--- Log opened Mon Oct 03 00:00:17 2005
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03:37:42< mcp> dmacks: brickhouse works with tiger?
03:54:10< shres> asari: ping ?
03:54:26< asari> here!
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03:58:26< shres> asari: tell me one thing, if u use the debian method to build with system stuff and get deb's out of it. Then ur job is done right ?
03:59:20< asari> I don't see any debian's method
04:00:20< shres> u checked out ooo-build ?
04:00:58< asari> yep, only checked out, have't took a look yet
04:01:51< shres> ok, let me look
04:02:07< asari> shres: thanks..
04:02:51< asari> it would help, but almost done by myself, I think.
04:03:08< shres> this is mostly for the future, and i am doing it for fun :-)
04:03:19< asari> ahm, not only by myself. many help was given in #OO.o, etc.
04:03:50< shres> maybe for the next experimental release, we will tinker with the ooo-build idea
04:03:50< asari> shres: your fun will help me, anyway ;)
04:04:08< asari> tinker?
04:04:25< shres> try to use ooo-build i mean
04:04:42< shres> i will try it and if u find it convienient u can use it
04:04:52< asari> cool
04:05:56< shres> asari: look inside distro-configs/Debian.conf
04:06:12< shres> thats how debian builds ooo
04:06:18< asari> okay...
04:10:10< asari> my new finkinfo seems to have more --system- lines than any :)
04:10:10-!- Wizardling [i=Jamie@60-234-154-60.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #fink
04:12:49< asari> shres: anyway, thanks for your help
04:13:24< shres> asari: no problem
04:14:46< asari> shres: btw, don't you know any good tool for..
04:14:46< asari> http://download.openoffice.org/2.0.0rc/source.html
04:15:04< asari> get urls from this page?
04:15:13< asari> getting, or extracting
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04:15:40< Wizardling> Hello
04:15:56< shres> ok so, i just do a ./download after configuring with the right tag in ooo-build ;)
04:16:19< Wizardling> Is there any offical tie to the Fink project here?
04:16:19< shres> which does a wget i presume
04:16:23< shres> but those packages are zipped up and put into ooo-build mirros
04:18:41 * asari find . -name \*mirror\* in ooo-build directory
04:19:37 * asari ... in vain
04:19:42< shres> just use the default mirror
04:19:58< shres> i dont think there are too many mirrors yet ;)
04:20:15< shres> http://go-ooo.org/packages
04:20:36< asari> yeah, too many to write in CustomMirror: ..
04:29:43< asari> shres: `xml sel  -t -m "//a" -v "@href" -n < source.html` was that, maybe you don't have interest :)
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07:35:01< rand-irc> morn all
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08:14:48< cirdan> morning all
08:14:56< cirdan> 1st morning in new orleans
08:16:36< rand-irc> morn cirdan
08:16:44< rand-irc> you moved down there?
08:23:50-!- RangerAway is now known as RangerRick
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08:42:31< cirdan> rand-irc: no, on nat guard duty
08:42:35< cirdan> pulling security
08:42:42 * cirdan is a police officer for a month
08:42:44< cirdan> :-p
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08:44:24< rand-irc> ah
08:44:26< rand-irc> scary :)
08:44:32< cirdan> yup
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08:52:31< rand-irc> how long are you down ther for?
08:53:45< shres> hmmm.. there is no /proc in mac i presume ?
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09:01:38< asari> shres: what do you want to know by /proc?
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09:07:19< cirdan> rand-irc: 1 month
09:07:32< cirdan> dmacks_: you get my email?
09:07:32< dmacks_> Wizardling: We're the official IRC channel for the Fink project. What's up?
09:07:37< dmacks_> cirdan: Yup. Thanks!
09:07:50-!- dmacks [n=dmacks@pdpc/supporter/active/dmacks] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
09:08:03< cirdan> try tio erase the rax id # at the bottom of the 1st page :-)
09:08:07< cirdan> tax, not rax
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09:08:39< dmacks> Okay.
09:09:37< cirdan> also mayb wanna send a letter to dmalloc
09:09:37< cirdan> :-p
09:09:38< cirdan> his address is there
09:10:43< dmacks> Good idea! That addy is different than his whois record.
09:11:14< cirdan> should be his real legal address
09:11:24< dmacks> ya
09:11:43< dmacks> There was a dmalloc sighting here last nite! And miga too!
09:11:55< dmacks> (or else pogma is goofing off:)
09:11:56< gezick> so, fink is trying to install autoconf, and remove autoconf2.5 when i do an update-all after upgrading to tiger
09:12:02< gezick> how do i deal with that?
