Q. When General Brinton and Colonel Norris met, was there any considerable excitement in the party?
A. The only excitement was on the part of Colonel Norris. He was very much excited, and seemed to be full of expressed emotion. We were all very cool. We got over our excitement and cooled off. Got out of the fire, and we were not half as much excited as outsiders.
Q. What was the language used by Colonel Norris at that time to General Brinton?
A. Expressed great gratification at seeing him sound and well—something to the effect that he never expected to see him again, and glad to see him—an expression of great gratification, great friendliness.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. Did General Brinton say to Colonel Norris he would be damned if he would go back to Torrens and form a junction with Colonel Guthrie?
A. There was no language of that kind used on any one's part, no violent language of any sort, no obstinate language, everything was pleasant, in the friendliest manner, the whole conversation the whole time they were together.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Were you present, within hearing distance, during the time that Colonel Norris and General Brinton were together?
A. Yes; the whole time. They could not have said anything unless they had whispered without my hearing, and I saw no sign of whispering. I might add that we were all very much interested in what Colonel Norris had to say, what was going on in Pittsburgh, what was the situation in the city, and Colonel Norris described the events that had occurred, so far as he had seen or heard what was going on in Pittsburgh, and we were intensely interested in listening.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. What errand had Colonel Norris—what specific reasons, if any, did he make known that he came for?
A. I did not hear him specify any particular reason for his coming. I supposed, as a matter of course, he came out to see where we were, and hear what was necessary to be done, the proper thing for a staff officer to do; ascertain the whereabouts and condition of the troops. He seemed to want to know what we wanted and what could be done for us.
Q. Did he say he had been sent there by anybody—been ordered to go out and find General Brinton?
A. Didn't hear him say anything of the kind. I assume, as a matter of course, that he had been sent to see what had become of us.
Q. That you presumed?
A. Yes; that is, military custom did not require any statement. The proper duty of a staff officer, when any troops are scattered is to hunt them up and see what is the matter with them.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Did you hear General Brinton say what he intended to do, and what course he intended to pursue?
A. He said he wanted to get a place to give the men a chance to sleep, and get his men something to eat. They were entirely exhausted, and remarked that they were fit for nothing until they had that.
Q. Did Colonel Norris ask him to go back to Sharpsburg, where he could be supplied with ammunition and rations near the railroad?
A. Didn't hear anything of that kind said. It would have aroused me if I had. There was no ammunition at Sharpsburg, and no way to get it there. It would have been an absurd suggestion.
Q. The reason I ask that question, there was some testimony heretofore, that he had been asked to go back to Sharpsburg on the railroad, where he could be supplied with rations and ammunition. I want to know whether there was any suggestion of that kind on the part of Norris or any one else?
A. I did not know how we could get ammunition to Sharpsburg if we could not get it to the round-house. They might get it to us in the country just as well. They had to wagon it wherever they took it.
Q. Did Colonel Norris propose to furnish you with ammunition or rations—propose to furnish General Brinton with ammunition or rations for his command, or say anything about ammunition or rations?
A. The word "proposal" hardly covers it. He said he wanted to know of General Brinton if he wanted to go back for supplies, or whether he wished him to stay with him. And General Brinton said he thought it was better to go back for supplies. He particularly needed provisions right away. They might have used the word "supplies" two or three times, but he laid great stress on the fact that the men were nearly starved. That was spoken of two or three times. We were in a pretty desperate condition for something to eat; hadn't eaten anything for twenty-four hours. I know that made an impression on my mind and on my stomach.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. What time was it when Colonel Norris arrived?
A. When Colonel Norris arrived it was along about ten o'clock. It might have been from half past nine to half past eleven.
Q. You had something at the Union depot within twenty-four hours?
A. I had not. I sat down to the meal after the others had had their sandwiches, just before two o'clock, and was called away when I was putting the first mouthful in my mouth. I never got back. I was sorry my politeness kept me from putting it in my pocket.
Q. Where did you get your first provisions?
A. Along in the afternoon a man overtook us in a buggy with some loaves of bread, which General Brinton purchased, and broke up in pieces and gave to the men. Some of the men didn't get any.
Q. Did anybody in Sharpsburg furnish your men with provisions and water as your men passed through?
A. The men helped themselves to the water.
Q. Any of the citizens furnish provisions?
A. Some one came out that evidently recognized one of our captains, and came along to inquire for him, and handed him a bundle of cakes and crackers, which he scattered around among a dozen or twenty men—perhaps it might have been twenty-five. The men that got the crackers and cakes broke them up and passed them around. There was only a few got those.
Q. In marching out Penn street, after you left the round-house, at what gait did the troops march?
A. They marched rather slower than ordinary quick marching time, on account of pulling the guns, which necessitated their moving slow.
Q. Was there any haste at any point in the line of march?
A. There was a sort of break or stampede at one point before they reached the arsenal, where there was an unusual amount of firing. There was a sudden fusillade of musketry and pistols out of the doors, and out of the windows. A great many came from the second story windows at one time, or windows having the ordinary outside blinds.
