https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/classified-challenger-tank-specs-leaked-online-for-videogame/ * Home * Air * Sea * Land * International + Europe + North America + Pacific + Africa + South America + Asia * Analysis * Fact Check * The OSINT Bunker * About Us + Our Team + Contact Us + Submission Guidelines + Correction Policy + Social Media and Comment Moderation Policy + Privacy Policy + Cookie Policy Sign in Welcome!Log into your account [ ]your username [ ]your password [LOG IN] Forgot your password? Privacy Policy Password recovery Recover your password [ ]your email [Send My Pass] Search [ ] Sign in Welcome! Log into your account [ ]your username [ ]your password [Login] Forgot your password? Get help Privacy Policy Password recovery Recover your password [ ]your email [Send My Password] A password will be e-mailed to you. UK Defence Journal UK Defence Journal UK Defence Journal UK Defence Journal * Home * Air * Sea * Land * International + Europe + North America + Pacific + Africa + South America + Asia * Analysis * Fact Check * The OSINT Bunker * About Us + Our Team + Contact Us + Submission Guidelines + Correction Policy + Social Media and Comment Moderation Policy + Privacy Policy + Cookie Policy [ ][Search] Home Land Classified Challenger tank specs leaked online for videogame [challywarthunder1]The tank as it appears in game. * Land Classified Challenger tank specs leaked online for videogame By George Allison - July 16, 2021 44 Share Facebook Twitter Pinterest WhatsApp Email A user has posted a classified document online relating to the Challenger 2 in order to improve the accuracy of the design of the tank in combat game 'War Thunder'. A gamer identifying as Challenger 2 commander has posted a classified document online in order to improve the accuracy of the design of the tank in the game 'War Thunder'. War Thunder is a vehicular combat multiplayer video game developed and published by Gaijin Entertainment. Despite the fact that Gaijin Entertainment lists itself as a Cyprus-based studio, it was originally founded in Moscow, Russia, where it still has offices today. It also has branches in Germany, Hungary, and Latvia, you can read more on the studio here. So, what happened? A user identifying as a Challenger 2 commander posted specific excerpts from a Challenger 2 AESP (Army Equipment Support Publication, sort of like a user manual) to show game developers that they "didn't model it correctly". The user identifies as a make in Tidworth with a history of "Tanks & AFV's, CR2 Tank Commander, AFV Instr, D&M Instr, Gunnery Instr, Former ATDU". It should be noted that Tidworth is home to the Royal Tank Regiment who operate Challenger 2 tanks. Anyway, it is understood that the excerpts from the document had their 'UK RESTRICTED' label crossed out and a stamp of 'UNCLASSIFIED' added, as well as having various parts fully blanked. One forum user remarked that "the cover for instance had basically everything except CHALLENGER 2 blacked out". The forum user posted the following alongside the now removed AESP in an effort to have an issue with the in-game design of the vehicle rectified. "Linking those screenshots with the following edited image from the AESP's which is meant to show the relationship of the various components. The image isn't exactly to scale as its only meant to show the position of components relative to each other but it works for the point I'm trying to make here. The trunnion's sit centrally of the rotor. The trunnions support the rotor in the turret structure and the GCE sub components as previously stated are all mounted to the rotor." [forum2] Gaijin refused to deal with the apparently still classified documents. Saying through through their community manager: "Before any discussion, handling or bug reports are even made, proof of this documents declassification will be required as well as where it was sourced form. If it is declassified, it should be available to the public. Last time such a document was shared that was claimed to be "unclassified" it was in fact still classified and was confirmed that it should never have been shared. We make it very clear that we will not handle any source material unless it is publically available and fully declassified with the rights to prove that." Additionally, a forum moderator posted: "We have written confirmation from MoD that this document remains classified. By continuing to disseminate it you are in violation of the Official Secrets Act as stated by the warning on the cover of the document, an offence which can carry up to a 14 year prison sentence if prosecuted. Of this you are already aware, as a service person you have signed a declaration that you understand the act and what actions it compels you to take. Every time you post this you place us (International representatives of Gaijin), especially any UK citizens, in hot water as the warning so helpfully states that unauthorised retention of a protected document is an offence." It's not yet clear what happened - was the clearance faked or was it given by the wrong people? We'll update htis article when we know more. Share Facebook Twitter Pinterest WhatsApp Email [qqHX7Orc_400] George Allison George has a degree in Cyber Security from Glasgow Caledonian University and has a keen interest in naval defence technology and cyber security matters. George is on Twitter at @geoallison RELATED ARTICLESMORE FROM AUTHOR [20bde-2013-025-0349] Land British Army receives new rapidly deployable bridge [BRADLEYIFV-TAPS] Land Trophy Active Protection System picked for Challenger 3 [ajax] Land Ajax armoured vehicle trials halted again [aponec-official-20210620-035-001] Land British troops conduct firepower demo in Jordan [WFELDrySupportBridgedeployedafte] Land WFEL to supply Dry Support Bridges to Philippines [vanguardsub1] Land Britain second biggest defence spender in NATO Subscribe Notify of [new follow-up comments ] [ ] [>] guest Label [ ] {} [+] [ ] Comments may automatically be held for moderation by our team, they will be approved as soon as possible in accordance with our Comment Moderation Policy. Please do not e-mail the team in order to speed this process up. If you have any concerns about comment moderation or any general questions relating to our comment section please send an e-mail to [email protected]. For corrections, please see our Correction Policy. [ ] Name* [ ] Email* [*] [Submit Comment] guest Label [ ] {} [+] [ ] Comments may automatically be held for moderation by our team, they will be approved as soon as possible in accordance with our Comment Moderation Policy. Please do not e-mail the team in order to speed this process up. If you have any concerns about comment moderation or any general questions relating to our comment section please send an e-mail to [email protected]. For corrections, please see our Correction Policy. [ ] Name* [ ] Email* [*] [Submit Comment] 44 Comments oldest newest Inline Feedbacks View all comments Goldilocks Goldilocks 9 hours ago Sadly, we have 227 atm - soon to have just 148. Oh dear Reply farouk farouk 9 hours ago What a dick Reply Andy P Andy P 8 hours ago Reply to farouk Yeah.... While RESTRICTED is 'just' classified, you need to take a look at yourself if you're sending in an operators manual to a computer game company to try and get them to change stuff. Time to step away from your laptop. Reply Nate M Nate M 7 hours ago Reply to Andy P I my self play war thunder Great game. But russian bias!! Hopefully the leaked secrets will mean the nerfed british tech tree will get huge upgrade! However, this is a bad thing. Last edited 7 hours ago by Nate M Reply Raz Raz 7 hours ago Reply to Andy P The guy who posted it is a tank commander and has been gathering information for a long time and sone changes have come as a result. Everything he posts and collects he clears with his OC first and had quite a bit under review still. This article was so long ago and had been cleared by his superiors. Reply Andy P Andy P 6 hours ago Reply to Raz Fair enough Raz, I guess its easy to mock someone else's passion/ hobby. Each to their own I suppose. Reply Raz Raz 5 hours ago Reply to Andy P Yeah, the post was like 2 years ago and they post it now. If they paid any real attention they would know he did nothing wrong and gaijins claims were assumptions without merit. Reply nem nem 5 hours ago Reply to Raz The post was 3 days ago The sources were removed today by the mods after getting in touch with DE&S. The text is all still there on the forums in a locked thread. Last edited 5 hours ago by nem Reply Graham Moore Graham Moore 13 minutes ago Reply to Raz His OC would not have had the authority to agree release of this information. Reply dan dan 3 hours ago Reply to Andy P He should worry more about his job and less about his hobby. Reply Dern Dern 9 hours ago Usually a good idea not to post something you're given in work unless you can find it on OS in your own time.... Reply Rob N Rob N 7 hours ago Reply to Dern Yes agreed. This individual is obviously a security risk and has already given information to a possible future adversary. If they find hip he should de dismissed and charged under the OSA. Reply Raz Raz 5 hours ago Reply to Rob N Both of you are making assumptions on misleading information. This was posted on the forums around 2 years ago and they claimed it was still classified but he had gotten it approved by his superiors first and continues to provide information they use today to make the fixes we keep getting to the chally. Reply AyyP AyyP 5 hours ago Reply to Raz Incorrect - you can look and see he *just* posted it two days ago, and you can see a developer response stating that they directly asked the MOD if this information was kosher and they in turn were directly told "No." It would have taken you five minutes to verify that you weren't the one making assumptions on misleading information, my friend. Reply Jack Jack 4 hours ago Reply to Raz while the original forum post is from two years ago the classified docs in question were released like less than 2 days ago Reply Matthews Matthews 4 hours ago Reply to Raz Really? So he posted it 2 years ago and they noticed only now? Not trying to sound smart, just if I got it right. I dig for this guy, he has a passion I share with him, even if he does some little over the top things. Reply Raz Raz 4 hours ago Reply to Matthews We are just seeing a screenshot of the article and I remember it from back then. It says 17 hours ago or something but notice there is no date showing? They have cut it to not show the date it was posted and the screen shot was taken. Reply Jonathan Jonathan 7 hours ago Reply to Dern Yes thats a very good rule to follow. If your posting something that's not open source your probably risking your job if your lucky. Reply JJ Smallpiece JJ Smallpiece 7 hours ago As others have said, the future plan for British tanks is so small, it hardly matters. I'm more concerned about the British Government not funding defence properly. Thats the biggest security risk. The scary thing is, our fellow citizens elected these clowns. Reply Rob N Rob N 7 hours ago Reply to JJ Smallpiece To be fare the Government have increased defence spending recently and we are the second biggest spender in NATO. I would like to see more spent on defence but at least we have reversed the direction of cut cut cut. Not everything can be funded and the future battlefield may be very different from now