Harrisburg, March 12, 1878.
Committee met, pursuant to adjournment, at four o'clock, P.M., in Senate committee room No. 6. Mr. Lindsey in the chair. All members present.
W. W. Jennings:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. You were sheriff of Dauphin county in July last?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Still sheriff?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were you at home at the time of the first disturbance that broke out in Harrisburg.
A. I arrived home—I was at Atlantic City—I arrived home Monday evening, July 23, about half-past six or seven o'clock.
Q. Just state how you found the city as to order and quietness when you arrived home?
A. I found the city under a great deal of excitement. The trains, I was informed, had been stopped from running, and I immediately went to my counsel, Mr. Wise, for instructions in regard to my powers and duties, and met a number of the prominent citizens, and went to work at once under advice of my counsel to prepare a proclamation, and I was informed by the mayor and other citizens, that the citizens had been notified to assemble at two strokes of the court-house bell. I went around town and endeavored to get parties together, until about ten or eleven o'clock, as near as I can recollect, and spent sometime preparing a proclamation and advising with the prominent citizens, and one came to me at the Lochiel Hotel and said that the rioters were breaking into the stores on Market street. I called upon the good citizens for the preservation of law and order to go with me and suppress the riot. I suppose about one hundred or one hundred and fifty went with me, and went down Market street, and we dispersed the mob. We arrested a couple of the rioters there. Afterwards came back, and I sent squads out. I then organized the party into companies, and I sent squads out to arrest and take these men out of bed who had been prominent and active as rioters, who I was informed had been prominent and active as rioters, and we put those in jail. The next morning I had my proclamation out, and also orders organizing companies. The citizens responded promptly. We organized some ten or eleven companies, and we ran the town on military principles for about one week. We had an officer of the day detailed to patrol the town at night, and we had the fire department under command, and everything in readiness if there would be any further trouble.
Q. What was the nature of your proclamation, was it calling for citizens to join?
A. The substance of my proclamation was, commanding the rioters to disperse, warning them of the penalties of the law, and summoning all good and law-abiding citizens to assist me in putting down the riot.
Q. As a posse?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you have any difficulty in raising a posse of citizens?
A. No, sir; I cannot say that I had any great difficulty.
Q. They joined cheerfully.
A. They responded to my call. I arrived here at seven o'clock on Monday evening, and on Tuesday evening I paraded in the streets about nine or ten hundred men, organized as a regiment. My proclamation in the morning—that was issued on Tuesday morning. I had it printed during the night, and I had it posted all around town by daylight almost, and one of my proclamations called for them to assemble at the court-house, at two o'clock in the afternoon, and I supposed there were six or eight hundred men at two o'clock that afternoon there organized into companies.
Q. In the evening, at the Lochiel hotel, what was the nature of that call? Was it commanding the citizens to join you as a posse, or was it a request?
A. It was more of the nature of a request. Of course, the feeling in town was a matter I suppose would have to be handled very delicately, and I got up on the railing at the Lochiel hotel and said, "Gentlemen, I am informed the rioters are breaking into the stores down on Market street. For the preservation of law and order, how many of you will go with me to suppress it?" and there were a number of voices responded, "We will all go with you."
Q. And then you led off and they followed?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. When you reached the crowd, how large a crowd did you find assembled?
A. Well, I could not estimate the numbers. The line was drawn at the foot of Market street by the railroad. There was a line of men across the railroad there—standing there. I remember one man who was in front had a gun in his hand. I went up to him and took the gun from him, and he gave me some impudence and I took him by the neck and tossed him into the crowd.
Q. Was his gun loaded?
A. Yes; it was loaded.
Q. Who was that man?
A. A man by the name of Davis. He is now here in our jail.
Q. Was he a railroad man?
A. No, sir.
Q. What class of people were these rioters composed of?
A. Well, we afterwards arrested a number of railroaders, though we arrested a number who were not railroaders, and they who were not railroaders, I must say, were the worst characters. The railroaders did not want the trains to run, that was about the extent that they wanted or demanded. The other party, of course, that broke in stores, behaved in a riotous manner.
Q. What did your posse—or what did you find it necessary to do to disperse the crowd?
A. I think our appearance commanded respect. I could hardly put it in any other way. I think they thought we meant business when we went down there, and I gave them to understand that in as plain a way as I could.
Q. Did you disperse them?
A. Yes; we did.
Q. Was it necessary to use any violence in doing that, any more than to make the arrests you have told us?
A. Well, we arrested other parties there. In other words, when we came down there I told them what we proposed to do. We cowed them, and the parties who replied and gave us impudence, we arrested them at once.