Q. Shutters?
A. Slat shutters. Most of the houses at that time became two stories high. The shutters were bowed, and there came a volley of pistol balls and some rifle balls, and some from the rear. More than half of all the men that were hit during the commotion, were hit within five minutes, in that block. The firing was so sudden and unexpected, and two men were killed at the time, and one mortally wounded, and several others wounded slightly, that the men instinctively stopped. That was in the second brigade, in the rear. The others were beyond it, immediately where this firing took place. I believe I mentioned that all the attacks were made on the men in the rear. They would wait until we just passed before they fired, and fired from behind, alongside of the rear column. The first brigade continued to march on. Our brigade halted, and the men, by common impulse, without any order, commenced to fire in these windows, from which the smoke came. Of course, it stopped the firing from the windows. Some of the men fired from back down the street, and we opened the Gatling gun and fired down the street. The moment we commenced firing with that, we could not see a living thing down the street. Saw a dead horse, and two or three dead men, some smashed signs, and then we succeeded, by loud talking, in getting the men to cease firing, and just at that moment I noticed that the first brigade, or the first regiment, was double-quicking the men in the rear to their regiment, to close up the gap that had occurred in the straggling marching, and that had an appearance as though they were not marching away. The men at the head of the column were marching; in ordinary quick time, and in marching, the men would straggle out. It is very important, in a fight, that they should be together and touch elbows, and they were closing up, and some men in our brigade suddenly remarked, or raised the cry, that "the first is running away!" in the frightened tone of voice. It had that effect, and several others took it up and looked around, stopped firing, and saw that the first brigade was a block away from them, and with a common impulse, there was a sort of stampede or rush after them. The officers rushed around in front and could not stop them, and when they overtook the first brigade, they ran up into them in confusion. That was all the stampede there was. It was settled in a few minutes and got into shape again.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Do you know of any orders, written or verbal, urging General Brinton during the time he was in the round-house, or after he retired from there, within twenty-four hours, from General Latta, as to his course to be pursued after he left the round-house?
A. I do not know as I am a competent witness on that. I heard it second hand.
Q. Just what you know of your own personal knowledge?
A. I didn't see the order. I was informed through my brigade commander that the orders were to go east out Penn street, that was in reply to my expression of opinion that we ought to go to the Union depot and get our ammunition and supplies there. He told me General Brinton had orders to go east out of Penn street when we left. Of course, like a good soldier, I shut up. I supposed that was sufficient knowledge of the order.
Q. Any orders to General Guthrie to your knowledge?
A. I did not hear of any. All that was explained to me was that the order was to go east at Penn street when we left.
James H. Stewart, re-called:
By Mr. Means:
Q. Were you an officer in command of a regiment or brigade—a field officer or commissioned officer?
A. I was not, sir.
Q. I mean a commissioned officer at that time?
A. No, sir. I was not.
Q. What position did Colonel Norris occupy?
A. I do not know, I understood on the Governor's staff. I don't know whether he held a commission or not.
Q. Do you know whether he was commissioned or not?
A. No, sir; I did not.
Q. Do you know of any arrangement that was made through the colonel to have the troops rationed at any place or at any time?
A. Of the first division?
Q. Of Colonel Brinton's command?
A. Yes; I know something about it. I know we used every effort—do you want me to explain why?
Q. I want to know the whys and the wherefores.
A. Every effort was made to ration Brinton's command, whilst he was opposite to the round-house. We used everything in our power to do that. I myself had secured an engine from Cassatt, the vice president of the Pennsylvania railroad, and some gentlemen communicated with the Governor. Colonel Farr and Colonel Quay, and quite a number of us, carried on some tubs of sandwiches, and I having learned that the fire had taken place on Liberty street, we then telegraphed out, and found it was west of Twenty-eighth street, consequently, we could not get the rations, and we abandoned that. I afterwards went out myself to the general, carried an order, both written and verbal. I then returned to the Union Depot hotel. Every person connected with us, was very anxious to get the general's command furnished with provisions.
Q. Then the sum and substance of it was, you didn't succeed in furnishing them with rations?
A. We could not, it was utterly impossible.
Q. Were there any other arrangements made to furnish General Brinton's command with rations, after they arrived at the round-house, and after they got away from it?
A. We would have furnished him, if we had known where the general was.
Q. I ask the question, and I expect an answer plain, whether you did or didn't?
A. Whether we had sent any rations to them?
Q. Whether you did furnish them, and whether there was an arrangement made to get rations to them?
A. We had made arrangements—if he had turned his column back from where he was, beyond Sharpsburg, we had made arrangements to send rations up by the West Pennsylvania road.
Q. Where to?
A. To Sharpsburg. I supposed we might meet him there.
Q. Then you had no definite place that you expected to furnish these troops rations at?
A. No, sir.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Does the West Pennsylvania road run through Sharpsburg?
A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. Means:
Q. Now. Mr. Stewart, in short, what arrangements did you make to furnish them with rations at all?
A. Where do you mean?
Q. At any place after they left the round-house.
A. After they left the round-house?
Q. Yes.
A. We made no arrangements, for the very simple reason, that as I said, we could not find out where General Brinton's command was. You will remember, the telegraph lines were cut. We learned accidentally, that the general was retreating, and we would have used every effort in our power to get the command furnished with rations, and could have done it, if he had turned the head of his column back. And in this connection, I want to just state here, that so far as the First division is concerned, they were a valorous set of troops, and did good service for the county of Allegheny, used every effort that they could. I believe, that so far as my own personal knowledge is concerned, that General Brinton did everything that he possibly could to help along the trouble that occurred. He was posted there in the round-house all night, and I do not blame him, really.
Q. Do you mean just what you said: that General Brinton did all he could to help along the trouble that occurred?
A. Oh, no.
Q. I wish you would explain this; give an explanation.
A. What I want to say is this: the general in command did everything he possibly could to protect the citizens of Allegheny county.
Q. And suppress the riot?
A. And suppress the riot.
By Mr. Means:
Q. And the railroad property?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. I would like you to be a little more explicit—a little more definite in regard to these rations. When you intended to transport the rations to these troops, and how you intended to get them there, and if you intended to get them there at all?
A. In the first place, we didn't know where the first division were retreating to. We understood that they had left the round-house, and were going north. We then could have made—did make—some arrangements to send rations to them, as I said before in my testimony.
Q. What arrangements did you make—put them on cars, or take them by wagons—how did you intend to transport them over there?
A. If he had come back south of the Allegheny, we would have sent them out the West Pennsylvania road—if he had made a junction with Guthrie, as we wanted.
