A. There was no reason assigned. It had been arranged not to send that half regiment to the Union depot. I asked for General Pearson, and went to ascertain the cause of it, and the general said it was not necessary and directed me to remain there. At the request of General Brinton, he was going to bring the Philadelphia troops into the building, and a little after six o'clock they commenced to come in.

James Park, junior, being duly sworn, testified as follows:

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Will you please give us your residence and business?

A. My residence is Allegheny city. My business is manufacturer of steel and copper.

Q. I wish you to state now, in your own way, what knowledge you have of the riots that occurred in July last, and the efforts made to suppress them?

A. Some days previous to the Saturday when the riot was started, I was aware of the strike on the part of the employés of the Pennsylvania Railroad Company. On Saturday, the 21st of July, I believe it was, I was at the Pennsylvania railroad depot at the time of the arrival of the Pennsylvania regiments——

By Senator Reyburn:

Q. Philadelphia regiments?

A. Philadelphia, I mean, sir. I was there when they disembarked, and during the time they were engaged in taking their lunch. I felt very greatly exercised in reference to the whole matter, fearing that, with the small force of military, in the event of anything that would precipitate firing upon the people, very disastrous consequences might follow. Seeing Mr. Cassatt on the back porch of the hotel building, I went up to him, and cautioned him with some earnestness. I told him that Saturday was an idle day with our workingmen, and I thought I knew the temper of our men pretty well. Sunday would be an idle day, and it would be great wisdom on his part not to attempt to do anything until the following Monday.

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. What hour was that?

A. It was about four o'clock, as near as I can recollect.

Q. Before the troops went out?

A. Before they marched out. I told him it was very natural for our home military to feel some sympathy, if it were ever so little, in behalf of those who were termed strikers, and that they ought not to expect to place full dependence upon their efficiency in case of anything like a riot. He referred to the Philadelphia regiment as being composed of men who would not fire over the heads of the mob in case of any mob being started, but I told him that in case of necessity for firing that he ought not to have less than ten thousand men, and that I doubted with that force whether he would be able, in case of firing upon the people, to quell the mob that might be precipitated upon us from the firing of the militia, but at all events not to do anything with less than five thousand men. He said in reply that they must have their property. That if the State authorities will not give them possession of it they will call upon the general Government. He took out his watch and said they had now lost an hour and a half's time, meaning that the military should have been marched from the hotel to the place where the great crowd was congregated an hour and a half before the time which I am speaking of. I left for Allegheny just after talking to Mr. Cassatt, and went to my home on a matter of business—to see my son—and came back, taking the car up Penn avenue, and leaving the car at Thirtieth street. Just as I left the car the volley of firing took place. There was an immense crowd of people on the side of the hill. From the number that fell, I supposed there were a very great many killed, but it turned out afterwards that two thirds who fell had fallen to roll into a ditch that was cut on the other side of the road running up the hill, to save themselves. I thought it strange that the firing took place upon the people on the hillside. I could not see, from where I stood, what was going on close to the military, but it struck me, I recollect, at that time, as being very strange that the firing should be made about the line of the angle of the slope of the hill. I don't know that I can say anything more on that point. I went to my works, and I found great excitement all over that region of the city. I went to crowds of men, women, and children, warning them to go into their houses, for the reason that a little while before there was a good deal of commotion on Penn avenue, near Twenty-eighth street, and I thought giving evidence that some fighting was going on that might reach up into the neighborhood of these crowds of people, but I found that, with all my efforts, I did not accomplish anything, people still remained, and a great many run in that direction, just as people will. I cannot account for it, but no doubt gentlemen are well aware of the fact, just as I am, that people will do that thoughtlessly. My own son, who was just by my side the moment the firing took place, ran and got probably a hundred feet from me before I checked him. I told him he must not go in that direction at all. He came to his mind in a minute, and said he did not think what he was doing. I state this just to show how easy it is for a crowd of people to congregate where there is any excitement, particularly when the military are about. I went to my residence in Allegheny and heard nothing at all what was going on, supposing everything was quiet, and that there was no disturbance. Nor did I know that there was anything in the way of burning of property until Sunday morning. My partner, Mr. Charles L. Caldwell, came to my house and said he thought I better come to the city; that something ought to be done; that the Pennsylvania railroad property was being destroyed, and there ought to be some effort in the way of getting up organizations to arrest the work of the mob. He told me to go to the Chamber of Commerce; that James I. Bennett and others would meet me there. We repaired to the Chamber of Commerce and found the door closed, and we went to the printing office, and finally stopped at the office of the Pittsburgh Post, meeting Mr. Barr and Mr. Wakes, I think it was, and prepared for a meeting that we had bulletined to take place at twelve o'clock at the city hall, on Market street. That meeting was very well attended. A great many people on the way from church noticed the announcement on the bulletin boards, and repaired to the place of meeting. I felt very proud, on that occasion, of the people of Pittsburgh, and ever since that day, when away from home, I have registered from Pittsburgh, a thing I never did before. I always registered in Europe, and in this country, from Allegheny. Ever since that I have registered from Pittsburgh, and always will do so. I found wealthy men at that meeting, who pledged all that they were worth—not five thousand or ten thousand dollars—but all that they were worth, to put down the mob. John Moorhead, John Harper, John Slagle, and John R. McCuen signed a pledge that they would pay their proportion of all the necessary expenses to check that mob. A committee of twenty-five, I think, was appointed to meet at two or three o'clock at the mayor's office, city hall. This meeting I speak of was at the old city hall. That committee of twenty-five convened and appointed a committee to go to the mob and try to bring it to reason. There were no preparations to do it then, on the part of the citizens, but it was thought that the committee might appeal to them and stay the conflagration and destruction of property. That committee did go there, and went into the midst of the mob, and did appeal to them. I thought that they had about checked the matter, and that the Union depot would be saved, but the committee went from there to meet with some of the men who were on a strike. The committee met a number of them—I was present during all this time, and I know what the committee did, and do not state from hearsay—the committee met quite a number of the railroad men, who were there at that time—the strikers—and found them to express very great regret at the destruction of property. We proposed to them that they would attend an adjourned meeting, at the old city hall, to take place at three o'clock, or half past three o'clock, and proposed that they would organize and assist the citizens in saving the property. They talked very nicely about it, and one of their number—I think two of their number—attended that meeting. He was authorized to get up an organization of those men who were then termed strikers. I was a little too busy for some days to notice, but I believe they did make an effort in that direction. Then this committee of public safety went to work on Monday. I am speaking now of what took place on Sabbath afternoon. On Monday, Pittsburgh was certainly in a very deplorable condition. I noticed that the streets—some of them—particularly Fourth avenue and Third street, were crowded almost from curb to curb with strangers—not railroad men, because I think I should have recognized, from their appearance, the class of men that work in our work-shops from this crowd. They seemed to be composed of strangers, miners, and others from the neighboring parts here, up and down the river. Of course, the most of that crowd were idlers, men who would be ready to join in almost any destruction of property. They were not, I think, citizens—probably very few of them. Efforts were made by the committee of public safety to get organized. The mayor sent to Washington and got permission to take some of the Government arms. They were brought into the city, and General Negley and others were called in to assist, and, I think, the preparations that were made were done in a very short time, because on Tuesday the city seemed to be entirely quiet, and these crowds started for home. One very large crowd, that came down from the upper Monongahela river, were met by the mayor and General Negley, and many citizens that we organized, some with weapons and arms, and they agreed to go home, and said they had understood that men, women, and children were being shot down by the soldiers from a distance, and they came down to protect them, but they agreed to go home quietly. I believe I have told the story about as near as I can recollect—about all I know of it.

