Subj : Re: Free Oracle
To   : comp.programming
From : Shiro Kawai
Date : Thu Sep 15 2005 01:40 am

Robert Maas, see http://tinyurl.com/uh3t wrote:

> Test drive requires prior registration, which is not available currently:
>    Linkname: We're Down
>         URL: http://www.testdrive.hp.com/accounts/register.shtml

Then you can try it after they restore the service.

> I think I have a good attitude toward solving some kinds of tasks via
> some RDBS.
[...]
> So what other aspects of problem solving, relevant to applying for an
> entry-level job in JDBC programming (using Oracle or any other RDBS),
> would you need to know (re my personal ideas) in order to evaluate my
> chance of being hired by you or somebody who shares your views?

You took me wrong.

1. For an entry level position, I don't expect any prior
   knowledge about RDBS, so you don't even need to make such a
   lengthy explanation.  Instead, I'd like to see how the candidate
   has handled any technical problems around him/her.   You seem to
   have quite a few problems around you, so just solve them technically
   and tell how you've done it.  That's enough.

2. If you want to show your knowledge/experience on RDBS, then
   you'd better to tell more than that (like # of records).  That's
   what I said.   You can skip the explanation like above, since
   it's just a trivial knowledge.   Instead, state the things I
   suggested.   Of course this part is irrelevant if you don't have
   such experience.

> > BTW, being good at finding excuses not to do things earns a big
> > negative score.
>
> That statement needs to be qualified. For example, sometimes a
> particular tool is entirely inappropriate for a job, or it's not
> available at any affordable cost, and so there's good reason not to use
> that particular tool for that particular task.

That's right.  And when you face such situation, you're supposed
to come up alternative ideas to get the task done.
You may, and sometimes need to, explain why the particular tool
can't be used.  But that's the secondary issue.  If you can't
get the task done, it's no use of such explanation.

> (In my own case of not
> having already learned JDBC with Oracle, I've never had such a
> configuration available for me to play with. Maybe later this month
> when HP's free-trial site comes back online I'll have my first chance.)

So in this case, what you wanted to achieve?  I saw you were told
you couldn't install free oracle on your hardware.  Now, what
most employers want to see I suppose, is that how you find
alternative way to achieve your goal, or at least, how you try
to find it.  What did you do?

Just explaining why you can't do it without alternative idea
*is* called excuse.

> > If you say you had millions of records and dealt with tens of
> > transactions per second, for example, that counts.  Even when it's a
> > small size database, if it was actively used by lots of users and
> > you've maintaned it for years, it counts.
>
> I think you're asking way too much prior experience for a mere
> entry-level job. The whole point of entry-level is that it's a way of
> getting entry into serious work in some area, where there's no prior
> serious experience. Actually, in the true and original sense of the
> phrase, an entry-level job should require no prior related experience
> whatsoever. The fact that I not only studied how JDBC works but
> actually wrote some small applications, which worked correctly as
> planned, is a plus for my entry-level employment in this area. If you
> don't count my experience as relevant, or enough for entry-level job,
> then it's you who is making excuses why not.

See above.  My paragraph is only relevant if you want your experience
on RDBS to be counted.  For entry level job, you're not required to
have experience on RDBS, so it's irrelevant.  It doesn't hurt you if
you put a line (JDBC experience) on resume, if you need some more
buzzwords.  But when asked about it, just answer that your experience
is limited to a small application.  You don't need to make the
lengthy explanation like you've done, or you waste potential
employer's time.

Do you remember you've asked "what employers want?"  I've been
telling that.   I'm not discussing with you.  I'm just telling
mere facts.  Of course, It's up to you to take or dismiss it.
But you don't need to tell me what you _think_ of it.  I'm only
interested in what you _do_ to solve the problems you have.

I think I stop here.  Reply to this only if you've actually done
something to improve your situation.

.