09:12:21< gezick> and yes, i just selfupdate'd and cleared out my  apt cache
09:12:23< cirdan> !seen dmalloc
09:12:26< Melian> dmalloc <~whatever@chello080108111128.5.11.univie.teleweb.at> was last seen on IRC in channel #fink, 63d 8h 3m 48s ago, saying: 'hello'.
09:12:30< dmacks> gezick: Um, let it do it. What's the problem?
09:13:09< dmacks> cirdan: he didn't say anything:(
09:13:09< gezick> well, it can't remove autoconf2.5
09:13:09< cirdan> yeah :-(
09:13:09-!- cirdan is now known as dmalloc
09:13:15-!- dmalloc is now known as cirdan
09:13:15< cirdan> get him!
09:13:18< cirdan> gar, he left!
09:13:35< gezick> but why would i want to downgrade from 2.59-6 to 2.13-4
09:13:41< gezick> besides which automake 1.9 depends on autoconf2.5
09:13:44< cirdan> some things need old versions of stuff
09:13:58< dmacks> Perhaps the newer version enforces restrictions that were not present (and are violated) by something a certain package needs?
09:14:03< gezick> wouldn't it also stand to reason that some things need the new servsions instead?
09:14:14< dmacks> Yes. That's why we have both available:)
09:14:55< dmacks> But to solve your particular problem, we need to see your particular error message.
09:14:58< dmacks> !lisppaste
09:14:58< Melian> You can use lisppaste to paste errors at http://paste.lisp.org/new/fink , instead of flooding the channel.
09:18:03< lisppaste> gezick pasted "errors." at http://paste.lisp.org/display/12191
09:18:17< gezick> it's trying to install both autoconf and autoconf2.5
09:18:52< dmacks> And? /me doesn't see any error message.
09:19:56< lisppaste> gezick annotated #12191 with "actualerror" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/12191#1
09:20:57< gezick> of course, now i've cleared out my apt-cache, remove autoconf2.5 and automake1.9 by hand, and now apt can't find the autoconf2.5 package again.
09:21:10< gezick> and an apt-get update didn't help
09:21:52< dmacks> update-all doesn't work well when it tries to update many packages at once.
09:22:20< dmacks> (because one pkg may want one thing, another wants a conflicting thing, and it can't figure out how to satisfy both)
09:22:31< dmacks> Doing just 'fink update [one package]
09:22:52< dmacks> will work better because no one package would want mutually-exclusive things.
09:23:08< gezick> ok
09:24:05< lisppaste> gezick annotated #12191 with "can't find autoconf2.5" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/12191#2
09:24:16< gezick> what should i do about that error then?
09:24:28< dmacks> 'fink remove automake1.9'
09:24:45< gezick> i already did that.
09:25:11< dmacks> Then why does the error say that automake1.9 is in the way?
09:26:22< pogma> dmacks: dmalloc joined and left? maybe he'll join and stay and give us a new email addy soon :-)
09:26:48< dmacks> pogma: Yup and yup. Saw it in the logs sometime in past 2 days
09:27:05< gezick> mdmacks: because they're error output from two separate commands.
09:27:08< pogma> yeah, I scrolled back and saw a dmalloc
09:27:12< gezick> note 2 is the error from the seccond.
09:27:33< dmacks> Thanks for making this as confusing as possible.
09:28:10< pogma> fink remove automake1.9 says that?
09:28:13< pogma> wow
09:28:28< dmacks> gezick: We can't read your mind or your screen, man. You gotta tell us specifics...cause-effect.
09:29:07< cirdan> bbl...
09:29:46< akh> gezick: "fink rebuild autoconf2.5"--your system is looking for a nonexistent local binary archive.
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09:30:54< akh> (we need to tell people to run "fink scanpackages" after manually clobbering their .deb files)
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09:42:48< dmacks> Aw man...-submissions is basing stuff on stable and finding mistakes there:)
09:43:41< dmacks> We should rename "unstable" and "stable" to "current" and "crusty crap for the bindist"
09:44:02< akh> Yup
09:44:48< dmacks> RangerRick: What's the status on your apt upgrade project?
09:48:51 * dmacks wants to change an error-message wording, seems silly to push a big recompile just for that:)
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09:54:56< RangerRick> dmacks: I think it's all OK, but I'd really like to see some other people test it
09:59:58 * dmacks will try it today if you want. Could you add the patch from http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1285996&group_id=17203&atid=117203 to it?
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10:04:35< shres> asari: dude, do u install sun java or build with gcj ?
10:05:41< RangerRick> dmacks: ok
10:05:55< asari> Build with /System/Library/Frameworks/JavaVM.framework/Commands/javac, which comes with Mac OS X.
