X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: f996b,ba31c1eee468bb0 X-Google-Attributes: gidf996b,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-09-11 03:27:03 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!newsfeed.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!supernews.com!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news1.elcjn1.sdca.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: patches Newsgroups: alt.ascii-art Subject: Re: Patches... Message-ID: <42mrpts494u1gi1tjjabjirrf2vu8p178f@4ax.com> References: <3B9A074C.62C5@hotmail.com> <3B9A229F.12B7@hotmail.com> <3B9BD5CC.DEA40E54@gtcom.net> <3B9CC2B2.255@hotmail.com> <3B9D0074.14CD3901@gtcom.net> <3B9D0AC5.59C1@hotmail.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 122 Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 10:27:03 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.0.42.151 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news1.elcjn1.sdca.home.com 1000204023 24.0.42.151 (Tue, 11 Sep 2001 03:27:03 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 03:27:03 PDT Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster Xref: archiver1.google.com alt.ascii-art:7410 >to put *all* the pictures from the book on a web page and show us here >in aaa, but she hasn't even commented on that (and considering that she >got the pictures from Patches...). Maybe if more people were to make the >same request...? Maybe you should ask your local library to pick up a copy of the book, or head on down to the bookstore and check out the book itself... Brendas website is a simple site that promotes the book itself. One really should see the book and have a look at it, because Brenda has done an exceptional job of covering & supporting the ASCII art community. Instead, your on some binge about a "playing card" whose design you probably got off a deck of playing cards and she didn't get your permission to put it on the site, well who says she needs permission. Did you copyright a design that is probably already copyrighted? Or are you just trying to blow smoke up someones ass again? Did you ask the original playing card artist if you could redesign his/her card? You are making some kind of assumption that she got the pictures from me, and I never once sent Brenda Danet any pictures of any kind. She could easily have gotten them and it is my understanding that between #mIRC_Rainbow & #mIRC_Colors (now defunct) she captured images from what was played in the channel. (which is also documented and shown in the book) (ASCII artists themselves are certainly not in the channel 100% of the time, saying hey.. thats my art.. you can't use or color that) and what you put on a website for someone to look at, copy and use, is to my knowledge still game for the taking.... like it or not, if you don't want it stolen or used, don't put it on a website for people to do that to. Most people who in IRC color the ASCII art, leave the initials intact, but all of a sudden they need permission to do so? Since when? If you put it on your site, its there for people to do what they wish with, hopefully they are respectable enough to give credit, and keep the initials intact. Brenda also has a cd image of my website, which I never sent or gave her, she must have downloaded it, or went thru and saved each page. Do I care? No, I do not. Oh wait, maybe I should sue her for downloading my site... oh no, invasion of the html.... hahaa... NOT!!! Neither here nor there, the only part I personally had in helping Brenda with her book was with trying to distinguish who colored what for mIRC art, and in no way, shape or form did I ever give her permission to use ASCII colored art work. I did give permission for artists who are no longer in #mIRC_Rainbow or in IRC to have there art published, since the only real thing is the fact that it promotes the communities. People such as TwoTall, Kris, & Kymmy, are featured heavily in her book, and on her website. (These people used original art, never once to my knowledge using ASCII art) It is my impression from Brendas emails in the last day or so, that we have a misunderstanding at some point, I had made an assumption that she had help finding out who the ASCII artists were. Alot of the art in her book is older mIRC & ASCII art, and most of the artists used are actually original artists, using characters that are not traditional to the use of ASCII art. You see this thru her website as well. The way I see all this hoopla, is that while you have a point on permissions and original art permission should be given, your forgetting that this book would increase the recognition that ASCII art deserves and the artists who today still create and continue to support it's use. The book does that very well, and it will increase the support and recognition the ASCII art community so richly deserves. The book is not going to make Brenda a rich woman, the book's main purpose is to educate and teach about the various uses on the internet and the ways it can be used. The fact that she gave so much notice to ASCII and IRC colored art, shows that she appreciates and is intrigued by the art itself. I would for one look at the fact that she has tried to give credit and is willing to fix any mistakes that happen adding in details and corrections in the book as well. Tell me, Veronica, just where did you get the idea of the playing card? Certainly you didn't make it up on your own, maybe you saw it on a deck of playing cards and drew it in ASCII art.... So, does that make it yours, or the person who originally drew the design that is featured on the card. Before you make accusations which I personally know you are all to famous for, you should be sure you are innocent yourself. Why is it, you always see the bad versus the good side of things. People try to show something they love, try to support a community, and you go after them like a raging bull. She has removed the picture and the html page it sat on, replacing it for another image. Trying the link creates a 404 error. Yes, yesterday, when I tried it, it was still there, I am not sure Brenda has the html knowledge to realize she needed to totally delete it off her site for it "not to be there". However, that image is now gone, and the page does create a 404, and I doubt very seriously she heard from her publisher to get her to do it, since your remarks here and her watching has made her aware that she'd made a mistake in the first place trying to remove it. >Maybe if more people were to make the >same request...? and for your information, most of the art featured in the book, is by Joan Stark, I think yours is probably one of the only ones that isn't on Joans website. Brenda featured Joan Stark and Allen Mullen in her book, probably the two people willing to allow her permission to use there work to help in the writing of the book. Brendas next book was to featuer ASCII artists, the community, and to some degree the art in IRC, I bet she will think twice before she does that book... and while we'd love for her to support the art created in IRC... something that can't be created anywhere else, that goes with ASCII art as well... funny thing is.. a book of ASCII art would only enhance the community and give it a worldwide recognition like nothing else could do, and your outrage at one simple little playing card picture that was obviously taken off someone elses design in the first place, makes it very dificult if she will not have the support of the ASCII community to promote the recognition it deserves to have in the internet community. Please don't sit here and tell me that you didn't get the idea of your depiction of a a playing card design off the top of your head..... I know better than that. patches #mIRC_Rainbow - Undernet http://www.mirc-rainbow.com