Subj : Re: How much should I charge for fixed-price software contract? To : comp.programming,comp.lang.java.programmer,comp.lang.lisp From : Scott Ellsworth Date : Tue Aug 16 2005 05:42 pm Hi, Robert. Just a couple of quick comments in direct response to some questions: In article , rem642b@Yahoo.Com (Robert Maas, see http://tinyurl.com/uh3t) wrote: > > From: Scott Ellsworth [...] > > I'm not the kind of person to toot my own horn, to brag and brag and > brag incessantly until somebody takes a chance and hires me without any > evidence except my bragging. I'm a shy kind of person who would rather > show a demo of my work and let the other person decide if it's good or > not. But if nobody will ever look at my work, then nobody will ever > have any reason to hire me. > > So if I can't brag about my abilities (because I'm not the braggart > type), and if I can't show demonstrations of my work to people, then > what's your advice how to ever get somebody to hire me again? Simply put, there is a world of difference between "brag and brag and brag incessantly" and making it clear to the world that you are looking, and bringing certain skills to the party. Essentially, you try to find a context where talking about what you know how to do, and what "they" need is acceptable, like a user's group meeting or a BOF. I would not want to hire someone that buttonholed me, then would not shut up. I do not think, though, that it is out of line to attend a Java users group meeting, talk about recent projects, and then to hand out my cards to those who seem at all interested in what I have done. Mine say 'Java, Cocoa, and database consulting for the life sciences' as that is what earns _most_ of my income. I do a heck of a lot more than that - after reading a rails book, experimenting some on my own, and writing up my feelings about how it compares to Tapestry, JSP, and PHP, I have a pretty good feel for how Ruby on Rails works. I would be willing to take on a contract in it. My card does not mention it, but I might in conversation at such a users' group meeting. I might consider presenting my thoughts at such a meeting, perhaps with a few slides showing identical results, and how I got there using the three technologies. Alternatively, perhaps this goes on a blog. Different audience, and no way to pass out cards, but people can find it by google - it balances. [...] Others have discussed how you might research Sun and what they do, and how you might find people at Sun who are publicly visible, and perhaps willing to talk. > > Part of what I bring to the party is the code we have developed in > > house to solve certain problems, but really, the thing being sold is > > problem elimination. > > Please clarify what you mean by "problem elimination". It sounds like > "pest extermination", but I don't think that's what you mean. Do you > mean like if they have a business procedure involving five steps, but > one of the steps is taking an inordinate amount of time, but if that > one step were automated in a way that fit in with the other steps > nicely then that one step would take much less time without any bad > side effect on the procedure as a whole? Or one of the five steps is > producing very inaccurate results which is messing up the next step > after it, and if that one step were made more accurate then the whole > procedure would come out better? Or am I guessing wrong? Exactly right. More, I want my clients to feel like I make their lives easier - if they ask me to solve a problem, they get a list of options, their costs and tradeoffs, and someone willing to implement them for those prices. Sometimes, they just want me to pick a solution, implement it, and tell them it is done, and it is my call which class a given problem is in. I do guess wrong sometimes, but if I understand their process, and keep my eye on how much they are paying, those mistakes are minor and can be recovered from. > > At the end of the day, my job is to help my clients get their work done. > > That's what I'd like to do. How can I find somebody who needs help and > is willing to admit it to a total stranger like me? The user group example I gave above is just an example, but it is one I am trying to work up. Based on the past, if I convince the people running a user group to let me talk, at least one person is going to want to talk about their problems in that area - something like 'We tried a JSP-based app, and it was just too slow.' This might lead to work - I know how a profiler works and a depressing number of people do not. [...] > > I do ... try to get across what kinds of problems I can solve, what > > those problems usually cost, and what I cost by comparison. Ideally, > > this comes up early in the process, because if I am charging way more > > than they want to pay, why waste either of our time? > > I have no idea how much other people charge for custom software on a > per-use-case basis or per-function/method basis, so I wouldn't know how > to compare their standard charges with my (hopefully) more-affordable > charges. I meant that you should compare it to what the problem is costing them. For example - if every sales guy has his own Access database of contacts, and I am proposing one big MySql database with everyone's contacts, I can argue that this will let them cross sell, or perhaps that it will save them their four hour 'sales report meeting' every week. If it saves ten people three hours (they still likely need to report and meet some), then that is worth mumble mumble figure figure 30*25 or $750 per week for ten sales guys at $50k. Again, I have to guess, but a wild assed guess is better than nothing, and if I am clear about my assumptions, they will usually correct any really boneheaded number I used. Others have already addressed ruby, and pointed out some online piecework places. Good luck, Scott -- Scott Ellsworth scott@alodar.nospam.com Java and database consulting for the life sciences .