10:06:41< asari> shres: no additional installation is needed.
10:07:28< shres> ah, cool
10:08:13< asari> shres: try `ls -l /usr/bin/javac`
10:17:35-!- asari [n=asari@p2204-ipbf509marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has quit ["Quitting!"]
10:24:19< RangerRick> dmacks: I'm also trying to make it so that it can install the apt-ftparchive bit, so hang on until you seen an update
10:24:36< RangerRick> building db4 statically
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10:53:58< dmacks> RangerRick: /me thumb-twiddles.
10:59:20-!- asari [n=chatzill@p2204-ipbf509marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #Fink
11:05:55< RangerRick> dmacks: alright
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11:36:00< dmacks> @duke.edu now?
11:36:29< dmacks> I'm tellin' ya...#fink is better than a nationwide RFID network!
11:39:52< drm> nah, not really there
11:40:20< drm> the physics institute in santa barbara blocks the irc port in its firewall
11:41:35< drm> !seen msachs
11:41:35< Melian> msachs <n=msachs@c-24-34-72-223.hsd1.ma.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #fink, 16d 10h 25m 10s ago, saying: 'newmanbe, I don't know anything about they do!'.
11:43:02 * dmacks has been looking for him too
11:46:14 * drm vaguely imagines that brandeis must shut down for a week or so... starting when, tomorrow?
11:47:51< dmacks> Tonite.
11:47:51< drm> ah
11:50:10< dmacks> According to the brandeis alum here, they're only closed the holidays themselves, not the days in between.
11:51:00< dmacks> WHICH IS NOT EXCUSE!!! REPENT NOW FOR YOUR EVIL #DPORTS WAYS!!!
11:51:48< drm> what, he's doing dports now?
11:52:33< dmacks> nah, /me just needed *something* to ramble-on about on the theme of repentence:)
11:54:37 * asari joined #DarwinPorts
11:54:59< dmacks> * #darwinports was kicked by #fink
11:55:26< asari> heh, howdy dmacks, drm
11:55:32< dmacks> hello asari:)
11:55:32< drm> dmacks: sounds about right
11:55:58< drm> dmacks: i can't figure out how to send a private msg with this braindead irc client
11:56:08< drm> hi asari
11:56:10< dmacks> heh:)
11:56:33< drm>  HELP_PATH error: No such file or directory
11:56:43< drm> grrrr :)
11:57:47< asari> drm: export HELP_PATH=/dev/random will help you 
11:58:03< dmacks> h
11:58:03< dmacks> a
11:58:09< drm> help me what? :/
11:59:46< drm> ok, time to get to work...bbl
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12:10:37< dmacks> Now *that's* a useful symlink:  python -> @PYTHONINCLUDE@
12:18:50< akh> Sarcasm?
12:18:56< dmacks> Yes.
12:19:15< akh> Thought so. ;-)
12:20:08< dmacks> RangerRick: apt is giving me compiler warnings: warning: invalid conversion from `unsigned int*' to `int*'
12:20:19< dmacks> But otherwise so far so good...
12:20:36-!- ringerc [n=craig@dsl-202-72-144-62.wa.westnet.com.au] has quit ["zzzz"]
12:20:56< dmacks> (assuming it doesn't actually try to access include/python, that is:)
12:21:10< RangerRick> ok
12:24:40< dmacks> Whoops, spoke too soon: writer.cc:31:17: ftw.h: No such file or directory
12:27:11< RangerRick> erp?
12:27:32< RangerRick> I've got that in /usr/include
12:28:10< dmacks> If you're not keeping the HAVE_SOCKLEN_T parts of the .patch, you can prolly drop its -D from the CXXFLAGS
12:28:46< dmacks> The only /usr/include/ft* on my 10.3 box is fts.h
12:29:17< RangerRick> will that fix it?
12:29:42< dmacks> (and no ftw.h in any of my receipts, so it's *gasp* not an Installer.app problem)
12:29:48< dmacks> Dunno...what is ftw.h?
12:30:03< RangerRick> I'm asking bomgrep right now  :)
12:31:11< RangerRick> comes from DevSDK.pkg and MacOSX10.4.Universal.pkg for me
12:31:11< RangerRick> guess it's only in xcode 2.2 maybe?
12:31:11< dmacks> My RedHat box has both .h.
12:31:11< RangerRick> I thought I tried this stuff on 10.3, but...
12:31:11< akh> RangerRick: I've got it from XCode 2.1
12:31:31< RangerRick> sounds like it's a dmacks problem then  :)
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12:32:12< akh> Yeah--him and that silly outmoded OS.