Q. As who wanted?
A. General Latta.
Q. Did you say as you wanted?
A. I didn't say as I wanted.
Q. As the commander-in-chief wanted?
A. The Adjutant General; the commander-in-chief was not there.
Q. General Brinton, or who?
A. If General Brinton had come, and made a junction with Colonel Guthrie, we could have fixed the rations for him—could have done so if he had stayed in Sharpsburg.
Q. Now, in what way could General Brinton have made that connection with Colonel Guthrie?
A. How do you mean?
Q. By what road did he or could he have made it?
A. When he left the round-house, it was as easy for him to go to Guthrie's command as it was to march out to Sharpsburg.
Q. As you appear to know something about these arrangements, I would like to know what arrangement was made to get General Brinton's command any ammunition?
A. What arrangement?
Q. Yes; or if any?
A. I do not know that General Brinton's command had been exhausted of ammunition. We could have furnished him with all the ammunition that he wanted; as Colonel Norris told him, if he would turn back the head of his column, and make a junction with Guthrie, we could furnish him with both ammunition and rations.
Q. Now, do you know that Colonel Guthrie had ammunition, and plenty of it?
A. He had enough for his troops.
Q. How do you know that he had?
A. Having been out there in the morning, before daylight, furnishing Colonel Rodgers' command with some ammunition, I happened to know that Colonel Guthrie had plenty of it, and then we had more of it at the Union Depot hotel, and could have furnished the general's command with all the ammunition that he wanted.
Q. Had you any arrangements by which you would transport that ammunition to General Brinton's command—from the round-house, I mean?
A. After he left the round-house?
Q. From the Union depot?
A. O, yes; we could if we knew exactly where General Brinton was.
Q. Did you have any arrangements made to do that?
A. Well, we knew just exactly how we were handling our own stuff there.
Q. You did not know exactly what you were doing?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you know from the commander-in-chief that General Brinton was short of ammunition?
A. From the commander-in chief? The commander-in-chief was not there. The Adjutant General was there. I knew from what General Brinton had told us on his route north of the Allegheny that he was short of ammunition.
Q. Did General Latta know that, to your knowledge?
A. Not until we returned from seeing General Brinton.
Q. And when General Brinton had marched north, you say then you supposed him to be retreating, and you gave up all hopes of furnishing any provision or anything else—when General Brinton, you say, went north, out Penn avenue—I believe it is north?
A. North-east; yes, sir.
Q. Then, after you found he crossed the Allegheny river you gave up all hopes and quit making any efforts to furnish him with either provision or ammunition?
A. No, sir; we did not. I believe that every effort was made to furnish his men.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. I would like to ask Mr. Stewart in what capacity he was acting?
A. As a volunteer aid of the Adjutant General.
Q. And did what he directed you to do simply?
A. At what time?
Q. While you were acting as volunteer aid?
A. You don't want me to tell everything I know?
Q. No, sir; my question is, you did what he directed you to do?
A. Everything, of course.
Q. That was all?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. You did not assume to do anything on your own responsibility?
A. No, sir.
Q. Were you a member of the National Guard at that time?
A. I was not. I had been a major on the staff of General Pearson.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Of the National Guard?
A. Of the National Guard.
Q. And you went out with Colonel Norris because you were directed to go out there by the Adjutant General?
A. Directed to go by the Adjutant General.
Q. And all you know about ammunition or provisions is what you were directed to do in relation to it?
A. Of course that is all.
Q. In your testimony heretofore you stated that Brinton made a remark that he would be God damned if he would return to Pittsburgh again. Are you certain he made that remark and used that language?
A. I am under oath, am I not?
Q. Refresh your memory and see whether he made that remark?
A. The general knew Colonel Norris better than he knew me, and of course, was speaking to him.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Mr. Yutzy asks you whether you are certain that he made that remark?
A. I most positively assert that General Brinton made that remark.
Major Lewis D. Baugh, re-called:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. State whether you were with General Brinton's command on Sunday morning on their retreat?
A. No, sir; I was not.
Q. State what knowledge you have of the dispatches sent by General Brinton to General Latta during the night of Saturday?
A. I cannot, without my memorandum. I was present when the dispatches came in, several of them, two of them brought in by a scout, I think.
Q. From whom?
A. From General Brinton.
Q. To General Latta?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. You were in General Latta's office?
A. I was in General Latta's office.
Q. When two of them were brought in?
A. I think one or two, I cannot recollect. I was there when the scout came in.
Q. When the first dispatch was brought in?
A. I think so, yes, sir. I came in the room and found him there. If I had a report here I could talk more plain.
Q. You mean the Adjutant General's report?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Can you state the nature of the dispatch?
A. If I saw the book I could state which dispatch it is.
Q. Did you see any other one than those that are published in the Adjutant General's report?
A. I don't recollect of seeing any other. I was in General Latta's head-quarters off and on during the evening, being cut off from my division, and naturally went to the next head-quarters, and I was in there during the evening, trying to get my rations out to the troops. I was commissary of the first division, acting quarter-master at the time, I had some ammunition there as well as rations, and I was in the room and out of it until pretty near midnight, and then I attempted to join General Brinton by myself, and went up street in citizen's clothes.
Q. Did you succeed?
A. No, sir; could not get to the round-house, found that I would get shot very likely by our own men as I was in citizens clothes, and looked about as much like a rioter as any of the rest of them.
Q. Did General Brinton complain of being short of ammunition in any of those dispatches?
A. I think he did, short of ammunition and short of provisions.
Q. Do you recollect what he said about it?
A. No, sir; I do not, because it is all written down, and I had the report.
Q. Are all the dispatches that you read or saw, as coming from General Brinton that night, published in the Adjutant General's report?
