Subj : Re: Cancel Culture stupid
To   : Mike Powell
From : Jeff Thiele
Date : Sat Oct 29 2022 10:48:33

On 29 Oct 2022, Mike Powell said the following...
 MP> >  MP> When state communism leads to authoritarianism, as it always will,
 MP> >  MP> people
 MP> >  MP> who think communism is a good thing will tell you that "it wasn't r
 MP> >  MP> communism" or "they didn't do it right and we can do it better."
 MP> > State communism need not always lead to authoritarianism, just as democr
 MP> > capitalism need not always lead to authoritarianism, as has been the cas
 MP> > numerous instances.
 MP> But yet it always has as most humans don't like the idea of giving up all
 MP> of their freedom or beliefs.  So those people eventually have to be dealt
 MP> with in order for state communism to be a "success."

Communism doesn't require the "giving up" of all of one's freedoms or
beliefs. That is a function of an authoritarian state, not a communist one.

 MP> >  MP> The problem is that most people don't want everything to belong to 
 MP> >  MP> collective or the state because they realize they will never get as
 MP> >  MP> out of it as they are putting in it.
 MP> > They'll never get as much out of it as they're putting into it under
 MP> > capitalism, either. (And here we've switched from political systems to
 MP> > economic systems, just so you're aware). If workers got paid the true va
 MP> > of their labor, there would be no profits for the shareholders. Profit
 MP> > doesn't just appear from thin air.
 MP> Most of us are getting more out of it then we would a collective system.
 MP> Not all that you get out of something is monetary (see above).

People can enjoy their jobs under communism. There's no requirement that they
be unhappy.

 MP> >  MP> The ones who think it is good are
 MP> >  MP> the ones who won't be putting anything into it, which a true commun
 MP> >  MP> system will not put up with.
 MP> > Or the people who have realized that capitalism doesn't pay them their t
 MP> > worth.
 MP> Nothing ever will, especially if you are one that values your (lack of)
 MP> input over what it is really worth.

It's mathematically impossible to be paid the full value of one's labor under
capitalism.

 MP> > People can enter into communism voluntarily.
 MP> That is what I said?  If they can enter it voluntarily on those levels,
 MP> why try to force it on everyone, i.e. why would it ever be necessary at a
 MP> national level?

There are US citizens who don't agree with our government. But we have to
have one.

Jeff.

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