgur.com dog see the search faq for details. advanced search: by author, subreddit... this post was submitted on 08 Jun 2023 109,839 points (94% upvoted) shortlink: [https://redd.it/144f] [ ][ ] [ ]remember mereset password login ATF Submit a new link Submit a new text post Get an ad-free experience with special benefits, and directly support Reddit. get reddit premium apolloapp joinleave792,244 readers 34,392 users here now Apollo - an amazing new Reddit client for iOS All things related to Apollo, a Reddit app for iPhone with a focus on a clean, iOS centric UI with super comfortable and fast browsing. Feel free to post if you have any questions or suggestions! Subscribe and join our delightful community! You can also follow Apollo on Twitter: @apolloreddit Supporting Apollo If you're interested in supporting Apollo's future, buying Apollo Pro in the app helps a ton, as well as any donations in the app's Tip Jar! (Thank you, awesome person!) If you have BTC, ETH, or any other cool crypto abbreviations, others have mentioned they'd like to donate cryptocurrency, and if so, here are some addresses: (Thank you!) BTC: 1LamDwEtMYzeMF8F4evLVshgL6UaM1mU7e ETH: 0x53FDee21dCA9555Cd6d28089c8eA7E118d7189B6 Litecoin: LQgNag4cmGTbedXQvahpi6eQydpSjgBWv6 Nano: xrb_1j7ppgbx47bbyk1ohbuy9nqghreo8pct8z1gcghyqj7kz7tmz9xnugjntx9k (I add these based on request, if there's a different cryptocurrency you'd like to see added please PM me and I happily will!) a community for 8 years BTF MODERATORS * message the mods discussions in r/apolloapp <> X 110k * 9486 comments Apollo will close down on June 30th. Reddit's recent decisions and actions have unfortunately made it impossible for Apollo to continue. Thank you so, so much for all the support over the years. [?] 5285 * 189 comments Thank you Christian. From all of us. 2093 * 92 comments [3pUcdPHr] It's been fun, Reddit. 1858 * 24 comments [Nzjf0Cww] <3 1472 * 86 comments GUIDE: How to delete your Reddit Account 1012 * 27 comments If you have a Reddit Premium subscription, don't forget to cancel it. 919 * 16 comments [vWmkXTSI] Thank you so much for bringing the best experience of being here 506 * 106 comments Spez is doing an API AMA tomorrow... 603 * 86 comments [jUlKIgRY] If you can, send a tip to Christian! Winding down an app like this one can bankrupt an indie dev. Let's send some love his way 439 * 20 comments Don't just delete your account. Use a tool to delete all your data before deleting your account, so Reddit doesn't get money for your posts from 5 years ago showing up in google. Take your value with you when you leave. Welcome to Reddit, the front page of the internet. Become a Redditor and join one of thousands of communities. x 110k 110k 110k Apollo will close down on June 30th. Reddit's recent decisions and actions have unfortunately made it impossible for Apollo to continue. Thank you so, so much for all the support over the years. [?] Announcement (self.apolloapp) submitted 5 hours ago * by iamthatisApollo Developer[M][ey2iodron2]8 [Superheart][silver_48]22[cr1mq4yysv]7[p4yzxkaed5]108[hehehe_b_4] [fukjtec638]2[Big_Brain_][0o2j782f00]5[a05z7bb9v7]12[8ad2jffncl]7 [Trinity_48][9jr8pv84v7]5[80j20o397j][45aeu8mzvs]14[Levelup_48] [TeleportIn]3[wa987k0p4v]5[Rocket_48]20[Animated_H]9[Respect_48]6 [j3azv69qjf]4[Vibing_48]3[Faith_in_H]8[5nswjpyy44]7[2juh333m40] [hwnbr9l67s]2[klvxk1wggf]7[2jd92wtn25][12kz7a7j4v]2[trfv6ems1m]4 [xe5mw55w5v]6[Illuminati]9[iq0sgwn5bz]4[wait_what_]4[Timeless_4]8 [2Dread_48]3[b8xt4z8yaj][x52x5be57f]2[5izbv4fn0m][SnooClappi]4 [CrabRave_4]4[2754pa5jvs][4samff1ud5]6[7atjjqpy1m]2[TeleportOu] [platinum_4]346[SnooClappi]27[bph2png4aj]2[Updoot_48]4[6vgr8y21i9]3 [Starry_48]2[tcofsbf92m]50[s5edqq9abe][TakeMyPowe]4[pot_o_coin]18 [lop66ut2wn]49[Beating_He]3[ree13odobe]21[Mithril_48]15[heart_brea]26 [That_Smile][ks45ij6w05]16[9auzllkyd5][kqr00h8b7q]14[35d17tf5e5]2 [Bulb_48][nvfe4gyawn]15[v1mxw8i6wn]19[9avdcwgupt]2[rc5iesz2z8]2 [18mwqw5th9][Sunny_48]3[71v56o5a5v][gold_48]169[fck3iedi2u]7 [YouDropped]2[x1o2hnh9yw][ooo0r2cq7q]13& 1137 more - announcement Hey all, It's been an amazing run thanks to all of you. Eight years ago, I posted in the Apple subreddit about a Reddit app I was looking for beta testers for, and my life completely changed that day. I just finished university and an internship at Apple, and wanted to build a Reddit client of my own: a premier, customizable, well-designed Reddit app for iPhone. This fortunately resonated with people immediately, and it's been my full time job ever since. Today's a much sadder post than that initial one eight years ago. June 30th will be Apollo's last day. I've talked to a lot of people, and come to terms with this over the last weeks as talks with Reddit have deteriorated to an ugly point, and in the interest of transparency with the community, I wanted to talk about how I arrived at this decision, and if you have any questions at the end, I'm more than happy to answer. This post will be long as I have a lot of topics to cover. Please note that I recorded all my calls with Reddit, so my statements are not based on memory, but the recorded statements by Reddit over the course of the year. One-party consent recording is legal in my country of Canada. Also I won't be naming names, that's not important and I don't want to doxx people. What happened initially? On April 18th, Reddit announced changes that would be coming to the API, namely that the API is moving to a paid model for third-party apps. Shortly thereafter we received phone calls, however the price (the key element in an announcement to move to a paid API) was notably missing, with the intent to follow up with it in 2-4 weeks. The information they did provide however was: we will be moving to a paid API as it's not tenable for Reddit to pay for third-party apps indefinitely (understandable, agreed), so they're looking to do equitable pricing based in reality. They mentioned that they were not looking to be like Twitter, which has API pricing so high it was publicly ridiculed. I was excited to hear these statements, as I agree that long-term Reddit footing the bill for third-party apps is not tenable, and with a paid arrangement there's a great possibility for developing a more concrete relationship with Reddit, with better API support for users. I think this optimism came across in my first post about the calls with Reddit. When did they announce pricing? Six weeks later, they called to discuss pricing. I quickly put together a small app where I could input the prices and it would output monthly/yearly cost, cost for free users, paid users, etc. so I'd be able to process the information immediately. The price they gave was $0.24 for 1,000 API calls. I quickly inputted this in my app, and saw that it was not far off Twitter's outstandingly high API prices, at $12,000, and with my current usage would cost almost $2 million dollars per month, or over $20 million per year. That is not an exaggeration, that is just multiplying the 7 billion requests Apollo made last month by the price per request. Could I potentially get that number down? Absolutely given some time, but it's illustrative of the large cost that Apollo would be charged. Why do you say Reddit's pricing is "too high"? By what metric? Reddit's promise was that the pricing would be equitable and based in reality. The reality that they themselves have posted data about over the years is as follows (copy-pasted from my previous post): Less than 2 years ago they said they crossed $100M in quarterly revenue for the first time ever, if we assume despite the economic downturn that they've managed to do that every single quarter now, and for your best quarter, you've doubled it to $200M. Let's also be generous and go far, far above industry estimates and say you made another $50M in Reddit Premium subscriptions. That's $550M in revenue per year, let's say an even $600M. In 2019, they said they hit 430 million monthly active users, and to also be generous, let's say they haven't added a single active user since then (if we do revenue-per-user calculations, the more users, the less revenue each user would contribute). So at generous estimates of $600M and 430M monthly active users, that's $1.40 per user per year, or $0.12 monthly. These own numbers they've given are also seemingly inline with industry estimates as well. Apollo's price would be approximately $2.50 per month per user, with Reddit's indicated cost being approximately $0.12 per their own numbers. A 20x increase does not seem "based in reality" to me. Why doesn't Reddit just buy Apollo and other third-party apps? This was a very common comment across the topics: "If Apollo has an apparent opportunity cost of $20 million per year, why not just buy them and other third-party apps, as they did with Alien Blue?" I believe it's a fair question. If these apps apparently cost so much, an easy solution that would likely make everyone happy would be to simply buy these apps out. So I brought that up to them during a call on May 31st where I was suggesting a variety of potential solutions. Bizarre allegations by Reddit of Apollo "blackmailing" and "threatening" Reddit About 24 hours after that call with Reddit, I received this odd message on Mastodon: "Can you please comment publicly about the internal Reddit claim that you tried to "blackmail" them for a $10,000,000 payout to "stay quiet"?" Then yesterday, moderators told me they were on a call with CEO Steve Huffman (spez), and he said the following per their transcript: Steve: "Apollo threatened us, said they'll "make it easy" if Reddit gave them $10 million." Steve: "This guy behind the scenes is coercing us. He's threatening us." Wow. Because my memory is that you didn't take it as a threat, and you even apologized profusely when you admitted you misheard it. It's very easy to take a single line and make it look bad by removing all the rest of the context, so let's look at the full context. I can only assume you didn't realize I was recording the call, because there's no way you'd be so blatantly lying if you did. As said, a common suggestion across the many threads on this topic was "If third-party apps are costing Reddit so much money, why don't they just buy them out like they did Alien Blue?" That was the point I brought up. If running Apollo as it stands now would cost you $20 million yearly as you quote, I suggested you cut a check to me to end Apollo. I said I'd even do it for half that or six months worth: $10 million, what a deal! The bizarre thing is - initially - on the call you interpreted that as a threat. Even giving you the benefit of the doubt that maybe my phrasing was confusing, I asked for you to elaborate on how you found what I said to be a threat, because I was incredibly confused how you interpreted it that way. You responded that I said "Hey, if you want this to go away..." Which is not at all what I said, so I reiterated that I said "If you want to Apollo to go quiet, as in it's quite loud in terms of API usage". What did you then say? Me: "I said 'If you want Apollo to go quiet'. Like in terms of- I would say it's quite loud in terms of its API usage." Reddit: "Oh. Go quiet as in that. Okay, got it. Got it. Sorry." Reddit: "That's a complete misinterpretation on my end. I apologize. I apologize immediately." The admission that you mistook me, and the four subsequent apologies led me to believe that you acknowledged you mistook me and you were apologetic. The fact that you're pretending none of this happened (or was recorded), and instead espousing a different reality where instead of apologizing for taking it as a threat, you're instead going the complete opposite direction and saying "He threatened us!" is so low I almost don't believe it. But again, I've recorded all my calls with you just in case you tried something like this. Transcript of this part of the call: https://gist.github.com/ christianselig/fda7e8bc5a25aec9824f915e6a5c7014 Audio of this part of the call: http://christianselig.com/apollo-end/ reddit-third-call-may-31-end.m4a (If you take issue with the call being recorded please remember that I'm in Canada and so long as one participant in the call (me) consents to being recorded, it's legal. If anyone would like the recording of the full call, I'm happy to provide.) I bring this up for two reasons: * I don't want Reddit slandering me to internal employees or public people by saying I threatened them when they reality is that they immediately apologized for misunderstanding me. * It shows why I've finally come to the conclusion that I don't think this situation is recoverable. If Reddit is willing to stoop to such deep lows as to slander individuals with blatant lies to try to get community favor back, I no longer have any faith they want this to work, or ever did. What is an API or an API request anyway? Some people are confused about this situation and don't understand what an API is. An API (Application Programming Interface) is just a way for an app to talk to a website. As an analogy, pretend Reddit is a bouncer. Historically, you can ask Reddit "Could I have the comments for this post?" or "Can you list the posts in AskReddit?". Those would be one API request each, and Reddit would respond with the corresponding data. Everything you do on Reddit is an API request. Upvoting, downvoting, commenting, loading posts, loading subreddits, checking for new messages, blocking users, filtering subreddits, etc. The situation is changing so that for each API request you make, there's a portion of a penny charged to the developer of that app. I think that is very reasonable, provided, well, that the price they