A. I think they are. There may be some more that I did not see. I read it over, and found it pretty near as I knew. I tried my best to get provisions to him, and I delivered ammunition—four boxes—to somebody, to take out to some other station to some other troops.
Q. Torrens station?
A. Torrens station, I think it was. I recollect going down in the cellar of the hotel and getting them out; it was pretty hard work for some one or two people, besides myself, to lift them up. The elevator was stopped.
Q. You were the commissary of General Brinton's staff?
A. Yes, sir; I am regular commissary of the First division—General Brinton's division.
Q. And as such were in consultation with the general during the night?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know of any supplies being provided to General Brinton's command during the night, or at Torrens station?
A. No, sir; not that I know of. There were some supplies I sent down there, but whether they reached or not I do not know; I don't think they did. Some started out there. The supplies went out in a wagon; I did not send those out—out to the round-house. When General Brinton started, he directed me to remain there and make arrangements to ration the troops in the evening and following morning. I made the arrangements, and after getting through with that arrangement I went on the track, and found there had been a fight.
Q. You say you were not with General Brinton when Colonel Norris reached him?
A. No, sir.
Q. When did you see General Brinton after that?
A. I think about three o'clock in the afternoon, as near as I can recollect, without having any watch on me.
Q. Of Sunday?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did General Brinton say anything about having seen Colonel Norris?
A. I do not know that he did—I do not recollect it.
Q. Did he tell you anything about Colonel Norris having been to see him?
A. I don't think he did. As soon as I found they had left the round-house, I heard they had gone to the arsenal. I heard Captain Breck say to somebody that they had gone to the arsenal. I drove there, and found they were not there, and somebody said they had gone to the right. I followed out, and crossed the railroad track, and came to the hospital, and down to the hotel again. I found they had gone to Sharpsburg. I hired another carriage, and drove out to Sharpsburg; and when I got to Sharpsburg, I was bothered which road to take, and I daresn't ask anybody. I found the mark of the shoes that the column had moved in the road, and I followed up that road some distance.
Q. General Brinton did not mention the fact of Colonel Norris having met him that day?
A. I don't recollect of it.
Q. Did he say anything about having received any orders from General Latta?
A. No, sir; he asked me for orders as soon as I got there. I told him I had none. Then I went back to General Latta for the orders.
Q. Why did you go back?
A. He wanted orders.
Q. Did General Brinton send you back for orders?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Where did you go?
A. Drove down the river road to the bridge, about opposite to the Monongahela House; crossed there, and went to the Monongahela House, and went to General Latta's room, and found him, and delivered a note to General Latta.
Q. From whom?
A. General Brinton.
Q. What did General Latta say in reply?
A. Asked where General Brinton was, and I told him back on the hills about the poor-house, as near as I could tell, being a stranger there, then he gave me written orders to give to General Brinton.
Q. When did you tell this to General Brinton?
A. When he gave me the written orders, I asked him about provisions, and he says, I was commissary and it was my business to feed them. Says I, "Yes, but it is your business to give me some stuff." They had not time, and they left me there. Major Lazarus, one of the special officers, was in the room all the time, and there was a captain of the first regiment. I took them down with me, and turned around to Lazarus, and says I, "You read these orders. In case I do not reach General Brinton, or you see him first, give him these orders." Then there was two of us, in case one got picked up then the other would deliver the orders. When I crossed the river at the West Pennsylvania depot, he drove down and delivered the orders. As soon as I got out in the morning, I overhauled General Brinton and gave him the written order.
Q. Do you know what those orders were?
A. If I had a report here, I could tell you, sir.
Q. They are published in the Adjutant General's report?
A. Yes, sir. The substance was to proceed to Altoona.
Q. What is the date of the order—can you give that?
A. Sunday night, about nine o'clock, when I received it.
Q. You may give the substance of the order, as near as you can recollect?
A. To proceed to Altoona, and Mr. Creighton would furnish transportation. When I went back General Latta gave me orders that General Brinton should have it to-night. I went out, and jumped in a wagon, and started over.
Q. While you were at the Monongahela house, did General Latta say anything about General Brinton having disobeyed his orders?
A. No, sir.
Q. Did he say anything to you about having sent orders to General Brinton?
A. Not to me. Didn't hear him say a word about it.
Q. Did he mention having sent Colonel Norris or Captain Aull with orders?
A. No, sir; didn't say a word to me about it. I took General Brinton a note in, and handed it to him, and he then dictated an order. The order was written out, and handed to me, and delivered to General Brinton.
Q. Do you know whether Colonel Norris had returned?
A. I don't know anything about him.
Doctor J. E. Mears, re-called:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. State whether you were at the Union depot on Saturday morning, when Colonel Norris was sent by General Latta and General Brinton.
A. I was, sir.
Q. You may state what conversation took place between General Latta and Colonel Norris?
A. I don't know that I can state positively the conversation. I came to the hotel about eight o'clock on Sunday morning, went to General Latta's room, and reported that the troops had left the round-house, having learned that fact at the hospital, where I had spent a portion of the night, and said to him that I proposed to purchase some medical stores, and join him at once, and asked him where I should go to join him, and he told me to go to the arsenal. At that time, Colonel Norris was making preparations to join General Brinton also. What their conversation was, I cannot state positively, or what the nature of the instructions given to him were. I knew that he was going to see General Brinton, and, at the time, my impression was that he was going to see him in a friendly way. I knew that he was not officially connected with the National Guard, and the impression I had arrived at, at that time, was, he was simply going out to see him in behalf of General Latta, as a friend of General Brinton, to see what had happened and what condition they were in, but I didn't understand, at the time, that he was going officially to him.
Q. Was Captain Aull there, at the time?
A. That I cannot state positively. I went into the dining-room of the hotel, and had a conversation with Captain Breck. That I remember, but I don't remember of meeting Captain Aull, at the time.
