From owner-btk-mca@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Wed Nov 17 09:37:18 1999 Return-Path: Delivered-To: btk-mca-archive@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Received: by mercury.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (Postfix, from userid 110) id AAEAC17A63; Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:37:17 +0000 (GMT) Received: from niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (niobium [193.62.192.41]) by hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA15702 for ; Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:37:15 GMT Received: (from news@localhost) by niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) id JAA24780 for btk-mca-list@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk; Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:37:14 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk: news set sender to using -f From: s.eaton@ich.ucl.ac.uk ("Simon Eaton") X-Newsgroups: bionet.metabolic-reg Subject: Re: 'key' concepts Date: 17 Nov 1999 09:37:13 -0000 Organization: MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre Lines: 102 Message-ID: <199911170937.JAA05811@stella.ich.ucl.ac.uk> References: <01HW.B4579A3C000111B50A0200CC@news.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Trace: niobium.hgmp.mrc.ac.uk 942831433 24777 193.62.192.80 (17 Nov 1999 09:37:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk X-Received: from stella.ich.ucl.ac.uk (stella.ich.ucl.ac.uk [194.82.241.101]) by hgmp.mrc.ac.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA15689 for ; Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:37:10 GMT X-Received: from pc244-044 by stella.ich.ucl.ac.uk (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA05811; Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:37:05 GMT X-To: btk-mca@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk X-Reply-to: s.eaton@ich.ucl.ac.uk X-Priority: normal X-In-reply-to: <01HW.B4579A3C000111B50A0200CC@news.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12a) To: btk-mca@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Sender: owner-btk-mca@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk Precedence: bulk I agree with Simon- the concept "key" should be reserved for grant applications and corporate-style presentations. It does seem virtually meaningless within the cell. From: Simon Dobbs Subject: Re: 'key' concepts Date sent: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:16 +0000 Organization: dobbs research To: btk-mca@hgmp.mrc.ac.uk > On Tue, 16 Nov 1999 15:32:14 +0000, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote > (in message ): > > > David Chipman claimed that "it is very clear and very obvious what is meant > > by "a key > > metabolite in [the nonmevalonate] pathway". > > > > I intended to comment on this contribution when it appeared, especially the > > last paragraph ("I don't think it is wise for one school of theoreticians > > to lay absolute claim to the legitimate use of terms [e.g., 'key'] that > > they didn't invent..."), but as Pedro did that very effectively already > > there didn't seem much point. > > > > However, I was reminded of Douglas's original point when the latest issue > > of Eur. J. Biochem. appeared (vol. 266, number 1, Nov. 1999), as it > > contains a review (pp. 1-16) whose authors like the phrase "key > > intermediate" so much that they use it not only in the title but also in > > the first sentence of the abstract and in the first caption of the > > introduction. However, try as I might I cannot see that they are using in > > it the sense that David Chipman finds so obvious. > > > > They seem just to mean that phosphatidic acid is an essential substrate for > > various enzymes of lipid metabolism, not that "this is one of the > > metabolites which DEFINES > > in the conceptual sense" lipid metabolism, which would surely be absurd. > > > > So does the "very clear and very obvious" sense apply only to the > > nonmevalonate pathway, or is phosphatidic acid not truly a key intermediate? > > > > Among other things, Pedro wrote "'Key' used in this way is really a useless > > word, since then all enzymes are key... Remove any enzyme out of a pathway > > and it will no > > longer function." > > > > True enough, of course, but it may be worth recalling the time 30 years ago > > (too long ago for Pedro to remember...) when what many people regarded as > > an important enzyme (I don't think anyone called it key) was chymotrypsin. > > Despite being one of the few possible exceptions to Pedro's rule, being one > > of the few enzymes that one can readily imagine life getting on quite well > > without (about as unkey as you could ask for), it had a considerable > > importance by virtue of being an enzyme that was available in large amounts > > and was reasonably stable. It thus allowed a lot of the groundwork of > > enzymology to be laid that would have been impossible to do with enzymes > > that might have seemed more interesting biologically. > > > > Athel > > > > > > > > ================================================================ > > > > Athel Cornish-Bowden > > > > Laboratoire de Chimie Bacterienne, Centre National de la Recherche > > Scientifique, 31 chemin Joseph-Aiguier, B.P. 71, 13402 Marseille Cedex 20, > > France > > > > athel@ibsm.cnrs-mrs.fr > > Phone: + 33 491 16 41 38; fax: + 33 491 71 89 14 > > > > http://ir2lcb.cnrs-mrs.fr/~athel/homepage.htm > > > > Now available: Basic Mathematics for Biochemists (2nd edn.) > > http://ir2lcb.cnrs-mrs.fr/~athel/basmaths.htm > > > > > > --- > > 3Key2 is one of the most miss-used words in everyday vocabulary, not only in > this instance but throughout everyday speech and the media. Speakers and > authors seem to believe it bestows an implicit importance to their topic of > conversation. We now have 3key skills2 in education circles, which rather > gratuitously, and for no good reason, replaced core skills a couple of years > ago. We have key stages one to five in school education. Since all levels are > key stages , why is this redundant word used? The worst usage is the awful > mixed metaphor 3he has a key role to play in this scenario2 ... visions of > actors dressed as giant keys strutting and soliloquizing about on a stage. > Some time ago I set up the campaign for the abolition of the adjective key > (CAK), but it seems to have been largely ignored. > > Simon Eaton Research Fellow, Unit of Paediatric Surgery Institute of Child Health 30 Guilford Street, London WC1N 1EH Phone +44 171 905 2158 (Office, direct line) Phone +44 171 242 9789 ext. 2618 (lab) Fax +44 171 404 6181 --- .