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Anything in relation to the Duquesne depot that you know of?

A. At the meeting on Sunday, we started organizations, and were very much pleased to find our young men, particularly, falling into line. I think it could not have been five minutes after the announcement was made, that we wanted all to organize a company to go to the Duquesne depot—fearing that it might be set on fire—I think it was not five minutes after that, that I noticed, I think a hundred, probably, marching right past where I stood. I was presiding at the meeting, and I believe they were led in the wrong direction—they were taken up Third street, I believe—some person took them up to the elevator. Another company that formed—I do not know how many—went down to the Duquesne depot to protect that.

Q. Was any attempt made to destroy the Duquesne depot?

A. I understand there was some arrests there. I was present at the mayor's office when a man was brought in there, and Doctor Dickson and some others testified that he was caught in the act.

By Senator Reyburn:

Q. Do you know anything about the events before the strike, the dispute between the railroad employés and the railroad company—the causes leading to these disturbances?

A. Nothing more than from general information, that it was because of reduction of wages, and that the men thought the reduction was more than they were willing to accept, and that it had eventuated in a strike. I understand from quite a number that they were not committing any violence. Mr. Shinn, vice president of the Allegheny Valley railroad, and Mr. McCargo, superintendent of the Allegheny Valley railroad, said to me just before the arrival of the Philadelphia regiment, that there was no effort made at all by the railroad strikers to prevent the running out of trains. I think I can recollect very nearly Mr. McCargo's words. Says he, "Mr. Park, you or I can get on a locomotive and run out any train, and nobody will disturb a hair of our heads." He then followed that up by saying the difficulty was to get anybody to go on to a locomotive.

Q. To man the train?

A. That understood the moving of a locomotive, and running a train out. After seeing Mr. Cassatt, after this interview with Mr. McCargo, I mentioned that to Mr. Cassatt, and he said their presence intimidated them, and he said they made no act of resistance; but their presence intimidated persons—that the strikers were on the ground or on the road, intimidating persons that would take out trains.

Q. Was any threats made by yourself and other citizens to prevent a collision between the military and the people? You related an interview with Mr. Cassatt. Was there any other threats made by citizens like yourself to prevent a collision?