charge is reasonable. Claims that Apollo is "inefficient" Another common claim by Reddit is that Apollo is inherently inefficient, using on average 345 requests per day per user, while some other apps use 100. I'd like to use some numbers to illustrate why I think this is very unfairly framing it. Up until a week ago, the stated Reddit API rate limits that apps were asked to operate within was 60 requests per minute per user. That works out to a total of 86,400 per day. Reddit stated that Apollo uses 345 requests per user per day on average, which is also in line with my findings. Thats 0.4% of the limit Reddit was previously imposing, which I would say is quite efficient. As an analogy (can you tell I love analogies?), to scale the numbers, if I was to borrow my friend's car and he said "Please don't drive it more than 864 miles" and I returned the car with 3.4 miles driven, I think he'd be pretty happy with my low use. The fact that a different friend one week only used 1 mile is really cool, but I don't think either person is "inefficient". That being said, if Reddit would like to see Apollo make further optimizations to get its existing number lower, I'm genuinely more than happy to do so! However the 30 day limit they've given me after announcing the pricing to when I will start getting charged significant amounts of money is not enough time to deal with rewriting large parts of my app to lower total requests, while also changing the payment model, transitioning users, and ensuring this is all properly tested and gets through app review. Further, Reddit themselves said to me that the majority of the cost isn't the server, it's the opportunity cost per user, so the focus on 100 versus 345 calls, rather than the cost per user, doesn't sound genuine. At the very least providing even a bit more time to lower usage to their new targets would be feasible if they've historically provided it, and it's not the majority of the costs anyway. Me: "Because I assume the majority of it isn't server costs. I assume the majority is the opportunity cost per user." Reddit: "Exactly." Why not just increase the price of Apollo? One option many have suggested is to simply increase the price of Apollo to offset costs. The issue here is that Apollo has approximately 50,000 yearly subscribers at the moment. On average they paid $10/year many months ago, a price I chose based on operating costs I had at the time (server fees, icon design, having a part-time server engineer). Those users are owed service as they already prepaid for a year, but starting July 1st will (in the best case scenario) cost an additional $1/month each in Reddit fees. That's $50,000 in sudden monthly fee that will start incurring in 30 days. So you see, even if I increase the price for new subscribers, I still have those many users to contend with. If I wait until their subscription expires, slowly month after month there will be less of them. First month $50,000, second month maybe $45,000, then $40,000, etc. until everything has expired, amounting to hundreds of thousands of dollars. It would be cheaper to simply refund users. I hope you can recognize how that's an enormous amount of money to suddenly start incurring with 30 days notice. Even if I added 12,000 new subscribers at $5/month (an enormous feat given the short notice), after Apple's fees that would just be enough to break even. Going from a free API for 8 years to suddenly incurring massive costs is not something I can feasibly make work with only 30 days. That's a lot of users to migrate, plans to create, things to test, and to get through app review, and it's just not economically feasible. It's much cheaper for me to simply shut down. So what is the REAL issue you're having? Hopefully that illustrates why, even more than the large price associated with the API, the 30 day timeline between when the pricing was announced and developers will be charged is a far, far, far bigger issue and not one I can overcome. Much more time would be needed to overhaul the payment model in my app, transition existing users from existing plans, test the changes, and have users update to the new version. As a comparison, when Apple bought Dark Sky and announced a shut down of their API, knowing that this API was at the core of many businesses, they provided 18 months before the API would be turned off. When the 18 months came, they ultimately extended it another 12 months, resulting in a total transition period of 30 months. While I'm not asking for that much, Reddit's in comparison is 30 days. Reddit says you won't get your first bill until August 1st, though! The issue is the size of the bill, not when it will arrive. Significant, significant charges for the API will start building up with 30 days notice on July 1st, the fact that the bill for those charges being 30 days from then is not important. If you hear that your electricity bill is going up 1,000x and the company tells you, "Don't worry, the bill only comes at the end of the month", I hope you understand how that isn't comforting. What would be a good price/timeline? I hope I explained above why the 30 day time limit is the true issue. However in a perfect world I think lowering the price by half and providing a three month transition period to the paid API would make the transition feasible for more developers, myself included. These concessions seem minor and reasonable in the face of the changes. I thought you said Reddit would be flexible on the timeline? That was my understanding as well based on what they said on a call on May 4th: Reddit: "If there's an entity who's like 'Hey I'm showing really good progress', you know trying to like we're trying to get a contract in place, we're trying to do all that type of stuff, I don't think you're going to see us be like, you know, like overly aggressive on that timeline. And I feel pretty confident about that point by the way based on conversations I've heard internally." However when asking about more time, such as a 90 day transition period to make the changes, they said: Reddit: "On the 90-day transition, remember that billing doesn't kick in until July 1. So you won't see your first bill from July until the beginning of August, and it won't be due until the end of August (It's net 30 day billing). You do, however, have to sign an agreement to get paid level access on July 1." Did you explicitly ask Reddit for more time? Yes, my last email to them (including Steve) said: In terms of timeline, what concerns me most is the short nature of it before I start incurring costs. I have a large amount of users at price points that I won't be able to afford to support with 30 days notice. For instance, users who subscribed for a year for $10 six months ago when I had no idea any of this was coming, amounts to $0.83 per month or $0.58 after Apple's cut. Even if I'm able to decrease my API usage down to the number in your charts, that still puts me in the red for everyone of those users for awhile with no recourse. A situation like this is one that is legitimately making me legitimately leaning toward shutting down the app, but one that I could salvage if given more time to transition from the free API to the paid API. In prior calls you mentioned that provided I kept communicating and progress was being made, the timeline wasn't an absolute. Is that still the case, or is it now the case that the date is set in stone? That was a week ago and I've yet to receive any further contact from Reddit. Isn't this your fault for building a service reliant on someone else? To a certain extent, yes. However, I was assured this year by Reddit not even that long ago that no changes were planned to be made to the API Apollo uses, and I've made decisions about how to monetize my business based on what Reddit has said. January 26, 2023 Reddit: "So I would expect no change, certainly not in the short to medium term. And we're talking like order of years." Another portion of the call: January 26, 2023 Reddit: "There's not gonna be any change on it. There's no plans to, there's no plans to touch it right now in 2023. Me: "Fair enough." Reddit: "And if we do touch it, we're going to be improving it in some way." Will you build a competitor? Move to one of the existing alternatives? I've received so many messages of kind people offering to work with me to build a competitor to Reddit, and while I'm very flattered, that's not something I'm interested in doing. I'm a product guy, I like building fun apps for people to use, and I'm just not personally interested in something more managerial. These last several months have also been incredibly exhausting and mentally draining, I don't have it in me to engage in something so enormous. Will you sell Apollo? Probably not. Maybe if the perfect buyer came along who thought they could turn Apollo into something cool and sustainable, but I'd rather the app just die if it would go to a company that would turn something I worked really hard on into something that would ruin its legacy. To be clear: I am not threatening anyone in the previous paragraph. Reddit states that the Twitter comparison is unfair Reddit stated on the first call that they don't want to be like Twitter: Reddit: "I think one thing that we have tried to be very, very, very intentional about is we are not Elon, we're not trying to be that, we're not trying to go down that same path. [...] We are trying to do is just use usage-based pricing, that will hopefully be very transparent to you, and very clear to you. Or we're not trying to go down the same path that you may have seen some of our other peers go down." They now state that the comparison of how close their pricing comes to Twitter is an unfair one, and that when they said that above, they were apparently referring not to the pricing, but to the decision Twitter made to ban third-party apps at a rule level, not a pricing level. I think regardless of whatever their intent/meaning behind the comparison to Twitter was, the result is the same: the pricing will kill third-party apps, just as Twitter did. I said this to Reddit, and they responded that they don't think Twitter's pricing is unreasonable, and that if anything, if Twitter reversed the rule about third-party apps, they would probably increase the prices as well. Just to be clear about how wrong and out of touch that is, without naming names, a formerly very, very high up person at Twitter messaged me on Twitter and said: "The Reddit api moves are crazy. I'm not sure what choices you have but to move to another network. [...] That pricing is designed to prevent apps like yours forevermore." So to be clear, even this person thinks this pricing is unreasonable. I do too. Have you talked to CEO Steve Huffman about any of this? I requested a call to talk to Steve about some suggestions I had, his response was "Sorry, no. You can give name-redacted a ping if you want." I've then emailed that person (same person I've been talking to for months) suggestions approximately one week ago about how Apollo could survive this, and I've yet to receive a response. Do I support the protest/Reddit blackout? Abundantly. Unlike other social media companies like Facebook and Twitter who pay their moderators as employees, Reddit relies on volunteers to do the hard work for free. I completely understand that when tools they take to do their volunteer, important job are taken away, there is anger and frustration there. While I haven't personally mobilized anyone to participate in the blackout out of fear of retaliation from Reddit, the last thing I want is for that to feel like I don't support the folks speaking up. I wholeheartedly do. It's been a horrible week, and the kindness Redditors and moderators and communities have shown Apollo and other third-party apps has genuinely made it much more bearable and I am genuinely so appreciative. I am, admittedly, doubtful Reddit wants to listen to folks anymore so I don't see it having an effect. Your initial post in April sounded quite optimistic. Are you dumb? In hindsight, kinda yeah. Many of the other developers and folks I talked to were much less optimistic than I was, but I legitimately had great interactions with Reddit for many years prior to last week (they were kind, communicative, gave me heads up of changes), so when they said they were aiming to have pricing that would be fair and based in reality, I honestly believed them. That was foolish of me in hindsight, and maybe could have had a different outcome if I was more aggressive in the beginning. Sorry. /canadian (And to be clear, they did indeed say this. They used the word "substantive" and I wanted to make sure we had the same definition of something "having a firm basis in reality and therefore important, meaningful, or considerable") Reddit: "That's exactly right. And I think, thankfully, the word is exactly the right one. It's going to have a firm basis in reality. I also just looked it up. We're going to try to be as transparent as we can." Reddit claims they've reached out to developers who were bad users of the API, was Apollo contacted? On May 31st Reddit posted a chart of large excess usage by some unlabeled API clients, and stated: "We reached out to the most impactful large scale applications in order to work out terms for access above our default rate limits via an enterprise tier." To be clear, Apollo was never contacted, and I've been told from someone internally that Apollo is indeed not one of the unlabeled API clients. The only time that Apollo was reached out to by Reddit in any capacity about usage was late last year when we received an email about a 6 