From brown.1572@osu.edu Thu Nov 7 06:19:05 2002 Received: from mailscan4.cac.washington.edu (mailscan4.cac.washington.edu [140.142.33.15]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.12.1+UW01.12/8.12.1+UW02.10) with SMTP id gA7EJ4dr043692 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 06:19:04 -0800 Received: FROM mxu4.u.washington.edu BY mailscan4.cac.washington.edu ; Thu Nov 07 06:19:03 2002 -0800 Received: from mail-mta1.service.ohio-state.edu (mail-mta1.service.ohio-state.edu [128.146.216.41]) by mxu4.u.washington.edu (8.12.1+UW01.12/8.12.1+UW02.09) with ESMTP id gA7EJ3g3018308 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 06:19:03 -0800 Received: from osu.edu (dhcp-uh-249-209.cohums.ohio-state.edu [140.254.249.209]) by mail-mta1.service.ohio-state.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.6 (built Apr 26 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H5700B7NMFQ7H@mail-mta1.service.ohio-state.edu> for classics@u.washington.edu; Thu, 07 Nov 2002 09:19:03 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 09:01:45 -0500 From: h p brown Subject: Re: a metrical query To: classics@u.washington.edu Reply-to: brown.1572@osu.edu Message-id: <3DCA7249.2A4DA0AA@osu.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Win98; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en References: there are also 20 some articles in LSJ beginning with the sequence 'ekph-' as well, all (well I didn't check them all) involve prefixed /ek-/ which seems to not undergo leftward spread of aspiration by a lexical rule preventing that spread. why? well lexical rules are idiosyncratic, there's just no reasoning with them, but it probably has something to do with the sequence [ekh-] not being perceptible as underlyingly /ek-/ and so forms like the expected but opaque *ekhthlibo would have been replaced with the 'irregular' but transparent [ek-thlibo], etc. h p brown OSU G&L John Isles wrote: > Um, my Middle Liddell lists 27 Greek words that begin ekth- including > ekthlibo from which we get ecthlipsis. The three ecth- words I mentioned > earlier that are listed in the OED (ecthlipsis, ecthesis and ecthyma) are > all exact transliterations from the Greek, according to the OED. Are > Liddell & Scott and the OED wrong, then? > > John > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Hendry" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 7:46 PM > Subject: Re: a metrical query > > > I believe 'ecthlipsis' is the Latinized spelling, 'echthlipsis' (or > > 'ekhthlipsis') the direct transliteration from the Greek. I can't find > > where he said it, but Housman has some rude words somewhere about editors > of > > Latin texts not knowing that Latin drops the 'h' in the first of two > > successive aspirated consonants. In other words, 'cthonius' and 'Pthia' > are > > correct for Latin, even though they come from Greek words that begin with > > chi and phi, not kappa and pi. > > > > Tangent: When he was still in prep school, Edmund Wilson and his friends > > pleased their Latin teacher by inventing a figure of speech and calling it > > 'thypsis' (or possibly 'thipsis' -- I forget which). 'Ecthlipsis' sounds > > much more made-up than their made-up word. > > > > Michael Hendry > > 534-B Greenleaf Meadows > > Greece, NY 14612 > > (585) 865-3052 > > E-mail: curculio@earthlink.net > > Web-page: http://www.curculio.org .