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	  Sat, 21 Jun 1997 22:01:17 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Sat, 21 Jun 1997 22:01:17 -0400 (EDT)
Message-ID: <970621220116_255436924@emout10.mail.aol.com>
To: socgrad@csf.colorado.edu
Subject: Re: hiring
Thomas,
I am troubled by your dismissal of Beth's examples of gender tracking in
sociology.  Your main point seems to be that gendered interactions happen
everywhere, so who cares if they happen in sociology too.  I fail to
understand the logic behind such a point.  

Further, your characterization of women who are assumed to be sleeping with
their men professors as Women Who Should Simply Tell Their Friends To Fly A
Kite And Keep Working Hard To Succeed ... is quite insane.  It only indicates
to me how completely removed you are from such a situation.  If you think
women who have gone through such things are simply wimps who need an excuse
to fail, you're not only wrong, you're missing the point and you're
offensive.  

I could go on and dispute almost every point you made in reference to Beth's
post, but I'm too annoyed to do so.  Many men try to take themselves out of
their own privileged position to understand how these subtle gender dynamics
negatively affect women (in sociology and in the larger world).  Your
rejoinder simply shows that you view the world (and sociology) solely from
your experiences as a man, and are unable to accept that the world can be
substantially different for people who aren't men.  
**Men professors are just trying to avoid the sexual harassment rap that
those damn feminists have let get so out of hand.  
**Women graduate students should have gotten over all that gender inequality
crap by the time they get to grad school.  Why don't they just speak up, like
men?  What's the big deal?
**Women who are assumed to be sleeping with the men professors they work with
just need to accept the ostracism of their colleagues and keep their little
noses to the grindstone.  Only a loser would let something so silly prevent
her from succeeding.

These are very gendered responses.  It is not surprising that a member of
your gender group, since you will never have to deal with most of these sorts
of issues personally, would dismiss them as you have.  Still, I'm
disappointed.

Ivy Kennelly
University of Georgia