From: Digestifier To: Subject: Dead-Flames Digest #310 Dead-Flames Digest #310, Volume #48 Sat, 17 Sep 05 01:00:01 PDT Contents: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("BlackMonk") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("donz5") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("BlackMonk") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("donz5") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("er92sim") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("donz5") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("BlackMonk") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("donz5") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("donz5") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("BlackMonk") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("The Thurston Howller") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("The Thurston Howller") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("The Thurston Howller") Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson ("macca281F") ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "BlackMonk" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 02:01:30 -0400 "The Thurston Howller" wrote in message news:dggb6r$p8p$6@pita.alt.net... > > "BlackMonk" wrote in message > news:432bad3c$0$18645$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... >> >> "donz5" wrote in message >> news:1126935133.596719.285350@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... >> > BlackMonk wrote: >> > >> > >> >>You were unaware he called Mike Love a >> >>jackass and you claimed he didn't say it was tasteless for them to > perform >> >>"God Only Knows" when he said just that >> > >> > >> > Christ, you're tiresome. You really need to stop making assumptions. >> > >> >> What assumptions? These are direct quotes. Or are you now pretending that >> you ever said those things? >> >> >> > >> >>I never attacked someone for something he didn't do. >> > >> > >> > Your posts testify otherwise. >> > >> >> Wrong again. Are you going for some kind of record here? >> >> >> > >> >>That doesn't make judging a person based on gossip any more right. >> > >> > >> > And the world is relieved you're around to correct the record that Mike >> > Love is, indeed, not a jackass. Despite his vast history establishing >> > otherwise. No matter. >> > >> >> And you think the stuff you post is important? >> >> > >> >>What bullying? I said that what he did was tasteless. Why should he be >> >>allowed to call something tasteless and not me? >> > >> > >> > I refuse to believe that you're this thick and clueless over your own >> > posts. Enjoy your world. >> > >> >> I see you can't defend your own words. Why should he be allowed to call >> something tasteless and not me? >> >> Why did you say that he never did anything comprable to calling John or > Paul >> and asshole when he called Mike Love a Jackass? >> >> Why did you say he never said that performing "God Only Knows" after > Carl's >> death was tasteless when he used that exact word? > > Here we go, the old "I never said that" routine and variations > thereof......:) > Wow, you really are illiterate. There's no way anyone who has any familiarity with the English languague could possibly read that post and think it's any sort of denial. A six year old child would realize that I'm asking Donz why he's denying what he said. You'd better run out and find a six year old child. ------------------------------ From: "donz5" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: 16 Sep 2005 23:02:02 -0700 BlackMonk wrote: >>>I never attacked someone for something he didn't do. > >Your posts testify otherwise. >Wrong again. Are you going for some kind of record here? What makes your posts so tiresome is that you're stuck resorting to the same tactics you've employed so many times in past discussions -- this insistence on what one wrote and/or read that actually has no basis in reality, and your refusal to acknowledge such but instead just go on and on again making the same claims, despite the oft-cited evidence debunking them. Acknowledging your own words seems an impossible task for you. It seems that your aim is to just wear someone down if you just keep on repeating the same falsehoods. And I'm confident that this will continue with your next response. Hardly the stuff of substance, of honesty, of civility. Not your style. >And you think the stuff you post is important? And then there are these continual deflections, this irrelevant static. You get called for your bullying, so your instinct is to cloud, to distract, from your own words. The world is at fault here, not you. Nevermind the inconvenient fact that, thus far, no one here has found either your argument or your tactics persuasive. Indeed, the reactions from others to your bullying have been rather universal. It's both tiresome and boring.. As I said, enjoy your world, as delusional as it appears to be. Is it lonely up there? ------------------------------ From: "BlackMonk" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 02:04:47 -0400 "donz5" wrote in message news:1126936922.503625.117700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > BlackMonk wrote: > > >>>>I never attacked someone for something he didn't do. > > >> >Your posts testify otherwise. > > >>Wrong again. Are you going for some kind of record here? > > > What makes your posts so tiresome is that you're stuck resorting to the > same tactics you've employed so many times in past discussions -- this > insistence on what one wrote and/or read that actually has no basis in > reality, I see. Your sense of reality doesn't include direct quotes. and your refusal to acknowledge such but instead just go on > and on again making the same claims, despite the oft-cited evidence > debunking them. Acknowledging your own words seems an impossible task > for you. > What have you debunked? The claim the Macca called Mike Love a jackass? No, that actually happened. The claim the he said they were tasteless for doing "God Only Knows?" No, that happened too. So, what exactly did you debunk? ------------------------------ From: "donz5" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: 16 Sep 2005 23:09:33 -0700 The Thurston Howller wrote: >Here we go, the old "I