minute period where Apollo's server API usage increased by 35% before lowering again. Despite 35% for 6 minutes being a comparatively small blip (the above post references clients that are over by 500000%), we responded within 2 minutes. We offered to jump on a call with Reddit engineers if they needed an answer ASAP, identified the issue within several hours and Reddit thanked us for the fast investigation. Full email transcript: https://gist.github.com/christianselig/ 6c71608cf617d2f881cd2849325494c1 Claims that Apollo has made no attempt to be a good user of the API On the call with moderators, Steve Huffman said: Steve: "I don't use the app, so I'll give you the best answer I can -- he does scraping so that he can deliver notifications faster, but has done NO EFFORT to be a good citizen of the internet." First off, Apollo does no scraping, it's purely through authenticated calls to the API and has checks in place to ensure it stays within Reddit's API rate limits. I've open sourced the server code to show this. Secondly, to say we have made no effort is categorically false. I have so many emails reached out to Reddit on multiple occasions expressing concern about and bugs inefficiencies in the API, or ideas on how to improve things, or significant Reddit bugs that made things hard on us. When Reddit has had questions for us, as discussed above, we immediately jumped into action to get an answer as quickly as possible. Here's an email of me giving a heads up to Reddit of IP address changes on our server: Me: "With the new change it'll be maybe like, one IP address. This is all obviously still within the API rate limits as the requests are from individual user accounts that have signed in. Again, long story short the result will be more optimized if anything, I just wanted to give a heads up and ensure that it'd be okay if Reddit suddenly saw the server go from a bunch of different IP addresses to a single one which might cause some confusion if I didn't give a heads up." Me wanting to make sure we were doing everything as best as we could: Me: "Everything is going well, we just had a few questions about best practices making sure we're following any suggestions your team has. Is there any way we could poke someone on your team with a few questions we've been having and have a tiny back and forth? We were just seeing some elevated response times, and just thought it would be great if we could maybe describe what we're doing and see if anything seems off/suboptimal." Me reporting to Reddit that the API has a serious bug in recording rate limits: Me: "We obviously respect the rate limit headers and if a user comes close to approaching it (within 50 requests of the 600 every 10 minutes limit) we stop their requests until the refresh period occurs. However we're seeing some users have very, very weird rate limit headers. Things like "requests remaining: 0, requests made: 17,483, reset: 598 seconds left" which indicates they've somehow made over 17 thousand requests in two seconds which seems hard to believe." Me suggesting to Reddit improvements that could help improve efficiency of notification API calls: Me: "So like little stuff like that, where even if there's a streaming client or some way to minimize the calls there, I think it would help us both out enormously." Further, when making suggestions to your own employees, they themselves have expressed concern about how terrible the public API is: Call on January 26, 2023 Reddit: "I cannot tell you how painful it is to use our API. [...] The API needs to change. Like it's just unusable. I am surprised that you're able to build a functional app on it to be honest." Claims that third-party apps are not interested in talking Steve: "Why not work with the third party apps? Their existence is not a priority for us. We don't use them. I don't use them. It's a part of our traffic but not a lot, and it's a lot of work on our side to keep them alive. If I have to choose where to put our effort, we're going to focus internally. I'm kind of open to it, but I haven't - and I can't convince you, but I don't get the sense that they want to work with us either." I'm genuinely not sure where Steve has got the impression that I don't want to work with him. Despite reaching out multiple times and him declining to talk, I've stated multiple times on calls, literally saying the words "I definitely still want to talk". Reddit: "What I'm hearing is like, Yeah, great. We have this disagreement on pricing methodology, etc. But any feasible number that we get to, any number that's even in, the zip code of what we're sharing with you is unfeasible from your perspective financially. So it's like arguing around the edges of that price thing is like, it just won't make any sense to you. And I presume also just given the NSFW stuff and the removal of ads that makes it even more trickier." Me: Yeah. I mean, to be very clear, I'm not saying I'm walking away from the negotiation table and taking my basketball and going home and just gonna kick up a storm. That's not my intention at all. I definitely still want to talk. I'm not asking you to lower the price by a hundred times or something. I don't think - depending on what you mean by zip code - I don't think I'm so unreasonable that I'm requiring you to bend over backwards here." I've also emailed Steve and the other contact directly stating that I'm interested in talking, and including ideas for how we could come to a solution: Me: "I understand where Reddit's coming from in this. A free API, while appreciated, is not tenable for you especially heading into an IPO, and my only goal here is to come to a solution where we both feel understood. I also hear you that killing third-party clients isn't actually the goal, and in that spirit have been working on how to address your concerns from my end: [...]" I don't know how you can say I'm not interested in talking when you haven't my most recent email in a week. To say it once more, I was very interested in talking. On the other side of things, per the transcript, Steve and the other admin on the call don't even know when the discussions with third-party apps began. Steve: "When did we start talking with them?" AnAbsurdlyAngryGoose: "What month did you first start?" Steve: "FlyingLaserTurtles? Do you remember? April or May of this year." FlyingLaserTurtles: "Maybe late March? But yes." Claims that Reddit has been talking to developers for months talking about these changes Steve: "We've been in contact with third party apps for MONTHS, talking about these coming changes." When you announce that the API will be charging developers, the most important portion of that conversation is what will be charged, which was not available for almost two months after the initial call. From the time developers were told the price, to the time developers will be subject to the price, is 30 days, not "months". Months would have been very helpful, in fact. What about existing subscriptions? I've been talking to my rep at Apple, and over the next few weeks my plan is to release something similar to what Tweetbot did (Paul has been incredibly helpful in all of this) where folks can decide if they want a pro-rated refund on any existing time left in their subscription as Apollo will not be able to afford to continue it, or they can decline the refund if they're feeling kind and have enjoyed their time with Apollo. For the curious, refunding all existing subscriptions by my estimates will cost me about $250,000. A nice send off at WWDC Apollo got mentioned a few times during Apple's 2023 WWDC keynote, even by Craig Federighi himself, and even during the Vision Pro announcement showing Apollo as one of the existing apps compatible with the headset (I'm sorry I won't be able to see that happen). I was lucky enough to be there in person and it felt incredible. Some folks asked if there was any deeper meaning behind that, and while that would be cool, in all reality these things are so well produced that they've been done for a while now, so I'm sure it's just a coincidence, even if it's a really cool one. Extra icons A funny amount of people have reached out wondering about all the extra monthly icons I had queued up for Apollo. I love them, was so excited for them, and I'll make them available immediately for the short time left, but if you're curious here's a screenshot of all of them: https://christianselig.com/apollo-end/remaining-icons.png We ended up with well over 100 custom icons created by incredibly talented designers, and I'm really sorry to those designers who didn't get to see their work launched in the app (to be clear, don't worry, I paid them all - there isn't some bs "exposure" agreement - but it's fun to have your icon launch and I feel bad!) When is Apollo's last day? What will happen? In order to avoid incurring charges I will delete Apollo's API token on the evening of June 30th PST. Until that point, Apollo should continue to operate as it has, but after that date attempts to connect to the Reddit API will fail. I will put up an explainer in the app prior to that which will go live at that date. I will also provide a tool to export any local data you have in Apollo, such as filters or favorites. Thank you I want to thank a lot of people who have made this last week bearable. First and foremost, the communities, Redditors, and moderators who have reached out in support of third-party apps, making Reddit's gaslighting a lot more bearable in making me feel like at least someone was understanding me and in my corner. My girlfriend's been absolutely incredible and supportive. This year was our 10th anniversary, and Monday was her 30th birthday. We're down in California for Apple's WWDC and had a bunch of things planned to do for her birthday afterward, and I feel terrible that we're flying home early to deal with all of this instead of making her 30th special. I'll make it up to her. Andre Medeiros worked on the Apollo server component with me for the last two years, and it's been an absolute joy to work with a professional who knows so much on that side of things. The iOS developer community has been unbelievably kind to me over the past several weeks, I've spent the last week with many of them, even staying at an Airbnb with a bunch of them (they ordered me pizza as I wrote this post!), and I've got so many hugs and condolences haha. Specifically want to thank Paul Haddad of Tweetbot/Tapbots/Ivory, Ryan Jones, Brian Mueller, Curtis Herbert, Andre Medeiros, Quinn Nelson, Paul Hudson, Majd Taby, Ryan McLeod, Phill Ryu, Larry Hryb, Charlie Chapman, Mustafa Yusuf, Adrian Eves, Devin Davies, Jordan Morgan, Yariv Nassim, Will Sigmon, Barry Hershman, Joe Rossignol, Michael Simmons, Joe Fabisevich, my family, and so, so many more. Also want to thank everyone at Apple who have gone out of their way to be incredibly kind here (I don't know if I'm allowed to name names but you know who you are). I'll be fine No bullshit, I'll be fine. Through pure chance last year I spun off my silly Pixel Pals idea into a separate app, and that actually makes good revenue on the side. I also have savings. Recently (like last week) my city had its worst wildfires in history with over 100 homes destroyed. That's brutal, losing an app is sad, but it's been helpful to me to recognize how much worse it could be just literally down the street from me. Honestly. Apollo had an incredible run, I met the coolest people, by my last count talked with folks over 15,000 times in our subreddit about Apollo, and raised over $80,000 for my local animal shelter through Apollo. I feel incredibly fortunate. I think I'll rewatch Ted Lasso though. Supporting my work I build a second app called Pixel Pals that I spun off from Apollo that's thankfully done pretty well and I'll be spending more time on going forward. If you like the idea of digital pets it's a really fun app to check out. https://pixelpa.ls Media If any media/press folks have any questions, please shoot me an email rather than messaging me on Reddit, I missed a few last week because my inbox was blowing up. My email is me@christianselig.com AMA I think I covered everything, but if there's any questions feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer! In the event that this post is taken down or you want to link somewhere else, it's also available at https://apolloapp.io Thanks for everything over these last 8 years, - Christian * 9486 comments * share * save * hide * report top 200 commentsshow 500 sorted by: best topnewcontroversialoldrandomq&alive (beta) [ ] Want to add to the discussion? Post a comment! Create an account [-]lman2121 2582 points2583 points2584 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] (217 children) Craig's widgets :'( * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]glenn1812 1394 points1395 points1396 points 5 hours ago (169 children) Wish apple could intevine somehow. One of the best apps on iOS. God damn I can't believe that in a few months I won't be browsing reddit at the end of the day ever again * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]BlesserBot 588 points589 points590 points 5 hours ago (69 children) Apple won't be able to do anything :( It's REDDIT who with their outlandish api pricing brought us to this stage. Fuck this, I am out. