From: Digestifier To: Subject: Dead-Flames Digest #366 Dead-Flames Digest #366, Volume #48 Wed, 21 Sep 05 22:00:02 PDT Contents: Re: NYC advise needed (CC,NDC) (cj) Re: Brave New World (Sherry) Re: Simon Wiesenthal RIP (Andy Gefen) That Jet Blue Landing gear thing (NDC) (the.stugots@gmail.com) Re: NYC advise needed (CC,NDC) (Andy Gefen) Re: CLEVELAND: Free concert this Saturday 9/24/05!! ("The Iron Muffin") Chet Helms Tribal Stomp Lineup ("Dave Kelly") Re: Brave New World ("The Iron Muffin") Re: Brave New World (Tim Donohoe) Re: What's It Like in Atlantic City? ("Stephen St.") Re: Brave New World ("k sturm") Re: JGB ("alex sandoval") Re: Rhino's Fillmore 3 disc set ("Olompali4") Re: Brave New World ("Richard Morris") Re: Brave New World ("Richard Morris") Re: ndc-two subjects not to discuss with folks you like (Tim Donohoe) Can an impeached President run for office again? ("YoMama") Re: Rex Benefit: Roll Call ("Richard Morris") Re: Rhino's Fillmore 3 disc set ("Richard Morris") Re: Simon Wiesenthal RIP (Tim Donohoe) Re: The REAL Disaster (NDC) ("Richard Morris") Re: A Japanese sociological study for the benefit of Sweetbac (NDC) (Kelly Humphries) Re: Brave New World (Tom Beck) Re: 10 years ago today (Steve Lenier) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: cj Subject: Re: NYC advise needed (CC,NDC) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 22:27:07 -0400 send us a postcard man. who's wathcin bailey? have fun cj Spider Dawg wrote: > Got Cream? > > I never expected tickets to still be available when I got home from work > today, but after 45 minutes of turning down tix behind the stage I got > section 336! Good enough for me! > > Now I've got to figure out how to get there and where I'm gonna stay. > I've never been to "the" city and am not too crazy about the idea of > trying to drive there, or find my way around via public transportation, > so I'm thinking of taking Amtrak right to Penn Station. Problem with > that is where to spend the night, I'm assuming Manhatten hotels are > waaay out of my budget. So I guess what I'm asking for is advise on > reasonably priced accomodations that are easily accessable from "the > garden". Any info appreciated, and I'm sure there are plenty of other > folk wondering the same thing. > > TIA, > Jim (from Michigan) > ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Brave New World From: Sherry Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:28:05 GMT >> He's been in therapy since he was about 4, and completed a year in a group >> home dealing in behavior management. > > I know it sounds a bit harsh, and probably it's > too late now, but when I was a much younger asshole > I learned that a father's belt, though usually used > to hold his pants up, can be put to other uses. Sadly, we did spanking him when he was little. But yaknow - somehow smacking your kid so he doesn't punch his brother every time he walks by (literally every time!) doesn't make a hell a lot of sense to me. I mean, it's beyond mind numbing harder than hell to reason with him - but hitting him just felt WRONG. Felt like loss of MY control, and not really to do with a logical consequence to his actions. We are trying to teach him to reason. You need that in life, to some degree. Now, my grandfather would have said he'd teach him reason all right, reason to not hit his brother again or else I'll him him again. It's how I was raised, but it ain't for me, or my kids. Sherry in Vermont ------------------------------ From: Andy Gefen Subject: Re: Simon Wiesenthal RIP Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 22:29:34 -0400 A very good man with a very good mission. RIP, Mr. Wiesenthal. -- Andy (remove z's to respond) ------------------------------ From: the.stugots@gmail.com Subject: That Jet Blue Landing gear thing (NDC) Date: 21 Sep 2005 19:33:47 -0700 A song about tragedy narrowly averted... Nice landing dude! I wonder if they stop drink service the moment the red flag goes up... Do they allow you to smoke? Did anyone have emergency sex? These are the questions I must ask... -matt ------------------------------ From: Andy Gefen Subject: Re: NYC advise needed (CC,NDC) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 22:36:42 -0400 On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 16:00:53 -0500, Spider Dawg wrote: >> 3) Museum of Modern Art: If you are into museums, and you want to >> see a lot of the big paintings from Renoir, Van Gogh, etc, >> you should check it out. A visit will take a while, but you >> can limit it to the paintings. If you are into this type of >> thing, MoMA is a must-visit. Personally, I think the Met (Metropolitan Museum of Art) will fit most people's tastes (especially those with limited time and if it's a one-time-only sort of thing) better than MoMA. Lot s of iconic pieces. > >I need tips on *cheap*, but good, places to eat. I'm blowing a lot of >dough for a working class guy in a struggling industry. I bought a 6-pack >of Cel-Ray this summer, I'm good on that for another 20 years ;) Ollie's >sounds great, as does Katz's and Geno's. Chinatown even better. I can't >imagine any pizza being better than Loui's right here in my 'hood, but >while in New York...... bagels too. We have what is called New York >Bagel in Ferndale, I gotta try the real McCoy and see how authentic this >stuff is. I'll throw in recommendations for Ray's Pizza in Greenwich Village (6th and 16th or so?) and Jackson Hole for hamburgers. Good eats for cheap. > > >So, how about places to *stay away* from? NYC is not nearly as bad as it used to be. It always pays, however, to be alert to your surroundings at all times. That being said, you're not likely to be in any of the really bad parts. -- Andy (remove z's to respond) ------------------------------ Reply-To: "The Iron Muffin" From: "The Iron Muffin" Crossposted-To: rec.music.phish Subject: Re: CLEVELAND: Free concert this Saturday 9/24/05!! Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 22:46:13 -0400 SLAPPY wrote: > SLAP, a jazz-jam quartet, will be playing a FREE concert this saturday, > September 24 from Noon til 3pm at Market Square Park (across from the > West Side Market near downtown Cleveland). > > > For further information, please see http://www.slapjazz.com > > > Cya all there! > > > SLAPPY So, Slappy, what's your favorite Sugaree? -- The Iron Muffin DEAD FREAKS UNITE Who are you? Where are you? How are you? ------------------------------ From: "Dave Kelly" Subject: Chet Helms Tribal Stomp Lineup Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:43:15 GMT ....this looks like a fun day in the park....I mean, where ELSE can you see Vince Welnick AND Squid Vicious? Hey...whadda ya want for free? check it: http://www.2b1records.com/chetmemorial/ ------------------------------ Reply-To: "The Iron Muffin" From: "The Iron Muffin" Subject: Re: Brave New World Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:14:08 -0400 Sherry wrote: > > What they now call "ADHD" used to be called > > "an adventurous spirit and a curious mind". > > You've met my Tristan. Does he act like a drugged up zombie? Nope! > Do you honestly believe, having see how we live, that my kids > have even been not able to run around and play and climb trees > and so on? Boggle? No! > One of their favorite things to do is HIKE! Add in the years of > soccer and hockey and cross country- and not forget to mention, > we mow 3 acres with gas push mowers, and the kids have been > helping do landscape and yard chores since they were big enough > to help. As teens, they grumble a lot about it, but do it because we > do. Believe me when I say it is NOT an environmental problem > with my son, because it is not and has not been. I was referring to the thousands of children who are falsely diagnosed with (and medicated for) ADHD when they don't really have it, not Tristan. > I'm right. I KNOW. I LIVE IT! Eek! Please stop shouting at me! -- The Iron Muffin DEAD FREAKS UNITE Who are you? Where are you? How are you? ------------------------------ From: Tim Donohoe Subject: Re: Brave New World Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 03:21:24 GMT Everybody's Gonna Be Happy wrote: > > It blows my mind that any parent would seriously consider drugging up their > kid with some freaky chemical just because some nitwit doctor gets kickbacks > from some giant drug conglomerate. > THank god there was no ritalin when I was a kid. > Kids are naturally impatient and bouncy. Since most of them have no parents > around to guide or raise them during most of their day, and since the > schools they leave them at are often dull and incredibly boring, it > shouldn't surprise anyone that kids get antsie. > It seems to me that intelligent kids show signs of ADD more often than average ones, even when the parent and teacher thinks they are challenging them, the kids are still bored. Activities that involve a physical and mental workout might calm the kids down a bit. > What these antsie kids need is some time with their family and a lot of > chores to do, followed by some good physical exercise in the fresh air, be > it a sport or just the freedom to run around and climb trees. Challenges, > responsibilities, and a place to run around. This is what kids are supposed > to do, but since most kids today live in cramped cities or walled in suburbs > they don't have the chance. Throw in hundreds of hours on the game machine > and in front of the quick cutting television, and this is what we get. > Raise them as kids and all of a sudden there is no such thing as ADD. There > wasn't when I was a kid. This is an environemtally caused problem, its not > in their genes. > There may be some genes involved, they are studying the kids now and are finding some useful stats, the one I remember off the top of my head is the higher % of males that get diagnosed. If it was just boredom girls would have it too. The fact that a chemical works on some kids and not on others might be evidence that there is a chemical component to it. There are diets that work almost as well as ritalin for some kids so the chemical imbalance might be controllable that way. > I believe that a very small (tiny) number of kids have some chemical problem > that turns them into the Flash and that may need a medication. > > The vast majority are being drugged up and turned into good little robots to > satisfy society's need to ignore them and leave them to their own devices > without any guidance or responsibilites or chances to run free. Take away > the Nintendo and see if they improve. > > The parents of those kids are the ones who should be drugged; drugged to the > point where they can take being a parent and deal with having kids who do > what kids naturally do when neglected and left unchallenged. > > EGBH > There are a lot of options to try before drugs, some parents are just too impatient to try them and go right to the drugs, some kids just don't respond to anything except a drug and the parents give them ritalin rather than risk them becoming frustrated with their inability to concentrate (and learn) or act in a socially acceptable way. What bothers me is how often the drugs are tried before anything else, it has the makings of a giant conspiracy theory. ------------------------------ From: "Stephen St." Subject: Re: What's It Like in Atlantic City? Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 03:26:47 GMT "Neil X." wrote in message news:1127355552.711482.59970@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... > >> mjd wrote: >> >> A/C is a weird place - all glitz and money-grubbing tackiness along the >> boardwalk where the casinos are, then a block or two in it changes to >> post-war Dresden. >> >> The casino hotel rates jump dramatically on Fridays/Saturdays (like >> triple, from $100 to $300/nite), so if you're going to all 3 shows >> you'll take quite a hit after Thursday. You can save quite a bit by >> staying close by, in Absecon for example. You'll find motels around >> most of the nearby mainland, but avoid anything on Route 30 or in >> Pleasantville (it's not Pleasant). > > > > > OK, this is some great information. Thanks, mjd. Knowing where is > safe, and where isn't, is key. I'll definitely look in Absecon and > avoid Pleasantville. (Why is it that places with names like "pleasant" > seldom are?) > > >> Leave the fleaspray, take the cannoli... > > > I have no idea what you mean by this. > > Peace, > Neil X. Semi obscure reference to line from the first Godfather... soon after, one of my favorite movie lines of all time... Sonny "hey, forget that shit...uh...what about Paulie?" Clemenza "oh Paulie, aint gonna see him no more" ------------------------------ From: "k sturm" Subject: Re: Brave New World Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 03:28:47 GMT "Sherry" wrote in message news:BF5787AA.54EC7%sherry13@together.net... >> That was why I got so excited >> by Sherry's remark that there was a brain-scan diagnosis, because I >> thought >> perhaps she had become aware of something new. In reality, I suspect she >> mis-spoke about that. > > I'm actually planning to call my son's doctor tomorrow and ask to clarify > that. But I'm pretty sure that's what the record (mri-type brain image - I > am not sure of the exact machine they used) says. > > Sherry in Vermont > Just as I was reading this thread, there was a report on the news about a new test to see whether or not medication will work for a child diagnosed with ADHD. http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=health&id=3461293 ------------------------------ From: "alex sandoval" Subject: Re: JGB Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 03:34:20 GMT good night irene ------------------------------ From: "Olompali4" Subject: Re: Rhino's Fillmore 3 disc set Date: 21 Sep 2005 20:36:17 -0700 > Where did you find this. some cat in DNC sez... " the HMV site in Japan" ------------------------------ From: "Richard Morris" Subject: Re: Brave New World Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 20:42:01 -0700 "Sherry" wrote in message news:BF5787AA.54EC7%sherry13@together.net... >> That was why I got so excited >> by Sherry's remark that there was a brain-scan diagnosis, because I >> thought >> perhaps she had become aware of something new. In reality, I suspect she >> mis-spoke about that. > > I'm actually planning to call my son's doctor tomorrow and ask to clarify > that. But I'm pretty sure that's what the record (mri-type brain image - I > am not sure of the exact machine they used) says. > > Sherry in Vermont > I don't question that he had a brain scan. But I suspect that it was probably use *to rule out organic dysfunction* ... and thus when you have ruled out other possible causes, you are left with ADD/ADHD as the problem. So in a sense the brain scan may have resulted in a diagnosis of ADD, but only through process of elimination. Just a guess. R. ------------------------------ From: "Richard Morris" Subject: Re: Brave New World Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 20:55:20 -0700 "Tom Beck" wrote in message news:43321373.1010202@pclink.com... > Sherry wrote: > >> >> >> He's been in therapy since he was about 4, and completed a year in a >> group >> home dealing in behavior management. > > I know it sounds a bit harsh, and probably it's > too late now, but when I was a much younger asshole > I learned that a father's belt, though usually used > to hold his pants up, can be put to other uses. > Gawd. Tom, we are talking about people who appear to lack impulse control, or organizational skills, and there is nothing they can do about it. You are suggesting beating them? I have a young man right now who may be experiencing a mild form of inattentive ADD. I asked him what it was