A. I don't know of anything done in that way. I suppose persons would have felt that they were interfering. I felt a little in that way. When I was advising Mr. Cassatt, I felt that the State, or the railroad company, or one power, was directing that sheriff—somebody was directing the whole movement, and believed for me to give advice on that, probably it was a little premature, or at least Mr. Cassatt might have thought it was uncalled for, and I was greatly in fear that some stone might be thrown or pistol shot, and that the military might fire, and I felt sure the strength was not there if the mob was started—if a mob was precipitated upon the citizens of Pittsburgh, there was not military enough to put it down.

Q. Did you know that the trains had been stopped during Thursday and Friday?

A. Yes; I knew by general rumor, and was told by a great many that the Pennsylvania railroad were not able to operate.

Q. Why didn't you make a suggestion to the railroad officials sooner?

A. I never thought of doing it; but if I had thought of doing it, I would have thought that they might have told me to attend to my business, just as I would have done, if I had any difficulty at my works, and railroad men came to advise me—"you mind your own business, and I will attend to my strikers."

Q. In the suggestions that you made to Mr. Cassatt, did you suggest any plan to preserve the property and prevent its destruction from Saturday until Monday?

A. I said the better way would be to wait. I am not very clear in my recollection. I tried to fix it upon my memory, but it is a little misty just how I put that to Mr. Cassatt; but as near as I can recollect, it was like this—of course, in substance it would be the same—that Saturday was an idle day, and Sunday would be an idle day, and to-night these people would be in their beds and with the force he had—he said, I think, eight hundred men would be expected in momentarily—I said, as near as I can recollect, that to-night these people will be in their beds, and with the force you will have, take possession of your grounds, but don't attempt to move any train until Monday. I recollect very clearly impressing that upon him, not to move a train until Monday. I knew on Monday all the mills would be running and the men would be at their places, and if there was any little disturbance in the moving of trains, the civil authorities could manage it, even if the military didn't take any part in it.

By Senator Reyburn:

Q. From your knowledge of the kind of people, did you regard it as necessary to call the military to suppress them?

A. No, sir; I didn't. I think it was a mistake, a very serious mistake. I knew that the day police of Pittsburgh had been discharged—that is, most of them, and that the mayor was left with a very small force, but I knew at the same time, that the class of men that was engaged by the railroad companies—they are a pretty intelligent set of men—they can be reasoned with, and if arrangements had been made to have had their ground protected by police, not allowing any one to come up Twenty-sixth or Twenty-eighth streets—done that at night, I don't think there would have been any trouble. I don't think any of those men that were termed strikers—I think they would have hardly violated the law in knocking down police, if the police had said the orders were that nobody was to come. I forgot to say that very soon after the firing, after I had warned these little crowds on Penn street to go into their houses, I went over to my mill—the mills generally stopped about half past three o'clock, sometimes as late as four o'clock, and I found that some of our men had been a good deal excited—one man had rushed into the office, and wanted to know from our time-keeper if his gun was at home. He told him he must not have his gun, must not attempt to go for it, because if he did he would alarm his wife, who was then sick, but he went for, and brought his gun back, and handed it to our time-keeper, and went out in the mill for something, and the time-keeper gave it to our manager, and he took it back in our office, and broke the stock of it, then our time-keeper bet five dollars with this man that he had not a gun, and the gun was brought in, and it was broke up, and this man rejoiced over it, and said he had been making a fool of himself, he was very glad he had come to his senses, and he didn't take time to reason, nor did, I think, any of these men. Their general life and their education and training has been more or less different from yours or mine. If your son had been in that crowd or your brother, and you had heard he was shot, you would have just done as I would have done, sat down and reasoned whether he had any business to be there, and you would not have run in and shot down Philadelphia soldiers, or any other soldiers. They just heard somebody was killed, and they rushed for arms, all being done on the impulse of the moment, and done in a way that you or I would not have done, because if my son had been there and shot, I would have lamented it terribly, but I would not have gone there with a pistol or gun. I would have reasoned, undoubtedly, as you would have done, that he had no business to be there, or ought to have been home. These men didn't reason in that way.

By Senator Yutzy:

Q. Have you not had quite a number of strikes among the employés in the mills or factories in this vicinity, during the last five or six years?

A. I can call to mind quite a number of them.

Q. You are a manufacturer?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Employ a large number of men, do you not, sir?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Have you ever had any strikes in your works?

A. Yes, a number.

Q. Did the strikers attempt to prevent other men from working, that you employed?

A. Not by force. I never knew of any attempt by force. They did it by persuasion. I have twenty odd men out now. My rule is never to take any man into my employ that has ever struck on me. I will keep them from starving, with money, but not with work. I don't think there is any occasion for a strike. We require notice, and we give notice, and let every man know that if he ever strikes, he never can work for us as long as God spares me on this earth. I will lend him money, or do anything for him, but he will never work for me.

