Subj : Re: Fundamentalists and P To : Mike Powell From : Jeff Thiele Date : Sun Sep 04 2022 13:50:50 On 04 Sep 2022, Mike Powell said the following... MP> > Offering to trade the far-right for the far-left is a form of bargaining MP> > a poor one. MP> I don't think he was offering to trade one for the other, but rather MP> stating that both extremes are bad. Violence aside, persons at either of MP> the poles are not going to compromise on anything and make it difficult MP> for anyone else to do so. However, violence aside, there are not enough people at either of the poles to make much difference in the bigger picture. That is why there's no "violence aside" for the far-right. MP> > The far right widely espouses political violence, secession, MP> > and civil war, while violent sentiments on the far-left are extremely ra MP> That second half is BS. You should do some homework there. A previous MP> breach of the Congressional chambers in the 1950s would be a good start. MP> Various groups of leftist radicals during the 1960s/70s would be another MP> one that would include violent sentiments and political/government MP> structural change in their beliefs. Best place to find many of those MP> involved is to look over the list of pardons handed out by Clinton, MP> Obama, and to some extent Carter. It's a matter of degree. I didn't say it was non-existent; I said that by comparison they were extremely rare. Dirung the civil rights era, conservatives were no strangers to violence themselves. Murders, lynchings, church burnings, you name it. MP> Let's not forget the shoot-em-up of the Republican team for the MP> Congressional baseball game. Right-wing activists have also been involved in bombings. MP> There was a sports echo on another network that I used to read. At MP> least it was supposed to be about sports. It had been taken over by MP> politics. The only person in there who was claiming to be armed and MP> ready for revolution/civil war was in the "not my President!" crowd and MP> claimed to be affiliated with others like himself. Ironically, this MP> would usually come out after someone made the incorrect assumption, as MP> was recently made here by Gregory, that "lefties" are not armed. Ironic MP> because he just made that bad assumption, and ironic because it was you MP> that called him out on it. Interesting anecdote. What show was this? MP> > In particular, as of late, the far-right has used violence to threaten MP> > democracy and the peaceful transfer of power, while the far-left has don MP> > such thing. Sure, there were the George Floyd riots, but those were more MP> > about MP> > local police oppression than national political issues. MP> Again, more BS. More came out of the "George Floyd riots" than what you MP> claim. The true peaceful protesters were indeed protesting police MP> oppression, while many of the rioters were opportunists who saw an MP> opening for political change, including anarchists seeking changes to MP> the structure of our government... see Portland and Seattle for two MP> examples. Some of what went on in Wisconsin and in Louisville, KY, are MP> two more. Are anarchists leftist, though? Anarchy doesn't seem like it would have much of a social safety net. "Every man for himself" doesn't seem very "socialist." It sounds much more "rugged individualist" to me. MP> I am honestly shocked that you admit to riots now, considering the MP> narrative here has always been "those were peaceful protests." Also, MP> that you admit to "riots" plural, while claiming that those violent MP> sentiments are "extremely rare" in comparison to a single riot carried MP> out by one group on one day. I never denied that there were riots, but I did try to puch back on the idea that the protests in general were violent, which they were not. On the other hand, the George Floyd riots were widespread across the US with only a few of them having violence associated with them. MP> I have always maintained that, if it had not been for the 2020 Summer MP> riots going mostly unchecked, what happened in January the following MP> year would also not have happened. One group saw another getting away MP> with all sorts of crap, saw most of the crap being passed off as MP> "peaceful" or "understandable" by those in power, and decided MP> (incorrectly!) that this form of behavior was now acceptable in our MP> country. The vast majority of the protesters were, in fact, peaceful. There were hundreds of arrests of those suspected of violence, although they did not get the individual news attention that the insurrectionists are getting. As far as this form of behavior being acceptable in our country, the insurrection was not only perfectly acceptable to the sitting president at the time, but also encouraged by him and various other Republicans. Jeff. --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Raspberry Pi/32) * Origin: Cold War Computing BBS (1:387/26) .