From: Digestifier To: Subject: Dead-Flames Digest #324 Dead-Flames Digest #324, Volume #48 Sun, 18 Sep 05 16:00:01 PDT Contents: Re: The REAL Disaster (NDC) ("volkfolk") Re: San Francisco Deadheads..... ("volkfolk") Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Brett") Re: Anybody else get this? (polasus@my-deja.com) Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Dave Kelly") Re: Dicks Pick 10 is Mashing my Potatas! ("Nick's Picks") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? (Ken Fortenberry) Re: The REAL Disaster (NDC) ("Richard Morris") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Brett") Re: Clinton interviews.. (n9ck@earthlink.net) Re: San Francisco Deadheads..... ("Ron") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Dave Kelly") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Brett") Re: Clinton interviews.. (leftie) Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Brett") Re: Republican Criminals ("Schmoe") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("ck") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("Brett") Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? ("ck") ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "volkfolk" Subject: Re: The REAL Disaster (NDC) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:07:59 -0400 "Richard Morris" wrote in message news:e5edna5-muXVNbDeRVn-tw@comcast.com... > > "Everybody's Gonna Be Happy" wrote in message > news:YBgXe.122$aB1.1756@eagle.america.net... >> >> "volkfolk" wrote in message >> news:qrydnQg1YZCC6bDeRVn-jg@comcast.com... >>> >>> "Roxanne McDaniel" wrote in message >>> news:1mHWe.922$gK.322@newssvr22.news.prodigy.net... >>>> >>>> "Stuknot" <> wrote in message ... >>>> >>>> I found it offensive. >>>> >>>> John H. >>>> **************** >>>> I did too. >>> >>> Unfortunately, I think that there is way more than a grain of truth. >>> Forty years of "giving" people handouts instead of a hand up, has >>> resulted in innercity poor that have no skills, no future and no hope. >>> Why is that Asian immigrants come to this country and within a >>> generation have children who are valedictorians in their High School and >>> at the same time three or more generations of African American's where >>> the men are in jail or just plain missing and the girls are pregnant at >>> 14? >>> >>> I will tell you why, culture. The welfare state has created the problem, >>> It is the old cliche' "Give a man a fish he eats for a day, teach a man >>> to fish, he eats for life:" >>> >>> So while you may find it offensive, I think it hits on some essential >>> truths >>> >>> Scot >> >> >> Another thing no one wants to talk about is that almost 70% of the black >> babies in this country are born to unwed women, mostly teenagers. >> >> Bill Cosby dares to discuss the anti-education and anti-intellectual >> culture American blacks have created and are perpetuating; a culture that >> is openly opposed to personal growth and success. Black kids who do well >> in school are mocked and ostracized because they act "white". >> >> This is all connected to the welfare system and the entitlement >> mentality; but these things can change if the black community, led by >> prominent, successful, and popular black figures, puts their collective >> mind to it. >> >> There isn't much evidence this is happening or will ever happen. >> >> The Asians you mention base their lives on two things: family and >> education. This is what they value, along with a tremendous work ethic. >> Popular and successful black figures provide ostentatious displays of >> material things obtained through overnight athletic or entertainment >> success. Bling bling. > > From what I have observed over the years, black poverty is not so much a > result of the welfare state, as Scot maintains. I think that it may be > the opposite: the welfare programs grew as a result of the cultural issues > that you allude to above. I don't have the research to back it up, but I believe that the Black nuclear family was far stronger before Johnson's "Great Society" programs were put into effect. (Which is not to say that they were better off as a whole, because I don't believe that for a second) > Problem is, what do you do about it? Most welfare programs were designed > to care for *children* ... and that is the horrible bind that we are in > with respect to welfare reform. When you cut people off cold turkey, you > cut off children who need to eat. Reagan's welfare queen image was just > bullshit. The answer is job training, employment opportunities and child > care ... I agree, but with the stipulation that job training is mandatory for anyone who recieves a welfare check > What I have seen is that there is a very real and widespread sense within > the black community that it is difficult to the point of impossibility to > be successful within the system that exists in this country, because of > the sense that the deck is stacked against them due to racism. I think > that all black people are aware of this, but have internalized it to > varying degrees. I am sure that this is going to go ove like a lead balloon, but look at someone like Condi Rice. Forget her politics and look at her success. The Black community regards her as the female equivalent of an "Uncle Tom". As Toad pointed out, the popular culture is far more interested in sports or entertainment as the bench mark for success, not education or business acumen. > Some have given up, and some actively try to beat a system that they feel > has