12:32:18< dmacks> Yeah, I flew to Cupertino and broke all of XCode1.x distros! BWAHAHAHAHA!
12:32:30-!- muesli [n=muesli@mail.muehlhaeuser.de] has joined #fink
12:32:36 * dmacks holds world hostage for...one Meeeeelion dollars!
12:32:54 * RangerRick will try it on 10.3
12:33:30< dmacks> (Also, 4-place compatibility_version isn't legal I don't think)
12:34:42< RangerRick> should only be 3
12:34:53< RangerRick> oh, I see
12:34:53< RangerRick> yeah
12:35:04< dmacks> :)
12:35:08< gecko2> !lart dmacks for talking to much
12:35:08 * Melian pulls out her louisville slugger and uses dmacks's head to break the homerun record for talking to much
12:35:14< gecko2> *g*
12:35:36< dmacks> *wheeeeeee* I-can-see-you're-house-from-heeeeeeere!
12:35:45< gecko2> dmacks: http://ircstats.freeforge.net/fink-stats.html <-- if you want to know why i've done that =)
12:36:29< dmacks> interesting
12:38:21< dmacks> "Poor his, nobody likes him/her. He/She was attacked 2 times." ?
12:39:03< gecko2> someones nick was his =)
12:39:31< dmacks> Nope. Someone's parser doesn't understand language.
12:39:41< RangerRick> no, if you look at the example, it's "* RangerRick slaps his forhead"
12:40:04< gecko2> or just a misinterpretation
12:42:36< dmacks> RangerRick: could you add a DescPackaging about detecting docbook2man but not using it (if that is the case)? Otherwise someone's gonna bitch about missing dep.
12:48:40< dmacks> The existing ftp-archive pkg shleps along its own ftw.* files
12:49:08< dmacks> in %n.patch
12:49:40< RangerRick> hm, ok
12:50:19< RangerRick> I'll add 'em
12:50:56< dmacks> bbl
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13:34:07< akh> (apropos message on -devel) Just when we thought we were rid of storable-pm, they drag it right back in...
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14:01:21< spiral> hi
14:02:18< akh> hi
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14:31:16< dmacks> akh: DIE STORABLE DIE!
14:32:53< cirdan> hahaha
14:32:54< cirdan> hey dmacks
14:32:59< cirdan> akh
14:32:59< dmacks> hiya
14:34:23< dmacks> RangerRick: New apt (-ftparchive component) calls %p/bin/gzip explicitly; prolly a good idea to add Depends:gzip so we don't screw it up.
14:34:47-!- vasi [n=vasi@modemcable133.147-70-69.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #fink
14:35:28< cirdan> hey vasi
14:35:58< vasi> hey
14:36:02< dmacks> vasi's back from the dead^Wsemester!
14:36:02< cirdan> ok, we need some officers for fink.inc
14:36:05< cirdan> lawyer needed names
14:36:05< vasi> heh, shanah tovah dmacks :-)
14:36:05< dmacks> (l'shanah tova, btw:)
14:36:05< dmacks> heh:)
14:36:05< cirdan> president, vice, and treasurer
14:36:12< cirdan> heh
14:36:35< dmacks> "May the new new be full of a unified transliteration scheme."
14:36:54< vasi> ?
14:37:00< dmacks> crap....s/new new/new year/
14:37:06< vasi> ah yeah
14:37:42< vasi> it's not so bad rosh hashanah
14:38:08< vasi> when you get goyim wishing a 'happy chanuka', but they say it 'ch' like in 'chair'
14:38:28< dmacks> heh yeah
14:38:28< vasi> that gets weirder
14:38:51< cirdan> lol
14:39:11< vasi> cirdan, drm said you were going somewhere?
14:39:29< dmacks> Goes bad the other way too...friend of mine was looking at something about the bible, asked me what the "tanak" was.
14:40:33< dmacks> Melian: tell cirdan where to go.
14:41:22< cirdan> vasi: yeah, deployed to New Orleans to help out
14:41:22< cirdan> !lart dmacks
14:41:22 * Melian runs at dmacks with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut
14:41:34< vasi> oh wow, good luck with that
14:41:59< cirdan> yeah
14:42:09< cirdan> it's ok
14:42:21< cirdan> looks like i'll be living in the convention center for the next month
14:42:56< vasi> there are still people there!? nuts...
14:43:13< RangerRick> dmacks: ah, yeah
14:43:22< RangerRick> I also failed to build on 10.3
14:43:22< RangerRick> make[2]: .//msgcomm: Command not found
14:43:22< dmacks> Well yeah, *someone*'s gotta give out swag at the exhibition booths.
