Subj : Re: Why use a Point, and recommendations
To   : Ulrich Schroeter
From : Dan Clough
Date : Sun Jun 04 2023 09:54:00

-=> Ulrich Schroeter wrote to Dan Clough <=-

 DC> Just started following this echo, as I may have an interest in setting
 DC>  up a point for reading mail.  I have a few questions, and apologize
 DC> if they've been asked before, which I'm sure they have...

 DC> 1.  What pros/cons are there to using a Point, versus reading/writing
 DC> echomail directly on a BBS, or with an Offline Reader.  I operate a
 DC> BBS, and have used offline mail readers for years.  Just wondering
 DC> how/if a point would be "better" in some way.  What can it do for me
 DC> that I can't currently do with my OLR (MultiMail)?

 DC> 2.  I'm interested (only) in software for Linux.  A glance through the
 DC>  existing messages here would seem to indicate that 'OpenXP' is the
 DC> point software of choice.  Pretty much true?  Any alternatives to
 DC> that?

 DC> Thanks for taking some time to provide me some info/advice, and I look
 DC>  forward to participating here.

 US> currently you've probably only received responses from the Zone 1
 US> perspective view. But there are also others ...

 US> First is the historical view ...
 US> back in the 80's and 90's as Fidonet starts increasing, this was
 US> the before-internet-time ... all Zone 1 had the so called
 US> local-area-calls with zero addtl. fees using local phone calls.
 US> You could start a phone call at first of the month and could be
 US> online 24/7 until the last day of the month without any addtl.
 US> fee except the base fee you've paid for your telephone provider.

 US> In Zone 2 it was totaly different. Beside the base fee you had to
 US> pay monthly, you've paid for every call time based. So every
 US> online minute counted up to a total amount fee you had to pay to
 US> your phone provider. To get an idea, I've compared back in the
 US> late 80's ... 1 coke did cost 1 USD In Germany the one coke did
 US> cost 1 DM. In relation to the phone bill, you had to pay every 5
 US> minute approx 1 DM. To be one hour online, you had to pay addtl.
 US> 6 DM.

Wow, that's very interesting and something I did not know.

 US> Thats why BBS'sing becomes popular in the US but not in Europe.
 US> In Zone 2 you cannot calculate your online costs. Therefor, the
 US> Fidonet developed mechanisms to call a bossnode with minimum
 US> time, if the transfer speed becomes better, the less time was
 US> required to be online, that counts to your phone bill. Therefor
 US> Offline solutions spread in Zone 2 where in Zone 1 BBS'sing was
 US> your friend.

Perhaps that is true, generally speaking.  But I can tell you that for 
myself, back in the 90's, first as a user and then as a Sysop, I used 
the QWK/offline reader method.  This was of course not related to trying 
to minimize my telephone costs, it was just more convenient and offered 
more options.  Also, as a Sysop, in those days I only had one phone 
line, so did not want to busy up my incoming phone while I was reading 
and replying to messages on the BBS.

 US> As said, Offline solutions have been developed. One option was
 US> the QWK technique but this didn't only become popular be the
 US> users that are still most time online at BBS'ses. The Point
 US> solution becomes more popular in Zone 2 because each user still
 US> uses the technique, that connects different BBS'ses with mailers
 US> to exchange mails and files in the background.

 US> Point programs in the beginning uses exactly the same mailer,
 US> tossers, tickers, editors that Node system uses beside their
 US> running BBS

 US> Each BBS user works under the hood of a BBS sysop - mostly the
 US> Fidonet Node sysop. Fidonet technical they have no voice. Fidonet
 US> technical you have to apply for a nodenumber to get fidonet
 US> member and have becoming a voice. With a nodenumber, you can be
 US> uniquely identified by your fidonet aka. As QWK reader you're
 US> still running under your bossnodes main nodenumber. Starting with
 US> point you receive your unique Fidonet Point-AKA and becomes
 US> addressable in the fidonet.

 US> The are differences in the Point systems.
 US> Ones that are standalone systems (OpenXP, WinPoint) with their
 US> own dedicated messagebase structures.
 US> You cannot combine these message base with any known BBS systems
 US> message base or other fidonet compatible editors or tossers and
 US> tickers. They are standalone as is. Good for people who dont want
 US> continue to discover the world of Fidonet. Its only good to
 US> select some discussion channels, some fileechos and receive the
 US> traffic for them.

 US> The 2nd type of Point systems, are Point systems, that allow you
 US> to move forward with your journey to get a Fidonet Node member,
 US> add a BBS system to your running system, to play around with
 US> different tossers, tickers, netmail trackers. Playing around with
 US> a BBS system in the Background connected to your local
 US> messagebase that interchanges traffic with your bossnode. Once
 US> you've received the learning curve to apply for a Fidonet
 US> Nodenumber, you only switch the Pointnumber with your applied
 US> Nodenumber and continue running your system as before. With the
 US> mailer system you can also add othernets to your configuration to
 US> have a multilevel networking environment. With such a system
 US> you're probably able to switch from one OS system to another.
 US> Running BinkD mailer you can run your system on Windows, on
 US> Linux, on OS2 maybe others. One of such combination of mailer,
 US> tosser, editor as point starter kit is the BinkD, HPT, GoldEd
 US> package. For Linux Philip Giebel deployed the Fidian package.
 US> For Windows long time there was the Fidopoint-Paket-Deluxe
 US> available for Windows, but failed the switch from Windows 32bit
 US> to Windows 64bit The heart of this package is the universal
 US> Tosser with the ability to support different types of FTN
 US> compatible message bases. Therefor this solution is the
 US> open-forward system with the best effort if you want to continue
 US> with your fidonet journey

Thank you for all that info, and for taking the time to write such an 
interesting and involved reply.  For me still today, the BBS/QWK method 
is still my preferred method.  I will continue to monitor this POINTS 
echo, and possibly try it again one day.

Appreciate it, and take care!


.... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.
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