nothing for them. Those are either the welfare folks, or the > criminals. That is because there is no family support system, which I believe was severly compromised by a welfare system that penalized fathers for sticking around and supporting their families > Even black people who are successful within the system may have lingering > doubts that their case is exceptional--they made it in spite of the > system, not because of it. And most of them get reminders on a daily > basis not to take anything for granted. I don't disagree with this premise, but I think most successful people, no matter what their race, don't spend a whole lot of time dwelling on obstacles or feeling sorry for themselves. While I agree that historically Black people's opportunities were limited by their skin color, I don't believe that is true today. Economics are the biggest factor in anyones success, not race. > If this is going to change, it has to change from within the black > community, with the support of white folks. And Cosby's recent experience > demonstrates how tough that is going to be. Absolutely, but unless the Jesse Jackson's and the Louis Farrakan's stop playing the race card everytime that something happens to poor Black people it won't happen. YMMV, Scot ------------------------------ From: "volkfolk" Subject: Re: San Francisco Deadheads..... Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:09:20 -0400 "LP" wrote in message news:1126904900.710664.228850@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com... > > leftie wrote: >> Mizshely wrote: >> snip! >> >> Mizshely: HatefulNarc is a bug-eyed fuckwit and you don't want him >> within 200 miles of a David Nelson show. >> >> Trust me on this. > > This is the PERFECT setup for mark & joe to meet in the intimate > confines of a tavern.... PLEASE for the LOVE OF GOD don't try to stop > it!!!! > > LP I would pay real money to be there for that one. Scot ------------------------------ From: "Brett" Subject: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: 18 Sep 2005 14:11:29 -0700 Here... ====== Well over three decades later, Pink Floyd guitarist Roger Waters and producer Allan Parsons have finally decided to set the record straight. "We sat in the studio night after night with the film (Wizard of Oz) being projected onto the wall," Waters confessed. "And we began the arduous task of synching the album to match the film in as many ways as possible." Waters and Parsons went to great lengths to keep their projects from the rest of the members of Pink Floyd. "We would finish a day's recording and tell the other members of the band that we'll meet them in the pub in a few hours," admits Parsons. "Of course a few hours later we'd phone the pub and tell them that we had a flat tire or that one of us fell ill, and we'd spend the whole night into morning matching the tracks with the movie." Asked why they waited till now to reveal their secret, Parsons and Waters refused to officially comment. However, Waters did have this to say: "I was the driving force behind the band for virtually our entire career. The fact that I was able to have them play along with such an elaborate scheme - all without their knowledge - basically seals my fate as the heart and soul of the band." ====== Now that's interesting... Brett ------------------------------ From: polasus@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Anybody else get this? Date: 18 Sep 2005 14:25:52 -0700 I could have sworn that was going to end with :... so send me just $10." It reaffirmed my faith in people that it didn't. ------------------------------ From: "Dave Kelly" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 21:40:19 GMT "Brett" wrote in message news:1127077889.339553.293900@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... > Now that's interesting... > > Brett * Not really...yet ANOTHER lame attempt at humour by Team Meisner...you boys should go smoke some more weed. At least the "Press Conference" from a few months back had a hint of originality. This was just plain lazy. Sweetbac productions ------------------------------ From: "Nick's Picks" Subject: Re: Dicks Pick 10 is Mashing my Potatas! Date: 18 Sep 2005 14:28:18 -0700 this is the Playin>China cat right? good stuff. ------------------------------ From: Ken Fortenberry Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 21:32:39 GMT Dave Kelly wrote: > "Brett" wrote: >>Now that's interesting... >> >>Brett > > * Not really...yet ANOTHER lame attempt at humour by > Team Meisner...you boys should go smoke some more weed. > ... A *LOT* more weed. -- Ken Fortenberry ------------------------------ From: "Richard Morris" Subject: Re: The REAL Disaster (NDC) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 14:37:59 -0700 "volkfolk" wrote in message news:TridnXkmB7uKSrDeRVn-qw@comcast.com... snip > I don't disagree with this premise, but I think most successful people, no > matter what their race, don't spend a whole lot of time dwelling on > obstacles or feeling sorry for themselves. While I agree that historically > Black people's opportunities were limited by their skin color, I don't > believe that is true today. Economics are the biggest factor in anyones > success, not race. It is not a matter of dwelling on obstacles or feeling sorry for themselves. It is a matter of fact that they get daily reminders, some very trivial, some very profound, not to take anything for granted and assume that they have, "made it". A couple of examples. My colleague that I