14:43:33< RangerRick> msgcomm is supposed to be part of the gettext utils, on my tiger box, I have an /sw/bin/msgcomm but it's not owned by any package!
14:43:39< RangerRick> (bad)
14:43:39< rand-irc>  ltr all
14:43:55< rand-irc> have a good night
14:44:24< cirdan> rand-irc: odd, i have it
14:44:24< cirdan> gettext-tools: /sw/bin/msgcomm
14:44:26< cirdan> maybe your status file is screwd up
14:44:43< RangerRick> oh, wait, I'm a dumbass
14:44:43< RangerRick> dpkg -S not dpkg -L
14:44:43< RangerRick> haha
14:44:43-!- rand-irc [n=admin@216.129.208.116] has quit ["Get MacIrssi - http://www.g1m0.se/macirssi/"]
14:44:43< dmacks> :)
14:45:28< cirdan> !lart RangerRick 
14:45:28 * Melian hauls RangerRick up by the scruff of the neck and spanks him until he waddles
14:45:38< cirdan> haha
14:46:06< vasi> ooh RR's around, i can bug him :-)
14:46:35< vasi> RangerRick: all that 'deduplication' stuff in Shlibs.pm that you added...
14:46:39< vasi> does it actually prevent something bad from happening?
14:46:50< dmacks> Apple tech note TN2071 covers fts vs ftw. Executive summary: rewrite your code. Metasummary: bring your own ftw.*
14:47:21< cirdan> lol
14:48:38< RangerRick> vasi: I honestly don't remember
14:49:00< RangerRick> I wouldn't have written it if it wasn't covering for some issue we ran into, but I don't remember what that issue might be, nor if it's still an issue  :)
14:49:17< vasi> RR hmm
14:49:44< vasi> cuz (ironically enough) there's a lot of code there that duplicates what's done elsewhere
14:49:50< vasi> some of which was written earlier than its copy, and some later
14:50:07< vasi> so i'm not really sure what to do with the whole thing
14:50:58< vasi> dmacks, i think i have a ftw in apt-ftparchive.patch
14:51:21< dmacks> vasi: Yup. That's where I told RR to get it:)
14:51:33< dmacks> (he's rolling a new apt that includes apt-ftparchive)
14:52:45< dmacks> If other stuff needed it too, we could have a ftpcompat pkg or somesuch. But nothing except apt-ftparchive seems to need it.
14:52:45< vasi> ooh, how subversive :-)
14:52:45< RangerRick> any ideas why sources.list is not a ConfFiles: in the existing apt.info?
14:52:54< dmacks> s/ftpc/ftwc/
14:53:03< vasi> RR, cuz we suck
14:53:03< cirdan> heh
14:53:15< RangerRick> vasi: I've got it linking a static libdb now, so ftparchive is in my apt package
14:53:15< RangerRick> should I add it?  :)
14:53:28< cirdan> conffiles are a pain if we ahcange the file
14:53:49< cirdan> it then asks the user if they wanna merge our changes
14:53:49< dmacks> OTOH, it keeps us from screwing users if we change the file.
14:53:58< cirdan> if it's not a conffile we just overwrite it
14:53:58< RangerRick> as opposed to just overwriting it  :P
14:54:02< vasi> RR, i like the idea of statically linking with db4*, but some people *cough*pogma*cough* really don't want bd4* in base
14:54:12< cirdan> hehe
14:54:24< RangerRick> vasi: that's why I'm statically linking it, I just build my own copy  :)
14:54:35< vasi> RR, oh really? hmm
14:54:36< akh> vasI:  And didn't he abdicate?
14:54:41< cirdan> :-p
14:55:03< RangerRick> http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/fink/experimental/rangerrick/common/main/finkinfo/base/apt.info?rev=1.7&view=markup
14:55:03< vasi> akh, heh
14:56:55< vasi> RR, doesn't building a whole new libdb take a while?
14:57:13< vasi> (maybe you can cheat and take %p/lib/libdb*.a if it exists...otherwise build yourself :-)
14:57:19< RangerRick> vasi: not that long, I'm just building libdb.a
14:57:19< vasi> (drm would kill me for suggesting that though!)
14:57:19< RangerRick> ah, that's true
14:57:30< RangerRick> haha
14:57:35< RangerRick> well, we'd need the headers too
14:57:47< RangerRick> it's not too horrible
14:57:54< RangerRick> and anyways, apt already takes forever
14:57:54< RangerRick> what's a few more minutes?
14:58:05< akh> Not like rolling a new python and mozilla.