and what kit is required is likely to change. At one time a line of Dreadnaughts was the thing... in the future it might be AI controlled stealth drones. The traditional tank as we know it today may not be as much of a player... Read more >> Reply Spyinthesky Spyinthesky 6 hours ago Reply to Rob N Indeed I'm not sure despite my contempt for Boris's Buffoons that any alternative Govt would have increased defence spending, indeed had Corbyn been elected we would have bikes in place of tanks. Again I agree the effectiveness of tanks esp past this decade is very much up for debate it needs a serious conflict to truly judge, I wonder how long battleships would have lasted had the 2nd WW not occurred maybe even into the 60s who knows and would the Aircraft Carrier still much doubted by some in 1939 gained the impetus in the 40s and beyond? Tanks futures... Read more >> Reply Graham Moore Graham Moore 7 minutes ago Reply to Rob N Drones and tanks have different roles. The drone cannot replace the tank. Tanks are not obsolete or all the tank-owning nations would be scrapping them now. Tanks have actually been used frequently on deployed (kinetic) operations; air superiority fighters and warships have not. Reply Harry Bulpit Harry Bulpit 7 hours ago Unfortunately War Thunder is developed by a Russian company. So this could have serious implications. Reply colin colin 7 hours ago Doesn't really matter we have only 148 Challenger in the UK . Poland has secured 250 x Abrams M1A2 SEPV3 Reply Jack Jack 6 hours ago Reply to colin $6 Billion USD for 250 tanks ? That seems steep to me. The UK are spending $1.1 Billion USD for 148 Challenger 3s. I wish we would upgrade more, even if we put the additional tanks in storage. Reply Sharpie Sharpie 6 hours ago Reply to Jack @Jack you'll probably find that the Poland deal includes a lot of other things that you need to operate a new tank, like spare parts, ammunition, crew training, maintenance tooling, etc Reply Spyinthesky Spyinthesky 6 hours ago Reply to colin We have to accept that Britain's role in any war and especially in Europe won't be at the head of mass tank battles. Other specialities are far more important for us and we can and should only expect a minor tank contribution as much as 300 or 400 would be ideal if we had the budget for it I agree. Fact is Poland, Central European powers and Germany and then France are by far those with highest priorities there. We would be better working on and offering state of the art fast moving and deployable anti tank weapons for the... Read more >> Last edited 5 hours ago by Spyinthesky Reply Graham Moore Graham Moore 8 seconds ago Reply to Spyinthesky You suggest that tanks of European armies would only see action in eastern Europe, and that for some reason that precludes use of British tanks - I don't get that. Britain has deployed tanks on deployments outside eastern Europe since WW2 in Korea, Suez, Kosovo, Bosnia, the Gulf, Iraq and Estonia. Reply Graham Moore Graham Moore 6 minutes ago Reply to colin We have only 6 destroyers - still wouldn't want their secrets leaked. Reply Jonathan Jonathan 7 hours ago I have to say that's a pretty robust response from the site moderators. Actually checking back with the MOD. So full points to them. Reply Shirazz Shirazz 6 hours ago Its not clear yet where the mistake has been made. The guy that posted the excerpts has always maintained that they have been cleared. Someone has obviously made a mistake but it isn't clear who it is yet, whether that be the guy on the forum or otherwise. It is probably best not to jump to the conclusion that this has been 'leaked' just yet. Reply Rob Rob 6 hours ago What a plank. Hope he gets a knock on the door from the fuzz. See the thing is the real world isn't a computer game and this idiot may well have caused 'real world' casualties. Reply dan dan 6 hours ago So many people nowadays have zero common sense. Ugh Reply Dave12 Dave12 3 hours ago Reply to dan Ye but dan you are a trumpski supporter lol Reply Arty Arty 6 hours ago Fxcking legend he was fed up with the challenger and went fxck it this needs to be fixed Reply Hi Ga Hi Ga 5 hours ago Absolute mad lad. Reply Karl Karl 5 hours ago Welcome to global Britain, a laugh everyday. Reply Gunbuster Gunbuster 5 hours ago Think before you click. I read through everything I post to ensure its already open source or is no longer classified. Reply ian ian 4 hours ago lmfao, i can make a meme outta this Reply Dave12 Dave12 4 hours ago Any one plays the pc game series combat missions? It's a pretty good strat game, yes I nerd this. Last edited 3 hours ago by Dave12 Reply dan dan 3 hours ago Even if that stuff wasn't "classified" his job is being a tanker in the British Army. Not trying to make a "game" more realistic. Jeez. Reply Phil Tidy Phil Tidy 3 hours ago "Bernard, who else gets Defence Secrets before Number 10?" "Oh that's easy Prime Minister, the Kremlin". Reply Brian Brian 1 hour ago I wish someone at the MOD would leak the specs for the Hispano 20mm cannon cause they are totally fuked in WarThunder too! Reply Bob Bob 59 minutes ago "Anyway, it is understood that the excerpts from the document had their 'UK RESTRICTED' label crossed out and a stamp of 'UNCLASSIFIED' added" Might have been a declassified document? Reply wpdiscuz wpDiscuz [ ] [Search] STAY CONNECTED 121,735FansLike 441FollowersFollow 63,255FollowersFollow 15,105SubscribersSubscribe Other News [216887369_4332311730123319_50915502737642] Sea Britain and America extend aircraft carrier cooperation July 13, 2021 The extended agreement lays down guidelines to ensure that the training and operation of both nations' carrier forces are "harmonised". 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