Q. In the different strikes, in your works, was there ever any violence used by the strikers, to prevent men from working, you put in there?

A. I don't recollect of any cases.

Q. Did you ever have any difficulty in getting strikers quiet—dispersed from your works?

A. No, sir; they were always very quiet, and when told to leave—sometimes they were not inclined to go out, and they called to me and I requested them to go, spoke to them mildly about it, and told them that my rules were to be carried out. I did once have to bring in a policeman, but the man was very drunk and did not know what he was doing. I am satisfied that if he had been sober, he would have left the building without calling in a policeman.

Q. You have had strikes in the city where there have been a larger number engaged than in this?

A. Oh, yes; we have had strikes where the aggregate number would have amounted to many more than those engaged at the Pennsylvania Railroad Company's works. We have had ten strikes here.

Q. Was there any violence resulting from them at all?

A. No; I don't recollect only in the case of a strike on the part of the puddlers, probably about twenty-five years or so ago. There was some little trouble at Bailey's mill. They brought on some eastern puddlers, and when they attempted to start the furnaces—it was principally women, the wives of some of the men—they struck them with stones a little, and had some few knock-downs, but they soon quieted.

Q. Have you had any difficulties lately—any violence, that is the last few years?

A. No, sir; none at all.

Q. Have you not had a strike among your puddlers, within the last few years?

A. Yes; about two years and a half or three years ago, and I couldn't employ them again just for the reason that my rules were, that any man that strikes can never work for me again, and I thought, of course, as there were so many idle puddlers at that time, that I would have no trouble in starting up my puddling forge. A puddler came around and says, "I can get men and can start you puddling." Says I, "I would like very much to start." Says he, "I can get up a gang by Monday." Says he, "Did you have any trouble?" Says I, "Yes; they struck." Well, they wouldn't work. That lasted for three or four months, and I concluded that some determination had been agreed upon, that these men that struck, must work for me, and I determined they never would—I determined before we started up. I would lend them money at any time, but they might starve, or their families starve, for want of work. I dedicated that forge to negro labor. My men was a little disposed to interfere by violence with the men who engaged themselves to carry on that work, but I have never known any serious interference with my negro workmen at all. We have had peace and quiet, so far as I can learn, and white puddlers have never molested them at all, and we have had them two or three years.

Q. Still working?

A. Yes; we pay them the same price as white men, because I told them when they came that we would pay them just the same price as white puddlers got in other mills, and we have had to do so.

By Mr. Dewees:

Q. Have you an idea how many employés are employed in the different mills in the cities of Allegheny and Pittsburgh?

A. I guess twenty or twenty-five thousand, probably; that is merely a guess. I would have to think over the number of mills. I suppose something like twenty thousand, and probably more.

By Senator Yutzy:

Q. You are speaking about a strike about twenty or twenty-five years ago. Have you any recollection of the military being called out at that time?

A. I don't recollect of them being called out—they might have been.

Q. At any other time within the last twenty-five years, were the military called out to preserve the peace?

A. I think one time I recollect of them being called out—I think it was at the time of starting the negro puddlers at the bolt company's works. I think then the military was called on; that is about two or three years ago.

Q. Was there any serious opposition to those new men working there?

A. There was some quarreling and knocking down. I think there was nothing very serious.

Q. As a general thing, in strikes among your men here in the mills or manufactories, you think it is bad policy to call out the military to suppress any trouble that might arise from them?

A. Yes; I do so. I think so for the reason that the military would do very well, if they could overawe, but the fear is that somebody would throw a stone, or somebody would fire a pistol, and then they would fire into the citizens. You understand as well as I do, that you put up proclamations and warn people to disperse, and you can go in and talk and plead with them, and still the crowd will be there, and it is almost certain that innocent people will be shot down, if there is any firing.

Q. In your testimony, you state you saw Mr. Cassatt in the rear porch of the Union depot, and advised him not to attempt to move trains on Saturday, as the men in your mills and manufactories were idle on that day—not to attempt to move trains until Monday—what reply did you get from him to that advice?

A. He said they must have possession of their property. If the State authorities did not give it to them, they would call on the general Government, taking his watch out, and said that they had now lost an hour and a half. That is about as near as I can recollect. The idea was they had lost an hour and a half in moving the Philadelphia regiment up to Twenty-eighth street—up to where the crowd was congregated over their property; that is, the railroad men as a general thing, on their property. I think the citizens were, as a general thing, on the hillside, as near as I can understand it—the most of the citizens, spectators, &c., were up on the hillside—some of them were up as high as the pest-house, on the hill. One young lad was shot there through the wrist—he was in a line with the pest-house.

Q. Were you a member of the citizens' committee waiting on Mr. Cassatt at that time?

A. No, sir. We had no citizens' committee at that time.

Q. Were you a member of the committee that waited on the Governor and the officials of the railroad company, at any time after that, to give him some advice?

