From sigma@upsilon.pair.com  Sat Apr 12 11:27:45 1997
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Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 14:27:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: sigma@pair.com
Reply-To: sigma@pair.com
To: FreeBSD-gnats-submit@freebsd.org
Subject: mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run
X-Send-Pr-Version: 3.2

>Number:         3267
>Category:       kern
>Synopsis:       mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run
>Confidential:   no
>Severity:       critical
>Priority:       high
>Responsible:    dyson
>State:          closed
>Quarter:        
>Keywords:       
>Date-Required:  
>Class:          sw-bug
>Submitter-Id:   current-users
>Arrival-Date:   Sat Apr 12 11:30:01 PDT 1997
>Closed-Date:    Sun Mar 22 09:07:15 PST 1998
>Last-Modified:  Sun Mar 22 09:07:49 PST 1998
>Originator:     Kevin Martin
>Release:        FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386
>Organization:
pair Networks
>Environment:

	Fresh 2.2.1-RELEASE installation, no active users, only cron jobs.

>Description:

	Cron jobs, which run every ten minutes, make several calls to
	/usr/bin/grep and /usr/bin/wc - once or twice per day, these
	files get their ctime and mtime updated to the current time.
	This has also been seen in the past with 2.2-BETA_A and 2.2-GAMMA.
	It has been reported as early as February 1996 for FreeBSD 2.0.5.
	The most serious concern is that when this problem was occuring on
	a heavily loaded 2.2-BETA_A system, we also saw numerous filesystem
	corruptions (disappearing files, etc) - although there is no proof
	that this is related.

>How-To-Repeat:

	Have been unable to repeat by running programs manually many times,
	but it happens routinely if not consistently when run from a cron
	job (as root).  See also the archives of freebsd-bugs and
	freebsd-questions, when searched for "mtime and ctime".

>Fix:
	
	Unknown.  Errant filesystem bug?

>Release-Note:
>Audit-Trail:

From: Martin Kammerhofer <mkamm@icg.tu-graz.ac.at>
To: freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org, sigma@pair.com
Cc:  Subject: Re: kern/3267: mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:37:41 +0200

 When I was running FreeBSD 2.2-BETA_A I experienced similar problems:
 Modification times of files occassionally changed (to current time,
 i.e. they seemed to have been touched) without apparent reason.
 Since it was reproducable (a Makefile's rules broke consistently due
 to a modified mtime) I tried to track it down.
 The mtime changed during an 'install -c' of a large file (a kernel).
 I ran install under gdb and it was exactly during the *large* read(2)
 call (when install slurps in the source file) when mtimes changed.

From: Martin Kammerhofer <mkamm@icg.tu-graz.ac.at>
To: freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org, mkamm@icg.tu-graz.ac.at
Cc:  Subject: Re: kern/3267: mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 1997 17:32:56 +0200

 After installing patches from -current (
 
 dyson       97/04/05 18:29:49
 
   Modified:    sys/i386/i386  trap.c
                sys/miscfs/procfs  procfs_mem.c
                sys/vm    vm_fault.c vm_map.c vm_map.h vm_prot.h
   Log:
   Fix the gdb executable modify problem.  Thanks to the detective work
   by Alan Cox <alc@cs.rice.edu>, and his description of the problem.
 
 ) and recompiling the 2.2.1 kernel the problem seems fixed.
 Thanks to David Nugent <davidn@unique.usn.blaze.net.au> for pointing
 me to that fix. According to email from Kevin Martin <sigma@pair.com>
  - the original PR submitter - it also works for him. :)

From: Martin Kammerhofer <mkamm@icg.tu-graz.ac.at>
To: freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org, mkamm@icg.tu-graz.ac.at
Cc: Kevin Martin <sigma@pair.com>
Subject: Re: kern/3267: mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 16:24:52 +0200

 Forget about applying this 3.0 patch to 2.2.1. It fixes mtime but
 breaks lots of other things. ("ps -a" from root will hang in "pfslck"
 state, a gdb executable modify problem is *introduced*, ...).
 2.2 definitely has to mature a while...
Responsible-Changed-From-To: freebsd-bugs->dyson 
Responsible-Changed-By: joerg 
Responsible-Changed-When: Sat Aug 23 17:59:05 MEST 1997 
Responsible-Changed-Why:  
John fixed it in -current.  He's probably the most knowledgable 
person who could ever tell of a possible fix in 2.2-stable, too. 

From: Kevin Martin <sigma@pair.com>
To: freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org
Cc:  Subject: kern/3267 mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run (fwd)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 06:51:28 -0500 (EST)

 I believe it's since been established that the mtime/ctime problem is
 something in FreeBSD 2.x's virtual memory system, and that the problem is
 1) relatively harmless, and 2) eradicated in 3.0/CURRENT.
 
 Good enough for me - close it out.
 
 Thanks,
 Kevin Martin
 sigma@pair.com
 
 ----- Forwarded message from Studded -----
 
 From Studded@dal.net  Sun Mar 22 04:48:20 1998
 X-Envelope-To: <sigma@pair.com>
 Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 01:48:17 -0800 (PST)
 From: Studded <Studded@dal.net>
 X-Sender: dougdougdougdoug@dt050n33.san.rr.com
 Reply-To: freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org
 To: sigma@pair.com
 Subject: kern/3267 mtime/ctime sometimes updated when a program is run
 Message-ID: <Pine.BSF.3.96.980322014441.1317f-100000@dt050n33.san.rr.com>
 
 Greetings, :)
 
 	I am writing to you in regards to your FreeBSD Problem
 Report. The FreeBSD project is currently conducting a beta test on
 version 2.2.6 and feedback as to whether you are still experiencing
 your problem would be very valuable. 
 
 	If you are still experiencing the problem you reported, it
 would help the project track the problem if you could upgrade to the
 latest snapshot of 2.2.6-Beta (located at releng22.freebsd.org) and
 test your problem again. 
 
 	If you have any feedback regarding this Problem Report,
 whether you are still experiencing the problem or whether the PR can
 be closed, please mail your response to
 freebsd-gnats-submit@freebsd.org. Please do not respond directly to
 me. I am merely a humble volunteer and have no official connection to
 the FreeBSD project. Therefore I cannot make any changes to the status
 of your Problem Report. It is also very important that you include 
 the category and number of your Problem Report (kern/3267)
 in the subject line of your response.
 
 	Another option if you need a refresher on the details of your
 problem or would like to submit a followup is to use the web page
 interface and look up your PR by number.
 http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr-summary.cgi
 
 	Thank you for helping to make this the greatest release of
 FreeBSD ever.
 
 Doug
 
 
 -- 
 ***         Chief Operations Officer, DALnet IRC network       ***
 *** Proud operator, designer and maintainer of the world's largest
 *** Internet Relay Chat server.  5,328 clients and still growing.
 *** Try spider.dal.net on ports 6662-4    (Powered by FreeBSD)
 
 ----- End of forwarded message from Studded -----
State-Changed-From-To: open->closed 
State-Changed-By: steve 
State-Changed-When: Sun Mar 22 09:07:15 PST 1998 
State-Changed-Why:  
Closed at orignator's request. 
>Unformatted:
