Subj : Dog 'n' pony To : Michael Grant From : mark lewis Date : Sun May 13 2001 06:00 am ml>> ml>> and at that point, "fido has fallen apart"... ml>> MG> Their responsibility. Not a hub's. ml>> ml>> agreed to a point... now, which side of the line are you ml>> going to stand on... the one to keep fido going or the one ml>> that lets fido fall apart? MG> Is it "falling apart" if one node has a problem because his MG> outdated software pukes, because another node is trying to MG> integrate web technology into his BBS and remain an active MG> part of Fidonet at the same time in an attempt to keep MG> people interested in BBSing? non sequiter... fido is falling apart any time one's system isn't performing as it should WRT moving the mail... please stop trying to make me the "enemy"... i'm not... MG> Do we put the needs of those sysops who are running old MG> software that can't handle new message formats ahead of local storage message formats have nothing to do with MOVING the mail... indeed, you don't need a bbs or locally stored messages to move the mail in fidonet... MG> the needs of those sysops who are trying new ideas in an MG> attempt to keep Fidonet alive? they can try all the new ideas they want as long as they still conform to the older specs when necessary to communicate with older systems... MG> If we do so, what if the sysops trying those new ideas get MG> discouraged and leave Fidonet for good? what's any different in that and what we've always had? nothing... MG> Suppose someone found a way to distribute Fidonet echos MG> via e-mail mailing lists? Should we discourage this sort MG> of thing, or encourage it? fidonet echoareas have been being passed via internet email mailing lists for years... so what? MG> I'm for keeping Fidonet alive. That means embracing new MG> ideas, and new possibilities, and encouraging everyone MG> to try their best to keep up with the times. hahahahaha... and the technologies you're proposing we move to are older and more antiquated than fidonet, itself... that's funny! ml>> MG>>> they can get a better tosser, or can run a program such as ml>> MG>>> NoBogus *themselves* to filter out the messages that cause ml>> MG>>> their outdated software to puke. ml>> ml>> NOT if their hardware and/or OS cannot run the software and THAT's ml>> ml>> part of the whole point of this stuff... ml>> ml>> MG> Squish doesn't have these problems, nor does Jam, and both of ml>> MG> those will run on a 286; so will NetMgr, which can delete ml>> MG> netmail messages that might cause a problem. I'd be willing to ml>> MG> bet NoBogus would run on a 286, too; it's a simple enough ml>> MG> program. ml>> ml>> NONE of them will run on mac, amiga, apple, commodore, linux, beos, etc... ml>> fidonet is not solely ibm pc compatibles... i'm personally aware of ti99s, ml>> also... MG> I ran Linux before; I'm well aware of other OS's. There exists MG> Fidonet software for those formats, no? If it's abandoned and MG> unsupported though, the sysop /should/ consider using a MG> different OS. This is not a problem with Linux; Fidonet MG> software for that OS is actively being developed. OS/2 and MG> Mac are different stories though. so now you're advocating alienating (future) sysops because their chosen platform and/or machine does not have any supported existing software for it? MG> Yet this comes back to /my/ point. Mac's, and most of those MG> other OS's /can/ do TCP/IP, can't they? maybe you should find out before attempting to make a point one way or the other about them... also, please note the differences between the OS' and the machines... MG> They /can/ do UUCP, HTTP, FTP, and even Telnet, can't MG> they? i dunno... why don't you find out and let us know? MG> These are the new standards of communication, and Fidonet MG> had better make haste to integrate itself into these new MG> standards or it'll get left in the dust. new standards?? hahahahahahaha... http is the newest of what you listed... the others are older than fidonet... it's http that allowed us to create the www and to abuse the transport system(s) in the way they are currently being abused... [chomp rest of the story] i'm outta here... )\/(ark * Origin: (1:3634/12) .