A. Yes.

Q. State that?

A. I have forgotten the day. I don't recollect the day he arrived, but I think it was—I don't recollect the day he did arrive—it was some time in the week after the riot.

Q. The latter part of the week?

A. Probably it was; by the way, it was Saturday. I recollect very distinctly, because I spoke of Sunday just about as I did to Mr. Cassatt. Joseph F. Dilworth, Mr. Johnson, and myself were appointed a committee to visit the Governor. We got word to meet him Saturday morning at Thirty-third street, in a car, and we went up there and met him. I believe I did the first talking, and advised that nothing should be done until Monday to take possession of the ground. He said he was going to do nothing in a hurry—was going to take his time, and move with caution.

Q. Was this the conference with the Governor?

A. With the Governor himself. He said he was not out here in the interest of any railroad, but in the interest of peace, or something to that effect. He left me to understand that he didn't come to look after the Pennsylvania Railroad Company, but to look after the safety of this community. He had an impression that our water-works were stopped, and he did just as he said he would do. He waited quietly and did not do anything at all until Saturday night, until everybody was in bed. He put out pickets along Penn avenue, and up and down the streets, to keep everybody from going on the railroad property, and then commenced to work, and tore up the track and relay. That could have been done before the Governor came.

Q. Could the trains have been run.

A. I think so. I don't think there would have been any disturbance at all. If they had the trains there, they could have taken them out without any disturbance.

Q. In your opinion, from what you know, would there have been any disturbance, if they had attempted to move trains on Saturday or Sunday, when the Governor was here, at the time you had this conference with the Governor?

A. I think there would have been no disturbance—I am satisfied that the men who were designated as railroad strikers, regretted, probably as much as any other set of men, the destruction of the railroad property, and probably they would have been about as ready as any other men to have interfered with any outside people annoying the Pennsylvania Railroad Company in its moving trains. They might not have gone on to the locomotives and moved them themselves, but if any persons could have been procured to take out the trains, I don't think that the railroad strikers would have interfered.

Q. Would the crowd of people have interfered on that Saturday?

A. I don't think they would have interfered on that Saturday—that was about a week after the riot.

Q. Did I understand you to say you appealed to the Governor not to attempt to move trains on that Saturday?

A. Yes, I did.

Q. Did you think at that time there might be trouble?

A. I think so. I thought it was wise to take time, and do nothing until Monday.

J. Guy McCandles, sworn:

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. State whether you were present at the firing of the militia, on Saturday afternoon?

A. I was.

Q. Go on and state what you saw, and what occurred.

A. I was there the whole of Saturday. Went up Saturday morning, and was there during the day, and was there at the time of the firing, and when the Philadelphia troops came up, and whenever the troops came up, the crowd increased in front of them on Twenty-eighth street, until it was very dense, and there was a company deployed across the street to push them back. They marched up in front, with arms port, and marched up against the crowd, in order to push them back, but it was too dense, they could not do it. They retreated back a step or two, and charged bayonet. I was up on the hill, about two or three rods up on the hill, so that I could not hear any orders given of anything of that kind—I could only see their movements. I could see all their movements well. They attempted to charge bayonets, walked up slowly, got nearer and closer every moment, until the bayonets began to infringe on the crowd. Then one of the crowd got hold of a bayonet, and tried to pull the musket from the soldier. He jerked it from him, and he then gave him a sort of a push, and knocked him, I do not know which. Right immediately back of them, I saw a man draw out a pistol, and shoot right into the crowd. At the same time, there was two or three other pistol shots heard at different points. Almost simultaneously, we had a scattering fire from the soldiery, directed mostly right up on the hill towards where our troops were lying.

Q. Hid you hear any order to fire given?

A. I did not.

Q. How close were you?

A. About three rods off, at least. I could not have heard an order to fire. There was a good deal of noise and confusion.

Q. How many were wounded in the conflict?

A. I really don't know. I saw about fifteen or sixteen that were wounded, around on the hill where we were standing. I saw about that many there. There was one of the soldiers that was killed, shot through the head, twenty or thirty feet off, and when I went to him he was dead—a soldier of the Nineteenth regiment. I thought it was one of our own men. He was dead when we reached him. It was not one of our men, but the Nineteenth regiment, that was lying on our right and front. There was a very heavy volley of stones thrown into the soldiers previous to the fire.

Q. You were surgeon of the Fourteenth?

A. I was surgeon of the Fourteenth regiment.

Q. It was commanded by ——

A. Colonel Gray.

By Senator Yutzy:

Q. Do you know whether this soldier was killed by a shot fired from the mob or not?

A. It was not a pistol shot, I know that from the character of the wound.

By Senator Reyburn:

Q. He was not one of the soldiers who put the mob back?

A. No, sir; he was one of the soldiers on the hill. They were facing towards the hill, and there was a great many of the mob that were there on the side of the hill, between the other soldiers, before us and Twenty-eighth street—a dense mass of them there.