Q. Did you see the major, Saturday?
A. I didn't, sir. I may have seen him not to know him.
Q. Did you see Colonel Norris when he started in the carriage?
A. I didn't; because Colonel Norris started before I did. He took a hack, and I was going to a drug store to get some medical stores, and also going to a livery stable to get a conveyance, and Colonel Norris left the hotel before I had left Pittsburgh. As I said in my testimony before, I met once, after he had seen General Brinton.
Q. State what conversation you had with him?
A. I took with me, at the suggestion of Captain Breck, a man who had acted as scout during the night, a member of Murphy's cavalry, I believe. He went with me on account of my being a stranger in Pittsburgh, and showed me the way to the arsenal. When we reached the arsenal and found the troops were not there, and when I was denied admittance by the guard at the gate, or refused to be permitted to go near the gate or have conversation with him, I drove on, and the crowd knew nothing at all about the country beyond that point, so that the way was ascertained by asking persons, of course very cautiously, so as not to let them know what our object was. I followed the command by watching the road and seeing the foot-marks across the bridge going through Sharpsburg, and got through Sharpsburg and passed into the country, turned to the left, and I should think, not more than a quarter of a mile from the point at which I met Colonel Norris returning to the city. He was in a carriage with another person whom I did not know, and to whom I didn't pay particular attention. I got out of the buggy and halted them. They didn't seem to be very desirous to be halted, because it was not desirable that it should be known who they were in that portion of the country. I asked the colonel where the command was, and he told me it was about a quarter of a mile beyond, on the hill. That was the only conversation I had with Colonel Norris. As I said before, he wasn't desirous of stopping very long to give me any information. His words and manner was such as indicated that it was not desirable that we should be seen conversing together, or holding any communication which would indicate that they were in any way associated or connected with the troops, as there were persons along the road that had followed up the command. I joined the troops, certainly no more than a quarter of a mile beyond. I found them resting in good order.
Q. When you joined the troops and met General Brinton, did he say anything about having received any orders from Colonel Norris?
A. No, sir; he didn't.
Q. Did he say what he intended to do?
A. I asked him the question, and he replied that he was going to the poor-house to get a place to rest his command, and also to get food, and I asked him whether he knew where the poor-house was, and what his information was, and he said that a citizen or some person at Sharpsburg had directed him, and told him to go there, that he could get food there, and get an opportunity to cook his rations.
Q. Did Colonel Norris say anything to you as surgeon of the division about having the column halted at any point?
A. No, sir; he didn't.
Q. To dress any wounds?
A. No, sir; not a word. It was as much as I could do to get him to halt them enough to ask him what I regarded as a very important question, where the command was, that I should join him.
Q. Did he say anything about what his business had been to the command?
A. Not a word; no, sir.
Q. Was there anybody in the carriage with him?
A. There was a person, sir, whom I didn't know. They were sitting—both of them—back in the corner of the carriage very closely.
Q. Would you recognize the person now?
A. No, sir. I didn't see anybody in the room whom I should recognize as being with Colonel Norris. I didn't closely examine the person. My business was with Colonel Norris, because I knew him, and desired simply to get the information from him.
Q. Did you know Colonel Norris?
A. I knew him by sight, having met him with the Governor's staff on one or two occasions. I had seen him at the hotel before.
At this point the committee adjourned, to meet to-morrow morning, at Reading, Pennsylvania.
Reading, April 19, 1878.
The committee met at the Mansion house, at eleven o'clock, A.M. Mr. Lindsey in the chair. All members present except Messrs. Reyburn, Larrabee, and Yutzy.
George S. Goodhart, affirmed:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. State whether or not you were coroner in July last, at the time of the difficulties here among the railroad employés?
A. I was coroner; yes, sir?
Q. Still holding that position?
A. Still hold that position. I was elected at the same time that Samuel J. Tilden was elected—elected, I say, that is my opinion.
Q. Can you state what day the first difficulty among the railroad employés broke out here, or commenced?
A. No; I cannot. I cannot state the day. I presume it was within a week or somewheres about the 16th—15th or 16th of July. I would date it about a week anterior to the time these men were killed, which was on the 23d, Monday. The excitement ran very high throughout the day of Sunday.
Q. Will you please give us a history of how it first started, and then trace the extent of the difficulty and troubles along up until you come to the date of the conflict between the strikers and the militia?
A. Well, I don't know that I can answer that question with much accuracy. There had evidently been for some time before considerable contending between these engineers who were suspended and the Reading Railroad Company. It is that, I presume, that led to the difficulty.
Q. What time were the engineers suspended by the railroad company?
A. That is more than I can say.
Q. Was it some time prior to this difficulty—outbreak?
A. Yes; certainly it would be prior to this.
Q. How many of them had been suspended?
A. That I cannot say—a large majority of them, I think, that were on the road were suspended.
Q. Were there a large number of them suspended, and were without employ in and about the city of Reading?
A. It was generally so supposed.
Q. And the first dissatisfaction was among that class of men, was it?
A. Yes; and those who sympathized with them. There were differences of opinion among the citizens here. Many sympathized with the railroad company, and many, also, with these employés, and the feeling during the day of Sunday was very much against the Reading Railroad Company.
Q. That was Sunday, the 22d?
A. Yes; the 22d, and on Monday the general impression was here, with those that I had interviews with, that property and shops would be set fire to that night.
Q. The railroad shops?
A. Yes; during the day of Sunday, there was a good deal of excitement on the street here, on Penn street, and a great many people congregated out about the corner of Sixth and Penn and Seventh and Penn.