Q. Did you have any soldiers, any of the militia at your disposal during any of them?
A. No, sir; we did not call for the militia at all.
Q. Did not find it necessary?
A. Did not find it necessary.
Q. About how large was the crowd at that time? How many would it number in your opinion?
A. It is a hard matter to give you an estimate. The crowd broke and ran across the bridge, and parties who lived on the other side of the canal have estimated them from two to five hundred people. I judge there were two or three hundred people there anyhow.
Q. Did they re-assemble at any time after being dispersed that night?
A. No, sir. Right after we had dispersed them, we organized at once into companies and patrolled the whole town, and of course it was known that we would arrest any assemblies or any crowds at any place. On Tuesday evening there were a number of parties who were looked upon with a good deal of suspicion at the depot—at the railroad; but they made no demonstration, and dispersed on our approach.
Q. What was done with the parties that you arrested?
A. Tried and convicted at court.
Q. Do you know how many were tried and convicted?
A. No, sir; I could not tell you. We had forty under indictment, I believe. Some of them are in jail now.
Q. Were they tried by the county courts or police courts?
A. They were arrested and had a hearing before the mayor, and were tried by the county courts—committed by the mayor, and tried by the county court.
Q. Were any of the militia brought in at any time?
A. No, sir.
Q. Coming under your own knowledge.
A. No, sir; not under my own knowledge.
By Mr. Engelbert:
Q. I would like to ask you a question. I have understood that there was considerable grumbling and growling about the expense for that thing—how much was that?
A. The county paid in the neighborhood of $2,000. They paid me $1,965. We heard of a case in North street where a man had some two or three hundred guns in his house, and on Tuesday we took the guns from him, and he brought in a small bill and the items were made up. There were fifty men that were detailed as specials. They were on duty, in connection with the mayor's police, as policemen, and we paid those two dollars a night—or two dollars a day—and it amounted to something upwards of $1,200—between $1,200 and $1,300—and the balance of the expense was for providing rations for our men at night. We were organized as a regiment, and we had regiment and company quartermasters, and we were provided with rations at night. They had quarters and all that kind of thing. That caused the expense, which was paid by the county commissioners.
Q. Not charged to the State?
A. No, sir; charged to the county. As it was all done under my orders, the county was liable for the expense—that part of it. The mayor had charge of these fifty men, to a great extent, that acted with his policemen—the mayor's policemen acted with me from the very start.
By Mr. Engelbert:
Q. Both acted in conjunction harmoniously?
A. Yes; the mayor and his police were the first to tender their services.
Q. Not afraid of one superseding the other?
A. We had no trouble at all. We procured fifty revolvers from the State for the use of those fifty men we had. The other men armed themselves.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Armed with muskets, and rifles, and shot guns?
A. No, sir; I wanted them only to have clubs, but nearly every one of them had pistols.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. I understood you to say the mayor and police tendered their services to you?
A. As soon as I arrived in town, it was supposed by the people that the sheriff would take charge of it. The mayor came to me, and tendered the services of himself and the policemen, and the policemen and the mayor were in front in anything done where the danger was supposed to be.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Held the post of honor?
A. Yes, sir. We used the policemen as skirmishers—you understand that.
By Mr. Engelbert:
Q. Of course, that expense has been paid by the county, and considered finally settled?
A. Yes; the expense consisting of pay for these fifty men, and there were some twenty—to distinguish them from them the rioters, we had badges printed and labeled, and all that kind of thing—did not think it necessary to get uniforms—and that cost something. The members of the posse got no pay at all.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. In your official duties, did you inquire into the causes and origin of the riots, to ascertain what were the causes and grievances complained of?
A. The principal one was they did not receive enough to pay for the labor.
Q. These railroad men?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What did the others complain of?
A. The others talked about being in want, and sympathizing with them on general appearance. I heard "bread or blood" in quite a number of places.
Q. Were the mill men and furnace men and the employés of the manufactories in and about the cities engaged in this riot as a general thing?
A. No, sir; I would say no. Not the men that worked. The fact of the matter was, my idea was, that the parties who were most active and violent were those who did not work at any time.
By Mr. Reyburn:
Q. Never worked?
A. No, sir.
Q. Did they belong to the city, mostly?
A. Oh a good many of them did; yes, sir. It brought our worst characters to the surface, of course.
By Mr. Engelbert:
Q. When you found a man who was boisterous, and rather of an ugly disposition, you did not wait until the next day to arrest him?
A. We went for him at once.
Q. Right then and there?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you not propose to do it in a quiet way?
A. We did not want to bark up a fight in any way. Of course, our whole course was to suppress disorder; but when a man was violent, we would not hesitate, and we did not run around with a chip on our shoulders, and ask some one to knock it off, or anything of that kind.
Q. The posse had pluck enough to arrest them at once?
A. We arrested them after we went to work—after we got the posse organized—wherever they could be found. The mayor's police made the largest number of arrests.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Did you have any conversation with the railroad men to ascertain what their grievances were?