Q. Was he standing in his command?

A. He was away from his command. He was not exactly in the crowd—the crowd was below him.

Q. He was not with his command?

A. Was not standing in rank at the time.

Q. How far away from his command?

A. About a rod from where the command was at the time. There was one or two companies on the hill in the same line with the others, and then two or more—three rods down, in front, near the hospital grounds. Had he been down with his command he would not have been shot—the shooting was higher.

Q. Was he back of his command?

A. As I say, his command was, at the time—some of the companies were—down near the railroad tracks, and there was a couple of companies up to the right of our regiment, three rods back of them on the hill, and it was between two—he was just between the two.

Q. Was he immediately behind any particular company, close——

A. He was some little distance to the right.

Q. Was he a non-commissioned officer, do you know?

A. No, sir; he was a private.

Doctor John S. Dixon, sworn:

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Where do you reside?

A. 273 Penn avenue.

Q. Practicing physician?

A. Yes, sir; for ten years, in the city of Pittsburgh.

Q. State what knowledge you have of the riot, and what was done to suppress it?

A. The first part I took in any suppressing the riot—on Sunday I stayed at home, thought I might be needed, and that that was the best place for me. When it got so bad, and the Union depot had been fired, I thought it was my duty to go to the side of the hill to see what I could do there, and somebody proposed, or said, that as the grain elevator had already been set afire, that the next would be the Duquesne depot, and Mr. Bissell and myself and some others—quite a number started. I think he and I were the only ones of our party that got there. We went down to the Duquesne depot, and met a few persons there we knew and a great many we did not know. I do not know who was in sympathy with us or not. After being there some time, and trying to devise means of preventing the depot from being fired, if an attempt was made, we talked of getting a cable, and shutting off the leading avenues to the depot. There was a man rode up in a buggy and stated there was an attempt to fire the lower end of the depot. We were then at the upper end. We walked down, and there was a party examining a car. I went up and looked into the car, and there was some smoke and embers there, which somebody had scattered before I got there, to prevent it from catching fire. There was a barrel of oil rolled under the car—I do not know for what purpose it was, I suppose to set fire to it, and there was one man in particular by the name of David Carney or Carter. He was arrested afterwards; he was ringleader. I talked to him, and tried to persuade him not to do anything of the kind. He said he had been up all day at the fire above, and that he was one of the advance to set fire to the Duquesne depot. I asked him where he was from. He told me he was first an engineer on the Oil City railroad, and then he said he was from Ohio, then he told me he was from Greene county. He was so drunk and so excited and wild, with the burning, that he didn't know what he was talking about. He was bound to do mischief, and we talked to him one after the other, trying to persuade him, while one was holding him in control, and the party, the rest of the gentlemen, were interested in protecting the depot. They talked to a crowd, trying to persuade the people that lived there, if the Duquesne depot was fired, the whole lower part of the town would be burned, that the fire department were trying to save property on Wilder street on the hill, and that there would be several squares of valuable property destroyed if this depot was set on fire, as it is a mere shell, an old frame building, and very large. This man who was a ringleader of them, he said he didn't care a damn; he said that the property holders would have to pay for it, and the rich would have to pay for it, and he was a friend of the workingman. I told him if he would burn this property the working people, so many of them, would be burned out of house and home. He said there would be good come of it, at any rate, and that he was bound to burn that, and that they would burn the Connellsville depot, and that they would burn the bridges, and then they didn't care a damn what became of the rest of the town. I told him he had better not do that, that it was a very bad thing to do. Mr. Bissell told him, to try and keep him under control, that he had sent for policemen. The policemen came and I made information against him, and as soon as a couple of policemen nabbed him he wilted right away. He was very willing to be marched off to the lock-up. In his testimony at court, he said that he had arrived in the city Saturday afternoon, at two o'clock, from the oil regions, that he had been working that summer on his father's farm, some place up there, I have forgotten where he said—at some place, Parker, Oil City—had been working there during the summer, and heard there was going to be some fun down in Harrisburg, and he was coming down to have some of it, and that he had gotten drunk and didn't know what he was doing—that was according to his own testimony in the criminal court. He was convicted, I believe, for something like four years, that was about the total of my experience. I made an information against him.

Q. How did you learn his name?

A. I asked his name at the time, and he told me. He gave me two or three names, but his right name is either Carney or Carter. He gave one four or five days afterwards, at municipal hall, and at first he denied that he was the man at all—he never had seen me. Said he had been arrested on the south side for drunkenness, but he was recognized by Bissell and others, and he owned up he had been there. His name is Carney alias Carter.

Alexander King, sworn:

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Where do you live?

A. Pittsburgh, Nineteenth ward.

Q. What is your business here?

A. Merchant.

Q. In what kind of mercantile business are you engaged?

A. In glass material. I am not doing much now—winding up.

Q. Employ a large number of men?

A. No, sir; we have only two. I have been manufacturing heretofore, and have had quite a lot of them in a glass manufactory.

