Subj : Knowledge..... To : KEVIN GIBSON From : LEE LOFASO Date : Mon Jul 23 2001 09:52 am Hello Kevin, KG>This is the last in a string of replies. It was interesting to think KG>about these things again. I'm comfortable with my general perception KG>of good and evil even if the logic puzzles remain a challenge. Hey, don't sweat it. I'm gonna present a few logic puzzles that'll stump John and Frank big time, assuming they'll take the bait. :) >LL>By making a premise that God is the source of all good, then what >LL>is the origin of evil? >KG>Is God the author of all things? >LL>Could be. >LL>Can good come from evil? >KG>Yes. But did you mean can evil come from good? >LL>Either man was created good and is tempted by evil, or man was >LL>created evil but capable of doing good. >LL>If one takes the former view, then good cannot come of evil, being >LL>that our Creator is all-good and all-powerful. KG>But you just said that God could be the author of all things. I said *could* be. KG>Wouldn't that mean both good and evil issue from the same source? At first glance, it would seem so. But upon further reflection what seems to be a contradiction in actuality is not. Suppose parents give birth to a child, and bring that child up to be a good kid. Then, as the child becomes an adult, he/she does some terrible things. Does that mean the parents are the source of this evil? Or is it that the child chose of his/her own free will to do evil? KG>We identify something as evil because it represents something bad, KG>inferior, offensive, disagreeable, etc. We've not distinguished KG>between naturally-occurring evil and man-made evil in this thread. KG>In the much bigger picture about which we can only speculate, KG>natural evil serves as a catalyst, among other things, and KG>man-made evil is something we strive to eliminate. Can there be such a thing as "naturally-occurring" evil? Why, or why not? Can you extrapolate on what you mean by "naturally-occurring" evil so that the concept will be clearly understood? How is this particular form of evil, if it exists, different from "man-made" evil? Or is it any different? >LL>But if one takes the latter view, being that man is evil but capable >LL>of doing good, well, even Hitler did *some* good things. Certainly >LL>the Devil is capable of doing good works, if only to deceive. KG>Consider the Book of Job. KG>God uses Satan as a prosecutor. A movie, "The Devil's Advocate", was made on that premise. Loved Al Pacino as the Devil. :) KG>Consider 1 Chronicles 21:1 and 2 Samuel 24:1 KG>God moves David to sin. Satan provokes David to sin. KG>Then David is punished. Why? KG>Feel free to present your conclusions. David separated himself from God through sin. But God did not cause David to sin. It was through David's own fault. As for punishment, I'm not so sure. It could be considered a loving act of mercy. >LL>If so, that would seem to contradict the original premise that God >LL>is the source of all good. But yet, we know that evil exists. >KG>You've lost me. What is the origin of evil? If God is the origin, the God is evil. If not God, then it must be somewhere else. And if it is somewhere else, where is such origin to be found? >LL>What is the origin of evil? Did God create evil? Or is the origin >LL>of evil to be found elsewhere? If God created evil, then that would >LL>imply that God is not all-good and all-powerful. KG>No, it doesn't. Not in my book. If God created evil, then God is not all-good and all-powerful. To be all-good implies that one can do no evil and/or create no evil. >LL>And if God is not all-good and all-powerful, then God is not God. KG>God is God. God is God, but that does not answer the question. Is God good or evil? I do not mean "mostly" good or "mostly" evil. By good I mean totally good. Our perception may be much different from what good actually *is*. So how can man know what is truly good or truly evil? >KG>you'd be welcome as a member of the "Dead Philosophers Society." >LL>Would that be an "honorary" member, or a full-fledged member? KG>The question hasn't come up before now. There's always a first time. :) KG>You'll have to see the Chairman. :-) You'll have to present a motion, which would require a second, and then open for discussion before taking a vote... Hey! Wait a minute! Nobody ever said the "Dead Philosopher's Society" is a democratic organization. That means I'm the Prez. :) --Lee * SLMR 2.1a * We won't talk about her any more, if you'd rather not. --- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5 * Origin: Try Our Web Based QWK: DOCSPLACE.ORG (1:18/140) .