14:58:06< vasi> heh...some of us are stuck on slow maxs :-)
14:58:39< dmacks> W
14:58:39< dmacks> h
14:58:39< dmacks> a
14:58:39< dmacks> t
14:58:45< dmacks> ?
14:58:51< akh> Now that's slow.
14:59:03< vasi> y/x/c/
15:01:55< akh> Sssllooow Macses, precious!
15:02:00< dmacks> heh
15:02:45< vasi> lol
15:02:53< akh> meh--/me has to pay cash for my commute because I forgot my pass today.
15:03:09< dmacks> From quilt-dev: "Although Mac OS X 10.4 [...] has nftw and ftw compatibility functions, and code that uses them seems to build and link properly: the resulting calls do nothing [...]"
15:03:32< akh> heh
15:03:41< dmacks> Perhaps it's a wrapper around Tiger's poll() ?
15:03:50< akh> bbl
15:03:51-!- akh [n=akhansen@ldx3.psfc.mit.edu] has quit []
15:04:26< RangerRick> hahaha
15:05:07< dmacks> Maybe we really should roll a ftwcompat...
15:06:14< RangerRick> for the win!
15:06:26< dmacks> hehe!
15:07:11-!- Wizardling [i=Jamie@60-234-154-60.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit ["See ya starside!"]
15:07:57< brendan> looking at my quilt package? ;)
15:08:29< dmacks> heh...naw, googling for: [ftw fts "os x"]
15:09:30< dmacks> Ah good, no more Depends:*utils. I can test it now.
15:10:39< dmacks> er crap...still needs fileutils. That's gonna cause problems for lots of folks.
15:10:46< vasi> whatcha need fileutils for?
15:10:52< brendan> cp -l
15:11:30< vasi> ooh this is useful: http://www.matisse.net/OSX/darwin_commands.html
15:11:52< RangerRick> vasi: neat
15:11:52< RangerRick> brendan: could use a for loop  :)
15:12:00< vasi> cp -l makes a link-tree?
15:12:11< brendan> yeah
15:12:23< cirdan> yup
15:12:37< vasi> hmm...i think X has a tool for that
15:12:37< RangerRick> find -type d followed by find ! -type d, mkdir'ing the former and symlinking the latter  :)
15:12:42< vasi> but better to pull in fileutils than x11
15:12:54< vasi> RR, and doing a bunch of path munging
15:12:54< brendan> didn't realise fileutils was that big a deal
15:13:26< vasi> it's not really
15:13:26< newmanbe> Bah. Was someone lookng for msachs again?
15:13:26< vasi> well, to me it's not
15:13:34< RangerRick> lot of people don't like having it installed though
15:13:51< brendan> I don't like having it either, but not to the point of writing my own lndir thingy
15:14:08< vasi> i make heavy use of 'debfoster -f', so i never have BDeps sitting around
15:14:08 * vasi fails to care :-)
15:14:40< dmacks> Used to be several packages that GConflicts:fileutils.
15:14:45< dmacks> s/G/B/
15:15:06< brendan> that seems odd
15:15:45< brendan> since those fileutils are probably native on the systems where the packages originate
15:16:14< RangerRick> I've seen fileutils do some weird things with non-latin1 characters though, might be because of unicode issues or something that they conflict
15:16:14< dmacks> IIRC, 'install' had different flags from apple's and people didn't know they had to patch to make sure to get /usr/bin's
15:17:15< vasi> if we could go back in time...it might have been best to have 'fileutils' and 'fileutils-default'
15:17:15< brendan> and upstream wasn't expecting gnu's install?
15:17:29< dmacks> brendan: Or Maintainers weren't when they wrote InstallScript
15:18:00< vasi> so that you could use %p/lib/fileutils/cp for one-offs without changing what will happen for everybody else
15:18:11< RangerRick> vasi: we still could...
15:18:15< RangerRick> would be a solution to my coreutils package  :)
15:18:31< brendan> think dports goes the gcp route, though that's also a little annoying
15:18:57< dmacks> More than "a little" IMO. Can't just fiddle PATH to get it.
15:19:35< vasi> dmacks, no reason not to do both actually
15:19:35< dmacks> Yeah.
15:19:50< vasi> so it's easily accessibly to users, and also to scripts
15:20:24< brendan> btw anyone have a link to a summary of tiger's poll() problems handy?
15:20:35< dmacks> fink.sf.net/doc/porting I think
15:21:22< brendan> hmm, was hoping for something more specific
15:21:54< dmacks> Eh? That doc states exactly what the problem is, how it's broken, what to use instead.