never said that" routine and variations >thereof......:) Yep -- I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one to have noticed that he's resorted to this tactic time and time again. Then he bombards you with questions demanding you to defend words never uttered. Obnoxious to say the least. ------------------------------ From: "er92sim" <10752@hotmail.com> Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 23:09:37 -0700 "BlackMonk" wrote in message news:432baff2$0$18649$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > > "er92sim" <10752@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:3p1ognF8b447U1@individual.net... >> >> "BlackMonk" wrote in message >> news:432ba71c$0$18644$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > >>> You are very gulllible. Do you believe everything you read? >> >> Do you? >> > > I'm not the one regurgitating gossip. Ah, but you are. You talking to the Wilson's? Love being unjustly villified by the press? This is stuff straight out of the National Enquirer. > > >> Or are you just >>> the kind of person who always believes the worst about people you >>> haven't met? >> >> Mike Love has openly been an asshole in public, often. If he's doing it >> as a lark that doesn't matter, he IS being an asshole. And his suit >> against Brian and his treatment of Brian (along with many other close >> people) when he was the most vulnerable is reprehensible. >> > > You mean his suit to get credit and royalties for the songs he co-wrote? > The one that even Brian thought was justified? That one? Yes. I know he won it. But it was the harassment for years that Brian received from him that I am more referring to. > >> And this is all common knowledge. You choose to take some sort of >> defender stance, ok for you. But it's meaningless to anyone else >> connected to reality. > > What do you know about being connected to reality? LOL. This is going nowhere. A mobius strip of meaningless babble. And do the people in films newsgroups give a hang about this? This will be my last post to any group except the beatles. > > ------------------------------ From: "donz5" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: 16 Sep 2005 23:10:43 -0700 BlackMonk wrote: >What have you debunked? The claim the Macca called Mike Love a jackass? No, >that actually happened. The claim the he said they were tasteless for doing >"God Only Knows?" No, that happened too. So, what exactly did you debunk? And there it is again. Like clockwork. You're still not getting it. ------------------------------ From: "BlackMonk" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 02:13:14 -0400 "donz5" wrote in message news:1126937443.149564.25620@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > BlackMonk wrote: > > >>What have you debunked? The claim the Macca called Mike Love a jackass? >>No, >>that actually happened. The claim the he said they were tasteless for >>doing >>"God Only Knows?" No, that happened too. So, what exactly did you debunk? > > > And there it is again. Like clockwork. You're still not getting it. > In other words, you've debunked nothing. ------------------------------ From: "donz5" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: 16 Sep 2005 23:15:54 -0700 er92sim wrote: >LOL. =A0This is going nowhere. =A0A mobius strip of meaningless babble. An apt and far more concise description than my own observations over BlackMonk's argumental tactics. Nice going. Still, he'll continue to believe that he's "won" with what he's convinced is his superior, logic without realizing how dishonest it was -- just watch. ------------------------------ From: "donz5" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: 16 Sep 2005 23:17:04 -0700 BlackMonk wrote: >In other words, you've debunked nothing. And there it is yet again. ------------------------------ From: "BlackMonk" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 02:19:07 -0400 "donz5" wrote in message news:1126937373.226611.215180@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com... > The Thurston Howller wrote: > > >>Here we go, the old "I never said that" routine and variations >>thereof......:) > > > Yep -- I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one to have noticed that > he's resorted to this tactic time and time again. Then he bombards you > with questions demanding you to defend words never uttered. Obnoxious > to say the least. > No, I've asked you to defend what you DID say. You seem incapable of doing that, so you're pretending that you didn't say what you did. I'll refresh your memory. >>>What he posted was no better than repeating "Paul is an >>>asshole" or "John is an asshole." >> >> >> >> You claimed "he wrote nothing of the sort," when in fact he referred to Mike Love as a jackass. >>He suggested that The Beach Boys had no right to perform >one of their songs and that it was tasteless for them to do so. "Words never written." However, "tasteless" was the exact word that he used. So, you see, I'm not asking you to defend words you didn't write, I'm asking you to defend words you did write. ------------------------------ From: "The Thurston Howller" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:08:17 +1000 Reply-To: "The Thurston Howller" "BlackMonk" wrote in message news:432bb084$0$18645$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > > "The Thurston Howller" wrote in message > news:dggb6l$p8p$0@pita.alt.net... > > > > "BlackMonk" wrote in message > > news:432b9341$0$18650$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > >> > >> "donz5" wrote in message > >> news:1126927842.493163.192890@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... > >> > BlackMonk wrote to macca: > >> > > >> > > >> >>You really can't take criticism, can you? > >> > > >> > > >> > You didn't offer criticism; you attacked. > >> > > >> > >> He deserved it. > > > > Who died and made you the boss around here > > You did. Simpleton. ------------------------------ From: "The Thurston Howller" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:09:38 +1000 Reply-To: "The Thurston Howller" "BlackMonk" wrote in message news:432bb13f$0$18650$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > > "The Thurston Howller" wrote in message > news:dggb6r$p8p$6@pita.alt.net... > > > > "BlackMonk" wrote