work with ... B.A. from Cal Berkeley, graduate degree in education. His wife is a medical doctor. By every stretch of the imagination, these are successful folks, with a six-figure income. We were talking about looking for a new car the other day. He mentioned that when he goes car shopping, he has to wear a shirt and tie, preferably jacket. Not wise for him to go in shorts and a t shirt like me. Why? Because car salesman make all kinds of assumptions about him as a black male that they don't make about me with respect to honesty, ability to pay, and so forth. A big deal? Not in isolation maybe. But when you encounter this shit on a regular basis, you understand that there is something out there that you have to watch out for, and that society might hold back on you at any time. Another one: My friend Dr. Tom Williams, PhD in education loves to tell the story of him driving down Interstate 5 by himself one afternoon. He needs to pass a slower-moving car so he does, but as he gets up next to the car he sees that it is being driven by a woman by herself. She looks to her left as he passes her, and sees him in his car ... and she reaches over and locks her door! Going 70 miles an hour on the freeway! I could tell you many stories like this. Most of them sort of trivial ... some involve people losing their jobs. Some involve people not being able to get jobs. In every case, it is *not* something that white people experience regularly, and most simply are not aware that it happens. They think everyone else experiences the world just like they do, and that racism passed away in our society decades ago. Some black folks teach their kids that they have to be "better than" in order to make it ... others teach their kids that the deck is stacked against them in the white man's world so they just have to get over any way that they can ... others teach their kids that in order to make it you have to be successful in the areas where black folks can compete on equal terms: sports and entertainment (or the kids soak it up from society). How many white people feel compelled to give messages like that to their kids in order to help them to cope with the world? > If this is going to change, it has to change from within the black >> community, with the support of white folks. And Cosby's recent >> experience demonstrates how tough that is going to be. > > Absolutely, but unless the Jesse Jackson's and the Louis Farrakan's stop > playing the race card everytime that something happens to poor Black > people it won't happen. Farrakan I have little use for. Hate isn't the answer, although the Nation of Islam historically preaches the self-determination that you desire everyone to practice. Jackson as a younger man worked well with young people, pushing messages of responsibility, education, self-determination, and so forth. I think he saw that maybe it wasn't enough, I don't know. I don't necessarily agree with either of them, but I am not nearly as afraid of them as I am of Bush. By the way ... the time to talk to someone about responsibility and self-determination is generally not right after they have lost everything that they own! Richard ------------------------------ From: "Brett" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: 18 Sep 2005 14:46:56 -0700 Duide, I did a web search for Dave Kelly and Sweetbac productions - Man, you should be ashamed! Here's what I found in one of the serach results: A Few Hard Men - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions A Fistful of Penis - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Assablanca - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Everybody Does Raymond - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Field of Reams - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Homo Alone - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Honey, I Blew Everybody! - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Men In Back - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Queer and Present Danger - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions Dude - are you serious with this shit? Brett ------------------------------ From: n9ck@earthlink.net Subject: Re: Clinton interviews.. Date: 18 Sep 2005 15:12:04 -0700 > > Did he not have the means and opportunity to capture OBL but pass on it? Perhaps Clinton might have gotten OBL , but I was satisfied with what Hillary Clinton said about it in her recent book. Bush didn't get OBL either....... > > His lame slacker attitude toward national security was a criminal joke on > > us. I like that phrase, "lame slacker attitutde." It describes Bush taking long vacations while terrorists from Saudi Arabia attack us; going to bed early instead sending prompt help to New Orleans. Bill Clinton was the best president we've had since JFK. I'd vote for him again if he could run, and I'll damn sure be glad when President Hillary Clinton takes office in a couple of years!! ------------------------------ From: "Ron" Subject: Re: San Francisco Deadheads..... Date: 18 Sep 2005 15:13:51 -0700 Hey Mark, don't let the left-wing loonies get ya down. DNB at the sweetwater should be fun. I wish I was able to get up there for the show, I'd buy ya a beer, from one RWNWDH to another. Peace, Ron ------------------------------ From: "Dave Kelly" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 22:32:37 GMT "Brett" wrote in message news:1127080016.110879.98390@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > Duide, I did a web search