Q. What class of people generally gathered?
A. They were mostly workingmen, men thrown out of employment.
Q. Men from the manufacturing establishments?
A. Manufacturing, yes, sir; mechanics and laboring classes, principally.
Q. How large a number assembled?
A. I presume I saw as many as fifty to seventy-five, probably one hundred at times during the day on Sunday.
Q. What day was the railroad bridge across the Schuylkill burned?
A. It was burned that same night.
Q. Sunday night?
A. Yes; sometime during the night, about midnight, I think.
Q. This assembly of men on Sunday, was it composed of railroad men—were they actually engaged in running trains then—or was it men who had been discharged?
A. I am not prepared to answer that question, because I know very few of the engineers on the road. I do not know that I can point out a single man of them.
Q. Did the Reading railroad continue to run their trains?
A. They did on Sunday, I think, and a part of the day on Monday. On Monday, towards evening, some of the trains were stopped here in the city by some parties. It seems some of them were boys. Young men got on to the trains, on to the locomotive. At one time, I understood a boy—however, I don't know that I can say that, either, it was so stated by some of the witnesses, that a certain boy got on to a locomotive, and moved it back and forth, just about as he would a little wagon—made a plaything out of it.
Q. Drove the engineer from his engine?
A. Yes; they got off some way.
Q. You did not see them?
A. No; I did not see them. In fact I did not go on Seventh street at all on that day. I don't think I was on Seventh street on the Monday.
Q. Did the crowd remain together during the night of Sunday night, or did it disperse during the evening?
A. That is more than I can say, but I should suppose that it did not disperse very early—I think it highly probable that they kept up looking round for news.
Q. What street were they on on Sunday?
A. Principally, Penn street—corner Sixth and Penn streets.
Q. What was the character of the crowd, as being demonstrative?
A. Well, they were anxiously looking for news from other quarters, from Pittsburgh and Baltimore, where they had been on the strike, and, as a matter of course, they would congregate in front of the telegraph offices. Well, the news came pretty direct to the Eagle office, and they looked there to the bulletin boards for exciting news, and they came around for that purpose, and there was some of them, no doubt, were hard cases, and ready for any emergency.
Q. Were they noisy and boisterous?
A. I cannot say that they were.
Q. Did you have any conversation with any of them?
A. No; I did not.
Q. What seemed to be their troubles and grievances. Did they make them manifest in any way?
A. Well, the main grievance among them, that I could learn, was the depressed state of things, being out of employment, not able to get any-anything to do, and want generally.
Q. Who did they seem to blame for that state of things?
A. There was a good deal of censure placed upon the Reading Railroad Company, more than perhaps any other.
Q. On Monday morning was that crowd still in the streets?
A. Yes; there were some there on Monday morning.
Q. How large a crowd?
A. Probably not so many. I do not think there were so many there that morning as there were on Sunday evening and during the day on Sunday.
Q. Had the news of the burning of the bridge reached you then?
A. Well, not until during the night. I heard the fire alarm bell, but I did not get up. I did not go out at all.
Q. The fire alarm was sounded, was it?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were there any efforts made to extinguish the fire by the fire companies or civil authorities of the city?
A. Well; yes, sir. They went out, as was stated, before the inquisition—before the inquest; the firemen went out, Chief Boyer was there and a number of others, and it appears they could not do anything towards arresting the fire in any way. Some of the cars, I think, were set on fire, some box cars they had out there. Afterwards, it appears, that the report came that the bridge was on fire—that was stated before the inquest, that the mob was so great that they threatened the engineer, the chief of police, and other parties there that intended to suppress the flames—to put down the excitement.
Q. The mob would not permit the firemen to work?
A. Would not permit them to work—to put any water on the fire at all.
Q. Did they use any violence towards the firemen?
A. Not that I could learn.
Q. Did they make any efforts?
A. Not any that I know of.
Q. Do you know whether the police of the city were there—any of them to protect the firemen?
A. The chief of police was there, and no doubt he had a number of the police with him.
Q. Did you see the crowd during the day? How large a crowd was there during the day on Monday?
A. I suppose it would vary, likely, from one hundred to one hundred and fifty.
Q. Where were they mostly during the day?
A. Between the Keystone house, and the Eagle office.
Q. They still continued to gather around the bulletin boards?
A. Yes; around the bulletin boards. Some of them would come over, occasionally, to look at the Times' office, but most of the news came through the Eagle office, and the consequence was, the most of the crowd were in front of the Eagle office, there and at the Keystone house.
Q. How was it at the railroad depot, and about the railroad offices?
A. I don't know, for I didn't go there at all.
Q. Do you know how large a crowd was there?
A. No.
Q. Do you know whether there was any efforts made by the civil authorities of the city to disperse the crowd during the day?
A. Well, there was an effort made, at least it so appeared in the inquisition, that parties went to the sheriff, with a view of getting him to render some assistance. One party, a man by the name of Miller, proffered to suppress the mob with fifty men. Said that if the sheriff would allow him to, that he thought he could procure that number of men. This was sometime during the day of Monday that this statement was made. The proffer was made to the sheriff.
Q. Made by Mr. Miller himself?
A. By Mr. Miller, in company with Mr. Wood.
Q. What reply did the sheriff make to that offer?
A. I don't know the exact words—I have all that testimony down.
Q. Give us the substance of it—of his reply?
A. He did not feel disposed to do anything. They said they would get arms and ammunition, and everything that was necessary, to put it down, if he would give his consent, which, it seems, he declined to do; and when they said they would get the arms or guns, he said the rioters have guns, too; and he also said to them that he would not go to do anything by way of suppressing it, for fear that he would be shot the same as the sheriff was at Pittsburgh.
Q. You had received news, then, that the sheriff of Allegheny county was shot, had you here?
A. Yes; at that time.
Q. Which afterwards proved incorrect. Was that the only reason that he gave for not accepting the proposition of Mr. Miller?
A. I am inclined to think that was the only plausible reason he gave. He didn't believe in going out and being a target to fire at.
