Subj : Slimmed down Debian To : Ky Moffet From : Barry Martin Date : Wed Jun 10 2020 10:47:00 Hi Ky! > KM> Ancient history comes back to haunt you. :D > I sometimes interpret that as if I wait long enough the answer to my > question will come! KM> Someday your prints will come. KM> -- motto of the serial printer. "Psst! CTS?" "Huh?" "Is it Clear to Send?" Or maybe as Mr. Miaggi could say to Grasshopper: "XON, XOFF... XON, XOFF...." > > Have you noticed it seems like the newer the machine the shorter the > > time it runs? 286: two years. Something-or-other 4-core: 3/4 year > > (rounded and to keep the time unit consistent. > KM> Not mine! Bullet (quadcore) *never* needs a restart, and only > KM> happens when the power is out beyond the UPS's capacity. And the > KM> stack of Dells don't get restarted enough to notice, either. (Tho > KM> what's with all the kernel updates this year? Seems like it's one > KM> every day!) > That wasn't me! I hadn't made the correlation of newer expiring sooner. > And hopefully my 8-core last longer than barely half a year! ...Maybe > they had better heatsinks and fans earlier! Thinking of the "AMD KM> Well, no... heatsinks in particular have improved immensely. And KM> there's really no excuse for shipping a hot-running CPU without KM> at least a basic heatpipe cooler. HP has made them standard on KM> Xeon systems. But AMD's philosophy is why bother when gamers will KM> replace it with some fancy aftermarket cooling to compensate for KM> their overclocking habit. Almost seems the Green-visored Ones would say to ship without any heatsink/fan and save the money. Sell as an accessory and mark up the price. ...Legal Department might be mooing as some sort of cooling is required and there would be a significant number of purchasers who would rip off the yellow warning sticker and run without any cooling. KM> I have two of those cheap little HP heatpipe coolers, on the two KM> hottest CPUs, and they do a stellar job. First time I checked, KM> the i7-4820K (130W) was running at a barely-warm 82F. (Tho at the KM> moment SIW has lost its marbles and thinks it's 478F. Er, I don't KM> think so; I can put my finger on the cooler's foot and it's KM> barely warm.) But you're one tough man! ...Can't find it now but at one time PSensor displayed one thermal sensor as a couple hundred degrees below zero! Since swapping in the CoolerMaster EVO cooler the maximum CPU temperature I've seen has been just below 120øF -- and considering there are times when it's been 85ø here in the Computer Room probably not a number. Prior to swapping it out the room was a lot cooler -- upper 60's/lower 70's but the CPU would hit thermal cutoff (listed at 70øC/158øF but I don't recall mine) -- doing the backup overnight was frequently sending over the edge so I would be waking to a shut-down machine. "Oddly" the backup would automatically restart in the morning and while running hot didn't quite reach the I Quit stage. With the CoolerMaster EVO cooler the max temp was 111øF. > approved" heatsink/fan combo which kept the FX-8320 processor > sufficiently cool as long as it didn't do much work. KM> ..."as long as it didn't do too much work" is the very KM> description of inadequate cooling! Maybe that was the reason for the multiple cores: you're getting too hot, hand your processes over and take a break. > And knock-on-wood there have been power glitches but no power outages so > far this year, "Partial-house" generator would be nice (I don't need to > have everything running per normal when the power fails); might not be > budgetable again this year as have to have the roof replaced (hail > damage and the insurance only paying a portion, though more than thought > they would), plus the deck and porch needs replacing. KM> I've had the thought that a generator that could run off the KM> natural gas line would be a Good Thing. It will be, though not falling through the deck seems to be a better idea right now. > As for power-up times, this one has been running for 17+ days since the > last reboot (probably a major update), the computer running the MythTV > Backend probably closer to a couple of months. KM> Bullet would have the longest uptime here... 113 days. KM> So that's how long since the last power outage. Tho that's gotten KM> less frequent since they trimmed all the trees that could touch KM> and ground out a line when it rains. They were trimming branches several years ago and dropped one across a major transmission line (40,000, 400,000 volts - was up there) -- oops! > Not sure about the 'constant' kernel