Subj : Re: Upstate brainwashees To : Aaron Thomas From : Randall Schad Date : Tue Oct 01 2024 14:40:40 AT> I'm talking about undocumented migrants; people without background AT> checks. Not "immigrants." I don't know where the numbers come from AT> either, but they are often reported by the media and they range from 7 AT> to 20 million, while Trump has suggested that Biden may have let in AT> closer to 40 million undocumented migrants. That begs the question, then: if nobody can provide valid data, how can we attribute anything to anyone? Either we're back to just making things up (which isn't above anyone, especially lately), or someone, somewhere, is gathering data and extrapolating numbers based on a combination of historical context, statistical processes, and a light dusting of conjecture. AT> Also, this isn't about an "immigrant population," this is about the AT> number of foreigners who entered the USA without a visa while Biden was AT> president. "Illegal immigrants" equals "undocumented migrants." We used to call them "illegal aliens." Same people, different name. AT> I appreciate that but listen to yourself: illegal population? That is AT> ridiculous. Think about it: 1) there hasn't been a census count since AT> years before Biden opened the border 2) even if we did a census count AT> yesterday, how many people are going to report it on paper that they are AT> illegal immigrants? 3) there's no way to accurately measure the number AT> of illegal immigrants. Okay, I'm listening to myself. My self says that there is a valid, rough approximation of the entire population of the country, including people who aren't here legally. My self also says that political statements that include numbers meant to incite fear and anger are grossly inaccurate. The latest DHS report that I could quickly pull up lists "unauthorized immigrant population" (which, again, are the people we're both talking about) from 2018 to 2022. That report also lists an approximate number of 11 million in 2022, with an annual entry estimate of just over 2 million. They do list the methodology for coming to those figures if you're interested. My SyncTerm paste function isn't working (running the latest RC version), so I can't paste the direct link, but the report is available on the dhs.gov website. All that aside, if, by your statement, we can't accurately measure it, how can anyone blame the current administration for not improving it? AT> This means: Joe wants the border open, he has the same handlers as AT> Kamala, so therefore Kamala wants the border open too. AT> AT> RS> AT> Q: Does Trump control congress? AT> RS> AT> A: No. AT> RS> AT> RS> Interestingly enough, he did have enough pull to get congress to vote AT> RS> down an immigration bill that both sides liked, seemingly because he AT> RS> needed the immigration platform for his campaign. So maybe that's not AT> RS> true as we'd like. AT> AT> Mike tried to make that same argument but I guess I'll have to say this: AT> it's been debunked. Ex presidents don't control anything. Trump doesn't AT> control congress. He doesn't have "pull." If ex presidents controlled AT> congress, which they don't, then what would the purpose of having a AT> congress be? I did address this in another post. At some point I would really like to find the article that quoted someone as receiving a phone call from Trump where he "asked" the congressman to shoot down the bill. AT> RS> AT> Q: If Trump IS controlling congress, what are Democrats doing ab AT> RS> AT> A: Nothing. AT> RS> AT> RS> On THIS point, I'm in 100% agreement. Democrats have done embarrassin AT> RS> little to solve much of anything in quite a while. AT> AT> It's not just Democrats, there are no useful Republicans either. Not in AT> congress at least. This actually sparked a thought... If I set aside a little time later this week, I might pour a glass or two of scotch and see if I can compile a short list of passed legislation that actually solved a problem anyone cares about. I'm certain that's going to be a short list. :) RS .... Avoid arguments about the toilet seat... Use the sink. --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Windows/32) * Origin: The Arena BBS ú netasylum.com:2323 (1:226/44) .