A. No, sir; not to any extent.
Q. Did you, with any of the parties that you arrested?
A. Oh, I talked with them after they were in jail; yes, sir.
Q. Did you find out from the railroad strikers, or from any reliable source, whether there was any pre-arranged plan for a strike or not among the railroad men?
A. From what they told me, they would give me that impression—that there was a pre-arranged plan for a strike. They complained. My understanding of what they told me was that they had been got into this thing by the engineers, and then the engineers had stood back and let them stand the trouble. Their words were, "Stand the racket."
Q. What day did they first strike here in Harrisburg?
A. That I cannot tell. I was not here.
Q. Was there any organization here known as the Trainmen's Union?
A. I understand that they have an organization here—Locomotive Engineers' and Trainmen's Union.
Q. Did you learn it from any of the men themselves?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you learn the objects of the Trainmen's Union?
A. Well, all objects—the idea that they gave me was, it was for beneficial and mutual protection. The parties that were arrested—the larger part of them that were arrested by the mayor's police, they blamed it more on the locomotive engineers than any other society. That they had got them to strike, and showed their hand, and got them into trouble, and they had stood back and done nothing. We often find, when persons are in trouble and they are in jail, they always have some other parties to blame it on.
Q. Did they say to you what they proposed to do?
A. No, sir; other than they wanted their wages increased. They did not speak of the organization as one of the objects being for the purpose of getting up strikes. They said it was more as a beneficial and mutual protection society; but I inferred from what they said that they regarded the society would act together in a strike.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. Was it a complaint they made of the reduction of the wages—that the wages had been reduced?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did you learn when that reduction had taken place?
A. I did not.
Q. Whether it was immediately preceding this strike or not?
A. That I do not know, sir.
Q. Did not learn from them how long their complaint had been standing—how long it had been running—whether recent?
A. No, sir; they did not go into the particulars at all in their complaint. It was on general principles about the workingmen being oppressed, and the road oppressing them.
Q. The rich oppressing the poor?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Did these men that you talked with claim the right to interfere with other men who were willing to work; did you have any talk with them on that subject?
A. Well, I cannot say that I could answer that direct. They said, in substance, that those men who did not assist them, that were working men, that did not go into the strike with them, were blacklegs, and all that kind of thing; appeared to have a good deal of feeling against those that wanted to work, and did not go in with them to the strike.
Q. Complaining against those who would not join them?
A. Yes, sir.
Thomas Reckord, sworn:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Where do you reside?
A. I resided, at that time, at the bridge—the toll bridge.
Q. In July last.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was your business then?
A. Toll-gate keeper.
Q. At what bridge?
A. Harrisburg bridge—toll bridge.
Q. The bridge across the Susquehanna?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. On Monday, the 23d day of July, state whether there was any crowd coming there to cross the bridge from the city?
A. Yes; I was sitting in the office, reading a paper. All at once I heard a great noise, and I looked out the window of the house, and I saw a large crowd coming up, I suppose two or three hundred.
Q. What time of the day was it?
A. I can hardly tell you what time of the day it was. I think it was towards noon, or some place about that time.
Q. Go on and tell us all the facts about?
A. Well. I jumped off my seat and ran out of the door. I saw they were making for the bridge. I run and shut the gate. There was a great part of them got over before I got that accomplished. I shut the gates and kept a great many this side. Those that got in passed over the bridge while I was there. There was another crowd came and insisted upon going over, and I wouldn't unlock the gates. They told me they would break the gates. Very well, said I, you can do so. There was one man—a young man—he was half grown—a great part of them were young men—he went and took hold of the picket-gate to break it open. I caught him by the collar of the neck and threw him back. I said I would throw him in the river if he didn't stop. He wanted to know what I had to do about it. I told him I would show him. I kept him at bay there for a long time. Finally there was a man came there—I cannot recollect his name now—and told me the mayor had sent him up there to tell me to open the gate. I used the remark that the mayor had nothing to do with that—I wouldn't open the gate—this was individual property, and it had nothing to do with the matter at all. I wouldn't open the gates. Some of them jumped over—some of them jumped over the gates, and finally this man insisted that the mayor had sent him. I wouldn't believe him at first. Finally he said it was so, and there was two or three men stood at the gate there and begged me to leave them over. Says I, if I open the gates they will crowd in. They said they wanted to go over, and would help me to shut the gates. These men were standing there waiting to get over, and they promised to help. I unlocked the gate, and after I unlocked it these men came in and tried to help me shut it, but the crowd pressed so hard, by the time I got the latch in they sprung the gate and threw it off its hinges—it is just set on hinges—and the gate fell over, then they all rushed in. I had no more command over them at all. They all rushed right through.