updates as I have LivePatch turned > on. ...Last I knew LivePatch won't work with a 32-bit system, though > sloppy advisement as just indicates something wrong with the log-in to > Ubuntu1 instead of the real reason. KM> I don't know LivePatch? PCLOS does updates on the fly, but you KM> have to restart to load a newly-arrived kernel. There've been so KM> many this year that GRUB's list has become very long. I've never KM> had to boot to an older kernel, but not worth the bother to KM> remove 'em, either. LivePatch is something relatively new -- think it started with or maybe mid- Ubuntu 16.04. At first I didn't use it -- wait to have the others test it out; every so often will see a notification an update has been applied; looking in Notifications History one was done 18 hours ago, so around 2 p.m. yesterday. No idea what it updated, then three-quarters of the time I had no idea what it was asking about (permission to apply an update). As for older kernels, I haven't had to go into that option in ages. Handy to have just in case, though two or three is probably all needed. OTOH, "if it ain't broke" (let me take crack at it! ). > KM> I give XP 4GB and other VMs 8GB, seems like since I've got it and > KM> the base OS doesn't need it, I might as well use it for > KM> something. Does make a considerable difference in performance... > KM> can't tell this XP from the real thing. > I'll have to play around later. Did check and I am currently running > 4096 MB (so 4 GB) memory for this XP Virtual Machine. I do recall > increasing to that amount definitely improved the response. Seems moreI KM> The default is something like 512mb which is a trifle cramped. Here there was "noticeable sluggishness". I think just drawing out the display was took one or two coffee slurps. > have an issue with video sluggishness: Video Memory at 20 MB currently, > which seems horrendously tiny but off-hand don't recall the reasoning. KM> 8mb should suffice for XP that's not doing recentish gaming. I KM> think VirtualBox defaults it to 128mb which is overkill for basic KM> use. OK, thanks. I vaguely recall playing with the video memory values and don't recall why I settled on the 20 MB value. > Use the XP portion only for BBSing, so text and it seems to keeo up . > The only video issue is if move a window around (in XP) and some > juttering: move-stop-move-stop-move-stop.... As I don't watch any > videos on the XP VM probably no need to alter, though may be worthwhile > to know for the Linux test VM. KM> That generally indicates something wrong with the video driver. KM> Try one of the other VM settings. Some get along with different KM> hosts better'n others, is my vague grok. OK, will check that out also. I don't recall playing with the video drivers as usually the default one is the best but of course also know not always true! Will also clone the VM and experiment on the clone. > KM> I sometimes ask myself that. Yeah, some are just for fun. I > KM> mean, I have WinXP, why do I need ReactOS? Because it's there! KM> Except not today. The crappy socket939 box that was reassigned to KM> ReactOS (cuz that AMD CPU don't do proper 64bit) decided to pop a KM> capacitor, and it looks like it's the same general location as my KM> slightly newer one with the southbridge problem. Methinks there's KM> a reason Asus went to solid capacitors. They were cheaper than warranty motherboard replacements?! > Sounds like a worthwhile reason to me! I'll admit to trying to keep > things the same aorund here just because it's easier and less confusing, > plus I have no real need to run separate systems. Well, almost did > because 'needed' XP for the BBS and X10 (home automation) but those > could have been converted to a Linux utility. here.> KM> Yeah, some of 'em are because I can, or because that hardware has KM> no better mission in life (this explains the box that I just left KM> with the Vista that came on it; they like each other, and I don't KM> need the system to do anything else, so it's a good reserve home KM> for Vista). Makes sense to me! KM> Still debating what goes on Fireball, tho since chances are it KM> eventually replaces Bullet (when/if it ever dies) ... XP64! Don't you just love new operating systems?! > > Will you call that machine "Milk"? Then you could have Milk of Mageia! > KM> LOL! Sounds like a plan. :D > KM> Tho I have a (black) cat called Milk (Do you want Milk? do you > KM> want Milk2?) and they might get confused. > I'd probably name the machine something else. Was sort of like when I > had Honey (RIP) - my Lhasa Apso I adopted: did some hyphenated commands KM> Awww... Tnx... > so she (hopefully) wouldn't get confused: "you want to go outside- > bathroom?", hopefully coupling the 'outside' concept of "do you want to > go outside" to play, go for a walk, etc., and not confuse with one of > saying we had to go to the bathroom. KM> Oh yes, they can make those connections well enough. I sort of know dogs (and other animals) can connect thoughts and understand or at least get the idea of what a human is saying, so the 'trick' is to minimize the 'foreign language' confusion. Sloppy example would be "roll over" and offering a roll (the bread kind) with "do you want a roll?". Would almost make sense on "do you want a roll?" the dog would roll over. > ..So "Mageia"..... Nothing coming even semi-clever coming to mind. KM> I still haven't named the 3 Dells anything clever, tho Larry, KM> Darryl, and Darryl comes to mind. Especially if two of the Dells were essentially identical! > KM> From userland, I don't really care so long as it works, and > KM> doesn't annoy me with lagging, crashes, or too many obvious > KM> vulnerabilities. > Which is more my side of the coin. I don't know, so I have to go with > what others offer. Ubuntu was selected out of the myriad of Linux > offerings because MythTV used it. And sort of based on my "let's not > get too mixed up" philosophy with MythTV being based on Ubuntu it sort > of made sense to learn or at least be more familiar with Ubuntu to > troubleshoot MythTV. KM> So there's some method to your masochism. Yup! Just not always so apparent from the surface. (Why am I thinking "deep down I'm really shallow"?) > > been a perfect candidate for an electric car when I needed to buy the > > current replacement years ago: local driving, so no need to be concerned > > about charging sites. Big block to purchase was the cost.) > KM> I live where the power goes out in bad weather. I like gas > KM> engines. KM> I also don't like the idea of trusting to an electric car when KM> there are stretches of up to 200 miles between power outlets. Just bring along a power pack! Most of my travels I'd be within 20 miles of an outlet -- the one at the house. The store where I worked was only five miles away, so a ten-mile round trip. Any long distance travelling we always took the other car. > times and the transformer would have to be replaced. He asked if wanted > to have it replaced now -- Memorial Day, which was the beginning of > summer and we immediately said yes as preferred a long replacement > outage while it was cool as opposed to delaying and needing it done on a > 100ø summer day or during a snowstorm. KM> Gee, ya think? :D It was sort of a no-brainer. We did ask about checking with the neighbours: three other houses get power from the same transformer; the supervisor (guess so - he seemed to be in charge) said it didn't matter as the pole was on our property so we got to make the decision. > As for powering a generator, the little ones tend to put out square > waves which will ruin electronics and some electrical. The bigger gas- KM> You can get a sine-wave convertor, tho. Probably true; I sort of prefer 'doing it right' from the beginning, so would be a small one with a sine wave output. > powered ones have the disadvantage of needing to be refilled, and so > shut down and cooled down so any spilt gas doesn't ignite. And int he KM> Natural gas. :D > middle of a rainstorm or snowstorm going to be a little grumbling about > that. So probably would go with a natural gas powered generator as have KM> What did I just say? :D > NG here, plus at one time there was a NG air conditioner cooling the > house (!) -- previous owner of the house owned several gas stations and > one had to be demolished to make room for something -- I think the > building of the second I-74 Bridge, not to be confused with the new > bridges being built currently, which caused the demolishment of the > replacement gas station. Anyway, makes sense here to have a NG > generator; now to have the necessary 'spare' money...... KM> There's the real problem! Maybe we'll just sit in the dark after KM> all. Oh, so you think natural gas would be the better way to go?! Money is and isn't the problem: having enough spare money for an emergency is sort of a requirement. Yes, loans can be done; will see about maybe combining the deck replacement with the NG generator. Just got the roof replaced (hail damage) and while the insurance covered most of that didn't cover it all (so the need for some 'spare' money). > Around $1.25 per year -- not bad! My systems