Board:   [DoveNet] Debate
Subject: Re: Universal Health Care
From:    Arelor
Date:    Tue Jul 07, 2026 11:46

@VIA: PALANTIR
  Re: Re: Universal Health Care
  By: nixx to Outlaw on Mon Jul 06 2026 01:27 pm

 >
 > Yes there will always bewaste, but we are humans, we developed society
 > specifically to help and protect each other, most if not all species on this
> planet operate on this model, we are the only one that say "hey, I don't
 > want to share".

I don't think we developed society for selfless reasons.

We have evolved in order to become racist, tribalistic, selfish motherfuckers. Easy proof of that is when you observe a manageable group of humans in a closed environment they split into groups and start attacking each other. Thisapplies to schoolyards and blue collar work environments.

There is a reason bullying and mobbing are so popular. Humans like being part of an exclusive group and members of a group derive their sense of belonging from beating weaker groups. This alone isreason enough to realize large scale cooperation cannot happen in human groups without tangible incentives - people hates each other too much. This is also one of the reasons why I don't buy the regular "but humans evolved into cooperation" humanist theorizing.

These day and age humans don't climb the ladder by becoming more useful or valuable. They climb the ladder by manipulating the environment they operate in. Any employee with two braincells KNOWS the way to raise within a company is not to be the best worker, but to be the best cocksucker. This applies to a 30 employee company but applies even harder to larger corporations, and Governments are the largest corporations around.

Frankly, Machiavelli had this figured out on the 15th Century already and actually made the case. Scumbags fail upwards.

But do you wanna know what is the final nail in the coffin when it comes to voluntary cooperationism? That most people who toot that horn don't believe in it in the least. Thought experiment: if I was about to be split by lightning, and the only way to save me was to set your car on fire and sacrifize it to Thor or whatever, would youset your car on fire? How many people would set their cars on fire for me? Let me tell you: everybody would love for somebody to lose their car for me but nobody would take the hit themselves, because as far as everybody is concerned I am a random worthless dude like there are 8 billion else around. Socialism at its core is just that idea that people wants something done but don'twant to do it themselves so they delegate the task to feel good about it.

And in the case of healtchare it is very evident. There are private cooperative services nearly everywhere: I know cooperative farming, cooperative banking... there is no reason why private cooperative healthcare can't exist, yet the default plan for a whole lot of people is to build a giant healthcare corporation, declare it is ok to do so because it belongs to the government, and force everybody to participate, rather than build aprivate cooperative so good that people flocks to it because of how damn good it is.


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