Q. You may go on and state what you desire to on the subject?

A. I noticed a few days ago, in an evening paper, a statement made by Sheriff Fife, or said to have been by him—of course, I do not know, I only read it in the papers—that I had offered the rioters a thousand barrels of flour.

Q. That was in Sheriff Fife's statement?

A. You gentlemen know, of course, what he did say. It was in the evening papers. It is altogether unfounded; it was neither flour nor money, nor have I ever offered nor paid one cent, or spoken to anybody on the subject. It is utterly without foundation.

Q. What you desire is to correct——

A. Any impression of that kind.

Q. And if such statements were made by the crowd, they were made without authority?

A. Yes, sir.

By Mr. Means:

Q. Was it not an assertion made here that that was the strikers this side, not the rioters?

A. The strikers. The crowd there claimed that the citizens were in sympathy with them, and they, too, had offered them a thousand barrels of flour. I think that was mentioned in the Chronicle. I should just say, I had never seen one of the strikers or rioters until I saw one of them in July—that is the first I ever saw any of them.

C. L. Jackson, sworn:

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Where do you reside?

A. 202 Juniata street, Allegheny.

Q. What is your business?

A. Engineer of the Fort Wayne railroad.

Q. Were you an engineer of that road in July last?

A. I was.

Q. State, Mr. Jackson, whether you had any knowledge of any pre-arranged plan among the railroad employés to strike?

A. I had not.

Q. Before the day of the 19th of July?

A. I had not. The first time I heard of it I came in in the evening at nine-twenty, Friday evening. I heard that they were stopping the trains from coming out.

Q. You came in from the west on Friday evening?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. That was the first you knew anything about it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Did you know anything about the organization of the Trainmen's Union?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. For what class of employés was that organized?

A. Brakesmen and firemen.

Q. Conductors?

A. Conductors.

Q. Engineers, too?

A. Engineers, I think.

Q. What was the purpose and object of that union?

A. Indeed, I could not say.

Q. Were you connected with it?

A. No, sir.

Q. Don't belong to it?

A. No, sir.

Q. Had you any talk with men that did belong to it?

A. No, sir.

Q. Were you solicited by other employés to join it?

A. Yes; I was asked to join it.

Q. What reasons did they give—what inducements did they hold out for your joining it?

A. Indeed, I hardly know what they were.

Q. Who asked you to join it?

A. Conductors.

Q. What persons?

A. Indeed, I could not say.

Q. Conductors asked you to join it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. What did they say was the object of the union?

A. They did not say.

Q. Didn't they give you any object?

A. Didn't give me any information.

By Mr. Larrabee:

Q. Did they say to you how much advantage it would be to you to join it?

A. No, sir.

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Was it secret?

A. Yes; I believe it was.

Q. You know how extensive it was?

A. No, sir; I do not.

Q. Don't you know how many lodges there were organized?

A. Lodges organized all over the country, I think.

Q. You say you knew nothing of any pre-arranged plan for a strike?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you go out again after coming in on Friday night?

A. No, sir; not until after it was settled.

Q. And remained in the city of Allegheny all the time?

A. Yes, sir; I was over Sunday afternoon.

Q. Were you over Saturday to Pittsburgh?

A. I came over Saturday about two-thirty, or near two-thirty to three o'clock.

Q. Where did you go Friday night?

A. During the night I stayed in about two squares of home—Washington avenue, there.

Q. With the crowd?

A. There was a crowd around there. There was not very many.

Q. What class of men—railroad employés?

A. There was very few railroad men there.

Q. What were you staying there for?

A. I thought it was best to stay there. I heard of the trouble over in the city here, and I thought I would not come over, and that the best place to stay was at home.

Q. You were not at home?

A. Within two squares of home.

Q. How many men were there with you?

A. I suppose the forepart of the evening there was a good many men around there.

Q. How many would you judge?

A. I suppose maybe fifty or hundred; but they scattered away.

Q. All railroad men?

A. No, sir.

Q. What other men were there, besides railroad employés?

A. There was men that lived around there.

Q. And you remained there all night?

A. I remained there. I stayed there until about two o'clock in the morning.

Q. What was the object of that meeting?

A. There was no meeting.

Q. About fifty of you together. Would not you call that a meeting?

A. There was only two or three of us at seven or eight o'clock.

Q. What was the purposes or the objects of the coming there?

A. The men were just waiting. They saw the fire over at Pittsburgh.

Q. Was there any fire Friday night?

A. This was Saturday night.

Q. Friday night, you said?

A. I went right home Friday night.

Q. And stayed at home?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Then it was Saturday night you spoke of the coming there?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Sunday morning, where were you?

