X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: f996b,898980d436245f34 X-Google-Attributes: gidf996b,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-07-23 08:41:34 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!newsfeed.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.tele.dk!194.25.134.62!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsrouter.chello.at!amsnews01.chello.com!news-feed.nld.sonera.net!news.soneraplaza.nl!not-for-mail From: Lennert Stock Newsgroups: alt.ascii-art Subject: Re: Uh? I don't know....what's it supposed to be? Message-ID: <97folt4uu4aojju8tnenirgksp4k95v3r0@4ax.com> References: <3b595df8.1142454@news.ntlworld.com> <9jelvh$l69$1@news.kolumbus.fi> <8fimlt09abkdiurn1kssn02rerd7magt2t@4ax.com> <9jgb6g$qeq$1@news.kolumbus.fi> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 trialware MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 50 Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 17:33:19 +0200 NNTP-Posting-Host: 213.73.134.67 X-Complaints-To: abuse@sonera.nl X-Trace: news.soneraplaza.nl 995902309 213.73.134.67 (Mon, 23 Jul 2001 17:31:49 MET DST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 17:31:49 MET DST Organization: Sonera Plaza Xref: archiver1.google.com alt.ascii-art:6754 On Mon, 23 Jul 2001 08:10:10 +0300, "Janne Raevaara" wrote: >> Well that sounds like bullocks, if not, not very objective. >> There are over 1500 muds out there, many with over 100 players >> and 20+ coders on at all time, some over 10 years old. So for >> these people the format must be doing something right. Actually, >> MUD is the first proof of what will happen when vr's that my >> grandma can use, hit the masses. If it works for you, tv-addiction >> is paled compared to it. > > >I have to admit that MUDs are an important part of the history of computer >gaming... But that's just it. I think that there is no use in coding 1600:th >MUD for a diminishing group of players. They became popular as as the first >form of "real online gaming" and where defined by technical limitations of >that time. Now that most of those limitations are history, why code an other >MUD? (Of course, people create 4-channel tracker music, too...) That's one side of it. The other side is not really answered by the 4-channel tracker music example, but by the question: Why do people read books when they can watch television and movies? A: Because it's a different experience on a different level of abstraction with its own strengths and weaknesses. (still, telnet sucks of course) For instance, none of the commercial graphical vr's so far has come close to the sheer size and depth of many of the muds. That's because most resources are spend on other things than the actual content. Which is b.t.w. the most prevelant failure of all released v.r. systems. I've seen many where people concentrate on making the best system, and implement Tic, Tac, Toe in glaring 3D realism as an afterthought. Funny to observe that in South-Korea, with the heaviest internet use in the world (they are about 3 times longer online compared to the average american/west european user), is the only country where vr's have captured the masses. Mostly used in situations where family at home can talk to family working elsewhere around the country or planet. The vr's they run are like 1 generation behind Ultima, but the -worlds- they created are the most sophistated in terms that they work for the people as intended. What I'm waiting for is the killer next generation graphical vr app, better than the current Quake, Ultima and Sony efforts, easy to use, but distributed and licensed as with MUDs, i.e. free and being able to start your own vr's. Back to ASCII art. If you're into popularity, it sounds like a good plan not to create the 1600th mud. If you're into popularity, it sounds like a good plan not to create ASCII art as well ;) Both can be a lot of fun though. I guess for both, there will always be an audience.