Subj : [ 9/15] Newsgroups: alt.pagan.magick
To   : All
From : Rachel L. Akers
Date : Mon Feb 19 2001 09:11 pm

>... (cont)
Subject: nagasiva's alt.magick FAQ
Summary: This is a file of biased responses to frequently
         asked questions in the alt.magick newsgroup.
Keywords: FAQ, magic, magick, occult, occultism
Replaces: 500009
Url: http://www.luckymojo.com/namfaq.html
X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.4 (NOV)
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:34:31 GMT

     ____________________________________________________________

>... (cont)

   SCIENCE

   05.01: can you prove that magic exists?

     the question is ambiguous, since the terms 'prove' and 'magic'
     (by any spelling) are contested as to their meaning, varying
     widely across the spectrum of esoteric and scientific study,
     from academic to popular social circles.

     fantasy role-playing game types of effects (magic) visible to
     the video camera cannot be demonstrated (proven) to the
     skeptical inquirer. at best they may be achieved within the
     realm of imagination sometimes called 'the astral plane'. the
     childhood game of 'make believe' may play an integral role in
     how magic works. any extraordinary effects are considered
     below.

     psychospiritual effects achieved through the use of ritual
     symbolism (magic) are very difficult to verify (prove), and it
     may be hundreds of years before a scientific approach to
     mysticism is ever achieved in any depth and the charlatanry is
     winnowed from the reality. for now, skeptical groups are
     forging standards based on the technics of illusion (stage
     magic) that serve to expose the charlatans more easily. cf.
     the key term 'skeptic' in the Gehennom Goo (which you can
     find at

                http://www.luckymojo.com/magi/goo.html ).

     a reservoir of energy that may be drawn upon to achieve
     supranormal or supernatural effects (magic) has never been
     demonstrated to exist (proven), though many mystical and
     magical cosmologies seem to rely upon it for their support
     (e.g. prana, chi, 'the force', etc.). in any case, the concept
     of something being 'supernatural' is illogical and based on
     quite limited ideas of what constitutes 'the natural world'.

     systems of psychospiritual transformation (magic), whatever
     their success, can easily be demonstrated (proven) to exist,
     and their elements vary considerably based on the culture and
     time of their construction. often they are differentiated
     based on taxonomical or traditional labels (e.g. 'Solomonic
     magic' and 'Chaos magick').

     esoteric philosophy designed to inspire the location and
     activation of the personal will (magic) is very easy to
     identify and comprehend (prove) by the diligent, though to
     what their application leads (ultimately a subjective effect
     of study and discipline) is still debated even in the occult
     communities dedicated to their study.

     the usual 'proof' that people accept is based on what I call
     Stoplight Magic. the phrase Stoplight Magic derives from a
     deceptive trick that I used to play on my brother when riding
     in a car or on bikes, or when walking quickly, toward a red
     signal light. as he was younger and less worldly, I would
     often try to trick him into thinking that I was powerful
     enough to change the lights to green in our path, by watching
     the cross-traffic light and, when it turned yellow, expressing
     some kind of intentional gesture to immediately precede the
     change to green our way. I have played similar tricks on
     people in an attempt to see what kinds of attention are
     required to successfully carry out stage magic (even during
     occult or religious rituals!) or basic card tricks (in which
     I've had an interest from a very young age).

     over time I found that others actually believed that they
     could achieve this feat, and I conjecture that they convinced
     themselves of it through a selective acceptance of their power
     and a restricted memory of success and failure. through this
     means they would 'try to change the light'. if successful,
     this would ACTUALLY be a type of telekinesis, rather than
     magic in any conventional sense. they would then dismiss a
     failure as a function of their unreadiness or lack of
     connection to the 'energy' they needed, and accept as a
     success whenever the light coincidentally (or properly-timed)
     changed to green for them. the timing might even develop over
     a period of time due to subconscious cues.

     this system of selective success-building in tune with natural
     rhythms I have since called Stoplight Magic and do not think
     that it includes any unusual or transpersonal volitional
     phenomena.

     the standards relevant to a truly scientific study of magic
     are intentionality and repeatability. one must be able to
     declare an intent to affect the world and be able to
     repeatedly take ritual and/or symbolic actions which are
     followed by the achievement of these effects.

     there are practical limitations to what may be 'proven' to any
     given individual. one may always find a way to justify denying
     anything that what one wishes. there is no way around this
     kind of 'skepticism'. one may set one's blinders (or
     spectacles) at the strength one prefers and nobody else will
     be able to affect them until some set of criteria (terms of
     proof) are agreed upon by those disputing the matter.
      __________________________________________________________
>... (cont)

--- Msged/2 4.00
 * Origin: Elfwhere - The POINTy eared POINT (3:640/531.2379)

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