Q. How large a crowd went through?
A. I suppose there was a couple of hundred went over. I may say so by the looks of them.
Q. Did they say what they were going for?
A. Yes; some of them.
Q. What did they give as their object?
A. Their object was to go over there for some soldiers—over there to bring them over in safety. These soldiers over at Fairview—they wanted to come over, and they sent a man over to get some one to protect them.
Q. Did you see the man the soldiers sent over?
A. No; I didn't. He might have paid his toll, and went over.
Q. Do you know of your own knowledge that they sent a man over?
A. No, sir: I don't.
Q. You only get that from the crowd?
A. Hearsay.
Q. Did they come back?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. State the facts?
A. When they came back they had soldiers in the center, they flanked all around, and came in a kind of square across the bridge.
Q. How many soldiers were there?
A. There might have been twenty or thirty. I really don't recollect. I knew at the time. It has passed my memory. Something near that. They were in the center of these—fetched them over with music.
Q. What kind of music did they have?
A. Drum and fife, I think it was.
Q. How large a crowd was surrounding the soldiers?
A. There was not so many surrounding them as they came over. There was a kind of square formed, and the balance was running loose around.
Q. What class of men?
A. Most of them were half grown boys and negroes.
Q. Who carried the arms?
A. Some few boys carried some of the soldier's arms, and the rest the soldiers carried themselves.
Q. Did you try to prevent them going through the gates when they came back?
A. Oh! no.
Q. You allowed them to pass?
A. Yes, sir.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. No one seemed to be commanding this crowd or to lead the mob—no one seemed to be leading the mob or controlling it?
A. No one, individually. There was some men there that used very hard expressions toward me, sitting on the bench, and they threatened to mash my head, and everything else.
Q. Was there any one giving commands to the mob?
A. No; I didn't see any individual giving commands. They all seemed to take part in it—no one individual that I took notice.
Q. No one directed their movements?
A. No; they came up in a crowd.
Q. Did there seem to be any officers among the soldiers?
A. That is more than I can answer.
Q. You didn't see any one that from their uniform or any other emblem seemed to be officers?
A. Not that I can recollect. I don't know as there was any officers among them. I cannot recollect whether there was or not.
Q. The soldiers and the crowd were on good terms?
A. They came very quietly through, there was nothing——
Q. Did the soldiers act as if they were prisoners of war?
A. They walked very quietly surrounded by these men—went up Market street.
Q. There didn't seem to be any coercion there?
A. No, sir.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. How long was the crowd gone before they returned with the soldiers?
A. It might have been a couple of hours—fully that, I guess. There was a crowd continued there until they came back. I had to keep the gates locked all the time—the crowd was still remaining there waiting for them to come back.
Attorney General Lear, sworn:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. You may state what facts came under your own observation in relation to the railroad riots of last July?
A. The first knowledge I had of them was on the morning of Friday, which was the 20th, I guess. I received two dispatches, brought by the same boy at the same time, one from Governor Latta and the other from Adjutant General Latta in relation to these matters. The Governor told me that he had been applied to by the sheriff of Allegheny county to assist in suppressing the riot, but he thought he had no authority, and had so answered the application. I telegraphed to him I thought he was right, there was no vacancy in the office of Governor; and the Adjutant General's dispatch was from West Philadelphia, that he was then on his way in pursuance of the clause stating that he had general authority from the Governor before he went away, &c.—I cannot tell the language of the dispatch at all. I telegraphed to him that I thought he ought to go—sent two dispatches, one to Philadelphia and Harrisburg. I believed from his dispatch that he had gone to Harrisburg. Then I was at home in Doylestown, at that time. On Monday or Sunday I got knowledge of the thing being serious. I concluded I ought to be nearer to it so that if there was anything for me to do I could do it; and I started to Philadelphia, and I got there and found a messenger at the hotel waiting to take me to West Philadelphia—with a carriage—to see Colonel Scott, who had a dispatch from the Governor, asking him to send me to meet him at the nearest point I could reach him in Pennsylvania. Colonel Scott suggested that the best place would probably be at Beaver, where Quay was. That was on Monday, the 23d, at twelve o'clock, and at half past six, the first train that went, I started to go to Beaver. I went through Harrisburg on the evening the sheriff has testified to, the 23d, and on out to Pittsburgh. All that occurred there was that I met the Governor. He came to Pittsburgh instead of stopping at Beaver. I got a dispatch that he was going on through, and I saw several committees of citizens at Pittsburgh during the day, and asked for the Governor to remain. A committee of printers and newspaper men, and a committee of bankers, who said they were in the hands then of people that might go any time into their banks and compel them to open their vaults, and a committee, of business men, men who had large numbers of hands employed, wanted me to impress upon the Governor the importance of recommending a compromise, which I didn't feel much inclined to recommend. The Governor came there that evening at seven o'clock, without having determined whether he would remain or not. I went to the train to go with him east, but he concluded—there was a committee of people there to wait upon him—and he did remain. That was seven o'clock, Tuesday evening. He remained until three o'clock the next morning. We didn't go to bed. We remained at the Monongahela house and prepared, and Mr. Quay and the Governor supervised, the proclamation that was issued from the room there, and met committees of citizens, &c., and remained up until three o'clock or half past two, and we started down to Allegheny depot. We had to go from there at that time. We found several acres of people around there in the way. They didn't disturb us. Stopped us going across the bridge to see what we were and who we were, but went on notwithstanding. We came east, and at Altoona, when we took breakfast, there were, I suppose, a thousand people around there. A crowd of that sort of people that generally constitute a riot and a mob.