like in the classroom for him, and he described fairly frequent periods where he simply "fogs out" ... his mind wanders, he loses track of his surroundings, he misses stuff the teacher is talking about. I picked up his story and asked him if he ever experienced certain things that other kids diagnosed with ADD have described, and he burst into tears! I asked him what was making him cry and he said it was the first time anyone ever seemed to understand what he experiences. His father just thinks he is lazy. I suggested that they have him screened for petit mal seizures, because what he described could be consistent with that. Always rule out physiological causes first. Another possibility is that he is experiencing some psychological symptoms as a result of being abandoned by his mother when he was about eight. Avoid the pain by dissociating from the environment. A third possibility is ADD. The key thing here is that he is disturbed by what he experiences, and it seems beyond his ability to control. No amount of punishment is going to fix him. R. ------------------------------ From: Tim Donohoe Subject: Re: ndc-two subjects not to discuss with folks you like Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 04:00:33 GMT The Lord of Eltingville wrote: > kpnnews@yahoo.com wrote: > >>Stephen St. wrote: >> >>>Their children and how they act >>> >>>Their spouses and how they act. >> >>I would add religion to the list. We were hanging out with >>two friends this year when I opined on God answering prayers. >>My views did not jive at all with my friends wife. Subject >>would have been better left undiscussed. Politics can also >>be sketchy. I hate to say it, but education is the key with >>politics. The undereducated always spout the party lines and >>can never deviate from that (on both sides). [...] > > > I have a few well educated friends who still argue that our feckless > leader is doing a good job. I also have a couple friends whose > education stopped at high school who are the same way. > > It's not so much the level of education that compels some people to toe > a particular party line at all costs, it's their ability to understand > that their own beliefs might not always be "right," combined with their > willingness to accept that someone from "the other side" has a valid > point. Plus, sometimes people just lie about stuff ------------------------------ From: "YoMama" Subject: Can an impeached President run for office again? Date: 21 Sep 2005 21:01:21 -0700 Yes, I know - it's the Washington Post - but it's still an excellent article. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/21/AR2005092102036.html "The big surprise of Bill Clinton's Global Initiative conference at the Sheraton Hotel in New York last week was how strangely calming it was." Our country needs some "calm". ------------------------------ From: "Richard Morris" Subject: Re: Rex Benefit: Roll Call Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 21:07:26 -0700 "Dave Kelly" wrote in message news:1JmYe.1005$Ur.119@newssvr29.news.prodigy.net... > > "Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message > news:LrmYe.408$u44.183@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com... > >> WHOA !! My wife Kristine and her friend Mary Ann are gonna >> be in Sec. 4, Row 6. > > * right ON!..sec 4 row 6....seat number? > Thats OK. > I'm gonna make a special effort to grind on EVERY > female audience member in that section!....I'm gonna assume > there's MORE than enough of Kristine ta freak on? > I thought so. Used to have a cocker spaniel that would do that to female guests--male too. Finally had the sumbitch fixed. (Watch out for that DK). Getting him fixed didn't help much. His habits were already established. R. ------------------------------ From: "Richard Morris" Subject: Re: Rhino's Fillmore 3 disc set Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 21:08:16 -0700 "Olompali4" wrote in message news:1127347070.061911.26620@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > In case ya' missed the 10 disc Ltd. Ed. > This'll be retail compilation > > Fillmore 1969 > > disc1 > Morning Dew > Good Morning Little School Girl > Doin' That Rag > I'm A King Bee > Cosmic Charlie > Turn On Your Lovelight > > disc2 > Dupree's Diamond Blues > Mountains Of The Moon > Dark Star > St. Stephen > Eleven, The > Death Don't Have No Mercy > > disc3 > That's It For The Other One > Alligator > Drums > Jam > Caution (Do Not Step On The Tracks) > Feedback > We Bid You Goodnight > Is this the Owsley special edition release? :) R. ------------------------------ From: Tim Donohoe Subject: Re: Simon Wiesenthal RIP Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 04:10:53 GMT Tom Beck wrote: > > It was extremely barbaric. The full extent wasn't > known until the end though, partly because the Soviet > Union had never conducted a census of its people and > had no accurate way of knowing how many were missing. > One story I read about Wiesenthal was that he tried to kill himself twice while in the camps. In a conversation with a guard he said "Even if you do get out of here alive nobody will believe your story" After that day he decided to dedicate the rest of his life to making sure people believed the