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Zekro 213 points214 points215 points 5 hours ago (54 children) Buy Reddit * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]LowProfileXP 130 points131 points132 points 4 hours ago (31 children) Normally I'm a lurker on here, but since I'll be deleting my account soon.....Apple doesn't buy software companies unless they can somehow integrate them exclusively for the purpose of selling more of their hardware. For example, Apple bought the Dark Sky app, then they migrated most or all of Dark Sky's features into the Apple Weather app and proceeded to shut down the Dark Sky app entirely on all platforms. Simply put, buying Reddit would not contribute to selling more iPhones. Also, Reddit also comes with its fair share of "baggage" (pornographic content, misinformation, violent posts, etc), of which Apple wants no business with. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (31 replies) load more comments (22 replies) load more comments (14 replies) [-]fs454 428 points429 points430 points 4 hours ago[platinum_4] [Illuminati] (45 children) /u/spez I hope you enjoy the large exodus of users. Should have just worked with him to add first party ads or something. And maybe not be greedy Elon clones. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Mister_Hangman 163 points164 points165 points 3 hours ago (13 children) Dear /u/spez, Sincerely, get fucked. What an absolutely stupid business decision... but then again, you clowns and your private equity bullshit. This is why digg v4 happened. Now youll see it happen here. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (13 replies) load more comments (31 replies) load more comments (53 replies) [-][deleted] 5 hours ago (35 children) [removed] [-]Dumdumgirlsbeeep 52 points53 points54 points 4 hours ago (34 children) Please remember if you delete your accounts to ALSO delete your posts and comments too. Don't let Reddit have your content. [?] * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]HomoFlaccidus 29 points30 points31 points 4 hours ago (20 children) My thoughts exactly! Go scorched earth and delete everything before you go. Hell, Apollo should release one final update, with a feature to delete all your posts and comments, before deleting your account. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (20 replies) load more comments (13 replies) load more comments (11 replies) [-]changelogApollo Server Man 4228 points4229 points4230 points 5 hours ago*[ks45ij6w05][p4yzxkaed5]2[Starry_48][tcofsbf92m]2 [lop66ut2wn][35d17tf5e5][TakeMyPowe][Sunny_48]& 4 more (78 children) Working with you on this has been nothing short of a blessing. Thank you for everything, /u/iamthatis <3 Edit: I'd like to remind folks that Apollo does have a tipping function. I know Christian deserves every bit of support we throw his way. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]ap0phis 392 points393 points394 points 5 hours ago (6 children) Thank you. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (6 replies) [-]lawofficeofbobloblaw 61 points62 points63 points 4 hours ago (4 children) Thank you for your service, serverman! * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (4 replies) load more comments (66 replies) [-]SkyGuy182 2241 points2242 points2243 points 5 hours ago (24 children) Apollo is an absolutely amazing app that I use to judge all other iOS apps. I will sincerely miss this app, the people who love it, and Christian's engagement with the community. My Reddit usage will almost certainly die alongside Apollo. I'm pouring one out for you, u/iamthatis. Thank you so much for such an incredible app. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't crying a little right now. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]jerrymandarin 38 points39 points40 points 4 hours ago (1 child) Truly, Apollo is so intuitive and so seamless. Other iOS app developers should aspire to create something as functional as Apollo. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (22 replies) [-]Dyan654 1191 points1192 points1193 points 5 hours ago*[platinum_4] [pot_o_coin] (17 children) This is legitimately heartbreaking. I downloaded Apollo on the first day it was out of beta, and it's unequivocally my favorite app. It's one of the only third-party apps I use that is so well designed, so emblematic of Apple's HIGs, that it might as well be a first-party application. As far as I'm concerned, it's literally perfect. I'm absolutely disgusted at the way Reddit has conducted themselves. It's embarrassing, unprofessional, and imo libelous. I think you'd have a good case for a libel lawsuit, especially given your documentation. I suppose this isn't a surprise, given Reddit's precious corporate bullshittery, but this is a new low. /u/iamthatis - if the June 12th blackouts are effective in making Reddit change their course, and they issue a full-throated apology, would you be interested in continuing the app's operation? I get it if not - the way you've been treated is reprehensible - but it's an important question to ask. Thanks again for all your work. If Apollo indeed shuts down, I swear to god, I'll never use Reddit again. May their IPO burn. IMPORTANT EDIT: As far as I can tell, this post is being suppressed. Check out the different between when I'm logged in and logged out (same exact page, 1 second apart): https://imgur.com/a/7qHnOyM. Could be because of this feature, but it's hard to say. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Redtailcatfish 186 points187 points188 points 4 hours ago (3 children) This is way too far down. OP please consider talking to a lawyer. You may have a case here. This is extremely unprofessional at best and you have troves of evidence to support your claims. Regardless of your decisions on Apollo you will have to work in a world where your reputation has been damaged potentially forever after this. That's a big deal * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) [-]IndexZer0 35 points36 points37 points 2 hours ago (1 child) I'd love for this to be higher up so as to get an answer to this. It's a well worded question and I'm in total agreement the treatment of /u/iamthis being uncalled for. Apollo came with the receipts and proper math for how Reddit is just being disingenuous with their asks. I think I like this question because I'm still holding out hope for a miracle here. I guess the only social media I use is something I'm going to have to stop using. I mean...what now? Do I have to go socialize in the real world?!? That's not what's supposed to happen in 2023! * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (11 replies) [-][deleted] 800 points801 points802 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] [trfv6ems1m] (70 children) Thank you for everything. I'm deleting my 11 year old account. So long * permalink * embed * save * report * reply [-]wedid 442 points443 points444 points 4 hours ago (35 children) Bro actually did it * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]NazTehRpR 195 points196 points197 points 4 hours ago (22 children) A lot of people are actually following through. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Blarghnog 112 points113 points114 points 4 hours ago (16 children) I'm just waiting until the 30th. But I'll be knocking out a half dozen accounts, some of which are over 10 years old. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]NazTehRpR 33 points34 points35 points 3 hours ago* (0 children) I got 7 years on this platform and enjoy being on it. This app makes it possible, & It's sad that this is happening. Hopefully something happens before than. But I'm definitely seeing [deleted] in some places. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (15 replies) load more comments (5 replies) load more comments (12 replies) [-][deleted] 39 points40 points41 points 3 hours ago (2 children) https://i.imgur.com/B3g5nGe.jpg * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]ph-x- 66 points67 points68 points 3 hours ago*[Bulb_48] (2 children) PLEASE consider overwriting and deleting all your comments and posts before you go: It's easy and entirely automated! A lot of people come to reddit through Google. A lot of money is made that way. Reddit doesn't deserve that anymore, delete your stuff even if your profile 99% shitposts anyway. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (28 replies) [-]Defying 2805 points2806 points2807 points 5 hours ago[ks45ij6w05] (172 children) Their fucking claims of you blackmailing them is incredibly insane. Fuck this place * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]disgruntled_pie 919 points920 points921 points 4 hours ago (99 children) Yeah, that sounds like it borders on defamation. Maybe Christian can still get $10 million out of this after all... * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]acelsilviu 690 points691 points692 points 4 hours ago* (92 children) They were internal statements though. It might have been possible (and funnier) if he'd waited for spez or an admin to publicly say that shit, and only then hit them with the "btw I recorded everything you said". Edit - that was wrong, Reddit did publicly state that Christian threatened them. Hoooooo boy. Edit2 - as several people have pointed out, the distinction seems to be legally irrelevant anyway, thanks /u/Professional_Row340 /u/ throwaway39402 /u/noturlawyer * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Manny-Both-Hanz 249 points250 points251 points 3 hours ago (38 children) Yeah, and they even doubled down on it: Apollo threatened us, said they'll "make it easy" if Reddit gave them $10 million. I am confused about this bullet point, can anyone clarify what it actually means? Apollo threatened who? Where? And what does that $10M figure have to do with anything? BuckRowdy replied: Reddit is saying that when they approached the dev of Apollo about the changes, he asked them to buy his app for $10 million. They characterized it as a threat which makes little sense. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Jakeman52 147 points148 points149 points 3 hours ago (33 children) Legitimately should have taken his offer and fired their entire mobile team if they were smart. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]btk79 136 points137 points138 points 3 hours ago (20 children) 10 million for an app like Apollo is a FUCKING BARGAIN. They are incredibly dumb. The default Reddit app is ridiculous in comparison. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]SharkAttackOmNom 82 points83 points84 points 2 hours ago (4 children) Well Apollo is useless to them at any rate. It's not built to push ad, supply algorithm data, support test features like polls, live streams, whatever engagement optimizations they're trying this month.... They would have a hard time taking this app and bending it to their capitalistic will. Would end up running as shit as their own app. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]ElPlatanoDelBronx 37 points38 points39 points 2 hours ago (2 children) The dogshit UI on their app is the main issue. They would definitely make this one worse if they bought it, but it would still be miles better. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]greenskye 32 points33 points34 points 2 hours ago (1 child) They've tried that before. All they did was run that app into the ground too * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (15 replies) load more comments (12 replies) load more comments (4 replies) [-]MINECRAFT_BIOLOGIST 89 points90 points91 points 3 hours ago* (10 children) Well, thread's archived now, so there's a permanent record of what they said. Let's see how this shakes out. EDIT: Archive link - https://ghostarchive.org/archive/OQMGD Wayback Machine's being a little odd so I used Ghostarchive. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]werid 52 points53 points54 points 3 hours ago (9 children) spez have edited other people's comments before. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (9 replies) load more comments (42 replies) load more comments (6 replies) [-]GCisEZ 42 points43 points44 points 4 hours ago (7 children) i assumed they were hiring neckbeards. turns out they were scouting out the fucking county circus! scumbags. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) [-]PopDownBlocker 56 points57 points58 points 4 hours ago (3 children) It's not even a misunderstanding that caused an escalation. They went out of their way to accuse someone of blackmail, knowing full well that they were making shit up. It's not just a disagreement. They are actively trying to harm Christian's reputation to bring down Apollo. Fucking scumbags! They're acting like Russia when they accuse Ukraine of false shit so that they can justify their destructive actions. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (60 replies) [-]jack0rias 772 points773 points774 points 5 hours ago[Bulb_48] [iq0sgwn5bz] (29 children) Fuck /u/spez and Reddit in general. They're insane if they think their plan is going to work out. Furthermore, fuck /u/spez even more. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]doctor_who_17 86 points87 points88 points 4 hours ago (11 children) Fuck /u/spez Didn't think it was possible to be an even bigger cunt * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (11 replies) load more comments (17 replies) [-]tman612 6000 points6001 points6002 points 5 hours ago[gold_48]2 [platinum_4]3[p4yzxkaed5][Faith_in_H][kqr00h8b7q][6vgr8y21i9]& 2 more (317 children) I will stop using reddit on June 30 :( * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]mininova721 2473 points2474 points2475 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] [Respect_48] (114 children) There's no way I'll ever use their official app. I rather give up the site entirely. RIP Apollo. You were truly the best. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]GoingTibiaOK 732 points733 points734 points 5 hours ago* (51 children) Same. I actually quit Reddit before until I found Apollo. I have no problems giving it up, realistically Reddit has been wearing me down lately, it's all fighting and political shit now. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (51 replies) load more comments (62 replies) [-]LordTopley 302 points303 points304 points 5 hours ago (10 children) Same here. While I know I'll view it occasionally as so many of my Google questions end up as an answer on Reddit, I shall be doing that logged out and with an ad blocker on. I will provide nothing to Reddit other than an occasional viewer that provides 0 revenue. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]stupid-donkey 42 points43 points44 points 4 hours ago (5 children) Yeah, if /u/iamthatis had been given a reasonable cost and passed it on to users, I would have paid and Reddit would have got some money out of me. Now I'm only going to look at it on the desktop with ad blockers running when I want to look something up. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (5 replies) load more comments (4 replies) load more comments (191 replies) [-]Arvann 1277 points1278 points1279 points 5 hours ago[tcofsbf92m] (18 children) If Apollo goes, it is goodbye reddit for me. I never would have thought I would have to let go of this amazing app. Thank you Christian for working on Apollo for the last 8 years and delivering an app that so many people loved. Sad to see it go. Greed is evil. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (18 replies) [-]SethRavenheart 3953 points3954 points3955 points 5 hours ago [platinum_4] (177 children) Heartbreaking bye reddit * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-][deleted] 5 hours ago (35 children) [removed] [-]sumgye 101 points102 points103 points 5 hours ago (29 children) It is so sad. What Reddit has done is inexcusable. I only wish I could code and make my own Apollo using my own API key. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (29 replies) load more comments (5 replies) [-]Nick4753 1255 points1256 points1257 points 5 hours ago* (38 children) To make it even worse, they lied about someone who, even if they lowered the price, would've been one of their single most significant sources of revenue as a company. Either they're enormously unprofessional and don't know how to run a business, or they had no interest in keeping 3rd party apps alive. Or, most likely, both. There are many reasons to leave after all of this, being malicious to the creator of one of their biggest apps is just one of the more painful ones. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]bodnast 404 points405 points406 points 5 hours ago (9 children) they had no interest in keeping 3rd party apps alive. I imagine they were never really negotiating in good faith. This rate increase was their way of saying "gtfo" * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]sigtrap 65 points66 points67 points 4 hours ago (2 children) Absolutely. They didn't want to outright say they're killing 3rd party apps so they just priced them out of business. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (6 replies) [-]kilobitch 206 points207 points208 points 4 hours ago (13 children) They don't want 3rd party apps. They want to funnel users through their app to collect and sell their data and to show them ads. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (13 replies) load more comments (14 replies) [-]azermanus 652 points653 points654 points 5 hours ago*[gold_48] (56 children) Yeah I'm done. Mods, if you actually give a shit about this and want to affect change, don't do a two-day blackout - shut your subreddits the fuck down. Make Reddit come to the table. This isn't just Apollo. This isn't just about third party apps. This is the beginning of the end of Reddit being anything resembling what brought us all here in the first place. Reddit's execs are ready to hack this thing to hell in an attempt to make it a "desirable" product to sell. Maybe we make that hard since WE are the fucking product. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]boringhistoryfan 50 points51 points52 points 4 hours ago (27 children) I'm not a head mod for any subreddit. But I do mod a few. It seems to me that reddit could simply replace the mods on subreddits that close down and force them open again. Mods in general aren't a monolithic bunch. I'm sure there are plenty like me who are generally quite clueless about a lot of this API stuff. Or aren't tech savvy enough to be invested. And reddit will have no problems replacing mods till they find someone willing to open a subreddit back up I'd imagine. I'm just not sure if reddit would actually "come to the table" as it were on the issue. But I hope I'm wrong. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]azermanus 54 points55 points56 points 4 hours ago (14 children) It seems to me that reddit could simply replace the mods on subreddits that close down and force them open again. I think that would prove difficult. Not that aren't others that would gladly take over some big subs, but it could be a nightmare for Reddit to try to coordinate and moderate if the biggest subreddits suddenly shut down. Reddit is not Twitter. They don't have thousands of employees. They RELY on volunteer moderators, and if coordinated, users and mods can absolutely burn this site to the ground. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]mutt_rat 60 points61 points62 points 3 hours ago (5 children) They RELY on volunteer moderators Let's put this in real terms: they rely on unpaid labor that they're trying to leverage for an IPO so that people like Steve Huffman (spez) and all the venture capitalists that reddit took money from can cash in and fuck them out of their labor. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (5 replies) load more comments (8 replies) load more comments (12 replies) load more comments (28 replies) [-]Best-Expert 169 points170 points171 points 5 hours ago (17 children) I hope this begins the downfall of reddit, hopefully you or someone else create an equivalent app for lemmy and make it mainstream. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (17 replies) load more comments (27 replies) [-]RE_Chief 938 points939 points940 points 5 hours ago[p4yzxkaed5] (48 children) Looks like June 30 will also be my last day on Reddit. Thanks for making and improving a world-class Reddit client. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-][deleted] 106 points107 points108 points 4 hours ago (35 children) Why wait? I'm done now * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * reply [-]wickedlizerd 140 points141 points142 points 4 hours ago (30 children) Dude was NOT joking. Good for them * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (30 replies) load more comments (4 replies) load more comments (12 replies) [-]josh_is_lame 651 points652 points653 points 5 hours ago [p4yzxkaed5][Starry_48] (36 children) obligatory fuck u/spez * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Darkencypher 37 points38 points39 points 5 hours ago (3 children) Seconded * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (32 replies) [-]arthurcarver 1981 points1982 points1983 points 5 hours ago [Updoot_48] (30 children) Fucking greedy basts. Well, I'm sure I speak for everyone using this insanely amazing app, my absolute favourite by a long long shot, but thank you so much Christian. Big ups, man. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]hariharan_mifsud 374 points375 points376 points 5 hours ago (25 children) It seems the intention since the beginning is following Twitter's move to kill third-party app and redirect all traffic to themselves and monetize user's data. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]bodnast 231 points232 points233 points 5 hours ago (20 children) Yep the 3rd party apps are first. Then old.reddit.com will come next. It's like they want us to use Reddit less * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]jlusedude 157 points158 points159 points 5 hours ago (10 children) It will succeed. I'm not going to use Reddit after this. I don't have other social media and don't need this. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (10 replies) load more comments (9 replies) load more comments (4 replies) load more comments (4 replies) [-]MrC4meron 2073 points2074 points2075 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] [platinum_4][Faith_in_H][Starry_48][2juh333m40] (27 children) Fuck reddit * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]stoplookingusernames 224 points225 points226 points 5 hours ago (10 children) fuck reddit!!! im not gonna see my pets in my apollo app * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]theFavbot 44 points45 points46 points 4 hours ago[Starry_48] (6 children) Just downloaded the Pixel Pets standalone app * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (6 replies) load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (16 replies) [-]eggimage[] 288 points289 points290 points 5 hours ago* [Animated_C] (11 children) well. looks like my reddit addiction is getting cured in less than a month. this really sucks. so sorry this amazing app has to end like this. reddit truly is garbage edit: reddit, fuck you very much * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (11 replies) [-]Masterofunlocking1 276 points277 points278 points 5 hours ago (0 children) I want to thank you for making honestly the smoothest app I've ever used. It's a shame they can't see the error of their ways already. I wish the best for you. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]ckelley87 564 points565 points566 points 5 hours ago (20 children) I am so sorry to read this. :( Apollo is the only way I use Reddit on my mobile devices. Get bent /u/spez * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (20 replies) [-]NotTheSicario 278 points279 points280 points 4 hours ago (23 children) This came up as a talking point on the floor I work on between everyone there during lunch. We discovered that around 60% use Apollo, 15% use other third party apps and the remaining 25% don't use Reddit at all. The reason Reddit is doing this is because their investors want full control over what their users see and what they can do on Reddit. Considering Reddit only exists because of the content their users post, this seems like they're trying to destroy Reddit from within. During our discussion we came to a consensus that the likelihood of any of us using Reddit, if the third party apps disappeared, was basically zero. Reddits own app is lacking so many features, and their new desktop UI seems like a garbage TikTok clone. Thank you for all the hard work Apollo has been doing since it's inception, and I wish you all the best in the future. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]ElectronGuru 72 points73 points74 points 4 hours ago (5 children) It's worse than that. Twitter and facebook pay their mods. Reddit mods are all volunteer. And many/most use apollo. All that free labor is about to go poof! * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (5 replies) [-]AkioDAccolade 49 points50 points51 points 4 hours ago (8 children) old.reddit.com is 100% on the block next, no way they kill something like apollo which has so many users without killing old.reddit.com, which avoids a ton of the new reddit bullshit. I dont see ads at all on my reddit feed because pihole+old.reddit.com * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (8 replies) load more comments (8 replies) [-][deleted] 791 points792 points793 points 5 hours ago (53 children) BRB, deleting my Reddit account(s) * permalink * embed * save * report * reply [-]hooplasandwiches 563 points564 points565 points 4 hours ago (8 children) madlad did it * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]IFapToCalamity 195 points196 points197 points 4 hours ago (0 children) Based and (actually) red-pilled * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) [-]Dumdumgirlsbeeep 70 points71 points72 points 4 hours ago (20 children) Don't forget to delete your content too so Reddit can't use it! There are browser extensions that make it easy [?] * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]aniforprez 38 points39 points40 points 4 hours ago (7 children) https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) [-]fencepost_ajm 68 points69 points70 points 4 hours ago* (3 children) If you're planning to delete your content and account don't wait until the last minute. If the tools to do it use the API they may be affected in exactly the same way. See if there's anything about this on the tool's website. Edit: autocorrect * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (8 replies) [-][deleted] 32 points33 points34 points 4 hours ago (0 children) See you later space cowboy. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * reply load more comments (22 replies) [-]RSD94 6625 points6626 points6627 points 5 hours ago*[gold_48]4 [platinum_4][cr1mq4yysv][p4yzxkaed5]2[Starry_48]2[Animated_H]& 3 more (424 children) fuck reddit and fuck /u/spez thank you for everything Christian & co. <3 edit: thank you for the awards, but please consider sending that money to Christian & other affected developers as a thank you for their hard work rather than reddit's soulless pockets. shoutout to r/ ModCoord & r/RedditAlternatives * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]anchoricex 907 points908 points909 points 5 hours ago[Vibing_48] (103 children) I'm absolutely tilted at that call recording. Honestly what a total dickhead. Hyped Christian got them receipts. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]WalkingCloud 344 points345 points346 points 3 hours ago* (53 children) I was already pissed off about this, but /u/spez bold-faced lying on a call to moderators to try and spin things in Reddit's favour is absolutely disgraceful. Thankfully there is a recording because they were obviously banking on a he-said/she said situation. It's not a good look for a company that wants to charge developers millions of dollars per month for access. Would you trust a company with a CEO like that to send millions to? I sure as shit wouldn't. Honestly should be hounded about this on every announcement post he ever does. Edit: Holy shit they're doing an AMA lmao * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Thosepassionfruits 110 points111 points112 points 3 hours ago (14 children) That AMA may very well break EA's record for most downvoted post in the history of Reddit. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Stig27 52 points53 points54 points 2 hours ago* (11 children) That was -167k, I'd love to see it break -200k Edit: it was 667k, let's go for a million then! * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Kami_no_mikoto 44 points45 points46 points 2 hours ago* (8 children) -167k? its more like -668k /u/spez, you are gonna make history tomorrow again... in a VERY bad way. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (8 replies) load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (2 replies) [-]urStupidAndIHateYou 40 points41 points42 points 3 hours ago (0 children) Somehow I bet Victoria Taylor gets fired again over this. Yes, spez, we remember this shit even when you sweep it under the rug. You run a massive ONLINE platform, you think you'd understand object permanence at this point. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (37 replies) load more comments (49 replies) [-]ArnoldVonNuehm 2167 points2168 points2169 points 4 hours ago (160 children) Hey u/spez care to comment on the topic, you lying piece of shit? * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]ColoneISanders 1758 points1759 points1760 points 4 hours ago (84 children) If u/spez could read he'd be very upset right now. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]I_PUNCH_INFANTS 936 points937 points938 points 4 hours ago (50 children) /u/spez cant hear you he is hiding in his doomsday bunker till this is over. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]moonsun1987 507 points508 points509 points 4 hours ago (19 children) /u/spez I wonder if /u/spez is considering quietly editing all our comments to say we love /u/spez because that's what he would do just to be clear, fuck /u/spez * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (19 replies) load more comments (30 replies) [-]McRibs2024 238 points239 points240 points 4 hours ago (25 children) Nah he will just edit the post and feel happy again. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]correcthorsestapler 203 points204 points205 points 4 hours ago (14 children) Yeah, u/spez, edit our comments. I fucking dare you. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]cpqq 79 points80 points81 points 4 hours ago (6 children) /u/spez is a bitch boy, let's see if this gets edited. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]markca 51 points52 points53 points 4 hours ago (4 children) Can confirm /u/spez is a bitch boy. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]beelzeflub 39 points40 points41 points 3 hours ago (1 child) /u/spez eats salty gorilla turd nuts * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (1 reply) [-]DaveedDays 41 points42 points43 points 3 hours ago (3 children) Dude could u/spez be any fucking stupider??? I remember when the whole comment edit debacle happened, I remember the Ellen Pao debacle, I remember them firing Victoria. Every time I don't think u/spez could stoop lower he does. Fuck you, Steve. From the bottom of my heart, as a decade+ user of this site, fuck you. Your greed is going to tank this site that I once truly loved and enjoyed. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (3 replies) [-]TheRealvGuy 31 points32 points33 points 4 hours ago (8 children) ..or delete it i guess? * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (8 replies) load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (7 replies) [-]ShinShinGogetsuko 270 points271 points272 points 4 hours ago (16 children) Careful he might stealth edit your comment. He's known to do that. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]ArnoldVonNuehm 57 points58 points59 points 4 hours ago (1 child) I was honestly hoping he would ban me so I could spare myself the motion of deleting my account on the 30th, but oh well. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (14 replies) load more comments (58 replies) [-]Chicho_Procer 413 points414 points415 points 4 hours ago (12 children) He disabled pinging his username because he's a bitch who can't handle the slightest criticism. Still FUCK Steve Huffman. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]MarijuanaFanatic420 52 points53 points54 points 3 hours ago (4 children) I guarantee you he's read this. There's no way "major app developer burns all bridges and personally calls out CEO of reddit" doesn't hit his desk. He's just not going to comment on it until the lawyers have a chance. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Chicho_Procer 30 points31 points32 points 3 hours ago (2 children) Good. Steve, if by any chance you stumble upon this comment: If you love Prepping so much then prepare a traffic cone with lube and stick it up your ass. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (7 replies) [-]R0hanisaurusRex 539 points540 points541 points 4 hours ago (30 children) I heard /u/spez is being questioned by the DOJ about his connection to Jeffery Epstein. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]CrepeTheRealPancake 254 points255 points256 points 4 hours ago (10 children) He'll probably just edit your comment like he's been known to do. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]BovineJoniHimself69 201 points202 points203 points 4 hours ago (8 children) i love /u/spez and He is thE best and he's totalLy not Pointing a gun at me now * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Teknoeh 46 points47 points48 points 4 hours ago* (7 children) I heard /u/spez is and will always continue to be a gigantic piece of shit who's entire legacy will be running Reddit into the ground. Year after year, one bad business decision after another. Just another Elon except Spez hasn't done anything even remotely useful for the planet. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (19 replies) [-]elkend 58 points59 points60 points 4 hours ago (6 children) Every post we post on Reddit should now end with "fuck /u/spez" like a forum signature. fuck /u/spez * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (6 replies) load more comments (108 replies) [-]iamstevesteyn 771 points772 points773 points 5 hours ago (8 children) My day is ruined. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]sigtrap 288 points289 points290 points 4 hours ago (3 children) And my disappointment is immeasurable * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (4 replies) [-]Mathesar 509 points510 points511 points 5 hours ago (29 children) Oh lawdy there are tapes. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]geckospots 199 points200 points201 points 5 hours ago (2 children) He's got the receipts. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]Smooth-Question-3069 34 points35 points36 points 4 hours ago (1 child) Yeah absolutely legendary move getting these bozos on tape. Insane spin by Reddit. Not that I expected anything less but this is a disaster, this valuation is cratering. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (24 replies) [-]cocoiadrop_ 2419 points2420 points2421 points 5 hours ago (117 children) "I don't use the app, so I'll give you the best answer I can -- he does scraping so that he can deliver notifications faster, but has done NO EFFORT to be a good citizen of the internet." spez joins the r/LeopardsAteMyFace alumni. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Runelite_HD 856 points857 points858 points 4 hours ago* [SnooClappi] (22 children) LMAO spez You're telling me the guy in this interview isn't a good citizen of the Internet? Think your fedora is on too tight m8. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]geraldisking 131 points132 points133 points 3 hours ago* (12 children) Remember the article where Spez fantasized about a future dystopian world where he would be one of the leaders? Guys a nut job. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]AhmCha 56 points57 points58 points 2 hours ago (6 children) Lol he'd drink bad water and shit himself dead within days * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (6 replies) load more comments (5 replies) load more comments (9 replies) [-]present_absence 35 points36 points37 points 4 hours ago (3 children) Being a bad citizen of the internet means using the api normally I guess lol * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (90 replies) [-]shlem90 836 points837 points838 points 5 hours ago (78 children) I left Twitter when they killed Third Party Apps like Tweetbot. I will do the same here. Thanks for making a great App and making this site user friendly more than Reddit ever could. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (78 replies) [-]GBLoveSZN 1431 points1432 points1433 points 5 hours ago[Sunny_48] (93 children) /u/spez is an absolute piece of shit. Hope there are bad things coming his way. Do your job, karma. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]GoatboyTheShampooer 741 points742 points743 points 4 hours ago* (67 children) u/spez needs to resign. He continually fucks up over and over; and now this. EDiT: Annnd he's shitting himself: https://old.reddit.com/r/reddit/comments/144ho2x/ join_our_ceo_tomorrow_to_discuss_the_api * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]PinStacker 365 points366 points367 points 4 hours ago (28 children) Dude was caught changing messages and survived. Hence people recognizing this place is a time-waste cesspool. I am glad it's going to blow up in their faces trying to monetize it. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]MATHIL_IS_MY_DADDY 79 points80 points81 points 4 hours ago (0 children) lmao i remember that t_d fiasco was crazy. admin fiddling with messages was a wtf moment for me * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (27 replies) [-]CheckOutMyPokemans 58 points59 points60 points 3 hours ago (4 children) Lmao doesn't even give a time for the AMA. Amazing stuff. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]390TrainsOfficial 61 points62 points63 points 3 hours ago (2 children) It'll be during the period when Reddit has fewer visitors and the admins will be censoring the hell out of it because how dare the precious u/spez face the reality: he's made a terrible decision, destroyed one of the most popular third-party Reddit clients and caused a planned temporary shutdown of a massive number of subreddits (with several more subreddits closing permanently). * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (1 reply) [-]slushie31 41 points42 points43 points 3 hours ago (1 child) Sadly he's doing exactly what he's hired to do. Only care about Reddit making money. What a completely fucking sad state of affairs. [?] u/iamthatis and fuck Reddit! * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (31 replies) load more comments (25 replies) [-]Kdegeek 377 points378 points379 points 5 hours ago* (27 children) Welp. I guess I will no longer be using Reddit. My cakeday is October 31st, 2012, so heading towards 11 years. June 30th will be my last sign in if this goes through. I love this site, and the community on it, but I cannot support Reddit leadership on this. u/spez , the way you and the rest of Reddit's leadership team have handled this has been incredibly cruel, stupid, and tone deaf. If this is how you want Reddit to be run, then you don't want me. *edit to add: I also signed up for the PixelPals subscription. Not really my thing, but Christian has it turned off for me to up my Apollo sub to a year (so I could refuse the refund Lol). I know this is gonna be a lot of money out of his pocket, for something that wasn't his fault. If you like the idea of pixellated pets, or want to help a bit in offsetting his sudden $250k out of pocket bill, please consider downloading and subscribing :) * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (27 replies) [-]Hmesce42 658 points659 points660 points 5 hours ago (15 children) looks like u/spez is taking this personal! will be my last weekend using the website. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]ErikElevenHag 49 points50 points51 points 4 hours ago (2 children) u/spez is Tobey to my Michael * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]vxx 39 points40 points41 points 4 hours ago* (1 child) He's lying if he thinks it might help him. He has done it to me before. Even sworn. He's the type that would fake crying to dodge tough questions. He's unfit to lead a company and if reddit tries to survive he needs to step down in my humble opinion. I doubt he's been acting in the best interest of the company at any point as a CEO. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (10 replies) [-]WishMyHusbandHadAJar 170 points171 points172 points 5 hours ago [Rocket_48] (3 children) Fuck you u/spez * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) [-]Car333 1162 points1163 points1164 points 5 hours ago[45aeu8mzvs] (24 children) Very sorry to hear this. I guess that means my Reddit consumption will go to 0 now -_(tsu)_/- * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]bodnast 277 points278 points279 points 5 hours ago (11 children) Yeah my mobile reddit consumption will be zero, just like when Twitter killed tweetbot. Once they kill old.reddit.com, I'll be done with reddit on desktop. So frustrating * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (11 replies) load more comments (12 replies) [-][deleted] 165 points166 points167 points 5 hours ago (6 children) Deleting my Reddit account now, I could wait till June 30 but it feels wrong to keep using the site now that we know for sure what they're doing to Apollo. It's been a great run, and thanks Christian for all the work over the years. Will miss the communities a lot. Stay awesome guys * permalink * embed * save * report * reply [-]KaRue3 37 points38 points39 points 4 hours ago (0 children) So long, best to you! * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (5 replies) [-]Yorktown2016 331 points332 points333 points 5 hours ago (8 children) /u/spez you sound like a complete asshole and I will leave Reddit after the shutdown date. Unbelievable * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (8 replies) [-]SuperbBit 7382 points7383 points7384 points 5 hours ago* [platinum_4][Faith_in_H] (182 children) Oh no. I am so sorry for you and all of the fans of Apollo! Thank you for all your hard work on the Apollo app. This really was one of the best apps i've ever used. Take care! And please, don't refund. Let Christian keep what he deserves! :) Edit: please stop giving awards! The money will go to Reddit. They don't deserve that! * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Best-Expert 3210 points3211 points3212 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] 5[platinum_4]4[p4yzxkaed5]2[hehehe_b_4]2[SnooClappi][Starry_48] [5nswjpyy44][v1mxw8i6wn][9avdcwgupt][lop66ut2wn][kqr00h8b7q] [TableSlap_][CrabRave_4]2[Updoot_48][calculatin]& 12 more (157 children) People should stop giving awards to this post. Everyone please Stop giving reddit your money. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]sumgye 777 points778 points779 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] [p4yzxkaed5] (69 children) Seriously. We should all pitch in and buy Apollo and make it open source so we can use our own API keys. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]andylshort1 448 points449 points450 points 4 hours ago* (43 children) It's only a matter of time before they would take that away from you too. They don't care about third-party applications and would sooner price you out or end support for them to get you to use their own shitty, slow, buggy mess of an app. Don't give them the satisfaction. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (43 replies) [-]Chewcocca 44 points45 points46 points 4 hours ago[gold_48] [p4yzxkaed5] (7 children) People always assume that awards = money I have thousands of coins on my account that I didn't pay for. You used to get coins every time someone awarded you. I haven't used them because I think awards are pretty stupid, but they don't automatically mean money is being spent. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) load more comments (17 replies) load more comments (87 replies) [-]AmishAvenger 90 points91 points92 points 4 hours ago* (4 children) This is insane. Fuck Reddit What they're doing is bad enough. They acted in bad faith the entire time, and now they're outright lying and attempting to slander someone. How is it that they're unable to comprehend that their entire site, their entire business model, revolves around the users? No users, no Reddit. No users, no IPO. I say all the subreddits participating in the two-day blackout period just permanently shut down. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (4 replies) load more comments (19 replies) [-]Dead_Politician 153 points154 points155 points 5 hours ago (4 children) Holy shit. End of an era. I hate to read this. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (4 replies) [-]anakinfan8 141 points142 points143 points 5 hours ago (1 child) Well, this is a post I had hoped to never read. I'm gobsmacked that the Reddit head honchos can be this inept. Christian, thanks for literally everything you've done man. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]Cheechers23 142 points143 points144 points 5 hours ago (2 children) Man this has really killed my mood. Reddit really is trying to villianize Apollo and it's disgusting * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Blarghnog 45 points46 points47 points 4 hours ago (1 child) Worse, they went after the developer and if he hadn't had call recordings to call out the backstabbing manipulator that's running the company and his dark minions, it might have worked! It's not the API that matters really, though it sucks. Hey, business happens. Investors make demands. What's apparent is just how shitty management at Reddit is and their psychopathic behavior of manufacturing a blackmail scenario and spreading lies against this man's personal reputation and character. That's just obscenely outrageous and everyone who reads this post should step up to stick it to Reddit for coming after the developer as a person -- they went far beyond API changes into personal character assassination. This is a whole new level of bullshit coming out in this post. Wow. It's completely unnecessary and is only a reflection of the pathetic, manipulative and continued bad leadership running this company and investors should be taking note. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]tao_jones 251 points252 points253 points 5 hours ago (1 child) Just tweeted this to you, but I'll say it again here: Apollo was truly one of the greatest apps ever made for iOS. Unparalleled in quality. I will be so incredibly sorry to see it go. That spot on my main Home Screen will be hard to fill. Thank you for everything! * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]Lenininy 464 points465 points466 points 5 hours ago (39 children) The subreddits should go dark indefinitely until they walk back everything. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]yeahburyme 180 points181 points182 points 5 hours ago (5 children) Subreddits that have alternative communities should allow only top level posts as link posts from those communities, and no comments on reddit. Helps people move over. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (5 replies) load more comments (33 replies) [-]aruke- 556 points557 points558 points 5 hours ago (26 children) Sad. Investor greed at it again. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (26 replies) [-]JustAnotherArchivist 514 points515 points516 points 5 hours ago* [Starry_48] (30 children) Two minor things: https://github.com/christianselig/apollo-backend and https://christianselig.com/apollo-end/remaining-icons.png are currently (17:32 UTC) 404s. Edit: The GitHub repo started working at around 18:42 UTC. The icons are still down as of 19:05. Edit: The icons have also started working as of about 19:08 UTC. Thanks for the fix, Christian! * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]ownage516 162 points163 points164 points 4 hours ago (16 children) Really disappointed in spez. Hopefully that IPO money fills the part where his soul was * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (16 replies) load more comments (13 replies) [-]7plysMaple 110 points111 points112 points 5 hours ago (4 children) Thanks for the great UX and your dedication. I guess I'll start reading books instead of mindless scrolling. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (4 replies) [-]JusticeBonerOfTyr 307 points308 points309 points 5 hours ago (9 children) This is the best app by far for Reddit. I understand this decision but it freakin sucks that it had to come to this. Bullshit, Reddit wouldn't be anything or make any money if it wasn't for the users creating and sharing content. Reddit is also going to be much worse now that moderators aren't going to have the proper tools now to moderate since the official app is such dog shit. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]DragonDropTechnology 62 points63 points64 points 5 hours ago (6 children) This was my assumption, that Reddit tolerated (even supported) third party apps because they generate a significant amount of FREE content. It's similar to the no-annual-fee credit cards that can offer cashback. Credit card companies charge merchants; Reddit can serve ads (on the aforementioned FREE content) to some large percentage of users. Fuck these venture capitalistic scum. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (6 replies) load more comments (2 replies) [-]soaringSpriggan 105 points106 points107 points 5 hours ago* (7 children) Well, that does it. I'll be deleting all my reddit content on each account and then deleting each account so that I leave nothing behind on the site. I recommend each 3rd party app user do the same. Fuck Reddit, it's time to move on to something else and maybe overall spend less time looking at screens. I suppose this will be my last comment. I'll leave my content up until the Apollo blackout. One last edit: here is how you can delete your content: https://github.com/ j0be/PowerDeleteSuite Thanks for everything Christian. As a fellow software developer, I can only imagine how shitty this is for you. If there's somewhere like Mastodon that I can follow your future work, please link me to it. I am interested to see what you get up to in the future. One final edit (this time fr). I'll be on https://kbin.social/ instead for my Reddit fix. The fediverse is the future. I hope to see everyone here somewhere there. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) [-]ulkesh 188 points189 points190 points 4 hours ago (8 children) If Reddit allows this to continue, my 15-year account will be deleted and I will never return. Fuck /u/spez and fuck anyone at Reddit who is allowing this to happen. I helped Reddit become what it is today, as did millions of other users. Christian's app also helped Reddit become what it is today. Reddit will die the death it deserves because of this and good riddance. Make no mistake, charging for the API isn't an issue. Egregiously charging for the API is, and the timeline they have pushed is. They are greedy pieces of shit -- plain and simple. They could have handled this so much better with logic and reason. Instead they decided to screw everyone over. What a way to completely ruin your brand, Reddit. I feel bad for any decent people working there who will be losing their jobs from all the lost revenue this will clearly incur. But in the end they will be better off not working anymore for complete asshats. Thank you, Christian, for the best application iOS has ever seen. I wish you well. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (8 replies) [-]Ninjaguy5700 90 points91 points92 points 5 hours ago (1 child) I cannot express how sorry I feel for you and all of the hard work you put into Apollo. Thank you for creating the best third-party Reddit app! * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]pouwerkerk 83 points84 points85 points 5 hours ago (1 child) Thank you, /u/iamthatis, for all the incredible work you put into Apollo, for showing what independent iOS developers are capable of building, and for so clearly explaining why the Reddit API changes are unsustainable for businesses that use them. I have loved using Apollo and will miss it dearly. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]coolaaron88 75 points76 points77 points 5 hours ago (0 children) Wow the fucking End of an era. Never thought it would do down like this but thank you for being as transparent as you've been through all of this, I know it's been a back-and-forth battle trying to fight the good fight but I understand that you can only do so much. thank you Christian for everything, you've been an amazing developer. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]_jamieb 73 points74 points75 points 5 hours ago (2 children) Fuck this is sad to read. Two of my favourites apps (tweetbot was the other) going in such a short space of time is a kick in the balls. I've not read the comments yet but if by some miracle Reddit did a 180 after the blackouts on June 12th, would you keep Apollo going? I know if I was in your shoes I wouldn't as it seems the relationship as become a bit toxic thanks to their actions, and I'd be constantly worried about the rug being pulled from under me again. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]gforce216 65 points66 points67 points 5 hours ago (1 child) This was a wonderful app and the reason I even got into Reddit. I wish you best of luck in the future! And just as a light-hearted joke in this time...Any update on when we'll be getting that iPad update? * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]DinkyDonahue 126 points127 points128 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] [DuckDance_] (9 children) COMPLETE BOYCOTT OF BUYING COINS must occur. Not a one from anyone going forward. When you buy an award, you award greed. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (9 replies) [-]xezrunner 64 points65 points66 points 5 hours ago (2 children) It is incredibly heart-breaking to see that call being misinterpreted by the CEO, who then immediately apologized, yet continued to frame you as the one that "threatened" them... Reddit has become an incredibly hostile company in my eyes, and no doubt, them going IPO is probably the reason for their latest actions. This is simply a cut-and-clear example of what happens when a company shifts their focus from the product onto money. I'm really sorry to see Apollo disappear, especially because I was thinking of subscribing the past few days, even if purely to support the development of the app, since it provides so much of a better experience to me on mobile. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]Kirihuna 63 points64 points65 points 4 hours ago (0 children) I refuse to refund. You can keep my money and Reddit can lose my money. I'll find a new platform for sports, porn, programming and other subjects. Thank you for your hard work over these years. Your app has helped me in many areas of my life, from mental health (being able to access subreddits for it without having to use old.reddit on Safari or using the shitty App), to changing careers and everything in between. And wasting a shit load of my time that I could be productive lol. I hope you find peace in the next step of your journey. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]spasticpat 61 points62 points63 points 4 hours ago (5 children) Just a reminder that /u/spez edits comments that hurt his feelings https://www.theverge.com/2016/11/23/13739026/ reddit-ceo-steve-huffman-edit-comments * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (5 replies) [-]LordTopley 110 points111 points112 points 5 hours ago (3 children) Thank you for your efforts over the past 8 years. You inspired me to learn Swift and build apps. I made 2 apps that went into the store. While they aren't there anymore as I don't have time (started my own company and also became a Dad), I was immensely proud of myself for making those apps. Making those apps reignited my enjoyment for making things and I restarted my hobby of making websites. Today I run my own freelance web design company and I partly owe that to being inspired by your work. Good luck in the future and I hope to see new apps from you in the future. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) [-]MatchkeY 62 points63 points64 points 5 hours ago (1 child) Fair play. Thanks for all the hard work. Sorry it ended this way for you. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]rafaqueque 53 points54 points55 points 4 hours ago (1 child) Thank you for the amazing work /u/iamthatis. I wish you success. Fuck Reddit, fuck /u/spez and fuck every greedy investor. Please, just go fuck yourself, honestly. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]djaiss 148 points149 points150 points 5 hours ago (3 children) NOO GOD! NO. GOD. PLEASE. NO. NO!!! NO!!! NOOOOOO!!! * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) [-]dan-80 233 points234 points235 points 5 hours ago* (36 children) Will you build a competitor? Move to one of the existing alternatives? I've received so many messages of kind people offering to work with me to build a competitor to Reddit, and while I'm very flattered, that's not something I'm interested in doing. I'm a product guy, I like building fun apps for people to use, and I'm just not personally interested in something more managerial. These last several months have also been incredibly exhausting and mentally draining, I don't have it in me to engage in something so enormous. So sorry to hear that. I hope than one day you will consider a client for a Reddit alternative, like Kbin or Lemmy. So long, and thank you for the last 6 years. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (36 replies) [-]catsupatree 51 points52 points53 points 4 hours ago (2 children) Fuck u/spez Go ahead and edit my comment * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]SecuredMirrors 54 points55 points56 points 4 hours ago (1 child) And to the surprise of absolutely fucking nobody, Reddit took a good thing, ruined it, then made it worse by trying to make u/iamthatis out to be the bad guy. Fuck u/spez and Fuck Reddit. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]toolman10 384 points385 points386 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] (29 children) Also, as an Apollo Ultra Lifetime member, I will not be requesting a refund. If anyone else does, they are not helping this situation for Christian. Do not request a refund. What a sad fucking day. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]matttopotamus 99 points100 points101 points 4 hours ago (6 children) Definitely no refund needed. I'm in the camp that would have actually paid the monthly fee to continue using this app. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]mrhindustan 35 points36 points37 points 3 hours ago (3 children) I wish I could input my own API access token to continue. I bought Ultra lifetime but wish I could just pay Christian monthly as Apollo is just that good. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Eminem_McFlurry 29 points30 points31 points 3 hours ago (2 children) Yeah if Reddit was legitimately interested in charging reasonable amounts for API usage, the price would be per user and Apollo would just act as a middleman. If I go over some threshold, charge me like $5/month or something. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (2 replies) [-]ElectronGuru 30 points31 points32 points 4 hours ago (0 children) Was already pro. Bought ultra yesterday after canceling my reddit premium membership. Will not be requesting a refund. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (21 replies) [-]intercommie 47 points48 points49 points 5 hours ago (0 children) There's nothing to say other than thank you. You've done a great job with the app. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Zachrdoodle 45 points46 points47 points 5 hours ago (5 children) The Reddit API changes seem more and more like they're just obviously and blatantly trying to exterminate 3rd party apps. Probably so they can maximize add revenue and app traffic on the official app? :/ * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]RobertoPaulson 49 points50 points51 points 4 hours ago (3 children) I'd respect them a lot more if they just came out and said they were killing api access for third party apps for financial reasons. Killing them via pricing them out, and then playing the victim is just fucking slimy. * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (3 replies) load more comments (1 reply) [-]toolman10 46 points47 points48 points 5 hours ago (1 child) Apollo is one of the best apps I have on my phone, Christian. One I use several times per day--it just works, and it's a downright beautiful app. I understand why you are shutting it down (thanks for the huge post above) but it's a travesty. Greed is taking one of the best social media/forum apps ever created and killing it dead. The Reddit app is horrific. I won't use it. The smart move would have been to buy Apollo and let you continue development of it. June 30: RIP, Reddit mobile. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]redburn22 41 points42 points43 points 4 hours ago (2 children) Reddit should address these serious allegations. This post makes it very clear that a lot of what they said has been a lie, assuming that the recordings are authentic, which I have absolutely no reason to doubt. The Apollo developer has done such a good job of demonstrating how disingenuous they've been throughout this process. If Reddit had openly declared a ban on third-party apps, despite the negative impacts on this developer and their customers, I could respect that decision. Companies sometimes make such moves, and Reddit has the right to explore profit-making avenues, including consolidating usage to their app to potentially enhance user experience. What I can't accept is how they have chosen to lie to their customers (and defame their partners) to avoid PR blowback against their API changes. This not only shows a total disrespect to their customers but also shows how incompetent they are. When implementing an unpopular policy, a well run company considers amending the policies to be less disagreeable, or they just make the change openly and transparently and accept and weather the backlash. They don't attempt to dodge criticism by lying. And that's not even a moral thing. How incompetent are they to not realize that these public lies would be exposed. To me, it's not just wrong but also weak, given the transparency of the lie. Worse still is Reddit's blatant defamation of the Apollo developer, which seems to have been a calculated move to defend their narrative. Such behavior, whether it was intentional or it was a repeated mistake that they've chosen not to correct, is inexcusable. As a result, I've decided to limit my Reddit usage, resorting to searching for information with an ad blocker turned on. I'll reconsider my stance when they confront these claims, reverse these policies, or offer a truthful explanation of their actions. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-][deleted] 5 hours ago (22 children) [removed] [-]iamthatisApollo Developer[S,M] 292 points293 points294 points 3 hours ago[5izbv4fn0m] (13 children) While I appreciate the passion about Apollo I don't want this to escalate into threats of violence against anyone (implied or otherwise, and even if joking) so I'm removing this. Let's please steer clear of that everyone. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Meltingteeth 180 points181 points182 points 2 hours ago (2 children) "While I appreciate the... threats of violence against anyone..." -/u/iamthatis -/u/spez * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply [-]Totendax12K 37 points38 points39 points 2 hours ago (1 child) I appreciate the threats of violence against anyone -/u/Meltingteeth * permalink * embed * save * parent * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) load more comments (10 replies) [-]dingdongfootballl 42 points43 points44 points 4 hours ago (0 children) Eat shit u/spez * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (7 replies) [-]HippolyteClio 39 points40 points41 points 5 hours ago* (0 children) Reddit: "I think one thing that we have tried to be very, very, very intentional about is we are not Elon, we're not trying to be that, we're not trying to go down that same path. [...] We are trying to do is just use usage-based pricing, that will hopefully be very transparent to you, and very clear to you. Or we're not trying to go down the same path that you may have seen some of our other peers go down." Sounds like we know who to compare them to even more. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Silmar9 33 points34 points35 points 4 hours ago (0 children) fuck you u/spez * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]Mudkip-Mudkip-Mudkip 38 points39 points40 points 3 hours ago (2 children) I don't use Apollo, but I respect your transparency. Considering the state of Reddit right now, I took the initiative to archive your post text in case the admins decide to delete it: * Archive.org / Wayback Machine * Archive.is * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) [-]Spartan-417 94 points95 points96 points 5 hours ago[gold_48] (6 children) Hey, Christian People have floated the idea of setting up Apollo to use personal API keys I wish we could get that kind of thing set up so we can keep using this, the best client for Reddit full stop But I have absolutely no idea how to implement such a thing into the app, or if it is even feasible In any case, good luck for the future Your skill in making this should help you well in finding future jobs * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (6 replies) [-]bedstuybk 29 points30 points31 points 5 hours ago* (0 children) I've been a beta tester for Apollo since the start, and I've always loved your app, Christian. I can't imagine my day without it, but I'll have to now. Thanks for the years of tireless service, and I hope we meet again. So long, and thanks for all the fish. Edit: as for Reddit: I don't know who you are anymore. I think it's time we see other people. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-]PazuzuOvBabel 31 points32 points33 points 5 hours ago (1 child) Am sad. Never thought I will feel that sad about losing an app. th_th Thanks for the ride u/iamthatis * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (1 reply) [-]pm326 29 points30 points31 points 4 hours ago (0 children) What a narcissistic piece of dogshit you are /u/spez * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply [-][deleted] 5 hours ago (6 children) [deleted] load more comments (6 replies) [-]Uber_Nerd 58 points59 points60 points 5 hours ago* (2 children) Thank you for everything. Fuck Reddit! Edit: Sucks too since Apple just featured Apollo in the WWDC presentation. * permalink * embed * save * report * give award * reply load more comments (2 replies) load more comments (7089 replies) * about * blog * about * advertising * careers * help * site rules * Reddit help center * reddiquette * mod guidelines * contact us * apps & tools * Reddit for iPhone * Reddit for Android * mobile website * <3 * reddit premium * reddit coins Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy. (c) 2023 reddit inc. All rights reserved. REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc. [pixel] p Rendered by PID 80 on reddit-service-r2-loggedout-794c8d5f56-ndc8r at 2023-06-08 23:01:24.394658+00:00 running 7a5c034 country code: US.