Q. Demonstration at Altoona?
A. No. We had to crowd our way through to get our breakfast—the Governor, Colonel Quay, and myself. Doctor Reed was along. We got in and got our breakfast, but we had some difficulty to get there, because there was a crowd there, but they didn't disturb us. The Governor, when they came in, somebody said something to him, and he made some remarks on the platform, and they gave the Governor three cheers—after breakfast. Then we returned to Philadelphia, and made arrangements which took the Governor back. We got to Philadelphia on Wednesday, and on Thursday he returned west, and went to Pittsburgh, when he had got his military properly organized—and Mr. Quay and myself remained there, and some others of the Governor's staff, and communicated with parties in connection with the business, and to see about organizing some others—I was not concerned in that—organizing an additional military organization for the purpose of going out to the scene of the difficulty; but we remained there until Saturday morning. I received a dispatch from the Governor asking me to go and join him at Pittsburgh. I don't think he stated what he wanted me for. Yes, he did. He stated he wanted to see about what to do with certain prisoners that had been captured at Johnstown, by a regiment of regulars, under Colonel Hamilton; and I went out that afternoon, and I reached Pittsburgh about twelve o'clock at night. We went over—the first train, probably, that went in over the route that had been torn up in different places—where the old depot was, and had it torn out, that Colonel Hamilton's train, or the train his soldiers were on, was thrown off the track by the turning of the switch at Johnstown, about seven o'clock in the evening, and that he was very much injured himself—I think he had a rib or two broken—he could hardly sit down; but his men got out immediately and formed, and they picked up everybody that came about there, from that on until Monday—found some of them after daylight—were picked up and put into a car and taken to Pittsburgh, and put in the arsenal, and they had fifty-five of them there.
Q. As prisoners?
A. Prisoners, and the object of my being sent for was to see what to do with them. On Sunday I went out there, and was met by Daniel J. Worrall and the chief of police of Johnstown. He was brought along to see whether he could identify any of the dangerous or turbulent class of people of Johnstown, and I went into examination—all I could do was with the aid of eight of these policemen and Mr. Worrall, and I examined each one on oath—sixty of them, at least. The other fifteen of them were retained, because they were a little more suspicious characters, and it turned out, according to any kind of evidence that we could get—and I guess it was the fact—that they had been idlers that heard of this train being wrecked. Some of them were very innocent people, who had come there to see if they could render assistance. Some had come as idle spectators, and there was not the slightest evidence from any source that any of them had been guilty of having turned the switch, or were participants in the stoning of the train. The train had been stoned just before they got there, but none of those people were arrested until some little time afterwards, and as I concluded from the evidence I heard there, it seems most probable that the operators of the act wouldn't hardly be about looking on, just after a thing of that kind occurred, and they got out of the way. And these people, while they might have sympathized, there was nothing at all to show that they had any guilty connection with the turning of the switch. On Monday, I waited again to see about some others—we had got reports from Johnstown, saying that they were satisfied—parties who told to me that they were satisfied they were not concerned in it. Finally, from time to time they were all released, having no evidence against them whatever, and that was the principal part of my business there. It kept me there several days—maybe a week—on the train. That is all I know about that. Then there was a difficulty occurred at Scranton and I went up there, and the Governor telegraphed to me while I was there, and I went to see about what to do with some—there was an alderman up there had issued a warrant, in pursuance of the report of the coroner's inquest, I think, upon the bodies of some men who had been shot in the riot, and they had pronounced all the military, I believe, participants in what they called a murder, and I started in obedience to the dispatch the same day. I arrived there, but they had done just what I was going to recommend; they had delivered themselves up to the proper authorities, habeas corpus had been issued, and the judges of the court—I think Judge Harding had them to apply. It turned out that they were either indicted, or no bills found true against them, or something of that kind. There was other difficulties of that kind occurred while we were up there, and occasionally these same police alderman—Mahon, I think his name was, in the Sixth ward of Scranton—would issue out a warrant once in awhile against certain of the military, and they would simply go and give bail, and that was the end of it. That was all the connection I had with the riots—the actual knowledge I have about it. Something about these prisoners. We found some little difficulty in keeping them up there from getting into the hands—it was evident, as the people of Scranton said, that if the warrants of this alderman were executed, and the soldiers were taken over into that Sixth ward, that is made up—if any of you know the situation of Scranton, there is a ward that is made up of miner's houses across the stream—the Lackawanna, I think likely—and they threatened if any soldier was taken over there before this alderman he would never get back alive, and they were devising ways and means to prevent any difficulty of that kind. I remained there a few days, and came back to Philadelphia, and at St. George's hotel I got an honorable discharge from military service. That is all the duties I had, except attachments, &c., which were not connected with the riot.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. I wish to ask you a question: You were consulted by Governor before he left the State, as regards his absence for any length of time, whether it was policy for him to be absent and the policy pursued in his absence?
