Subj : Re: Guns
To   : Mike Powell
From : Dale Shipp
Date : Tue Apr 18 2023 01:38:02

 -=> On 04-17-23  15:53,  Mike Powell <=-
 -=> spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Guns <=-

 MP> I disagree.  In a lot of cases, the persons are described by others,
 MP> after the fact of course, as someone with issues, but they are often
 MP> already known to law enforcement because of said issues.

 MP> For example, both the kid who shot up the high school in Florida, and
 MP> the kid who shot up the grocery in upstate NY, were either known to
 MP> local law enforcement or the FBI.

But, none of the people who knew of the "issues" did anything to stop
the soon-to-be shooter.
 
 > In Australia, the similar people don't have access to AR15 type of
 > automatic weapons to carry out their delusional vendetta / suicide. A
 > hand gun with a limited magazine cannot do the carnage that can be done
 > with an AR15 and multiple 30 bullet magazines.

 MP> That last bit is not true.  In 2007, the Virgina Tech shooter used two
 MP> pistols to kill 33 (including himself) and wound another 23.  There are
 MP> not that many mass shooters who can claim such numbers.

I recall the Virginia Tech shooting.  As I recall, the shooter was
shooting from a concealed position in a tower.  It took some time to
identify where the shots were coming from and to get someone up there.
I also thought that he was using a rifle.  I would not have thought that
he could have been so accurate using a pistol at that distance.

 MP> One of his two pistols was a Walther P-22 which, as the name suggests,
 MP> is a .22 pistol.  A year later, another mass shooter (in Finland) used
 MP> a Walther P-22 (and only that pistol) to kill 10 and then himself.

 MP> That was the second mass school shooting in Finland in a little over a
 MP> year.  The first perpetrator also used a .22 pistol.  He killed 8
 MP> before shooting himself.

In each case, I stand by my statement, with the additional caveat of the
amount of time taken.  An AR-15 can do a lot more carnage in a short
time than a shooter with a pistol could do.

 MP> Australia is also not immune to mass killings.  After the shooting you
 MP> refer to, they do indeed have no more "assault weapon" mass shootings,
 MP> but they still have had mass-shootings, mass-stabbings, mass-bashings,
 MP> mass-vehicular-homicides, and at least three mass-arson killings (that
 MP> killed 15, 10, and 11).

Not immune, but it certainly seems from the reporting that they were
greatly reduced.

As the adage says, "don't let perfect get in the way of good".

 MP> As I told Aaron in another message, you are not going to stop people
 MP> who want to kill from not killing by taking their guns.

True -- but what I am lobbying for is not taking away their guns.  It is
removing military style automatic weapons from readily available public
consumption.

                               Dale Shipp
                  fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
                              (1:261/1466)


.... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 01:15:21, 18 Apr 2022
___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

--- Maximus/NT 3.01
 * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)

.