15:21:58< brendan> (I was pretty sure poll at least sort of worked with sockets, since icecast2 uses it)
15:22:08< vasi> brendan, it works for anything that's not a device, i think
15:22:55< brendan> ah. that's not what the docs say...
15:23:16< dmacks> pogma would know.
15:24:36< dmacks> gnome bugzilla 302672 was our original heads-up on the problem.
15:25:03< brendan> thanks
15:25:39< dmacks> "thanks, fink-gnome-core!"
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15:27:59< RangerRick> the docs are often wrong, because the come from million-year-old implementations from 4.4BSDlite, or they come from frankenstein BSD merges.  Either way, the man pages often get lost in the mix.
15:29:06< RangerRick> *they
15:29:34< brendan> meant the porting page
15:30:09< dmacks> Feel free to submit corrections.
15:31:41< vasi> or just write about it on the wiki
15:31:58< dmacks> Yeah! Then tell akh to port it into the docs:)
15:32:06 * vasi needs a nap...see y'all later :-)
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16:25:12< spiral> http://www.appletalk.com.au/articles/index.php?article=12088
16:25:39< spiral> hmm, just read on this tuto that they recommand not using apple's X11 but xfree from fink, why ?
16:26:12< RangerRick> got me
16:26:30< spiral> RangerRick: ?
16:26:30< RangerRick> xfree86 or x.org in fink are a little newer than apple's x11 as of tiger, but not so much to matter that much anymore
16:26:57< spiral> RangerRick: it was a matter with panter but no more with tiger, that's it ?
16:27:13< RangerRick> yeah, panther's x11 was not nearly as good as xfree86 or x.org, but it's not as big of a deal on tiger
16:27:14< spiral> panther sorry
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16:27:31< spiral> RangerRick: all right...
16:27:38 * spiral 'll buy an ibook really soon :-P
16:28:40< dmacks> Nothin' like a /. pick to generate lots of me2 articles parroting the same silliness.
16:29:03-!- dmacks [n=dmacks@pdpc/supporter/active/dmacks] has quit ["leaving"]
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17:03:41-!- Topic for #fink: Have a question? Check the FAQ: http://fink.sf.net/faq || Latest Installers: 0.6.4 (10.2), 0.7.2 (10.3), 0.8.0 (10.4) || Fink 0.24.10: Cameloparadalis
17:03:41-!- Topic set by akh [] [Thu Aug 25 10:00:59 2005]
17:03:41[Users #fink]
17:03:41[ Airo     ] [ cmeme   ] [ gzl         ] [ mcp      ] [ nkuttler  ] [ spiral  ] 
17:03:41[ asari    ] [ emp     ] [ hennker     ] [ mdmonk_  ] [ pnorman   ] [ swix__  ] 
17:03:41[ BleedAway] [ eno-away] [ jack-       ] [ Melian   ] [ pogma     ] [ usataway] 
17:03:41[ brendan  ] [ Erik____] [ JosephSpiros] [ mprentice] [ RangerRick] 
17:03:41[ cirdan   ] [ gecko2  ] [ kane-xs     ] [ muesli   ] [ RLD_osx   ] 
17:03:41[ Clef__   ] [ gopherd ] [ KraMer      ] [ Murr     ] [ runelind  ] 
17:03:41[ cls      ] [ gopherd_] [ lisppaste   ] [ newmanbe ] [ shres     ] 
17:03:41-!- Irssi: #fink: Total of 38 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 38 normal]
17:03:41-!- [freenode-info] Welcome Tor users! Please stop by #tor to compare notes and to report any freenode Tor problems.
17:03:42-!- Channel #fink created Sun Aug  3 17:57:20 2003
17:04:00-!- Irssi: Join to #fink was synced in 27 secs
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18:15:32< newmanbe> Downloading pkgsrc with rsync is *way* worse than downloading dists with CVS.
18:16:41< cirdan> heh
18:17:02 * newmanbe is mirroring it in, you guessed it, Gopherspace!
18:17:20< newmanbe> And I haven't finnished getting yet.
18:18:05< newmanbe> Hmm, it's not yet larger than /sw/fink.
18:18:19 * newmanbe makes it download faster by going away. :)
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18:57:20< bkn> hi, is dlcompat deprecated as of panther?
19:01:19< akh> bkn: "deprecated" in the sense that it became built-in.
19:01:37< akh> So, yes.
19:02:14< bkn> akh, how about 'deprecated' as is something else replaced it with full functionality? 
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19:02:34< akh> bkn: Yeah, that too. ;-)
19:02:55< akh> (at least, as far as is known)
19:05:11< newmanbe> pkgsrc has way too many ports.
19:05:49< newmanbe> Hmm, I suppose it has more files per port than does Fink.