in message > > news:432bad3c$0$18645$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > >> > >> "donz5" wrote in message > >> news:1126935133.596719.285350@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > >> > BlackMonk wrote: > >> > > >> > > >> >>You were unaware he called Mike Love a > >> >>jackass and you claimed he didn't say it was tasteless for them to > > perform > >> >>"God Only Knows" when he said just that > >> > > >> > > >> > Christ, you're tiresome. You really need to stop making assumptions. > >> > > >> > >> What assumptions? These are direct quotes. Or are you now pretending that > >> you ever said those things? > >> > >> > >> > > >> >>I never attacked someone for something he didn't do. > >> > > >> > > >> > Your posts testify otherwise. > >> > > >> > >> Wrong again. Are you going for some kind of record here? > >> > >> > >> > > >> >>That doesn't make judging a person based on gossip any more right. > >> > > >> > > >> > And the world is relieved you're around to correct the record that Mike > >> > Love is, indeed, not a jackass. Despite his vast history establishing > >> > otherwise. No matter. > >> > > >> > >> And you think the stuff you post is important? > >> > >> > > >> >>What bullying? I said that what he did was tasteless. Why should he be > >> >>allowed to call something tasteless and not me? > >> > > >> > > >> > I refuse to believe that you're this thick and clueless over your own > >> > posts. Enjoy your world. > >> > > >> > >> I see you can't defend your own words. Why should he be allowed to call > >> something tasteless and not me? > >> > >> Why did you say that he never did anything comprable to calling John or > > Paul > >> and asshole when he called Mike Love a Jackass? > >> > >> Why did you say he never said that performing "God Only Knows" after > > Carl's > >> death was tasteless when he used that exact word? > > > > Here we go, the old "I never said that" routine and variations > > thereof......:) > > > > Wow, you really are illiterate. LOL! Hey Tom, take a tip and stay away from your habit of making "grammer" flames. You're just not smart enough...:) ------------------------------ From: "The Thurston Howller" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:30:19 +1000 Reply-To: "The Thurston Howller" "BlackMonk" wrote in message news:432bb560$0$18640$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > > "donz5" wrote in message > news:1126937373.226611.215180@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com... > > The Thurston Howller wrote: > > > > > >>Here we go, the old "I never said that" routine and variations > >>thereof......:) > > > > > > Yep -- I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one to have noticed that > > he's resorted to this tactic time and time again. Then he bombards you > > with questions demanding you to defend words never uttered. Obnoxious > > to say the least. > > > > No, I've asked you to defend what you DID say. You seem incapable of doing > that, so you're pretending that you didn't say what you did. > > I'll refresh your memory. > > >>>What he posted was no better than repeating "Paul is an > >>>asshole" or "John is an asshole." > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > You claimed "he wrote nothing of the sort," when in fact he referred to Mike > Love as a jackass. > > > >>He suggested that The Beach Boys had no right to perform > >one of their songs and that it was tasteless for them to do so. > > > conclusions on words never written.> > > "Words never written." However, "tasteless" was the exact word that he used. > > So, you see, I'm not asking you to defend words you didn't write, I'm asking > you to defend words you did write. If this whole posts makes any kind of sense to you , then your nuts. ------------------------------ From: "macca281F" Crossposted-To: rec.arts.movies.current-films,rec.music.beatles,rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1960s Subject: Re: NYRB on Smile by brian wilson Date: 17 Sep 2005 00:02:44 -0700 <>Black Monk How can I be so wrong if I never made any definitive statements? I asked who sang the song, and I said "probably" Mike Love. << 1. You thought "God Only Knows" was Carl's song for his wife. However, Brian Wilson was the one who wrote the song, and he did so long before Carl was married. >> It was the song Carl sang to his wife...it was fairly common knowledge within the band that it was Car's love song to his wife. <<2. You assumed Mike Love sang it. However, the song it pitched too high for a baritone.>> I didn't assume anything, I said "probably". That's far less than an assumption, leaving room for other possibilities, which other people have commented very politely and kindly. Personally if someone admits he's not an expert on a topic, I try to enlighten them, not call the "dickhead" right off the bat. <> I never threw around the word "asshole". That's your word. I said "jackass", and having been backstage with the Beach Boys on several occasions, I stand by that. Mike Love , IMO, is a jackass. Not to toot my own horn, but in order to dispell your assumption that I have no idea what I'm talking about, I developed a friendship with Dennis, who was a huge baseball fan, as was his 3 year old son to whom I sent some baseball paraphenalia. Unfortunately, Dennis died shortly thereafter. I'd also be happy to inform you what the BBs eat and drink backstage, and to share with you the name of a very good friend of mine from college who just happened to be the BB's guitarist (and is now, or was on his last tour, Brian Wilson' guitarist. You just need to ask politely. :) Stefan ------------------------------ ** FOR YOUR REFERENCE ** The service addresses, to which questions about the list itself and requests to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, are as follows: Internet: dead-flames-request@gdead.berkeley.edu Bitnet: dead-flames-request%gdead.berkeley.edu@ucbcmsa Uucp: ...!{ucbvax,uunet}!gdead.berkeley.edu!dead-flames-request You can send mail to the entire list (and rec.music.gdead) via one of these addresses: Internet: dead-flames@gdead.berkeley.edu Bitnet: dead-flames%gdead.berkeley.edu@ucbcmsa Uucp: ...!{ucbvax,uunet}!gdead.berkeley.edu!dead-flames End of Dead-Flames Digest ****************************** .