for Dave Kelly and Sweetbac productions - * Yo!...maybe one of you Hard-Ons down at "Team Meisner" could google a good spell check....whats a "Duide" > Man, you should be ashamed! Here's what I found in one of the serach > results: > > A Few Hard Men - Dave Kelly / Sweetbac productions * Listen up, you test tube BABY!....Just because you know where the cut/paste function is on your computer gives you No right!.....let me say this again.....NO right....to plunder the "Dice" Clay archives! NONE! > Dude - are you serious with this shit? * Why ALL the anger in my direction?...."Team Meisner" slipped ...again.. why take it out on me?....You guys MUST know you didn't deliver.... hopefully this will give you ree-tods time to reflect on future internet comedy bits/pranks ...I realise this is probably a goof you guys started a couple years ago...and it WAS funny at first....but to stoop to old "Dice" Cay bits?...WHEW! > Team Meisner * Sweetbac Productions ------------------------------ From: "Brett" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: 18 Sep 2005 15:26:17 -0700 TEAM MEISNER?!?! What do you think this is - NASCAR? I love how you think this whole thing is a joke. If you're waiting for a punchline, you better bring some food 'cause you're gonna be waiting a long long time. KNOCK KNOCK? WHO'S THERE? KEN KEN WHO? KEN I BORROW $1,850 DOLLARS TO FIX MY TRUCK. IT'S ME DAVE KELLY... Brett ------------------------------ From: leftie Subject: Re: Clinton interviews.. Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 15:33:33 -0700 n9ck@earthlink.net wrote: >>> Did he not have the means and opportunity to capture OBL but pass on it? > Perhaps Clinton might have gotten OBL , but I was satisfied > with what Hillary Clinton said about it in her recent book. Bush > didn't get OBL either....... > >>>His lame slacker attitude toward national security was a criminal joke on >>>us. > > I like that phrase, "lame slacker attitutde." It > describes Bush taking long vacations while terrorists from Saudi Arabia > attack us; going to bed early instead sending prompt help to New > Orleans. > > Bill Clinton was the best president we've had since JFK. I'd vote > for him again if he could run, and I'll damn sure be glad when > President Hillary Clinton takes office in a couple of years!! Clinton was a "lame slacker?" What?!?!?! He didn't even stop working during blow jobs! The man's getting his dick sucked and he's still on the phone conducting state business. That's workaholic, baby. ------------------------------ From: "Brett" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: 18 Sep 2005 15:47:39 -0700 Brett Meisner Wins again! Brett ------------------------------ Reply-To: "Schmoe" From: "Schmoe" Subject: Re: Republican Criminals Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 18:48:38 -0400 Joe wrote: > Schmoe wrote: >> Joe wrote: >>> Republicans hate you, hate your children, and they especially hate >>> anyone who questions their illegal, insane, genocidal ways. So, >>> let's hear it in unison: "Go fuck yourself, Mister Cheney!" > >> STFU. Instead of whining with off-topic posts on usenet, get off >> your ass and go do something about it. > > What do you propose I do to rid our government of Nazis, and to rid > rmgd of Nazi-sympathizers? Get involved where it counts (not here). Protest, organize protests, run for office, support non-partison politicians in their bid for office, donate funds to organizations with viable efforts to create change. But to keep posting your whining crap that everyone knows indicates you are a poser, someone who likes to complain but won't sacrifice to make change. You're exactly the type of person who you pretend to hate. It comes off as simplistic whining and exudes no message regarding the subject. ------------------------------ From: "ck" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 18:51:37 -0400 "Brett" wrote in message news:1127083659.777429.242610@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > Brett Meisner Wins again! > > Brett > i think you should wait a little more than 20 minutes to declare victory... ------------------------------ From: "Brett" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: 18 Sep 2005 15:54:22 -0700 " i think you should wait a little more than 20 minutes to declare victory... " He wrote me an apology email basically letting me know I won. Brett ------------------------------ From: "ck" Subject: Re: Waters admits Darkside / Wizard of Oz connection? Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 18:55:54 -0400 "Brett" wrote in message news:1127084062.320700.238800@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... > " i think you should wait a little more than 20 minutes to declare > victory... " > > He wrote me an apology email basically letting me know I won. > > Brett > LOL... now THAT i doubt! ------------------------------ ** FOR YOUR REFERENCE ** The service addresses, to which questions about the list itself and requests to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, are as follows: Internet: dead-flames-request@gdead.berkeley.edu Bitnet: dead-flames-request%gdead.berkeley.edu@ucbcmsa Uucp: ...!{ucbvax,uunet}!gdead.berkeley.edu!dead-flames-request You can send mail to the entire list (and rec.music.gdead) via one of these addresses: Internet: dead-flames@gdead.berkeley.edu Bitnet: dead-flames%gdead.berkeley.edu@ucbcmsa Uucp: ...!{ucbvax,uunet}!gdead.berkeley.edu!dead-flames End of Dead-Flames Digest ****************************** .