A. He spoke to me about it. There seemed to be, as I said to him, and as appeared to him, as good a prospect of peace in this State as ever there was, and he asked me what I thought about the propriety of his leaving upon a trip of that kind, and I told him I could not see any difficulty about it. That no doubt the State would go on harmoniously and all right, that it would not be a vacating of the office of the Governor. He didn't tell me anything about that I give more attention than I otherwise would during his absence, rendering any aid I could to the other authorities, to see to things. General Latta telegraphed to me that morning I speak of, the 20th, that he had a general authority to act in the Governor's absence, when the military were required, and simply telegraphed that there was trouble on the Pennsylvania railroad. He had acted, however, before that, because he had called out the troops. I recollect pretty nearly the second dispatch sent to me to Harrisburg. They were both sent within half an hour of each other. That if the civil authorities were insufficient to suppress disturbance, to maintain the peace and call out the troops, and to communicate to the Governor if he could, and if not, to suppress the riot promptly, and we would look for the authority afterwards. That is about what he had told him, and he acted upon the general authorities which the Governor had given him.
By Senator Reyburn:
Q. In your conversation with the Governor, was there anything about the probability of a strike on the Pennsylvania railroad?
A. No, sir; there was no apprehension of anything of that kind at the time at all, although it seemed to come pretty suddenly after that. There was nothing at all to indicate it—the Governor said nothing at all about that—he simply talked to me about his going out of the State to remain a length of time he would be gone. I forget now what it was, whether it would give any authority to have his office considered vacant or any ability or disability to act. I told him I thought not, that for the purpose of managing the State government, I thought it would be perfectly proper for him to go, that he was entitled to have that sort of recreation. Of course, none of us apprehended anything, except what might arise at any time, and he had taken the precaution, it seems, although I do not know that, to say to General Latta, that he should act for the purpose of sustaining the civil authority as they had done heretofore, or something of that kind, as I learned afterwards, but the Governor did not tell me that, so far as I remember now. I believe that was what the Governor did say.
Sheriff Jennings, recalled:
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. As you are a military man, I want to ask you a military question. Do you know anything about the movements of the military about Harrisburg and vicinity and county?
A. When I came here, I believe General Sigfried was in command, and all that I saw of the military I thought they would be first rate, and I felt confident they would be useful to me in case I should fail with the posse. He kept them in camp; there was no straggling, no drunkenness or anything of that kind, and the men acted and conducted themselves like soldiers.
Q. Good discipline?
A. Good discipline. I would say that the troops were under good command.
David Mumma, affirmed:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Do you reside in the city of Harrisburg?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What is your profession?
A. I am a practicing attorney.
Q. State, Mr. Mumma, what knowledge you had of the conduct of the militia during the riots of last July?
A. We had no militia—no organized militia in the city until during the riots, until after the dispersal of the rioters by the sheriff's posse. A few men, two or three in number, sometimes came here in a train, evidently in order to meet their companies, and came for that purpose without organization, not more than five at one time, and the men who seemed to get up all the difficulties about the cars, immediately disarmed them and took their arms from them, and then there was no further violence exhibited to them. There were five, I think, is the highest number I saw. They had no means of resistance, as there was no organization, that was, of the military we had in the city before that.
Q. Those were men that had gathered in obedience to the call of their officers?
A. Gathered to meet their companies, came from the upper end of the county, some few from Lebanon county. They came in the trains, and they were only in squads of two or three, sometimes one alone.
Q. Were they overpowered by the mob?
A. They did not resist any, so far as I saw. Their arms were demanded, and they gave them up.
Q. How many did you see surrender their arms?
A. There may have been twenty or twenty-five, altogether.
Q. At different times?
A. At different times.
Q. Several in small squads?
A. Yes; no more than five. I did not see more than five at one time. They came from the upper end of this county. They were coming here to report.