Q. Did he make any effort to arrest the parties who were in the disturbance during Monday?
A. None that I can learn.
Q. Did he make any effort at any time?
A. I think not.
Q. Did he call for any posse to assist you in any way?
A. He swore in the next day quite a number of deputy sheriffs, but on Monday I don't think he called on any. He issued his proclamation and called and put it up, I think, in the evening, about five or six o'clock.
Q. On Monday?
A. On Monday.
Q. Now, can you give us the substance of the proclamation?
A. No; I cannot. I didn't see it.
Q. Didn't see it?
A. No.
Q. Was there any call made for the militia to come out, by the sheriff, to preserve the peace?
A. No.
Q. Do you know how the militia happened to come here?
A. Well, it was said afterwards that they came here by the order of General Bolton.
Q. Monday night—go on and describe the situation of affairs, if you will—where the crowd was, and what took place on Monday night?
A. The main crowd was up at the corner of Seventh and Penn, and where there are always quite a number of men congregated, particularly at that hour, shortly before dusk, and about that time. There had been large crowds there for some weeks or so, who frequently congregated there, and on that night, as a matter of course, it would be expected there would be more, in consequence of the transactions that took place during the day. People went there to see the excitement, and so on, and it was with a great deal of difficulty, as I understood from the testimony of Chief Cullen, that they could keep the pass-way clear, to allow people to pass up and down the street. I think, if I mistake not, Mr. Cullen had nearly all his force there. He was chief of police, and once or twice, I think, he stated he got the pass-way cleared. It was soon blocked up again. Just about dusk, or a little after, it appears that General Reeder arrived with some men at the outer depot. Mr. Paxton, in communication with him, told him where the rioters were, and where one of the cars were that they wished to release from the mob. That was at the commencement of the cut there. The general ordered his men right there to release that car, and I suppose, passing through the cut. He concluded to force his men right through. I don't know what acquaintance he had with the surroundings of the cut, but it strikes me very forcibly, even now, and has all along, that if he had sent a dozen men on either side of that cut, and his main body of men through the cut, that there would hardly have been a drop of blood shed. As these troops moved up the cut, they were met with volleys of stones and missiles, pistol-shooting, &c., from above either side, as they were passing along; and, indeed, I cannot see how they got through there and escaped with so little injury as they did. It looks to me almost a miracle. Have you observed the cut—have you been up there?
Q. Only in passing through it.
A. The testimony came in that they would throw stones large enough—well, too large for one man to handle—take two men—at one time two men were seen to get hold of a large stone, and push it right over, apparently on to them. They were treated in that way, until they got to the lower end of the cut, and they marched up the tracks on either side, I think, principally, on the west side. When they got about two thirds of the way through the cut, they fired forward, killing a number of men right at the corner of Penn and Seventh. One man was killed about two squares—better than two squares—below. He was on his way up town, somewhere. A man by the name of Trace, I believe.
Q. A citizen of the city?
A. Yes, sir; a citizen. Two or three men were killed on the southeast corner or near the southeast corner of the street, near the gutter. One or two of them were on the sidewalk. I think it very remarkable, indeed, that these men would come through there, and when they met with these missiles on either side of them, that they would fire forward, and being attacked as they were, it would appear as though they would fire in almost any direction for relief, and get out as speedily as possible.
Q. After they passed through the cut, did they encounter the mob at the end of the cut?
A. Some of them. Those that were throwing these missiles, on either side, I dare say, didn't organize in front of them; but there was some of the parties—some of the same mob—there.
Q. Was there any firing there, after they had passed through?
A. No; not after they had passed through.
Q. What street did they come out on, in passing through the cut?
A. Out on Penn street, and then down Penn.
Q. There was no firing, as they passed through the cut?
A. No; not after they had got on to Penn, west of Seventh.
Q. Did the troops accomplish what they were sent to—started to accomplish—gaining possession of the car?
A. Yes; they did that.
Q. How long did the troops remain in the city, then?
A. Well, during the night, I think. I think they left the next morning.
Q. Do you know where they went to from there?
A. No; I don't; but I learned that they had gone back to Allentown or Easton.
Q. Were any troops left at Reading, at all?
A. Yes; there was some left at the outer depot.
Q. To guard railroad property?
A. To guard the property of the railroad company.
Q. Was there any disturbance occurred after that Monday night?
A. None, that I could learn.
Q. Was the mob dispersed by the firing that took place?
A. Effectually.
Q. Did they ever rally, or come together again?
A. No; no rallying there.
Q. I wish you would give us the number of killed—the number that was actually killed—so far as you can?
A. There were ten killed—then another one subsequently died, about six or eight weeks, I think, afterwards—Corbett—from the wounds received at the same time.
Q. Making eleven in all?
A. Making eleven altogether.
Q. Were these all citizens, or a portion of them soldiers?
A. They were all citizens—no soldiers.
Q. Were any of them actually engaged, or were they citizens who had congregated there out of curiosity?
A. The larger part of them were there out of curiosity. Two of those that were killed were said to have had something to do with this matter, and were not innocent. The others—that is, taking it for granted that they were innocent, by being there, which the law, I believe, doesn't grant, either—may be said to have been innocent. Trace was, perhaps, the least censurable of any of them, for he was far away from the scene where this was transacted.
Q. I understand you to say this: of the killed there were only two who were actually engaged in the riots?
A. I would say, whose record was not altogether clear—free from censure.
Q. Now, how many persons were wounded, so far as you could ascertain?
A. That I cannot ascertain; but I presume there were as many as six or eight more that were wounded—probably more.
Q. Do you know how many of the soldiers were wounded?
A. No; I didn't learn, but I understand—I think that there were but two or three that were in any ways seriously hurt—none mortally.