have had to 'go up' > because of MythTV usage -- MythTV not being the hog but the high > definition playback is. Standard definition I could probably get by > with a 486 (guessing) but why? KM> Actually, I found a P3-500 is about the minimum for decoding KM> DVDs, and it's real borderline (has spasms of being unable to KM> keep up). The old DVDs default to what, 720p? so there's your KM> baseline. The P233 could not play MP4s without a lot of KM> stuttering and staggering, and DVDs were right out. Yes on the 720 resolution; anything higher is an up-conversion. Was looking at the notes I have on one of Frontend computers: AMD (!) - got it several years back; video card will output at least 1080 because that's what the max the local TV stations use. (Know NBC uses 1080 while FOX uses 720; dont' recall ABC and CBS off-hand.) Also half-remembering at least though MythTV version 0.28 it almost didn't matter what the CPU specs were as long as halfway current as loaded in to RAM and used the GPU in the video card. > KM> That kind of bug typically comes from the system BIOS. They don't > KM> actually know over 64gb (or sometimes 137gb), but will pretend > KM> they do until data exceeds that boundary. > In this instance definately was the hard drive: left for work one > morning and the system was fine; came home and -- what happened?! > Eventually pulled the hard drive and another system interpreted it as > the smaller size. KM> Oh, there's an Ooopsie, then. There was a bug in some of that era KM> that would crop up and do something like that, but I never KM> encountered it. You're special. Thank you! :) I don't know if it was a bug -- seems the hard drive was old enough that wasn't the cause. I always thought it was more like a RW arm or head fell off or wire broke. No reasoning other than seemed like a good excuse to me. KM> Actually, tho... if it was FAT32, there's your problem. Unstable KM> once the data exceeds 32GB. I *have* experienced that one. "250 GB" seems to be coming to mind, though that also was my go-to size for a lot of the computers around here. I'd also guess if the hard drive was reformatted to something capable of greater than the 32GB limit it would have brought the drive back to life. Sans data, but would have been seen as 128 GB, 240 GB, whatever. I do recall trying to get the original capacity back with various FATs but unable to, and the size always seemed to be reported about the same. > Have read where some businesses' software can't be upgraded to something > more current just because it doesn't exist so they have to stick with > antique hardware to run the software. KM> Yeah, lot of that with specialty ISA cards for industrial KM> applications. I wonder if anything I have in the basement is worthwhile?! And now that I typed that can't recall what I have; know I put some old stuff out for electronic recycle several months ago. > As for you seven 1GB sticks, odd, but semi-sorta makes sense: I have an > old Lenovo system with came with three 1 GB sticks -- four slots and the KM> To make matters odder, the seven sticks are server RAM KM> (registered ECC). That is getting odder! > fourth slot was empty. Lenovo said the system could use up to 8 GB (4x > 2GB), so eventually upgraded -- and the system wouldn't boot. Fiddle- > fiddle. Eventually just let it run with 2+2+1+1 (6 GB) as didn't seem > to like a 2GB stick in the 'upper' slots. KM> Some of 'em are cranky, tho might your second pair were KM> single-sided or ECC, either of which would not work, tho KM> single-sided sometimes not works in creative ways (shows up as KM> half the size, or even smaller). Right. The single-sided vs. double0sided did come to mind, and I tried various combinations/placements of the 2 GB sticks. With another computer several years ago did did have the issue where upgraded and was given a physically double-sided stick along with a physically single-sided stick. The single-sided one was detected as half the value, I think when paired with any of the double-sided sticks. Returned (was brick-and-mortar), explained my problem and the guy was familiar, got a physically matching pair and had no problems. KM> I have an Amptron motherboard (quality-wise from well beneath the KM> barrel) with a P4-2.4GHz CPU, and it has thoroughly weird ideas KM> about RAM... 2 slots and theoretically it supports 2GB (or was it KM> 4GB, I forget) but will only boot with a 512mb and 256mb -- AND KM> they have to NOT be the same speed or timing specs. Matched pair KM> = no boot! You win that quirkiness contest!! Guess a good idea to keep