story. ------------------------------ From: "Richard Morris" Subject: Re: The REAL Disaster (NDC) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 21:16:06 -0700 "king88uy7" wrote in message news:1127350770.262801.24760@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > Richard Morris: >>Gee. Something tells me that you are white. Very white. > > Whoa. There's nothing wrong with that, is there ? > There is when you justify racism with the argument that life just isn't fair, and there is no such thing as a level playing field, people aren't equal, so accept it and get over it. Somehow I have a hard time thinking that a person of color would advance that sort of argument. Nor would a fair-minded white person. We like to assume that everyone has equal opportunity in this country, and that we can eliminate injustice. At least some folks do. Others appear to be indifferent. R. ------------------------------ From: Kelly Humphries Subject: Re: A Japanese sociological study for the benefit of Sweetbac (NDC) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 21:18:41 -0700 Also sprach "Steve Terry" : > > "band beyond description" <123@456.com> wrote in message > news:3p3t6mF8db7mU1@individual.net... > > http://www.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/getarticle.pl5?fd20050918pb.htm > > Wow, in the good ol USA we don't have that problem, just lotsa rapes and > murders. And the Japanese Mafia's control of electromagnets that change the weather. How could you forget that?!?!? http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/aplocal_story.asp?category=6420&slug=ID%20Katrina%20Revenge Hmmm, come to think of it, that part about using this secret device to make another hurricane hit the US seems oddly prescient (and karmically fulfilling)... http://www.livejournal.com/users/tongodeon/319087.html?nc=13 ------------------------------ From: Tom Beck Subject: Re: Brave New World Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:45:12 -0500 Richard Morris wrote: > "Tom Beck" wrote in message >>I know it sounds a bit harsh, and probably it's >>too late now, but when I was a much younger asshole >>I learned that a father's belt, though usually used >>to hold his pants up, can be put to other uses. > Gawd. Tom, we are talking about people who appear to lack impulse control, > or organizational skills, and there is nothing they can do about it. You > are suggesting beating them? I sincerely try not to tell others what to think or do. If I came across that way "Then what we got here, is a failure to communicate." I was a jerk shit young asshole when I had less years. It worked on me, that's all I know for sure. > > I have a young man right now who may be experiencing a mild form of > inattentive ADD. I asked him what it was like in the classroom for him, and > he described fairly frequent periods where he simply "fogs out" ... his mind > wanders, he loses track of his surroundings, he misses stuff the teacher is > talking about. I had a similar problem. Nowadays I think too much pot smoking in the parking lot was part of the problem. I picked up his story and asked him if he ever experienced > certain things that other kids diagnosed with ADD have described, and he > burst into tears! I asked him what was making him cry and he said it was > the first time anyone ever seemed to understand what he experiences. His > father just thinks he is lazy. That was my problem, in a nutshell. Lazy dip shit. Tom ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 21:40:40 -0700 Subject: Re: 10 years ago today From: Steve Lenier in article 1127258080.822434.26790@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, jizzlobber@intergate.com at jizzlobber@intergate.com wrote on 9/20/05 4:14 PM: > > Steve Lenier wrote: >> in article 1127132112.975484.216200@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, Rogues >> Island's finest at mthitch@aol.com wrote on 9/19/05 5:15 AM: >> >>> The tickets I have framed over my desk would have been used to see the >>> Grateful Dead play their last show at the Boston Garden. >>> >>> sigh. >>> >>> Mark >>> >> >> Do they have the little Jerry stamped on the back, which GDTS did for anyone >> getting a refund on those previously issued tix? My Devore tix have that. >> And I still have my Shoreline envelope which was returned unopened. >> >> sigh. >> >> Steve > > Devore totally sux balls. I am glad that show didn't happen. > I've never been. I've lived in So Cal since the place was built and have never found reason to be there. I wish that show would have happened. And dozens more after it. Steve ------------------------------ ** FOR YOUR REFERENCE ** The service addresses, to which questions about the list itself and requests to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, are as follows: Internet: dead-flames-request@gdead.berkeley.edu Bitnet: dead-flames-request%gdead.berkeley.edu@ucbcmsa Uucp: ...!{ucbvax,uunet}!gdead.berkeley.edu!dead-flames-request You can send mail to the entire list (and rec.music.gdead) via one of these addresses: Internet: dead-flames@gdead.berkeley.edu Bitnet: dead-flames%gdead.berkeley.edu@ucbcmsa Uucp: ...!{ucbvax,uunet}!gdead.berkeley.edu!dead-flames End of Dead-Flames Digest ****************************** .