Q. Now you may state what efforts were made by the sheriff on Tuesday—Monday night and Tuesday to preserve the peace?
A. The only effort that he made then that I know of was that he sent notice to quite a number of the citizens to call at his office and be sworn in as deputy sheriffs. What instructions they received from him I don't know.
Q. Do you know how many offered themselves or responded to his notice?
A. I don't know, but I understood there was some five or six hundred citizens that were sworn in by him or his deputy.
Q. What efforts did the mayor make, if any, to preserve the peace during the entire disturbance?
A. The mayor was not here at the time, but returned the night, I think, shortly before these troops left. He afterwards went out to the depot and was in communication with General Reeder, if I mistake not. I don't think that anything further was done to suppress the mob, for everything was quiet then.
Q. The chief of police was on the ground was he?
A. He was on the ground, and I think manfully did his duty.
Q. How many police were on duty at the time in the city?
A. I suppose there were about twenty-five or thirty, I forget the number.
Q. Do you know what authority the mayor has in case of riot and disturbances, given by the charter of the city or the laws relating to the city?
A. I have never read them. I have never read the charter of the city; but my own judgment would tell me that he had power of suppressing—the same power of suppressing a riot that a sheriff would have.
Q. Was that matter discussed, or taken into consideration by the citizens at the time? Did you hear any expression by legal gentlemen as to what the power of the mayor was?
A. I cannot say that I did; but the matter was discussed pretty freely among citizens, and some seemed to think that the mayor ought to have suppressed the riot. I presume he would if he had been here.
Q. Did he arrive here before the firing took place in the cut?
A. No.
Q. Not until after?
A. Not until afterwards.
Q. Did the chief of police make any arrests, to your knowledge, prior to the conflict between the troops and the mob?
A. No; they made no arrests so far as I could learn. It seems they were under the impression that they were almost entirely powerless with the meager number they had to arrest them.
Q. They didn't feel strong enough to cope with the mob without greater assistance?
A. No, sir.
Q. Were any arrests made that afternoon?
A. Yes; a great many arrests.
Q. By what authority—by whom?
A. Well, by the chief of police—they made the most of the arrests.
Q. Were any arrests made by the sheriff?
A. I think not. I don't know of any.
Q. The arrests then were mostly made by the chief of police on warrants issued by the mayor?
A. I think they were issued by the mayor.
Q. What was done with those persons who were arrested?
A. Some of them were taken up to jail. Others were released on bail.
Q. How many have been tried?
A. I suppose there were between forty and fifty that were tried—they were to have been tried. Whether they have all been or not, I don't know.
Q. How long is this cut?
A. Well, it is nearly two squares.
Q. How soon after the soldiers were in did they begin to attack them?
A. Within about probably fifteen or twenty minutes.
Q. Did they continue to fire on them then until they got down on to Penn street, where the cut runs down level?
A. No, not quite. I don't think there were any stones thrown after they had passed Court street, within just half a square from Penn.
Q. The firing didn't commence until they got on to the cut?
A. No; it was before the firing on the soldiers you mean?
Q. Yes, sir?
A. It was not, I think, until after they passed Court street—about that.
Q. It was still in the cut?
A. Still in the cut.
Q. Then they got out of the cut on to level ground, and then it was that the firing was done, and when the mob was dispersed.
A. Yes; there was firing done there, and at Penn street. They couldn't fire up and down Penn street without being very close to it.
Q. And this stone that took two men to throw down—did that hit anybody?
A. That is more than I know; not directly, evidently, or it would have killed them.
By Mr. Means:
Q. Was the sympathy of the people of the city of Reading with the strikers, the discharged employés of the Reading railroad?
A. Well, there was sympathy on both sides, evidently; and during the day, on Monday, I am inclined to think, quite a number of the people sympathized with the strikers, rather than with the railroad company.
Q. You say on both sides. Now, I would like to know what you mean by both sides?
A. I mean the Reading Railroad Company and the dismissed engineers of the road.
Q. Then, in your opinion, the sympathy of the people of Reading was with the employés of the Reading railroad in striking and destruction of property?
A. No; I couldn't say that.
Q. My question was simply this: that I wanted to know if the citizens of the city of Reading were in sympathy with the strikers, or the discharged employés of the Reading road?
A. I should say no; although they had a good many to sympathize with them here in the city.
Q. Well, then, Mr. Goodhart, were they simply discharged employés of the Reading road that participated in this destruction of property?
A. That question I cannot answer, because, as I stated before, I don't know any of the engineers of the road now.
Q. Did there appear to be any tramps or any strangers connected with this party who were with the engineers or employés of the Reading road?
A. So far as I know they were all strangers to me, and I have very little hesitation in saying, that a good many of them were strangers, coming here from a distance.
Q. From a distance and from other sections of the country?
A. Yes, sir. I think a number of them were strangers, not citizens of the place, nor had they been in the employ of the Reading Railroad Company.
Q. To your knowledge, do you know whether or not, the mayor of the city of Reading ordered out his police to suppress these rioters?
A. Not to my knowledge.
Q. When the mayor was not here, was there any person in authority?
A. The chief of police. Chief Cullen, he has stated, took his men up to the corner of Seventh and Penn that evening, and I presume did his utmost to clear the pass-way there, and suppress the mob. What effect it would have had upon them had they arrested two or three or half a dozen of these men I am not prepared to say, it might, possibly, have dispersed the mob.
Q. Well, then, Mr. Goodhart, in your opinion, what amount of men would it have taken to suppress this mob and restore order and peace?
A. I should think that one hundred and fifty or two hundred men would have done it, properly armed.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. What other property was destroyed beside the destruction of the bridge?
A. There was a few houses that were burned.
Q. Any freight in them?
A. I think there was some, and then there was some property destroyed right on the road here in the city.
Q. Private property?
A. No; that was cars loaded, and there was one car filled with tobacco, that was broken into and a great deal of it being carried away.