the old RAM from discarded/upgraded systems just in case ever needed. > > True, though like you said some of the programmes check to see Swap is > > available, though seems like they check for a Swap partition is present > > but not necessarily the size of the partition. > KM> Some do, some don't. Photoshop is particularly stupid; it insists > KM> on a swapfile, but doesn't check if it's big enough before trying > KM> to use it. > Weird. Would guess a section of old code they haven't figured how to > get around. KM> More like Adobe has some swaths of general incompetence. Took 'em KM> til the most recent version to figure out that Illustrator's KM> menus really should respect system settings for large monitors, KM> instead of becoming so small you need a microscope to even FIND KM> 'em. (Photoshop at least had a setting to increase menu size, and KM> that sorta works, tho still doesn't respect system settings.) KM> Only reason I can think of is that to this day it must have KM> inherited menu handling from its Aldus ancestors, built for KM> Win3.1, where there was as yet no real standard for menu size or KM> font handling and lots of apps were still DIYing. I've play a bit with photo format converting software (MP4 to AVI) and rejected at least one because the icons were illegible. Hard to use that way! > Oops! ...I sort of stopped using smaller hard drives on the various > MythTV Frontends as they took a relatively long time to boot. KM> Until relatively recently, linux had poor to absent disk caching, KM> which made it glacial on hard drives with small cache. I don't recall the cache numbers but would guess a decent amount as were usually Western Digitals or Seagates. The brand doesn't guarantee decent cache amounts, just a general guideline, and wasn't an off-brand. Also used the suggested amount during set-up as figured they knew better than I. Know in a few systems I had two hard drives (one for the OS and one for Data) and would 'test install' on the OS drive to get the numbers: at the time more than one hard drive required all manual configuration and I used the test install to get them. > KM> Nope, just doing I/O stupidly, I think. > Microsoft: where we write a new operating system, test, release, then > find it doesn't work right so we create a new OS. Profits are great!! KM> Haha... I wonder what they plan to do with their cloud OS, since KM> they've said Win10 will be the last version of Windows. If they KM> want everyone to rush right out and buy it, just slap XP's KM> interface on Win10... that way they don't need another version of KM> Windows!! Plus cheaper as have the developing is done! I've not been paying all that close attention to Windows but thought "Windows 10" was going to be their last, though still have progressive upgrades and verions -- sounded confusing as "I have Windows 10" "Which one?" "Windows 10!" "Which Windows 10?" and "I just upgraded my Windows 10 to Windows 10!" (Huh?!) > > > Sounds a bit like some of the But Firsts around here! > > KM> I have way too many of these But Firsts laying around... today's > > KM> was Mow the Durn Lawn. > > You forgot "Before It Turns To Hay"! > KM> Too late! Tho I did finally get Jurassic Weedpark under control.. > KM> mostly... > The weather here has been ideal for growing grass: the weather guy > mentioned some yards needing to be mowed three times in one week! KM> Oh yeah, been like that here too... today we (me and the big KM> goat) chopped weeds. Tomorrow, the rest of the seedy grass... Cut the grass before the roofers came for last Monday -- could have gone another day or two but easier to find nails and other debris in short grass -- as it was we found a brass fitting for the nail gun their magnetic pick up missed ('cause brass isn't magnetic!). Not sure how they missed it as was bright brass (actually looked like it hadn't even been used yet). Yesterday (Tuesday) they finished the roof -- whoever calculated didn't do the figuring correctly; wasn't the roofers as they were ones to discover the shortage and called their boss to try to get the balance that afternoon (Monday). Also Cristobal hiked through the area yesterday; this morning cool but huuuumid, and another rain system should be wandering through by noon. ...By tomorrow (Thursday) might have been needing a scythe and sickle to get through! ¯ ® ¯ Barry_Martin_3@ ® ¯ @Q.COM ® ¯ ® .... Procrastinate NOW! --- MultiMail/Win32 v0.47 þ wcECHO 4.2 ÷ ILink: The Safe BBS þ Bettendorf, IA --- QScan/PCB v1.20a / 01-0462 * Origin: ILink: CFBBS | cfbbs.no-ip.com | 856-933-7096 (454:1/1) .