Q. Did they surrender, because they were in sympathy, or would it have been folly for them to have resisted?
A. It would have been folly to resist, if there was any determination on the part of the men who were in the crowd to enforce the demand. I may say here, that at this time there was not much exhibition of violence. The trains were running, that is the commencement of it. They stopped none but freight trains and local passenger trains; the other trains, more especially the mail trains, were permitted to run through, and there was no violence by anybody. Everybody seemed to stand and look on, and when a train arrived, the engine and tender would immediately be boarded by about four fifths boys, and some two or three men, and the coupling would be drawn, and they would take the engine to the round-house. Shifter was allowed to run, and they would move the cars away. I may say, just here, that on inquiry, many men who were connected with the railroad shops here, men that I knew, that always said they had orders that there was a general strike pending, and they were to stop any local or freight trains, and that other trains with the mails, were to go on, and that they had no disposition to give any trouble, and frequently I was appealed to, that we should use our influence to keep the military away; that if the troops were brought on there would be violence.
Q. What class of men undertook to influence you in that direction?
A. They were men who were employés of the railroad.
Q. Railroad?
A. Railroad and other places. Our other shops were not in the matter that I know of.
Q. What class of men demanded the guns from the gathering soldiers?
A. I know but one, and he was really the principal man who took charge of the guns. He is now in the penitentiary—was convicted at our court—a man by the name of Riggle, a loafer, who does not do anything and never did a day's work when he had it. I did not see any of our men connected with the railroad demand to take any guns from the soldiers at all.
Q. It was done by the lawless class?
A. Lawless class of men, mostly strangers. I did not know them, though I know a great many of our citizens, and there was a great many strangers here that we did not know at all. In the meantime, General Sigfried had got here, and some head was put to the military part of it, and I remember of speaking to several officers not to have the men brought in the town, for fear they might be overpowered. They were all taken to the arsenal. Everybody was anxious to have the arsenal taken care of. We were constantly assured by the better class of men that the arsenal would not be interfered with unless an attempt was made to put the military in. Hence, every citizen who had any influence tried to prevail on the military officers to get the men into the arsenal without bringing them into the city, and it was so arranged. Men coming in the Lebanon Valley train got off outside of the city and marched across. They came from above, got off at Rockville, and marched across, until they had sufficient men in the arsenal to defend it, and that, I have no doubt, was a very judicious method at that time, until there was a force here to stand up against the mob, if there was any trouble.
Q. Did you have any conversation with these soldiers, after they had surrendered their arms?
A. I believe I did speak to one or two of the men. There was some men, I just said before you came, Mr. Engelbert, that they came from your town to meet their companies, and they found themselves immediately surrounded by a mob, and they had no remedy, they had to give up their arms.
Q. What reasons did they give for surrendering?
A. They said they did not see how they could make any defense or hold their arms, because they were alone, and had not found their officers, and did not know what to do.
Q. Did you find any officers?
A. Military officers?
Q. Military officers in this section of the country—on the day——
A. I cannot give dates very well—but on the day when these men were brought over from across the river, I remember that, because when I came back I was informed of the fact that they had brought some men across the river. I was driving out to some property I have out here, and at the cemetery I met a couple of boys who said there was a whole lot of Light Horses, they called them, in the town of Progress. I left the boys and thought I had better go and see. I drove out and found a portion of the company of about thirty men, cavalry, without horses, and think they had infantry—they had muskets, but I think they had their cavalry equipments. These I saw at a tavern. Shall I say how they said they came there?
Q. Yes?
A. I spoke to them, and they told me they were taken up to Altoona. They were, as they called it, run into and cut off the road, and with a large number of infantry, and they were immediately surrounded there by the mob of about two thousand persons, hooted, yelled, and used violent expressions, and occasionally, I think, throwing stones in a small way. That they were then taken out of the cars, and, while standing there, the infantry surrendered their arms. Stacked their arms, as they called it. They were kept standing quite a long while in the hot sun, until very much exhausted, and finally they were again re-loaded in a train, brought to Rockville, six miles up the river here, and then they were advised or requested to get off the train, that it was not safe for them to come into Harrisburg on account of the mob, and that they started for a walk through the country, got some refreshments from the farmers, and crossed the country, and struck this little town of Progress, two miles or two and a half miles east. They said their purpose was to strike the railroad below Harrisburg, and inquired of me whether the steel works was a good place to strike. I told them it was not desirable to strike it, nor was it a very good place, for, while the men were still doing their duty, and there was no riot, they might be in sympathy with these men, and I would not advise them to come there. I remonstrated most seriously with them not to pursue that course; but to go back to the arsenal with me, where there was about six hundred militia and infantry, and there really was no danger of any body getting hurt in any way, and that they would be protected there, and it would be very unpleasant and unfortunate if they were to go back to Philadelphia, where I believe they were from. I was asked a question whether the infantry would fight. I told them I didn't know that; but from the way things were going, and from what they told me of the surrender of half a brigade at Altoona, I would not swear that they would; but I then went to the arsenal. The arsenal is about a mile from this little town. I drove back and found Colonel Gobin, of Lebanon, was in command. Sigfried was in command, and Gobin was in command on the ground, and I told him what I had done, and asked him to get into the wagon, while I rode out to get the men to come in. We went out and had another interview with the men, and they partially promised to come in; but I told them I would send them a lot of newspapers, and so forth—they had seen no papers, and didn't know what was going on, and to what extent. I came in to take my supper, and then bought a whole lot of newspapers, and started out to take the lower route instead of the upper one, and missed that—they had just started in. I then came into the arsenal, and left them to read my newspapers, and congratulated them.
