Subj : Re: Guns
To   : DALE SHIPP
From : Donald
Date : Tue Apr 18 2023 10:03:00

-=> Dale Shipp wrote to Mike Powell <=-

 -=> On 04-17-23  15:53,  Mike Powell <=-
 -=> spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Guns <=-

 MP> I disagree.  In a lot of cases, the persons are described by others,
 MP> after the fact of course, as someone with issues, but they are often
 MP> already known to law enforcement because of said issues.

 MP> For example, both the kid who shot up the high school in Florida, and
 MP> the kid who shot up the grocery in upstate NY, were either known to
 MP> local law enforcement or the FBI.

 DS> But, none of the people who knew of the "issues" did anything to stop
 DS> the soon-to-be shooter.

 > In Australia, the similar people don't have access to AR15 type of
 > automatic weapons to carry out their delusional vendetta / suicide. A
 > hand gun with a limited magazine cannot do the carnage that can be done
 > with an AR15 and multiple 30 bullet magazines.

 MP> That last bit is not true.  In 2007, the Virgina Tech shooter used two
 MP> pistols to kill 33 (including himself) and wound another 23.  There are
 MP> not that many mass shooters who can claim such numbers.

 DS> I recall the Virginia Tech shooting.  As I recall, the shooter was
 DS> shooting from a concealed position in a tower.  It took some time to
 DS> identify where the shots were coming from and to get someone up there.
 DS> I also thought that he was using a rifle.  I would not have thought
 DS> that he could have been so accurate using a pistol at that distance.

 MP> One of his two pistols was a Walther P-22 which, as the name suggests,
 MP> is a .22 pistol.  A year later, another mass shooter (in Finland) used
 MP> a Walther P-22 (and only that pistol) to kill 10 and then himself.

 MP> That was the second mass school shooting in Finland in a little over a
 MP> year.  The first perpetrator also used a .22 pistol.  He killed 8
 MP> before shooting himself.

 DS> In each case, I stand by my statement, with the additional caveat of
 DS> the amount of time taken.  An AR-15 can do a lot more carnage in a
 DS> short time than a shooter with a pistol could do.

 MP> Australia is also not immune to mass killings.  After the shooting you
 MP> refer to, they do indeed have no more "assault weapon" mass shootings,
 MP> but they still have had mass-shootings, mass-stabbings, mass-bashings,
 MP> mass-vehicular-homicides, and at least three mass-arson killings (that
 MP> killed 15, 10, and 11).

 DS> Not immune, but it certainly seems from the reporting that they were
 DS> greatly reduced.

 DS> As the adage says, "don't let perfect get in the way of good".

 MP> As I told Aaron in another message, you are not going to stop people
 MP> who want to kill from not killing by taking their guns.

 DS> True -- but what I am lobbying for is not taking away their guns.  It
 DS> is removing military style automatic weapons from readily available
 DS> public consumption.

I have a Ruger 10/22, extremely popular .22, that I can make look like one of
those scary "Military Style" weapons. It doesn't make it "Military Grade"
though. Much like my AR, it's just a "scary looking" semi-auto....



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