Subj : Re: [twgsdotorg]
To   : All
From : Kavanagh
Date : Wed Jan 15 2003 12:17 am

I have to agree with Dr. Bad.

If one out a hundred,  a million or whatever, were executed for a crime that 
they did not commit, that would be stain on all of us. 

Would be great to be certain, in which case hang them high.

 
>From a message by Dr. Bad about Re: [twgsdotorg]:
> 
 > 
 > 
 > >Death penalty opponents always use the scenario of 
 > >the "innocent death
 > >row inmate" to try to argue against the penalty. I'm sur 
 > >this happens
 > >occasionally, but I believe it is far less frequent than 
 > >death penalty
 > >opponents claim. 
 > 
 > IMHO a _single_ incorrect execution is sufficient to make the death penalty 
highly unattractive. Remember, the death penalty is not a choice between 
killing them vs letting them go, its a choice between killing them in about 10 
years time, vs locking them up for the rest of their lives. The difference to 
the community on the guilty ones is pretty minor compared to the loss of even 
just one innocent life.
 > 
 > Dr. Bad
 > 
 > --- The Mad Hatter <twgsdotorg@twgs.org> wrote:
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > Check CNN, MSNBC, Nytimes.com, etc., all of the major news sites
 > > covered it.
 > > 
 > > And yes, these people were innocent. Through DNA testing (which was
 > > not available when many of them were convicted), research, etc. the
 > > convictions were overturned, and in several cases the real
 > > perpetrator was convicted.
 > > 
 > > 8 of the convictions were obtained by confessions that were extracted
 > > under torture. The officer who obtained those convictions has been
 > > removed from the police department, however he has not as yet been
 > > jailed (I was unable to even find reference to him being charged).
 > > 
 > > The Criminal Justice systems of both Canada and the United States
 > > have errored with great regularity. A conviction in a court of either
 > > country does not mean that you are guilty, it often means that you
 > > could not afford a good lawyer. Harsh but true.
 > > 
 > > What is really scarey about this is that you stand a better chance of
 > > getting justice in Canada or the United States (even with all the
 > > faults of both systems) than you do almost anywhere else.
 > > 
 > > The Mad Hatter
 > > 
 > > >From a message by Cherokee about Re: [twgsdotorg]:
 > > > I would like to know the source of your statistics, in particular
 > > the
 > > 23 Illinois men who were "innocent".
 > > 
 > > These cases are almost NEVER cases of truly innocent men being
 > > convicted, sentenced to death, and then exonerated. Rather, they are
 > > usually cases in which some legal technicality allowed the men to go
 > > free. In every such case, the body of evidence was enough to convince
 > > a
 > > jury of reasonable people beyond a reasonable doubt, that the
 > > defendant
 > > was guilty.
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > --- The Mad Hatter <twgsdotorg@twgs.org> wrote:
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > There are three good reasons that the Death Penalty is a dead issue
 > > > in Canada. The Killer M's, David Millgard, Donald Marshall, and Guy
 > > > Paul Morin.
 > > > 
 > > > All three of these gentlemen were convicted of murder, all
 > > > exonerated.
 > > > 
 > > > For those who say it couldn't happen in the USA, I suggest you look
 > > > at Illinois where in the last 10 years 23 inmates who were on death
 > > > row were later found innocent.
 > > > 
 > > > The point of this being (for both Sanders and Cherokee who seem
 > > > unable to find it) is that government is best kept starved and
 > > > inoffensive, so that it cannot interfere with the lives of the
 > > > citizens. All governments should be kept this way - consider Saddam
 > > > Hussein if his government was defanged. He'd end up looking like
 > > the
 > > > Stay-Pufft Marshmellow Man.
 > > > 
 > > > Government is not he solution to the problem - it is the problem.
 > > > 
 > > > The only good politician is a dead one (they don't raise taxes).
 > > > 
 > > > The best government is the least government, and the least
 > > government
 > > > is no government at all.
 > > > 
 > > > Taxation is theft.
 > > > 
 > > > Why is the U.S. Government so hard on the Mafia? They don't like
 > > > competition.
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > The Mad Hatter - Radical to the Bone
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > >from a message by col sanders about Re: OT Military:
 > > > > No, I just don't find very many offenses worthy of execution.
 > > > 
 > > > Cherokee wrote:
 > > > 
 > > > >So violating the law is ok as long as it results in something
 > > > >productive?
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > >
 > > 
 > >
 > 
 > 



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