Q. How many officers were among them?
A. I think the officers were pretty much all there. I would say they were pretty much all there—the officers of the company.
Q. Were the captains and lieutenants there?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Were they in uniform?
A. O, yes; they were all in uniform.
Q. Their uniforms—the buttons and straps were not cut off?
A. O, no; they were all in good trim. I was somewhat amused in finding them washing their feet in a trough, when I came out there, and, under the circumstances, I thought it was a little funny. It was not so much so after all. They told me the trouble they were in. I want to say just here, there was a good deal of fault found with men who didn't go through this town in a military way. I am not one of the persons who find fault with the military in that way, and a company of soldiers without any orders is a mob—is not very good shape—and I think it is better that they didn't happen to come in just at that time. They said, however, they had no commanding officer. Their general commanding was back; the first division of Philadelphia; and they had nobody to give them orders, and they didn't know what to do, or what right they would have to come at all—didn't want to come without some authority, and gave that as a reason why they didn't.
Q. Did they have arms?
A. They had their cavalry arms.
Q. Sabers and carbines?
A. Sabers and carbines—pistols.
Q. Did they have ammunition?
A. That I did not inquire into. They had their arms in the bar-room there. I did not inquire, but I presume they had ammunition.
Q. Did they tell you they had become separated from their command?
A. As I understood it, they didn't belong to the command that they were with when they got to Altoona. General Brinton was at Harrisburg, and they belonged to his division.
Q. They were going on their way to join him?
A. I suppose they were going on to Harrisburg; but at the time when all this was going on, there was no exhibition of violence in this city, simply because there was nobody interrupting or interfering with the men who were stopping trains on Saturday evening, I think. What I mean by that is, there was no violence beyond that of stopping trains—I think on Saturday evening—I think that was when the first train was stopped in the depot. Rodgers had been interrupted, and they were very tired, and there was a great number of laborers in the cars—immense number of people were in the depot, and many of them were ladies and citizens of the State, and quite an effort was made by a number of us citizens to get that train on. When these boys, as we would call them—most of them were boys—they jumped on the tender, and when the train undertook to move out, they drew the pin. I may say, on that occasion, that a number of men connected with the railroad shops here made an appeal to me and to other citizens to get this train on, that it was not the orders that the passenger trains were to be stopped. These were outside men, boys interfering with them. Had nothing to do with it. I remember that a gentleman in Harrisburg was named who makes speeches for them, and I was asked to go and see him. Mr. McCrea finally said it was not worth while—ten or twelve attempts were made—an attempt to pull the train out, and some few men were pulled off the bumpers, and I pulled a boy off and they said I would start a riot, and they finally stopped that train, and passengers got off that night sometime.
Q. I want to ask you a question or two about those soldiers you found out there at this little village. I understand that they said that their reasons for going back were, that they were not with their commander, General Brinton, and there were no division and no brigade, at Altoona, of infantry?
A. They did not give that as their reason for coming back—but, as a reason why they did not want to engage in any active service here, because they had nobody to take the command.
Q. What reasons did they give for turning back?
A. They said the infantry surrendered their arms.
Q. At Altoona?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What infantry did they refer to. It was not any of their command that surrendered?
A. No; as I understood—who commands the center district?
Q. General Beaver's command?
A. It was one of these middle divisions of the militia. It might not have been General Beaver's, but it was up there somewhere. They were simply, as I understood it, attached to the military train to carry them west, as I understood it, and then they were again ordered into a car and run back without any desire of their own, as I understand that.
Q. How far were they run back?
A. To Rockville, about six miles to Harrisburg.
Q. And then they left there?
A. They were asked to go out. If they came to Harrisburg they would be assaulted. There was another party made a much bigger circuit and came to Linglestown. There was a large number. I didn't see them myself.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Did you know anything about this party of soldiers that were captured across the river here?
A. At that time I was out here in the country. I only saw when I came back, that there was a number of people going out Market street, and then I heard that they had captured some soldiers, and marched them down Market street. I didn't learn anything about them.
Adjourned to meet at the call of the chairman.