Subj : FreeBSD To : Roy J. Tellason From : Charles Angelich Date : Thu Nov 15 2001 12:59 am 123333681050 unix Hello Roy - --8<--cut RJT>> Hell, I haven't even tried it on a 386 yet. It runs slow RJT>> enough on the 486 I've got for a test fixture here. CA>> I seriously doubt that you will ever get a working linux CA>> onto a 386 machine. You might get something to `look' like CA>> it's working and you might be able to use it to telnet CA>> into a full linux server but it will be many meg just to CA>> create a dumb terminal. RJT> I don't know about that... RJT> Maybe I wouldn't be able to do too much with a current RJT> version, since a lot of what's in the current software RJT> seems to assume fairly current hardware capabilities, but RJT> with an older version? Older versions were short on drivers. Limited list of acceptable hardware. CA>> I have followed every lead for years to their dead ends. CA>> People who claim to have put linux onto 386's suddenly CA>> lose their only copy of the setup or develop amnesia and CA>> can't quite recall how they did it or even what distro CA>> they used. CA>> Smoke and mirrors have created much of our folklore. Add CA>> this to the collection. RJT> The book that I have around here that got me going with RJT> linux in the first place still has the cdrom that it came RJT> with in the back of the book. This is a fairly early RJT> version of Slackware, I have no idea off the top of my RJT> head what version of it, but it's pretty early. Maybe one RJT> of these days if I ever get a bunch of the other stuff I'm RJT> dealing with out of the way I'll give it a shot. Though RJT> when I first jumped into the LINUX echo the consensus was RJT> pretty unanimous that I might not want to bother with that RJT> one. At worst I could probably install it and upgrade it a RJT> bit here and there, depending. When a linux user tells me they've setup a minimal install on an old 80386 I tell them to burn me an image of it on a CD. Suddenly it changes to a system they _used_ to have or the user disappears. CA>> OS9 would work effectively on any Intel box. It works in CA>> 64k of memory. RJT> But that's still a commercial product, isn't it? I used to RJT> carry an echo for that at one point, but I think it's dead. OS9 is alive and well. Microware has always targeted embedded and other commercial venues. Their short contract with Radio Shack was a departure for them AFAIK. CA>> OBERON would work in a 386, it will function with very CA>> little memory (don't recall offhand what the smallest CA>> install was right now). RJT> I'm not at all famiilar with that one, is it a commercial RJT> product or what? OBERON is a sort of OS and compiler all in one. It was developed by Nicholas Wirth (father of Pascal) and some of his colleagues. It's free. CA>> OS9 and OBERON are modular by design and linux has a CA>> monolithic kernel. Nothing about linux is intended to be CA>> used on legacy hardware. RJT> Monolithic, maybe, but there's always the source... :-) Have heard that one before too. Just never produces anything but excuses. CA>> OS9 is expensive, OBERON is free. RJT> Yes? Where do you get it from? What else can you tell me RJT> about it? Is it some sort of a unix clone, or totally RJT> different? OBERON is more of a total environment. I had it working on an old 80386 a decade ago but I didn't have the time to write all my own software and it was new then. Now they have a browser and a few other apps available for it. AFAIK it's not a clone of anything but it does multitask. CA>> I would chose OBERON if I wanted to do legacy installs. RJT> It sounds to me like it might be worth at least a look, RJT> though as I probably mentioned earlier, this isn't a real RJT> high priority item with me, more a matter of having all RJT> this hardware sitting around that's otherwise going to RJT> waste... Unlike many other OS I think OBERON might be fun once you get the hang of it. According to it's college professor users they can write a few paragraphs of code in a matter of minutes that dupes rather large applications functions. With an OS that is also a language the mind boggles. Something like chaining utilities with pipes and tees in UNIX but in OBERON it is designed to do this. Pipes and tees are really kludges IMO. Oberon OS and compiler written by Nikolas Wirth: The basic system is small - it fits on one 1.44Mb installation diskette, including the compiler and TCP/IP networking. It is freely downloadable (with source code) for non-commercial use. An optional GUI component framework called Gadgets is available, with integrated WWW support (FTP, Telnet and HTTP on Ethernet, SLIP or PPP). Many useful applications are available, and the system has been used to build embedded systems http://www.oberon.ethz.ch/ http://www.oberon.ethz.ch/install.html ftp://ftp.inf.ethz.ch/pub/ETHOberon/Native/StdAlone/gadgets.arc If I remember correctly, the ARC extension is NOT the PKware or SEA version but is their own version. It's been awhile since I was fiddling with OBERON. It wouldn't function with the hardware I had then and I haven't tried with this hardware - yet. ;-) > > , , > o/ Charles.Angelich \o , > <| |> __o/ > / > USA, MI < \ __\__ ___ * ATP/16bit 2.31 * .... DOS the Ghost in the Machine! http://www.undercoverdesign.com/dosghost/ --- Maximus/2 3.01 * Origin: COMM Port OS/2 juge.com 204.89.247.1 (281) 980-9671 (1:106/2000) .