19:06:31-!- lisppaste [n=lisppast@common-lisp.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
19:07:25< akh> probably
19:14:50 * akh finished a GUI-based app today.  It's even useful.
19:14:53< akh> (to me)
19:15:29< newmanbe> I've made a Periodic Table of the Elements application program using AppleScript Studio.
19:15:56< akh> Fun--I've got a Periodic Table Dashboard widget.
19:16:23 * newmanbe wouldn't use dashboard if he had Mac OS X 10.4.
19:17:45 * akh primarily uses it for the weather conditions tool and for comic strips.
19:17:59< akh> Oh, yeah, the ZIP code notifier, too.
19:18:11< akh> s/not/ver/
19:18:17< akh> (verifier)
19:18:48< newmanbe> Just in case there was a bug in my built in sed. ;)
19:20:29 * akh was more worried about the combo of my small text size and my bad vision with glasses.
19:20:58< newmanbe> Ah.
19:21:08< newmanbe> ksh, sh, and csh are not fun shells.
19:21:44< akh> Unless you find minimalism fun.
19:21:55< cirdan> heh
19:21:59< newmanbe> They all support the features I want.
19:22:00 * cirdan should go to bed
19:22:03< newmanbe> Just not in one shell.
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19:22:21< newmanbe> The mili'matary doesn't have a bedtime for you? :)
19:22:29< akh> newmanbe: write your own shell.
19:22:30< newmanbe> Finder is broken.
19:22:41< newmanbe> Naw, I'll just install bash or zsh.
19:22:47< cirdan> bash
19:23:02< newmanbe> Yeah, probably.
19:23:23< newmanbe> finder won't update the Size of a folder if it's children don't change.
19:23:41< newmanbe> Even if the "grandchildren" have changed.
19:24:26 * newmanbe doesn't know how a child directory can be bigger than its parent. :)
19:24:55< akh> Good genes. ;-)
19:25:12< newmanbe> lol
19:26:14< akh> Or something...
19:47:01 * akh gets snotty with another "no useful information" n00b post.
19:48:00< cirdan> hrh, dpkg is up to dpkg 1.13.11.0.1
19:48:07< cirdan> heh
19:50:07< newmanbe> Hmm, too bad megahal isn't here or I'd ask it what that means.
19:50:50< cirdan> newmanbe: the version
19:52:47< newmanbe> Yes, but what does it *mean*?
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19:58:59< akh> newmanbe: it  mean's that Fink's dpkg is ancient, instead of merely very old.
20:07:10< newmanbe> Fink's version of dpkg is more sane.
20:07:34-!- megahal [i=foobar@ip-246-036.oberlin.net] has joined #fink
20:07:39< newmanbe> The version is I mean.
20:08:10< newmanbe> megahal: What does it mean when something has four subversions?
20:08:16< megahal> newmanbe: Not only does it mean anything.
20:08:25< newmanbe> Heh. :)
20:09:33< akh> ah
20:09:39< akh> Maybe it's a bugfix
20:11:48< akh> (a small one)
20:17:59 * akh prepares to install another .rpm file on my Debian box, feeling unholy in the process.
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20:37:08< newmanbe> akh: I think they fixed a typo in one of the comments in the source.
20:38:56< akh> hehe
20:39:08< akh> Worse yet, in a ChangeLog.
20:52:25 * newmanbe wonders if there is a limit to the number of lines of text in the clipboard.
20:52:41< newmanbe> TextEdit.app is frozen.
20:54:08< newmanbe> I think I might be the largest \.[com|net] Gopher server now.
21:00:21< akh> newmanbe: That wouldn't be hard.  ;-)
21:00:42< newmanbe> The now second largest has 6400 selectors.
21:01:01< newmanbe> The largest .edu has 276626.
21:01:47< akh> What's the .edu ?
21:02:14< newmanbe> iubio.bio.indiana.edu:70
21:02:30< akh> Interesting...
21:02:58< akh> Wonder if it's rodent studies....
21:03:00< akh> (gophers)
21:03:07< newmanbe> Not including today, I'm still the fasted growing server.
21:03:33< newmanbe> 28 new selectors a week.
21:03:47 * newmanbe is quite proud of himself if you couldn't tell. :)
21:04:10< akh> It does show a bit. ;-)
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23:21:54< wing> i tried to move away /sw and then ran the 0.7.2 installer. but the installer died with a generic "installation failed. please try again" error message when running in the chinese locale. if run in the english locale it doesn't even allow me to choose the destination volume.
23:42:37< wing> n/m. found the problem. 
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--- Log closed Tue Oct 04 00:00:18 2005

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