A. I did not get up at all until about ten o'clock.

Q. What time did you come over to the depot?

A. I came over about half-past two.

Q. How long did you remain at Union depot?

A. About ten or fifteen minutes.

Q. Did you come up to Twenty-fifth street?

A. No, sir.

Q. Where did you go from Union depot?

A. I came down Smithfield street, and went over the bridge to Allegheny again.

Q. You remained with this crowd until two o'clock, that you have spoken of?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Where were you during the day on Sunday?

A. Sunday night came over to the city, between one and two o'clock on Sunday.

Q. Go up to the ground?

A. I was over at the Union depot. I was up on the hill side.

Q. How large a crowd was engaged in burning and plundering?

A. I do not know. I could see eighteen or twenty in the crowd.

Q. Did you see any railroad men among them?

A. I did not see a railroad man.

Q. Did you know any of the men?

A. I know some of them.

Q. Who were they?

A. I thought you asked me if I knew any of the railroad men—no, I did not know the men there.

Q. Did you know any of the men you saw there?

A. No.

Q. How long have you been working on the railroad?

A. About seventeen years.

Q. Then you knew most of the men who were working on railroads leading out of Pittsburgh, did you not?

A. I did not know a very few of them, except on our own road.

Q. Except on the Fort Wayne road?

A. I have stopped right there.

Q. You know nothing of any pre-arranged plan among the men for a strike?

A. No, sir; I did not.

Q. You belong to the Engineers' Brotherhood?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Was there anything talked of in that organization of strikes?

A. No, sir; there was not.

Q. Was there anything communicated from the Trainmen's Union to the Engineers' Brotherhood of a strike?

A. Not that I know of.

Q. If you know anything of the origin or the cause of the strike, I wish you to state it to us fully?

A. All I know about it, is the reduction of the wages ten per cent.

Q. That you think was the cause of it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Was there any order on the Fort Wayne road for running double-headers?

A. No, sir.

Q. Then the only thing that they had to complain of on the Fort Wayne and Chicago road, was the ten per cent. reduction, was it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. When did that take effect?

A. I think it was on the 1st of July. I could not say certain.

By Mr. Means:

Q. Was there a necessity to run double-headers on the Fort Wayne and Chicago road, if they want to do it?

A. I do not know. I guess there is about as much necessity as there is on the Central road, if they wanted to do it.

By Senator Yutzy:

Q. Are double-headers used as a general thing where there are heavy grades?

A. Not on our road, there ain't.

Q. You have no very heavy grades on the Fort Wayne road?

A. We pull seventeen cars as our load.

Q. Don't you know, as a railroad man, that double-headers are used generally on heavy grades, if at all?

A. I know they are used on the Pennsylvania road.

By Mr. Lindsey:

Q. Were there any other complaints or grievances by the men of that road?

A. Indeed, I can't say that there was.

Q. Have you ever heard?

A. No, sir.

By Senator Yutzy:

Q. Is there any other secret organization of railroad men, besides the Engineers' Brotherhood, that you know of?

A. No, sir.

Q. Are you at liberty to state the object of the Engineers' Brotherhood?

A. It is a more beneficial thing than anything else.

Q. The object of that association is not to control railroad companies, is it?

A. No, sir.

Q. Simply for their own benefit?

A. Benefit; yes, sir.

Q. During the trouble at the outer depot, or on the Fort Wayne, did you know of any armed force of railroad men that were prepared to protect any trains from coming into the city of Pittsburgh that had troops on?

A. I know there was a lot of them went to get some guns. Went down to the lower end of the yard.

Q. Railroad men?

A. I could say I did not see that. I saw a crowd about two squares off from our house. I could see them move down the track. I understood afterwards that was who they were.

Q. In your conversation with railroad men of the Pennsylvania Central, did you learn what their grievances were?

A. No; not particularly.

Q. Did they not complain of double-headers?

A. Yes; I believe there was a complaint of double-headers.

Q. Anything else?

A. Indeed, I could not say that there was.

Q. On your road it was on account of reduction of wages, was it, that they struck?

A. I think that is what it was.

Q. Are you acquainted with Bob Ammon?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Did you receive any orders from him?

A. No, sir.

Q. During the strike?

A. Never saw him during the strike.

Q. Did you assist the railroad men in protecting the property of the company?

A. I did, sir.

Q. Help to guard it?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Against the mob?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Was there any violence used to prevent the running of trains that you know of?

A. Not as I know of.

Q. No threats made?

A. No, sir; I didn't hear any.

Q. Were you on duty during the riots—were you at work, or did you run your engines during the troubles?

A. I would if they had wanted me to.

Q. If the company wanted you to?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Did you assist the strikers in running the cars down out of danger?

A. I was over at the city the afternoon they were taken out.

Q. Take any of the cars out yourself?

A. No, sir.

Q. Did you run any engine during that time—from Thursday until Monday?

A. No, sir.

Q. Were you called on by the railroad officials?

A. No, sir.

Q. Or by Bob Ammon?

A. No, sir.

Q. You are still in the employment of the road?

A. Yes, sir.

At this point the committee adjourned until three o'clock, this afternoon.