Subj : ERN Charting Committee
To   : ANDREA SANTOS
From : Jack Yates
Date : Fri Jun 15 2001 11:08 pm

 ->> You might be on shaky ground including the point (whomever it might
 ->> be) in any policy complaint, nodelisted sysop or not.  Points are
 ->> not members of this network and the action for which you would file
 ->> a complaint would be an act of the point, not the sysop. the node
 ->> from which the point sent the netmail would be culpable, however.

 AS> If the point were merely a point (user), I'd agree but if the point is
 AS> a nodelisted sysop using someone else as a boss node for
 AS> "fronting" purposes, I believe a case could be made to include the
 AS> "point" in any policy action.

In this case, the point has:

A)  The appearance of being a committee of more than one person.

B) Anoymity you don't know who they are for sure.


 ->> this
 ->> also brings up a question as to the venue of the PC; if indeed the
 ->> point were an RC, do you file it with the NC of the network to
 ->> which the node belongs, or do you file with the ZC?

 AS> Probably with the NC, with an appeal to the ZC if necessary.

Appeals are a givin, of course.  If you are going to file a PC with the NC of
the network, you shouldn't include a point who is an RC of another region (if
indeed this is true) should you?

 ->> Further, your complaint, IIRC, was that an unidentifiable person or
 ->> aggregate of persons has sent you a netmail that you find annoying.
 ->> Do you find it annoying due to its content or due to its
 ->> anonyminity, or both?

 AS> Both.

Then, if you know who the point is, he's not anonymous and there goes half of
your case.


 AS> Don't know that this is pertinent.  If it ended up being so, that
 AS> would only apply to the point system, not the boss node.

It isn't, except that the supposition is that the programs are being used to
provide a facade for the person or people behind it.  It's highly unlikely that
anyone who is connected with the ERN committee is running FD 2.02 as their
regular mailer due to the supposed Y2K issues, isn't it?  Whom of those who
might be suspected of being on the ERN committee uses FM as their
editor-of-choice?  No one?

What this *does* provide is a barrier between the persons responsible for the
ERNroute.nnn and the masses and protects them from demands of accountability as
individuals, something that the ZLC does not enjoy.

Besides; since the only punishment provided for in P4 is excommunication (for a
greater or lesser time) and this means removal from the nodelist, and points
aren't in the nodelist, I'd reject your PC against the point.



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