From apeiron@satx.rr.com Sun Jan 27 10:57:14 2002 Received: from mailscan6.cac.washington.edu (mailscan6.cac.washington.edu [140.142.33.14]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.12.1+UW01.12/8.12.1+UW02.01) with SMTP id g0RIvCw6135112 for ; Sun, 27 Jan 2002 10:57:12 -0800 Received: FROM mxu4.u.washington.edu BY mailscan6.cac.washington.edu ; Sun Jan 27 10:57:12 2002 -0800 Received: from sm14.texas.rr.com (sm14.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.41]) by mxu4.u.washington.edu (8.12.1+UW01.12/8.12.1+UW02.01) with ESMTP id g0RIvA37030562 for ; Sun, 27 Jan 2002 10:57:11 -0800 Received: from spike (cs666947-85.satx.rr.com [66.69.47.85]) by sm14.texas.rr.com (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16) with ESMTP id g0RIxVpL009666 for ; Sun, 27 Jan 2002 12:59:32 -0600 From: "Dimitrius" To: Subject: RE: "The gods" vs. "God" in Aristotle Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2002 12:57:04 -0600 Message-ID: <000001c1a764$6946a450$6401a8c0@spike> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C1A732.1EAC3450" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2605 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C1A732.1EAC3450 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm about as far from scholarly as you can get, but I'll give your question a whirl as it is a problem I encountered with both Plato and Aristotle. Personally, I believe that Aristotle is trying to further the monotheistic notion you noticed. I also think that the term "the gods" is used loosely in an idiomatic sort of way as a conceptual tool (such as "By the gods" or "The powers that be" or what have you) in order to make or prove certain points. I don't think there are two different terms for God and "the gods" in Greek, though I could be wrong (the specific language is different, of course, with respect to plurality). After some lengthy research we could probably uncover some other term that was customarily translated as "the gods" but I'm not certain. I studied most of Aristotle under the assumption that he believed in a single god. This sort of problem was common for me in Aristotle, but I think it gets easier as you get to know him more. So, to answer your question, yes I believe Aristotle is indicating a single God. Try different translations to clear up confusion about artifacts or antiquated terms or ideas. This is a place where perseus could be a great help. Also, before making any guesses or assumptions I will stand by about Aristotle's own beliefs with respect to God or gods I would need to re-study Metaphysics in earnest. Take the ideas herein from a fellow student whose questions probably match your own. Dimitrius Rue -----Original Message----- From: CLASSICS-owner@u.washington.edu [mailto:CLASSICS-owner@u.washington.edu] On Behalf Of Brant Reiter Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 3:19 PM To: classics@u.washington.edu Subject: "The gods" vs. "God" in Aristotle Hello. I'm a layman reading Aristotle in translation, so I'm pretty much at the mercy of my translators when it comes to trying to make sense of the text. I've been reading the Penguin translations, which are very helpful in terms of footnotes and explanatory notes, but I've come up against one recurring problem that I haven't been able to figure out just by reading the books, so I'm hoping that perhaps some real scholars out there might be able to help me out. In 1178b7 - 29 (p. 333 of J.A.K. Thomson's translation) of the Nichomachean Ethics, in the space of one paragraph I get: "The gods in our conception of them are truly happy and blessed" and then later, in the same paragraph, "It follows, then, that the activity of God, which is supremely happy, must be a form of contemplation." Reference to a singular, Capitalized "God" is also made in Hugh Lawson-Tancred's translation of the Metaphysics (Lambda 7), but again we get the plural, non-capitalized "the gods" in Trevor Saunders' translation of the Politics ("Just as men imagine gods in human in shape, so they imagine their way of life to be like that of men" [1252b15]). So, um...what's going on here? Are there two different words in Greek for "the gods" and "God"? Is Aristotle indicating a monotheistic "God," or is this just an artifact of the translation? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Many thanks, Brant Reiter _____ Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C1A732.1EAC3450 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

 

I’m about as far from = scholarly as you can get, but I’ll give your question a whirl as it is a = problem I encountered with both Plato and Aristotle.  Personally, I believe that Aristotle is trying to further the monotheistic notion you noticed.  I also think that the term “the gods” is used loosely in an = idiomatic sort of way as a conceptual tool (such as “By the gods” or = “The powers that be” or what have you) in order to make or prove = certain points.  I don’t = think there are two different terms for God and “the gods” in Greek, = though I could be wrong (the specific language is different, of course, with = respect to plurality).  After some = lengthy research we could probably uncover some other term that was customarily translated as “the gods” but I’m not certain.  I studied most of Aristotle = under the assumption that he believed in a single god.  This sort of problem was common = for me in Aristotle, but I think it gets easier as you get to know him more.  So, to answer your question, = yes I believe Aristotle is indicating a single God.  Try different translations to = clear up confusion about artifacts or antiquated terms or ideas.  This is a place where perseus could be a great help.  Also, before making any guesses = or assumptions I will stand by about Aristotle’s own beliefs with = respect to God or gods I would need to re-study Metaphysics in = earnest.  Take the ideas herein from a = fellow student whose questions probably match your = own.

 

Dimitrius<= /font> Rue

 

 

-----Original = Message-----
From: CLASSICS-owner@u.washington.edu [mailto:CLASSICS-owner@u.washington.edu] = On Behalf Of Brant Reiter
Sent: = Sunday, January 27, = 2002 3:19 PM
To: = classics@u.washington.edu
Subject: "The = gods" vs. "God" in Aristotle

 

Hello. I'm a layman reading Aristotle in = translation, so I'm pretty much at the mercy of my translators when it comes to = trying to make sense of the text.  I've been reading the Penguin = translations, which are very helpful in terms of footnotes and explanatory notes, but I've = come up against one recurring problem that I haven't been able to figure out = just by reading the books, so I'm hoping that perhaps some real scholars out = there might be able to help me out.

 

In 1178b7 - 29 (p. 333 of J.A.K. Thomson's translation) of the Nichomachean Ethics, in the space of one paragraph I = get: "The gods in our conception of them are truly happy and = blessed" and then later, in the same paragraph, "It follows, then, that the = activity of God, which is supremely happy, must be a form of contemplation."   Reference to a singular, Capitalized "God" is also made in Hugh Lawson-Tancred's translation of the Metaphysics (Lambda 7), but again we get the plural, non-capitalized = "the gods" in Trevor Saunders' translation of the Politics ("Just = as men imagine gods in human in shape, so they imagine their way of life to be = like that of men" [1252b15]).  So, um...what's going on here?  = Are there two different words in Greek for "the gods" and = "God"?  Is Aristotle indicating a monotheistic "God," or is this = just an artifact of the translation?

 

Any help would be greatly = appreciated.

 

Many thanks,

Brant Reiter


Join the world’s largest e-mail service = with MSN Hotmail. Click = Here

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